HALKTV — broadcast
20260806 193000 UTC
330 transcript segments
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[00:00:00] tried, but the statute of limitations has expired. It is very grave that a deputy's immunity
[00:00:03] has been lifted, and the indictment
[00:00:07] that has not yet come
[00:00:09] has been disclosed. HDP Group Deputy Chairman Sezai
[00:00:13] Temelli said, "In the eyes of the prosecutors, it's as if we are an organized crime group.
[00:00:17] This understanding is an interference with politics, and serving indictments
[00:00:20] and making character assassination is not acceptable." Look,
[00:00:24] this is a,
[00:00:27] isn't it very interesting? All parties in the parliament. All party group
[00:00:31] deputies said that this
[00:00:34] was wrong, even the AKP said that this
[00:00:37] was wrong. Now, let's ask Gamze Taşçıer about this.
[00:00:41] How do you evaluate this, that all parties
[00:00:45] with a group oppose this? And also, what
[00:00:49] is it here, what is the violation of confidentiality,
[00:00:52] what is the staining of the presumption of innocence, what is the act of serving?
[00:00:55] Who could be responsible for this, and how
[00:00:58] can it be revealed?
[00:01:01] "First of all, let me state that
[00:01:05] we hear about an indictment
[00:01:08] against any deputy or us
[00:01:11] from the public, and we say, 'There has been an indictment
[00:01:14] against this deputy for this many things.' However,
[00:01:18] in order for us to learn what topic
[00:01:21] the indictment is about, that deputy goes to the chairman of the constitutional
[00:01:24] commission or learns about the indictment through a petition
[00:01:28] if" an indictment's content
[00:01:32] is served to the public even before
[00:01:35] it reaches the parliament, the issue here is not
[00:01:38] about Özgür Özel's misfortune. In fact, the common will
[00:01:42] that all political parties have shown today,
[00:01:45] that is, the will they have shown regarding the wrongness of this process,
[00:01:49] is important, because the purpose of an indictment is to initiate
[00:01:52] a constitutional process
[00:01:55] regarding whether a deputy's immunity will be lifted or not.
[00:01:59] If you... at the initial stage,
[00:02:02] you turn it into a perception of conviction
[00:02:05] in the public eye, this is not compatible
[00:02:09] with the rule of law principle and the traditions that have existed until today.
[00:02:12] Of course, we do not see this issue as
[00:02:15] solely Özgür Özel's problem. Politics is sometimes understood
[00:02:19] not by individual events, but by the pattern
[00:02:22] that events create. Look, especially when
[00:02:26] we put the developments of the recent months side by side, we see
[00:02:30] a systematic picture emerging. Operations against our Mayors
[00:02:33] since March 19,
[00:02:36] followed by indictments
[00:02:38] gate. That cheer being prepared one after another against opposition deputies,
[00:02:41] and our esteemed General Chairman has nearly 60 indictments,
[00:02:45] and he is the General Chairman of the Main Opposition Party,
[00:02:48] this needs to be emphasized. We see that the indictment
[00:02:51] against him
[00:02:54] was shared with the public without the parliamentary
[00:02:57] process being followed. Therefore, when we evaluate
[00:03:01] all of them within the same time
[00:03:04] frame, it is possible to say that we are facing
[00:03:08] a method related to the reorganization of the political
[00:03:12] sphere in Turkey. In democratic regimes,
[00:03:15] the judiciary is not a rival of politics.
[00:03:18] The moment the opponent referee becomes a party to the game,
[00:03:21] that is, if the judiciary leaves its refereeing
[00:03:24] duty during the process and becomes a party, then
[00:03:27] we should be worried. "It is a process
[00:03:30] that each of us, regardless of which political
[00:03:34] party we belong to, should be concerned about. Look,
[00:03:37] I must state this,
[00:03:40] the opposition should be able to speak freely.
[00:03:43] This is not independent of all the processes
[00:03:46] we just mentioned. Mayors should be able
[00:03:50] to carry out their duties without pressure.
[00:03:53] Deputies, look, in this country,
[00:03:57] there are even deputies who have indictments
[00:04:00] prepared against them just for the dissenting opinion they wrote.
[00:04:04] So, what we call parliamentary immunity is not
[00:04:07] just a speech we make in the general assembly.
