CBCNEWS — The Fifth Estate
20260816 050000 UTC
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[00:00:22] [Steven D'Souza] On this edition of The Fifth Estate... [shouting]
[00:00:25] We're on St. Mary's Bay in Nova Scotia,
[00:00:27] the richest part of Canada's billion dollar lobster industry,
[00:00:31] where there's a war on the water.
[00:00:34] -Go home. -You go home, lady.
[00:00:38] [Steven] Intimidation and frequent threats of violence.
[00:00:40] Places burning down, windows getting smashed in,
[00:00:44] houses being shot up, people getting shot at.
[00:00:46] You hear stories it's a little lawless sometimes around rural Nova Scotia.
[00:00:50] The fight over who gets to fish here
[00:00:52] has left communities bitter and divided. [Matthew] We're not pirates.
[00:00:55] We're not the villains. [Steven] Does racism play a role here? Uh...
[00:01:00] no. A dispute with roots older
[00:01:03] than Canada itself. Lobster's not going anywhere. [chuckling]
[00:01:07] It's been around for a very long time.
[00:01:09] [Steven] We look at who is cashing in on the chaos.
[00:01:12] I'm sick of it, it has nothing to do with conservation. It's just, it's total greed.
[00:01:15] We ain't [muted] going anywheres either, man. I'm Stephen D'Souza.
[00:01:19] This is The Fifth Estate.
[00:01:21] ♪
[00:01:37] [pensive instrumental]
[00:01:41] [shouting]
[00:01:48] ♪
[00:01:55] Woohoo, there's some biggins in there, boys.
[00:01:59] Some [muted] biggins. Send 'em a couple of those.
[00:02:02] You want to save a couple of these? Yeah, I want to take a picture of us,
[00:02:05] all three of us holding up jumbos. Just take my picture with this big lobster.
[00:02:08] The kids will get a kick out of it at least.
[00:02:12] And remember, you've gotta hold it up like this.
[00:02:17] Anybody else want a cool picture of the lobster?
[00:02:20] [Steven] Out on the water, it's easy for Matt Cope
[00:02:22] to lose himself in the moment.
[00:02:25] To cast aside, briefly, the battle taking place here.
[00:02:29] [Matthew] It's just, when you're out here...
[00:02:32] the rest of the world almost don't exist for a minute.
[00:02:37] How many traps do you put out usually?
[00:02:40] -Like, if I'm doing moderate? -Yeah.
[00:02:42] Like, when I was doing it here and I got charged,
[00:02:45] I was fishing a half a shot a gear. So I was fishing 150 traps.
[00:02:49] And I had two other band members with me. So we were...
[00:02:53] we were fishing about 50 traps apiece. Right.
[00:02:56] And during the commercial season, how many?
[00:02:58] We fished 300, which is a full shot, yeah.
[00:03:03] [Steven] But this is the boat you were in when all the trouble went down initially? Yeah.
[00:03:10] [Steven] Navigating the politics of these waters is far from easy.
[00:03:14] Every time the 39-year-old father of six sets out,
[00:03:17] he's putting himself at risk of threats, violence,
[00:03:21] and arrest for something he believes
[00:03:23] he has every right to do.
[00:03:26] What do you want them to understand about the dispute? -Like, what's happening here? -I want them to understand
[00:03:30] that we're not poachers, we're not pirates.
[00:03:32] I was selling my catch to make money for my family.
[00:03:36] [Steven] The waters in Atlantic Canada have long been harvested for lobster.
[00:03:39] The region is parceled into sections, each with its own strict rules
[00:03:43] for when lobster boats can go out.
[00:03:45] These are known as commercial seasons.
[00:03:48] Here in this part of Nova Scotia, St. Mary's Bay is fished commercially
[00:03:51] from November to May.
[00:03:53] One in five lobsters fished in Canada come from here.
[00:03:56] You weren't hiding anything, right?
[00:03:58] No, absolutely. I had bright buoys.
[00:04:02] I had my phone number, my name on them.
[00:04:06] I actually wanted them to call me so I could explain to them what I was doing.
[00:04:12] [Steven] Cope is licensed to fish during this area's commercial season,
[00:04:15] but he also fishes much smaller amounts out of season,
[00:04:19] a controversial practice that more than once
[00:04:21] has caught the eye of officers
[00:04:23] with Fisheries and Oceans Canada, or DFO.
[00:04:27] I have no problem fishing in season. That's what they're always going on about.
[00:04:30] Oh, if you just fish in season, if you just fish in season.
[00:04:33] And then we fish in season and it's still a big deal.
[00:04:35] And basically they said they were gonna take my boat.
[00:04:38] -[Steven] Was that DFO? -DFO, yeah.
[00:04:45] [Steven] Cope is Mi'kmaw, they're the predominant
[00:04:47] First Nations group in Nova Scotia.
[00:04:52] He traces his right to fish here
[00:04:54] to treaties signed with the British Crown in the 1700.
[00:04:57] So, there's a hierarchy here
[00:04:59] in Nova Scotia because of these treaties, that there's a hierarchy.
[00:05:03] It goes commercial-based fisheries,
[00:05:06] which is a privilege-based fisheries, and then there's rights-based fisheries, which is higher.
[00:05:12] [Steven] In the heart of St. Mary's Bay, at the wharf in Saunierville,
[00:05:15] the dispute over the hierarch, as Cope describes it,
[00:05:18] unfolded in 2020.
[00:05:21] Mi'kmaq launched a rights-based fishery outside the commercial season
[00:05:25] and it caught international attention.
[00:05:28] We're right on schedule, we're going to have
[00:05:30] our elder, Becky, give us an opening prayer.
[00:05:34] [Steven] Journalist Maureen Googoo covered the event.
[00:05:37] Five years ago, during the middle of the COVID pandemic,
[00:05:41] this Sipekne'katik First Nation
[00:05:43] decided to launch its own moderate livelihood fishery.
[00:05:48] Yeah! We covered the speeches.
[00:05:52] We got shots of them giving out lobster tags to fishermen,
[00:05:55] and then they were going on the boats.
[00:06:00] As soon as they went on the boats,
[00:06:02] they were met with a flotilla of non-Indigenous fishers
[00:06:06] who were ready to take those traps out of the water,
[00:06:09] and there was clashes. [woman] You're not welcome here. No, you're welcome here.
[00:06:13] [woman] You just said we're not welcome. You said to go home.
[00:06:15] ...instead of taking our money, go home.