[00:04:10] The speech our general chairman makes on a bus
[00:04:13] or on a chair in the street is also
[00:04:17] parliamentary immunity. Or expressing our opinion
[00:04:20] in these programs, expressing our party's views
[00:04:24] is also parliamentary immunity.
[00:04:27] However, in this country, only...
[00:04:31] the defense of this immunity or this right is not
[00:04:34] for the opposition, but for parliamentary
[00:04:37] democracy's minimum guarantee. If a deputy,
[00:04:41] when they take the floor, faces an investigation
[00:04:44] the next day for what they said,
[00:04:47] then the parliament's oversight function weakens,
[00:04:51] and this harms democracy the most.
[00:04:54] Tomorrow, for the general chairman of the ruling party,
[00:04:58] if they are in opposition, the first election will be this,
[00:05:02] we advocate that they should also be able to express
[00:05:05] their opinions freely. Look, Turkey's need
[00:05:08] is not a political system where the opposition is suppressed
[00:05:11] by the judiciary. Turkey's need
[00:05:14] is a democratic republic where both the ruling party
[00:05:18] and the opposition can stand before the nation on equal terms,
[00:05:22] compete, and the judiciary is
[00:05:25] not a party to this competition, but its guarantor.
[00:05:27] Therefore, I consider the objection
[00:05:31] of all political parties with a group, the deputy group chairmen,
[00:05:35] important today, but it should not
[00:05:38] just stay like this. This is also a matter of the national
[00:05:41] will, the parliament's reputation.
[00:05:45] The Minister of Justice must immediately implement
[00:05:48] an internal audit mechanism regarding this issue
[00:05:52] and investigate who served
[00:05:55] this to the public and take the necessary
[00:05:58] punitive actions. If the members
[00:06:02] of the People's Alliance are sincere in the statements
[00:06:04] of the deputy group chairmen you just read today.
[00:06:08] Yes, now, of course, on the one hand,
[00:06:11] the new party's Manisa provincial chairman
[00:06:15] faced an action. He was taken
[00:06:17] to Ankara, yes. Now there's this,
[00:06:21] isn't it? The new party seems to have caught
[00:06:25] a tailwind in the polls. Is this
[00:06:28] related to the Uşak case, or is it about the Manisa provincial
[00:06:31] chairman? It seems like there's nothing like that. I haven't looked into the details,
[00:06:34] dear professor, but it was the first action
[00:06:38] against a provincial chairman from the new party.
[00:06:41] Now, on the one hand, polls have been published for about 10-15 days,
[00:06:44] dear viewers, as you can see. In a significant portion of these polls,
[00:06:48] the new party is seen to have caught a significant tailwind.
[00:06:51] Is this being done to cut this tailwind,
[00:06:55] to make the new party only deal with such
[00:06:58] things? For example, there is
[00:07:01] a poll by Sonar. It doesn't serve us,
[00:07:05] it sends it to its subscribers, but
[00:07:08] somehow we get
[00:07:11] results from there. We are informed. 2005 people
[00:07:15] were interviewed. A CATI application was used,
[00:07:19] computer-assisted telephone interviews, conducted in July in 28 provinces.
[00:07:23] Friends, in Sonar's poll, let's look at the part about "If there was an election
[00:07:26] this Sunday." Let's look at the part about "If there was an election this Sunday,"
[00:07:30] that is, visual number 3. Let's see how much
[00:07:33] Sonar measured the new party's support.
[00:07:37] Yes, it has arrived. Now, without distributing the undecideds,
[00:07:41] if there was a general election this Sunday, which political
[00:07:45] party would you vote for? New Party
[00:07:47] 24.1%. AK Party
[00:07:51] 21.2%. HDP
[00:07:54] 6%. Good Party 4.9%.
[00:07:58] MHP 3.6%. CHP
[00:08:01] 3.5%. Key Party 1.8%. Victory Party
[00:08:05] 1.6%. New Welfare 1.1%. Great Union
[00:08:09] Party says 0.9. Those who say they would cast invalid
[00:08:12] votes are 2.7%. Those who say they are undecided
[00:08:15] are 13.5%. Those who say they would not go to the polls
[00:08:18] are 7.7%. Those who say they have no opinion
[00:08:21] are 5.9%. The total of this
[00:08:24] is 30%, 29.8%, so
[00:08:27] 30%. Now, when
[00:08:29] you distribute these, the table looks
[00:08:33] like this: New Party 34.3%,
[00:08:36] AK Party 30.2%, HDP
[00:08:40] 8.5%,
[00:08:42] Good Party 7%, MHP 5.1%,
[00:08:46] CHP 5%, Key Party 2.6%,
[00:08:49] Victory Party 2.3%, New Welfare 1.6%, Great
[00:08:53] Union 1.3%. 34.3%,
[00:08:56] 30%. So, despite being a newly established
[00:09:00] party, the new party comes out first
[00:09:03] in Sonar's poll, just like in some
[00:09:07] other polls. There is a 4-point difference, and still
[00:09:10] those who say they would vote for CHP
[00:09:13] are at 5%.
[00:09:16] So, Gamze Hanım, it is being commented
[00:09:20] that these actions are attempts to break this tailwind.
[00:09:24] Do you have any evaluation on this
[00:09:27] matter? Without a doubt,
[00:09:31] because whenever
[00:09:32] we wake up one morning to a new operation,
[00:09:36] a new illegality, an anti-democratic practice,
[00:09:40] then there's a poll result and
[00:09:44] the new party's votes increasing,
[00:09:47] the nation's favor. I want to add
[00:09:50] this to these polls: look, in addition
[00:09:54] to these, the rate of those who want early elections
[00:09:57] was 60% in the latest polls.
[00:10:00] In fact, this shows us that a significant
[00:10:04] portion of society believes that the government
[00:10:07] has lost its capacity to solve Turkey's problems.
[00:10:10] Look, people... "They don't ask for
[00:10:13] early elections for fun. They are aware
[00:10:17] that problems will no longer be solved with the current political
[00:10:20] government. So what do these
[00:10:23] people want? I mean, today, pensioners work
[00:10:26] for a lifetime. Today, since
[00:10:29] 2019, the number of working retirees over 60 has almost
[00:10:33] doubled. The lowest pension is 23,500 liras,
[00:10:36] and minimum wage earners receive 28,000 liras,
[00:10:40] which is far below the hunger threshold. More
[00:10:42] than half of registered employees receive the minimum wage.
[00:10:46] Young people are not looking for jobs, they cannot find jobs
[00:10:50] where they can receive their pensions. Today,
[00:10:53] nearly 400,000 children are employed
[00:10:57] in Turkey. When we look at all these,
[00:11:00] we need to interpret the demand for early elections
[00:11:03] and the public's turn towards a new political
[00:11:07] party exactly in this framework. Look, almost
[00:11:10] 90% of society is aware
[00:11:13] of the new party, despite its very recent
[00:11:17] establishment. More than 50%
[00:11:20] of them find the establishment of the new party positive.
[00:11:24] The new party has shown great favor. As in the previous
[00:11:28] poll, 34.3% is a very significant
[00:11:32] vote, a percentage.
[00:11:35] Of course, we do not consider this a victory,
[00:11:39] but these polls show
[00:11:42] us that a new glimmer of hope has emerged,
[00:11:46] that the nation is trying to entrust us with hope,
[00:11:50] and that this is a heavy responsibility. We will never
[00:11:53] become complacent by looking at these.
[00:11:56] On the contrary, we will continue to address
[00:12:00] the real problems of society, aware of the heavier
[00:12:03] responsibility on our shoulders, and express our
[00:12:07] solution proposals for them. And you will see
[00:12:10] that in your future broadcasts, we will experience
[00:12:14] all of this together. Look, our current 34%
[00:12:18] vote, in the future stages of these surveys,
[00:12:21] will increase further, because the new
[00:12:25] party is a party established by the people.
[00:12:28] The donations made show that the people
[00:12:32] are taking ownership of the trust, and it has become a hope
[00:12:35] in politics. Of course, a single poll
[00:12:39] result is not enough, but
[00:12:42] when we consider it together with the street,
[00:12:45] the favor shown to our general chairman,
[00:12:48] and the demand to become a member of our party
[00:12:51] as soon as possible, it has become
[00:12:55] a concrete indicator that a new hope has emerged
[00:12:58] for the nation, that the belief
[00:13:01] that this government can change has been revitalized
[00:13:04] with the new party. The question about early elections
[00:13:08] was also asked here. It's in visual number 1, friends,
[00:13:12] let me remind you of those, since Gamze
[00:13:14] Hanım mentioned it. Do you think an early general election
[00:13:18] should be held? To the question,
[00:13:20] in Sonar's poll, 59.4% said yes, early elections should be held.