[00:06:18] You go home, lady.
[00:06:19] And that went on for about a good two-month period...
[00:06:24] [indistinct shouting] [Maureen] ...in that area, and it got very violent.
[00:06:28] It got very scary. They said they won't let me leave
[00:06:32] unless they have my lobsters. [Maureen] There was fishermen, you know,
[00:06:35] who were trapped inside of a fishing plant at one point,
[00:06:39] and with non-Indigenous fishermen
[00:06:42] threatening to burn them out.
[00:06:48] [Steven] That wharf is now fenced off. Entry is controlled.
[00:06:54] But it doesn't keep away the tension that's still sharply felt here
[00:06:58] by the First Nations fishers on the other side...
[00:07:01] even in this postcard setting.
[00:07:07] [folk music playing]
[00:07:15] [Steven] The Clare region of southern Nova Scotia
[00:07:18] takes pride in its Acadian ros and its connection to the sea.
[00:07:22] Here the lobster business touches everyone in some way,
[00:07:26] and is the lifeblood of these communities. [Bernie] Outside of the Halifax area,
[00:07:29] once you start coming west,
[00:07:32] probably every coastal community,
[00:07:34] its main economic driver is the lobster fishery.
[00:07:37] The lobster fishery is the big enchilada. If it wasn't for that,
[00:07:40] I'm not sure how any of these smaller communities,
[00:07:43] coastal communities, actually could survive.
[00:07:45] My father owned a small fish plant. Anyway, it ended up,
[00:07:48] like a lot of the smaller communities around here, most everybody ended up going fishing.
[00:07:52] [Steven] Bernie Berry sets the table
[00:07:54] for what the commercial fishes see as the key issue.
[00:07:57] At the end of the day, it's the stock is the main worry here.
[00:08:03] And without the stock, a healthy stock, or a sustainable stock,
[00:08:07] nobody has nothing, okay?
[00:08:09] And so we've got to get our head together and we've got to take better care of this.
[00:08:15] There's still lobsters here, but you cannot harvest them in the summer
[00:08:19] and expect them to be there in the commercial season in the fall.
[00:08:23] It doesn't work that way. And the problem with the harvest in the summer,
[00:08:26] it's unregulated. It's not supposed to be happening.
[00:08:29] [Steven] When you talk to commercial fishermen,
[00:08:31] they say that the moderate livelihood fishery,
[00:08:34] anything out of season, is dangerous to the stocks.
[00:08:37] They may say that to you, they never say that to me. Somebody that knows better.
[00:08:41] [Steven] The question of First Nations' impact on lobster stocks
[00:08:44] has been trailing them for a long time.
[00:08:47] Questions remain unresolved. What are the natives entitled to?
[00:08:51] How many plan to enter the fishery and for which species?
[00:08:54] That's what the fight's all about.
[00:08:56] Lobsters, a few lobsters.
[00:08:58] [Steven] First Nations fishers say their treaty rights
[00:09:01] were upheld by a 1999 Supreme Court decision.
[00:09:05] [reporter] Donald Marshall was charged and convicted
[00:09:07] of fishing and selling eels without a license.
[00:09:10] Marshall was out to make a pot on behalf of all Mi'kmaq,
[00:09:13] that they have the right, not only to hunt and fish without a license,
[00:09:17] but also to make a living doing it.
[00:09:21] [Steven] The Supreme Court said Mi'kma,
[00:09:23] just 5% of the province's population,
[00:09:26] have a right to fish and sell their catch
[00:09:28] to make what the court called a moderate livelihood.
[00:09:33] We're here to make sure our kids in the future
[00:09:37] will have something better.
[00:09:40] 'Cause that's so weak, like look at him.
[00:09:43] [Steven] Some bands have negotiated agreements with DFO to do that.
[00:09:47] But the government wants them to sell only during commercial season.
[00:09:50] It looks like he's gonna make it, though. Oh yeah, he's flappin', he's swimmin' now.
[00:09:54] [Steven] But Cope says he should be able to fish
[00:09:56] for a moderate livelihood when needed.
[00:09:59] I don't like that they limit
[00:10:01] the potential of what we can make
[00:10:03] based on a term such as moderate livelihood.
[00:10:06] [seagulls squawking]
[00:10:08] [Steven] The opposition is still there,
[00:10:10] though not as overt as the open clashes of 2020.
[00:10:14] Indigenous fishers, a lot of them have talked about
[00:10:17] dealing with racism on the waters
[00:10:19] when they fish with non-Indigenous fishers.
[00:10:22] [indistinct shouting]
[00:10:25] [woman] They're dropping traps,
[00:10:27] but the guys behind the non-Native fishers
[00:10:31] are cutting their traps as soon as they drop them.
[00:10:34] I don't think people realize how...
[00:10:36] how racism affects an individual.
[00:10:38] It's very personal and it's very stressful.
[00:10:40] And sometimes your life is put at risk because of it.
[00:10:45] So I think, you know, for the fishermen that I've interviewed,
[00:10:49] they would prefer to have
[00:10:53] a season where they could fish
[00:10:54] without feeling like they're being discriminated against.
[00:10:58] Some folks, some First Nations individuals
[00:11:01] will say that they...
[00:11:04] are permitted to have a moderate livelihood in fishery.
[00:11:08] [Steven] Well, the Supreme Court said that. Yeah, but it's never been defined.
[00:11:12] [Steven] Does racism play a role here, do you think?
[00:11:14] [exhales]
[00:11:17] I don't think-- I mean, back in 2020, that's how...
[00:11:21] unfortunately, I think it was painted.
[00:11:24] But I think what it was...
[00:11:26] I mean, certainly the communities here and the fishermen were painted as racist because,
[00:11:30] I mean, things exploded.
[00:11:32] First Nations gear was cut off and all that.
[00:11:34] That was just, uh...
[00:11:37] pent-up frustration, anger,
[00:11:39] because nobody in the government seemed to be wanting to help
[00:11:43] and they took it upon themselves. Was it right? No.
[00:11:46] But, uh... no.
[00:11:50] I'm just gonna tie her around the post here.
[00:11:54] [Steven] What do you think is at the heart of their opposition?
[00:11:56] [Matthew] It's a very passionate field, fishing.
[00:11:59] I mean, right from your fishing ground,
[00:12:01] how you tie your traps, what bait you use,
[00:12:04] your family's been doing it for so long, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera,
[00:12:07] so that if you feel like you're entitled to something, I get that they're gonna be mad that
[00:12:11] there's people out there fishing and making money while they're not.
[00:12:14] But we could talk about residential schools,
[00:12:17] we could talk about the systematic racism,
[00:12:20] we could talk about the racism we get from the commercial fishing, but when it all comes down to it,
[00:12:24] we have a treaty right to do so. And if any one of them could fish
[00:12:27] in between the season...
[00:12:29] you guess what, they'll be out there fishing.
[00:12:36] [Steven] But fishing out of season, as Cope has been doin,
[00:12:39] puts him in a tough spot not just with commercial fisherme.
[00:12:42] DFO considers that illegal,
[00:12:44] leaving him few options to sell whatever he catches.
[00:12:49] Do you find you have places to sell
[00:12:51] when you're doing the moderate livelihood?
[00:12:53] Or how hard is it to sell during that time?
[00:12:56] [Matthew] It all depends on you. I have the connections and the resources
[00:13:00] to be able to sell to...
[00:13:02] like, very broad markets.
[00:13:04] But for the person that don't have
[00:13:07] as good connections, then...
[00:13:10] then that's-- that's all they can do.
[00:13:13] Somebody can really nickel and dime them, right?
[00:13:16] [Steven] In 2023, Canada's lobster industry pulled in
[00:13:19] almost $1.8 billion,
[00:13:22] almost half of that coming from Nova Scotia.
[00:13:25] With so much money in play,
[00:13:27] Bernie Berry alleges fishing in the summer
[00:13:29] is being leveraged into big sales.
[00:13:33] This is a, this is a...
[00:13:35] simply an out of season commercial black market fishery
[00:13:39] because it is profitable and most of the stuff
[00:13:42] that's being bought in here is being bought in cash
[00:13:46] and, or drugs. Your average lobster buyer isn't doing that.
[00:13:49] So somebody else has got to be involved and stuff like that.
[00:13:52] [Steven] How do you know that? Are you hearing-- Are you hearing stories or reports?
[00:13:56] Yeah. Well, again, it's just anecdotal stuff.
[00:13:59] ♪
[00:14:03] [Steven] But what is the reality here?
[00:14:05] In a place where little goes unnoticed, we try to get to the bottom
[00:14:09] of what's really happening on the wharf.
[00:14:13] -Coming up... -How do I look? Terrible?
[00:14:15] [Steven] We follow the money in the alleged black market. [Zacharie] You can say I came out threatening
[00:14:19] or I sound threatening to arrest me. [Steven] Who is in danger?
[00:14:23] [Geoffrey] As soon as I looked up at the wall and saw a pretty clear hole,
[00:14:26] it's pretty obvious it was a bullet. [Steven] And just who has the right
[00:14:29] to fish lobster in these waters? Even if half of what they're saying is true,
[00:14:33] most people wouldn't even believe it.
[00:14:42] Hi there, Canada.
[00:14:44] Hi Siri,
[00:14:46] How are you holding up?
[00:14:51] It's been difficult to say the least.
[00:14:55] I intend to resign as party leader, as Prime Minister.
[00:15:01] The funny, not so funny thing about the
[00:15:03] world right now
[00:15:05] is the thing that can consume your thoughts
[00:15:09] is the thing you maybe didn't see coming.
[00:15:13] My favorite word? Tariff
[00:15:16] is going to be cracking down. Minimum 10% tariff on all
[00:15:19] imports. Some contracts are already getting cancelled.
[00:15:22] Facing a potential 25 or even 50% tariff on steel exports.
[00:15:25] We're already hearing about layoffs. Feeling the financial
[00:15:29] pain of Canada's 25% counter tariffs. He believes that
[00:15:32] Canadians would benefit greatly from becoming the 51st state
[00:15:36] when our sovereignty is threatened.
[00:15:38] You do what you can. He is trying to break us. So you have
[00:15:42] questions. How should Canadians be preparing for that next trip?
[00:15:46] What is your plan? How seriously are you taking
[00:15:49] this threat of 100% tariffs on foreign made films?
[00:15:52] A lot of questions. How is Hamilton bracing for tariff
[00:15:56] impact? When we talk about counter
[00:15:58] terrorists, do those affect you? How much does it cost to be
[00:16:01] patriotic when picking items at the grocery store?
[00:16:05] And while your elbows have been up, elbows up.
[00:16:09] For us, it's the sleeves rolled up.
[00:16:12] Because you need answers about your neighborhood, your world,
[00:16:16] your Canada,
[00:16:18] and what it means for all of us to say we are Canadian.
[00:16:27] Our journalists countrywide and all over the world are on the
[00:16:30] case.
[00:16:32] Do you think you're gonna have to close?
[00:16:35] I hate to think about that.
[00:16:43] I'm about 15 kilometers from the Russian border. Where are
[00:16:47] Canada's allies? Where are Canada's markets?
[00:16:50] What is this country's place on the planet?
[00:16:53] It's the uncertainty that's the
[00:16:55] this issue. What is the next thing to happen and what will
[00:17:00] it mean for all of us? We assume that it will be a
[00:17:04] difficult Rd. Canada. We got you and we are right there
[00:17:08] right beside you trying to make sense of it with you.
[00:19:25] [somber music playing]
[00:19:32] [Steven] In this seaside town, for some,
[00:19:34] the only thing bigger than the love of lobster
[00:19:37] is the fear of the crime around the industry.
[00:19:40] This is the Clare region, with a population of just 8,5,
[00:19:44] where the lobster business in this small town
[00:19:47] has brought big city problems.
[00:19:52] I mean, I grew up here, I love my hometown
[00:19:55] and it's hard seeing it being abused so badly.
[00:19:59] [Steven] The towns along this shore have recently seen
[00:20:02] more than their fair share of crime.
[00:20:04] The Fifth Estate has tracked allegations of extortion,
[00:20:08] assault, arson,
[00:20:11] even threats to kill a dog. At one point, it was happening so frequently,
[00:20:15] you couldn't even keep up with what was going on.
[00:20:17] And there's poaching going on from Yarmouth anywhere,
[00:20:19] you know, it's so vast, the ocean's hard to control.
[00:20:22] [Steven] JC Comeau runs a business at the Meteghan Wharf.
[00:20:26] [JC] It's coming primarily from the fact that this illegal,
[00:20:28] underground poaching activity
[00:20:30] generates a lot of money to a handful of people,
[00:20:33] and they will do every they possibly can to keep it going.
[00:20:37] [Steven] But what is really tearing apart this community,
[00:20:40] many commercial fishers pointed the finger
[00:20:42] at the First Nations activity on Saulnierville Wharf.
[00:20:46] First Nations can go out in the summer legally
[00:20:49] under a license known as FSC.
[00:20:52] Fishers can harvest limited amounts for food,
[00:20:55] social and ceremonial purpose,
[00:20:58] but they're not allowed to sell their catch.
[00:21:01] According to this internal report from DFO,
[00:21:04] authorities have evidence confirming
[00:21:06] that lobster cod in FSC is being illegally sold,
[00:21:10] often through unreported cash sales.
[00:21:14] But is that the whole story?
[00:21:16] This guy right here is a small jumbo, so he's between three to four pounds.
[00:21:20] [Steven] That's a big boy.
[00:21:25] Geoffrey Jobert moved back to the Clare area from Halifax
[00:21:29] in 2020 to manage the family business.
[00:21:33] To the outside eye, the lobster processing busines
[00:21:35] seems straightforward. So in a crate that we had seen earlier,
[00:21:39] those gray boxes, they hold about £100 just mixed in there.
[00:21:44] [Steven] Buy lobsters from boats on the wharf, get the seafood out to distributors
[00:21:48] around the world. And then the trays are going to individually
[00:21:51] partition each lobster, and that's just to prevent them from eating each other.
[00:21:55] Did you have a sense of what you were getting yourself into?
[00:21:57] I had known a little bit that it can be
[00:21:59] a somewhat rough industry and one that's not always
[00:22:02] governed the best, I guess you could say,
[00:22:04] or you hear stories that's a little lawless
[00:22:07] Sometimes around rural Nova Scotia.
[00:22:09] [Steven] Buyers like Jobert have to go by the book.
[00:22:12] [Jobert] We're not allowed to buy out of seasoned lobster, and I think we'd face a hefty fine if we did.
[00:22:16] I don't think the indigenous people support
[00:22:19] or want any of the criminal activity that's going on
[00:22:21] that their middlemen maybe doing. I think they're just trying to find a place
[00:22:25] to sell their catch, so typically, like commercial fishermen, last little while
[00:22:28] they're making, like, eight to ten dollars a pound.
[00:22:31] And then I've heard rumors that the indigenous fishermen
[00:22:33] are only going to paid around $4 a pound because it is an illegal lobster.
[00:22:36] Kind of like a gray zone lobster or whatever you want to call it.
[00:22:40] And I think that's just too low for--
[00:22:42] for the species they're dealing with. But I mean, from what you've seen, I mean,
[00:22:46] would you describe it as Organized crime or what would you describe it as?
[00:22:50] Somewhat-- somewhat organized, but I wouldn't say
[00:22:53] it's like a huge operation or such a large scale.
[00:22:59] [Steven] In early 2024, Jobert started buying
[00:23:02] from a new boat and trouble followed.
[00:23:06] The story goes that that boat had upset some people,
[00:23:09] So they started making small threats here and there
[00:23:12] like a text message or Something like that to leave that boat alone.
[00:23:16] And I guess it kind of just boiled over to the point
[00:23:19] of that gunshot happening.
[00:23:21] [Steven] That fall, a bullet ripped through his home.
[00:23:25] [Jobert] I cut through the dining room, the kitchen and stop in the living room.
[00:23:29] It just seems so crazy and intense. Not something I had experienced before.
[00:23:32] [Steven] Do you feel scared knowing that there are individuals out there
[00:23:35] capable of this kind of stuff? I definitely feel uneasy.
[00:23:38] There's some reckless individuals like that that would, you know...
[00:23:43] go to those extents almost for nothing, for pride maybe.
[00:23:49] [Steven] No one has been charged in that shooting.
[00:23:55] But we did track down one of the men
[00:23:57] charged with a number of lobsr industry related crimes,
[00:24:00] including allegedly threatening Jobert.
[00:24:03] [woman] He doesn't answer the front, try the side. -[Steven] Yeah. -[woman] Yeah.
[00:24:07] [Steven] He calls himself a "Shady, fly-by-night" lobster dealer.
[00:24:11] [Richard] Fine. Have a good day.
[00:24:13] [Steven] There were weeks of negotiations to get him on camera,
[00:24:16] including a few in person visits.
[00:24:23] How do I look? Terrible.
[00:24:25] [Steven] He eventually agrees to sit down
[00:24:27] with CBC Nova Scotia reporter Richard Cuthbertson.
[00:24:31] We're the lobster mafia. Me and my Dad don't even talk half the time,
[00:24:34] it's not like it's..
[00:24:38] There's one in every town I guess, I don't know.
[00:24:40] [Steven] This is 33 year old Zacharie Thibault.
[00:24:42] He's currently on house arrest. [Zacharie] If the Thibault family's an organized
[00:24:46] crime family, they got to change the definition. A bunch of [muted] degenerate drug addicts
[00:24:49] driving around and being assholes, is about it.
[00:24:52] [Steven] We wanted to know if he shot at Geoffrey Jobert's home.
[00:24:56] Turns out Thibault was in jail at the time.
[00:24:59] Can't shoot that far. Not from Burnside anyways. [Richard] Yeah, you were in jail.
[00:25:03] [Steven] We know Thibault is facing charges for threatening to kill Jobert,
[00:25:07] extortion and harassment.
[00:25:10] Thibault says he's done some bad things,
[00:25:12] but denies those allegations.
[00:25:14] I went to jail this year, I was guilty on those I went to jail for,
[00:25:17] but definitely not guilty on this one.
[00:25:21] [Steven] But beyond his criminal past, we wanted his insight.
[00:25:25] He says for years he worked as an unlicensed broker.
[00:25:29] -[Richard] So this is all cash? -Yeah, most of it.
[00:25:31] [Richard] Yeah. So how much cash are we talking about? Fifty thousand, hundred thousand.
[00:25:34] [Richard] Like, you've got $50,000? -Yep. -What are you carrying it in?
[00:25:38] Huh? [scoffs] Pringle box.
[00:25:40] Pringle box, [indistinct]. -[Richard laughing] -Bring your truck. Whatever.
[00:25:44] [Richard] You're just driving around -$50,000 in cash? -Yeah.
[00:25:47] [Steven] He says unreported cash sales are a tax dodge
[00:25:50] and happen more often than people realize.
[00:25:54] [Zacharie] There's 1,688 boats in District 33-34.
[00:25:58] There's not one of them doesn't sell lobster's cache.
[00:26:01] [Richard] But you don't know for certain that those fishermen
[00:26:03] are not declaring that money on their taxes. If they report it, I'm a porn star.
[00:26:07] There's about as much likelihood as one is the other. Let me ask you this.
[00:26:10] Your unreported, all the business that you did, your unreported sales,
[00:26:13] how much of that was Indigenous, how much non-Indigenous?
[00:26:17] Ten percent indigenous.
[00:26:19] Yeah. Ten, 15%.
[00:26:22] -And the rest is non-Indigenous? -Yeah.
[00:26:25] [Richard] Do you think this is all being
[00:26:27] sort of used to fuel
[00:26:30] this sort of energy against the indigenous fisheries?
[00:26:32] Absolutely. Absolutely. Whether it be a scapegoat or just a lightning rod.
[00:26:37] -Is this just all lobster... -Absolutely. -...and all just lobster greed. -Yeah.
[00:26:40] I'll bet my reputation, as shitty as it may be, on that.
[00:26:45] [Steven] Thibault is making a point that echoes
[00:26:47] what many First Nations fishers told us,
[00:26:50] that they feel they're being unfairly blamed
[00:26:52] for risking stocks,
[00:26:54] causing crime, and illegally selling.
[00:26:57] I get angry when I hear it's illegal.
[00:27:02] You know, it doesn't need to be portrayed that way, right?
[00:27:12] [Steven] Shelley Denny is a fisheries scientist.
[00:27:14] She also researches Mi'kmaq self governance
[00:27:17] and the harm that comes when Treaties aren't respecte.
[00:27:20] [Shelley] If we are fishing in season
[00:27:22] with non-Mi'kmaq lobster fishers,
[00:27:26] that we are at risk and that we can be targeted.
[00:27:29] Not every non-Mi'kmaw harvester is,
[00:27:32] you know, vile or, you know, against the fishery,
[00:27:35] but there are some out there who will very much make sure
[00:27:38] people are bothered and try as much as they can
[00:27:41] to discourage them from continuing to fish there.
[00:27:47] [Steven] Some First Nations fishers at Saulnierville tolds
[00:27:49] they feel like they're being watched, their every move tracked.
[00:27:56] When we were there, commercial fishers
[00:27:58] parked outside the fence, sitting, watching.
[00:28:02] [fisher] And I own a boat over there.
[00:28:05] [D'Souza'] This Mi'kmaw fisher tells us
[00:28:06] seeing the commercial fishers brought back visceral memorie.
[00:28:10] She sees their presence as intimidation,
[00:28:13] though it's not always this obvious.
[00:28:15] Are you monitoring cameras? Are you reviewing footage?
[00:28:19] Tell me about, like, just keeping a track of all this?
[00:28:21] Yeah, listen, again, the number of people that's got eyes on that place,
[00:28:25] and then with the drone footage and stuff like this, it's...
[00:28:30] There's not much that escapes us.
[00:28:34] [Steven] Bernie Berry and other commercial fishers
[00:28:36] are watching, reporting what they see to DFO
[00:28:39] from their cars and from the air.
[00:28:42] [Bernie] People actually do some drone video.
[00:28:45] You can't deny videos.
[00:28:48] [Steven] They claim these videos show lobster being
[00:28:51] illegally harvested for sale.
[00:28:53] If you can climb a fire escape or a ladder with one camera,
[00:28:58] you can get up above, outside of the gate. You know, when you're back here, you're safe and everything
[00:29:02] and you can see the whole thing, what's going on.
[00:29:05] [Steven] Dan Fleck is a retired DFO officer
[00:29:08] hired to help the commercial fishers.
[00:29:10] He says their surveillance is necessary.
[00:29:14] We needed to have video, physical proof
[00:29:17] in the eyes of the Canadian public because it's a Canadian resource for everyone
[00:29:21] to actually see how it's being exploited, over exploited.
[00:29:28] [Steven] One thing First Nations and commercial fishers agree on,
[00:29:32] that DFO enforcement isn't hitting the mark.
[00:29:35] First Nations Fishers tell us
[00:29:37] they feel it's criminalizing their treaty rights.
[00:29:40] Commercial fishers we spoke to say,
[00:29:42] DFO isn't cracking down hard enough.
[00:29:45] So we feel some pressure. [Steven] Noel D'Entremont leads Conservation
[00:29:49] and Protection for the Maritime Region.
[00:29:52] [Noel] There's a lot of opinions on this matter,
[00:29:54] whether the...
[00:29:56] community members here in Clare, commercial industry,
[00:30:00] First Nations communities, everyone has their side.
[00:30:05] What we do is, enforcement is enforcement.
[00:30:09] How difficult is that though, for your officers when they're out there
[00:30:13] and knowing they have to make these distinctions?
[00:30:15] Yeah, so it is very challenging for our officers
[00:30:18] and we do hear that. And that's where we try and give them the clarity
[00:30:22] that they need, that...
[00:30:25] keep in mind what is authorized and what isn't.
[00:30:30] [Steven] This past summer, across southwest Nova Scotia,
[00:30:33] DFO seized six boats and more than 1500 traps,
[00:30:37] filling their storage cages.
[00:30:40] Coming up, the long fight for Mi'kmaw managed fisheries...
[00:30:44] The government's reaction was severe, strong,
[00:30:48] crush the treaty fishery. This is our treaty.
[00:30:51] [Steven] ...and the battle over the message.
[00:30:54] Do you see a world in which the moderate livelihood fishery could exist
[00:30:57] outside of the commercial season? No, no, I don't.
[00:31:06] Hi there, Canada.
[00:31:10] How are you holding up?
[00:31:14] The funny, not so funny thing about the
[00:31:16] world right now
[00:31:18] is the thing that can consume your thoughts
[00:31:22] is the thing you maybe didn't see coming.
[00:31:26] My favorite word, tariff, minimum 10% tariff on all
[00:31:29] imports. Some contracts are already getting cancelled.
[00:31:33] We're already hearing about layoffs. Feeling the financial
[00:31:37] pain of Canada's 25% counter tariffs. He is trying to break
[00:31:41] us. So you have questions. How should Canadians be preparing
[00:31:44] for that next trip? What is your plan?
[00:31:47] How seriously are you taking this threat of 100% tariffs on
[00:31:51] foreign made films? A lot of questions. How is
[00:31:54] Hamilton bracing for tariff impact?
[00:31:56] How much does it cost to be patriotic when picking items at
[00:32:00] the grocery store? And while your elbows have been
[00:32:03] up, elbows up.
[00:32:06] For us, it's the sleeves rolled up.
[00:32:08] Because you need answers about your neighborhood, your world,
[00:32:13] your Canada,
[00:32:17] our journalist countrywide, and all over the world are on
[00:32:20] the case. Do you think you're going to have to close?
[00:32:24] I hate to think about that.
[00:32:33] Where are Canada's allies? Where are Canada's markets?
[00:32:37] What is this country's place on the planet?
[00:32:39] It's the uncertainty that's the biggest issue. What is the next
[00:32:43] thing to happen and what will it mean for all of us?
[00:32:48] We got you and we are right there right beside you trying
[00:32:53] to make sense of it with you.
[00:35:07] We're doing a lot of work right now, so there's like...
[00:35:11] so there's workers, a lot of workers and stuff around too.
[00:35:16] The majority of people that are out there fishing
[00:35:18] are all following the rules. The only thing that might differ is that...
[00:35:24] some people fish out of season.
[00:35:26] [Steven] As a Mi'kmaw fisherman and businessman
[00:35:28] asserting what he says are his treaty rights,
[00:35:31] Matt Cope finds himself tangld in the web of accusations
[00:35:34] and anger surrounding the lobster fishery. And, uh...
[00:35:39] So they drive by here, my house and stuff.
[00:35:42] [Steven] An eight foot fence now surrounds his yard,
[00:35:45] built in part to block the prying eyes
[00:35:47] of fisheries officers who he says
[00:35:49] surveil him from the street and with dron.
[00:35:52] Ever since his arrest on fishery charges in 2020.
[00:35:56] Did somebody give them instructions
[00:35:58] to specifically target,
[00:36:01] Say, certain native targets?
[00:36:03] I mean, like, if that's the case,
[00:36:05] then I find that's kind of...
[00:36:09] stereotypical, maybe unjust.
[00:36:15] We have no problem trying to work for it. So it's frustrating because
[00:36:19] they call us lazy when we don't work. And when we do work, we're...
[00:36:24] we're taking something from them. Calling me a criminal, villains
[00:36:27] and poachers and organized crimes.
[00:36:31] Just the list goes on and on. It's just fear mongering.
[00:36:35] [Steven] He says DFO plays into that fear.
[00:36:39] I mean, if there was an avenue where I could report my catch
[00:36:42] and do it completely on the books
[00:36:45] and it be regulated, then I would do that. I have no problem doing that.
[00:36:49] There's nothing black market about it at all.
[00:36:51] I mean, if we have the rights,
[00:36:54] then make it so that we can sell our catch to the buyers.
[00:36:57] Make it so that we can report our catch.
[00:37:03] [people clamouring] Here we go. [indistinct]
[00:37:10] ♪ Put the hands together, it's getting dark again ♪
[00:37:14] ♪ Getting dark again ♪
[00:37:17] ♪ For the second time since we got up ♪
[00:37:20] ♪ It's getting dark again ♪
[00:37:22] [Dan] They still love to go out there and fish. I mean, despite all the challenges.
[00:37:26] I mean, it's part of their core of who they are as Mi'kmaq.
[00:37:29] We've always been a coastal people
[00:37:31] and the fisheries always been a part of our life.
[00:37:34] And they absolutely love it out there.
[00:37:36] They absolutely love it,
[00:37:38] being able to fish, look after their families
[00:37:41] and look after their friends.
[00:37:44] And there's so much pride in being part of that.
[00:37:48] You gotta thank Don Marshall Jr. It all started there.
[00:37:56] [Steven] In 1999, Dan Christmas was the executive chairperson
[00:37:59] of the Union of Nova Scotia Indians,
[00:38:02] a prominent member of the team supporting the Marshall Case.
[00:38:05] And finally, I remember that day,
[00:38:07] September 17, 1999, clear as a bell.
[00:38:13] I wasn't there for myself.
[00:38:15] I was there for my people.
[00:38:17] [Dan] When our lawyer called us and said
[00:38:20] that we had won. And so that was...
[00:38:24] probably one of the most happiest moments
[00:38:27] because I think we knew, all of us in that room,
[00:38:30] that things will never be the same again.
[00:38:35] [Steven] In that landmark ruling, the Supreme Court said Mi'kmaq could fish
[00:38:39] for a so called moderate livelihood.
[00:38:42] But the court left it up to First Nations
[00:38:44] and the federal government to negotiate
[00:38:46] what that term meant in practice.
[00:38:51] [Dan] What does moderate livelihood mean?
[00:38:54] We have no idea. We always thought that was a fiction,
[00:38:57] a legal fiction that really had no meaning.
[00:38:59] It was almost discriminatory, almost racist to say, well,
[00:39:04] you know, everyone else can fish commercially,
[00:39:07] but when you do your fishery, you know, keep it down here,
[00:39:12] don't make too much money off it.
[00:39:16] The Mi'kmaq were given the right to basically
[00:39:19] harvest the bounty of creation, to sustain ourselves.
[00:39:23] That's how we understood it.
[00:39:28] [Steven] In the following years,
[00:39:29] DFO did help expand Mi'kmaq fisheries,
[00:39:32] transferring licenses to them from commercial fishers.
[00:39:36] But Christmas says DFO avoided the key issue,
[00:39:39] one that would follow him later in his career.
[00:39:42] They wanted us to accept cash to enable...
[00:39:46] First Nations to obtain boats, licenses, gear training.
[00:39:54] But without ever referencing the treaty or the court case.
[00:39:58] And so it enabled the communities
[00:40:00] to enter into the fishery,
[00:40:03] the commercial fishery, in a big way.
[00:40:05] There was no recognition of-- of our treaty right,
[00:40:09] what the court called a moderate fishery.
[00:40:12] And we continued to ask the government,
[00:40:15] "Are you going to set up a table to talk about the treaty right?"
[00:40:19] And it was just silence.
[00:40:23] So why don't you just take yourself to the end of the wharf and respect us?
[00:40:26] We do respect you. Listen, do we have to blockade
[00:40:28] this [muted] wharf or what? [Steven] That silence led to clashes
[00:40:32] when First Nations fishers took to the water
[00:40:35] and DFO responded in force.
[00:40:39] [woman] Oh, my God.
[00:40:42] You have a license issued by the Department of Fisheries
[00:40:44] hat authorizes you to set those traps? Do you understand that?
[00:40:48] We're fishing under food fishery. This is our treaty.
[00:40:56] [Steven] Then as now, commercial fishers have stood in opposition,
[00:40:59] arguing the stock must be protected.
[00:41:02] -[tenses music playing] -[car horn honking]
[00:41:05] This is-- this is nowhere near aggressive.
[00:41:08] [Steven] The various fishers associations have since
[00:41:11] taken their message to the courts, government and media,
[00:41:14] forming the Unified Fisheries conservation Alliance in 2020.
[00:41:19] We collected millions of dollars from our members
[00:41:22] and we have a key mandate, and it's to pursue
[00:41:24] a legal resolution to the Marshall issue.
[00:41:28] [Steven] Colin Sproul is the head of the alliance.
[00:41:31] I think that a lot of indigenous governments
[00:41:33] have perverted the Marshall decision into thinking that--
[00:41:37] that Marshall rights mean an open ended accumulation
[00:41:41] of fishery access for coastal First Nations.
[00:41:43] Do you see a world in which the moderate livelihood
[00:41:45] fishery could exist outside of the commercial season?
[00:41:48] No. No, I don't.
[00:41:50] There's one lobster resource for Atlantic lobster,
[00:41:53] and it needs to be managed under one set of management plans.
[00:41:57] [Steven] Commercial fishers argue against expanding
[00:41:59] treaty fisheries by pointing to the off season as a time
[00:42:02] when lobster can repopulate.
[00:42:05] This lobster here, ooh, and lovely little eggs.
[00:42:08] They're always in some sort of reproductive season.
[00:42:11] They're not a very complicated species.
[00:42:13] You know, they're basically the insects of the sea.
[00:42:16] [Steven] Shelley Denny is the director of Aquatic Research and Stewardship
[00:42:19] at the Unama'ki Institute of Natural Resources.
[00:42:23] It's healthy, it's been healthy. I mean, there's been some ups and downs.
[00:42:26] Like any other a species that's fish commercially. The resource is fine.
[00:42:29] The lobster industry and the population
[00:42:31] seems to be doing great and you know, there just needs to be more room made
[00:42:35] and more accommodations made for Mi'kmaq fishers.
[00:42:38] The level at which the Mi'kmaq are harvesting,
[00:42:40] even if they're harvesting during seasons where...
[00:42:44] the lobster industry isn't, the impact would be minimal.
[00:42:49] [Steven] The internal DFO memo we obtain through access to information
[00:42:53] confirms much of what she's saying.
[00:42:55] Dated June 13, it says lobster stocks
[00:42:58] across the Maritimes, including around St. Mary's B,
[00:43:01] are in the Healthy Zone
[00:43:03] and that while the commercial catch is trending down in par,
[00:43:07] DFO says the decrease has not been directly linked
[00:43:11] to the food, social and ceremonial fishery.
[00:43:14] Like, no matter what the government says,
[00:43:16] no matter what biologists say, we can see the effect of,
[00:43:21] of the incredible amount of illegal fishing. DFO's own science, though, is saying that
[00:43:25] overall the health of the stock is in good shape.
[00:43:28] So is that not a good enough sign that things are okay
[00:43:31] and that there is enough for everyone?
[00:43:33] Certainly the lobster resource is in good shape,
[00:43:35] but it's important to understand why it is.
[00:43:37] Trap limits, releasing of buried females,
[00:43:40] minimum sizes, increasing the minimum size,
[00:43:44] escape fence in our traps. There are literally hundreds of management things,
[00:43:47] but the most important one of all is the seasonality of our fishery.
[00:43:51] At the end of the day though, isn't it as simple
[00:43:53] as there is only so much to go around
[00:43:56] and you and your members simply just don't want to share?
[00:43:58] You don't want to give up your share of the pie?
[00:44:01] Certainly there's enough lobsters to sustain
[00:44:04] all the communities that need to rely on it.
[00:44:06] I think those narratives have been put forward by certain Indigenous leaders
[00:44:10] because it's politically advantageous to them.
[00:44:17] [Steven] Thirteen people have held the position
[00:44:18] of Fisheries Minister since the Marshall decision.
[00:44:22] The current minister, Joanne Thompson, sent us this statement.
[00:44:30] She also says that since the Marshall decision,
[00:44:32] the government of Canada has invested over $1 billion
[00:44:36] to implement the right
[00:44:38] through communal commercial fishing licenses.
[00:44:41] That didn't completely answer our questions.
[00:44:45] So we came to Ottawa to ask the Minister directly
[00:44:48] if she will resolve a quarter century of uncertainty.
[00:44:52] Hi, Minister, I'm with The Fifth Estate. Just wondering, will you commit to solving
[00:44:56] the moderate livelihood question once and for all?
[00:45:00] Minister, what do you think about DFO? Do you feel like they're criminalizing First Nations
[00:45:03] fishers by enforcing the law the way they are?
[00:45:08] The minister didn't give us much of her time,
[00:45:11] but look who did get a meeting with her.
[00:45:13] Check out this photo from Jun. Some familiar faces.
[00:45:17] Bernie Berry, Dan Fleck and Colin Sproul.
[00:45:24] Coming up... Sometimes they're getting their boat seized,
[00:45:27] sometimes they're getting their car seized. [Steven] Mi'kmaq fisher's forced
[00:45:30] to take their fight back to court.
[00:45:32] [Matthew] We've been criminalized, harassed
[00:45:34] all the way through this system
[00:45:36] that's designed to be racist towards us.
[00:48:47] [singing in other language] [Steven] October 1st.
[00:48:52] In Nova Scotia, this is Treaty Day.
[00:48:55] A chance to recognize the peace and friendship
[00:48:58] struck by the Mi'kmaq and the Crown.
[00:49:01] We are all treaty people.
[00:49:05] [Steven] But also a reminder of the work remaining.
[00:49:10] [Norman] Twenty-six years since the landmark decision.
[00:49:15] We still need to work on trying to get our rights recognized.
[00:49:22] [Steven] The event had plenty of dignitaries,
[00:49:24] but few provincial or federal politicians showed up.
[00:49:28] [applause]
[00:49:30] [singing in other language]
[00:49:32] [Steven] It's an annual event and every year
[00:49:34] questions hang over the celebration.
[00:49:37] Will anything change and is Canada listening?
[00:49:41] [Dan] [indistinct] people have the right to self-determination. We have the right...
[00:49:46] to govern and manage our own fishery.
[00:49:49] As long as that principle is ignored,
[00:49:52] Will never have peace in the water. ♪
[00:49:56] [Steven] Matt Cope often finds himself forced
[00:49:58] to shed his fishing gear and put on a suit.
[00:50:03] [Matt] I don't even think I can count how many of these I've been through.
[00:50:08] [Steven] He's faced a number of lobster fishery charges
[00:50:11] since 2020 and hopes his case
[00:50:13] will be among the last.
[00:50:16] Fundamentally, when DFO says you're breaking the law,
[00:50:19] do you see yourself as breaking the law? [Matt] Absolutely not.
[00:50:22] The very law that they're claiming
[00:50:25] that I'm breaking is unconstitutional.
[00:50:30] I am the owner, editor of Ku'ku'kwes News,
[00:50:33] independent Indigenous News in Atlantic Canada.
[00:50:38] [Steven] Journalist Maureen Googoo is closely following how the Fisheries fight
[00:50:42] has moved from the water to the courts.
[00:50:46] It takes up a lot of my time. [Maureen] There's at least about two, three cases
[00:50:50] each week. I started getting calls from fishermen
[00:50:54] and they were saying that they were trying to do
[00:50:56] their treaty fishery in the summer
[00:50:59] and they were getting their gear seized,
[00:51:02] not recognizing their moderate livelihood treaty right.
[00:51:05] DFO was still enforcing the Fisheries Act
[00:51:09] and charging them with illegal fishing.
[00:51:14] So I just started tracking the court cases,
[00:51:16] getting the court information.
[00:51:18] I was really shocked to learn that there were over
[00:51:21] 50 indigenous fishers who were charged.
[00:51:27] [Dan] It is so disheartening.
[00:51:30] You would think that after Marshall
[00:51:34] that there would be no more court cases.
[00:51:37] But it seems that the government is so anxious
[00:51:40] to relitigate the case
[00:51:42] that they want to get a different decision
[00:51:45] that they'll continue to charge and charge
[00:51:47] and charge and recharge.
[00:51:49] Why not the federal government just sit down
[00:51:51] with the First Nation leaders and hammer out
[00:51:55] what a treaty fishery looks like?
[00:52:01] [Dan] It's not a Mi'kmaq treaty fishery. It's a DFO commercial fishery.
[00:52:05] So until the day comes when it becomes truly a Mi'kmaq treaty fishery,
[00:52:09] then we would have arrived where we should be.
[00:52:13] [Steven] Dan Christmas saw a way forwad without going to the courts.
[00:52:17] After he was made a senator, the first Mi'kmaw in the upper chamber,
[00:52:21] he led a Senate report recommending
[00:52:23] Fisheries and Oceans Canada fully recognized treaty fishi.
[00:52:27] Let Mi'kmaq create their own system
[00:52:30] separate from the commercial structure.
[00:52:32] I can't tell you how disappointed I was when...
[00:52:36] DFO just summarily
[00:52:39] dismissed our recommendations as nothing.
[00:52:42] [Steven] Over the generation they've been at this,
[00:52:45] -for Dan Christmas... -We would like to have
[00:52:47] the problems and also governmt of Canada to recognize
[00:52:50] that these ways of living stil are extent in our community,
[00:52:53] and that they're still an important means
[00:52:55] for some of our families to get by each year. [Steven] ...and Bernie Berry.
[00:52:59] There is individuals saying that, you know, "Let's go fishing next week."
[00:53:03] Others are saying, "Leave your plots in the water after the season" type thing.
[00:53:06] There is, certainly there's frustration.
[00:53:09] [Steven] It always comes back to family and livelihood.
[00:53:12] Cross your fingers, cross your toes and hope for the best. But a lot of instinct and experience
[00:53:16] go into it, doesn't it?
[00:53:18] If you go fishing for 30 or 40 or 50 years,
[00:53:21] Mother Nature usually wins on a bigger percentage of the time,
[00:53:25] and you're just playing catch up.
[00:53:27] [Steven] He hopes their strong ties to the past are respected
[00:53:31] when the future of the fishery is set.
[00:53:34] The industry should have a lot more input as opposed to somebody like you said,
[00:53:37] sitting in an office in Ottawa
[00:53:39] and just thinking how it should look.
[00:53:45] A really good friend of mine made this for me.
[00:53:49] I wear it at special stuff, like events.
[00:53:52] Sometimes I wear it to court and stuff.
[00:53:55] Especially with the ones where we're arguing the treaty.
[00:53:59] It's got the lobster on there..
[00:54:02] Commemorating the 1752 treaty.
[00:54:07] [Steven] Matt Cope draws strength from the treaties
[00:54:10] because for him, they're more than history.
[00:54:13] They're personal.
[00:54:15] But right there, that's our...
[00:54:17] That's our family tree with...
[00:54:22] Jean-Baptiste Cope. He would be my...
[00:54:25] great, great grandfather.
[00:54:27] He's one of the most recognized signatories
[00:54:31] of the 1752 treaty that gave us the right to hunt and fish.
[00:54:37] [Steven] For now, he's going to keep setting off,
[00:54:40] resolved not to be trapped on the water.
[00:54:43] [Matthew] I'm already almost 40 years old,
[00:54:45] So I want my children to be able to exercise their rights.
[00:54:48] I want them to be able to work hard
[00:54:51] and fish and be able to make a living out of it.
[00:54:55] I have the right to fish. I have the right to sell that fish.
[00:54:58] It's protected under the constitution, and I'm gonna fight that to the end.
[00:55:09] Hi there Canada.
[00:55:13] The funny, not so funny thing about the
[00:55:15] world right now is the thing you maybe didn't see coming.
[00:55:21] My favorite word? Tariff. Minimum 10% tariff on
[00:55:24] all imports. We're already hearing about layoffs. He is
[00:55:29] trying to break us.
[00:55:32] So you have questions. How should Canadians be preparing
[00:55:35] for that next trip? How seriously are you taking
[00:55:38] this threat? How is Hamilton bracing for
[00:55:40] tariff impact? And while your elbows have been
[00:55:43] up, elbows up, for us it's the sleeves rolled
[00:55:46] up. Because you need answers.
[00:55:50] Our journalists countrywide and all over the world are on the
[00:55:55] case. Canada, we got you and we are right
[00:55:58] there, right beside you trying to make
[00:56:01] sense of it with you.