[00:13:26] "Those who said no, it should not be done were 32.9%, no opinion, no answer,
[00:13:29] 7.7%. Now, here,
[00:13:33] for this question, the results of the May poll,
[00:13:36] June poll, and July poll are placed side by side.
[00:13:40] Yes, those who said it should be done
[00:13:42] were 53.1% in June, and in July, in this latest poll,
[00:13:46] it increased to 59.4%. It has risen.
[00:13:49] 59.4%. Another question
[00:13:52] it asked was "Are the audits
[00:13:55] and investigations into the municipalities belonging to the government and opposition
[00:13:59] conducted in a fair and equitable manner?" Visual number
[00:14:03] 2? There it says that 23.3% of the people
[00:14:06] surveyed said yes, the audits and investigations are conducted
[00:14:10] in a fair and equitable manner. Very
[00:14:12] low. No, 63.2% said
[00:14:16] that they are conducted in a biased manner.
[00:14:18] Then, let's see, those who said they are conducted in a biased
[00:14:21] manner, yes, almost 63% said so in May,
[00:14:25] it dropped to 58% in June, and then rose back to 63% in July.
[00:14:28] No, brother, these audits
[00:14:32] and investigations are conducted in a biased manner, 63%.
[00:14:35] These are large numbers, aren't they, Professor Deniz? Well, of course, 63%
[00:14:39] is a significant number. I also thought that if
[00:14:43] this button operation hadn't happened, it
[00:14:47] means politics is not arithmetic, but it could also be a reaction
[00:14:50] to the annulment exceeding 40%. I mean, it's said to be 34.5%
[00:14:53] there. Maybe it's a potential that exceeds
[00:14:56] that, that's why there's such urgency,
[00:15:00] and even the announcement of these
[00:15:03] indictments against Mr. Özgür Özel, or
[00:15:06] even the almost PR of it, actually
[00:15:10] shows this urgency and this haste
[00:15:13] very clearly, I think. I mean,
[00:15:16] people really want early elections.
[00:15:19] They want them because of economic problems, because of deep
[00:15:23] poverty. Since
[00:15:32] we took it into account, we see that
[00:15:35] the political spectrum in Turkey
[00:15:38] has experienced an upheaval. I mean,
[00:15:41] when you look at the People's Alliance,
[00:15:44] it's in a framework that doesn't even reach 35%
[00:15:47] or 36%, especially in this system where 50+1
[00:15:51] is considered, it seems to need
[00:15:54] different kinds of, let's say, openings,
[00:15:57] changes, or similar window dressing.
[00:16:01] Therefore, the new party needs to use
[00:16:04] this potential correctly, in my opinion.
[00:16:08] If used correctly, that 5% figure will
[00:16:12] also consolidate, and a potential that can geometrically
[00:16:15] exceed 40% is truly present,
[00:16:18] I see it clearly, I'm not just saying it to say it. When
[00:16:22] taken together with these figures, yes, Professor Alpay,
[00:16:25] could the government have an effort
[00:16:27] to link this process we just discussed
[00:16:31] to the elections? Of course, the numbers already
[00:16:35] indicate that. Now, the processes, as I just said,
[00:16:38] are parallel. On one hand, there are peace steps
[00:16:41] with the Kurdish movement, and as I said before,
[00:16:44] the steps taken towards disarmament must be supported.
[00:16:48] There should be no hesitation there. However,
[00:16:51] one must be vigilant about the political background of this matter.
[00:16:55] That is, the government's intention and goal is naturally to divide
[00:16:58] and fragment the opposition, to somehow
[00:17:01] paralyze the opposition, and to win the next
[00:17:05] election with a divide and conquer strategy. Now,
[00:17:09] a framework law is being prepared on one side,
[00:17:12] and on the other side, an indictment
[00:17:16] for the immunity of Özgür Özel is brought up.
[00:17:19] Remember, for example, I think it was October 20th, a statement was made, "Öcalan
[00:17:23] should come to Parliament, the terrorist organization should be dissolved."
[00:17:26] October 22nd, but then Ahmet Özer was arrested on October
[00:17:30] 30, 2024. That is, these operations
[00:17:33] did not start on March 19, but on October 30,
[00:17:37] 2024. That's what I'm saying, in the end,
[00:17:41] on one hand, there is a call, and on the other hand,
[00:17:44] there is a process that started with membership in a terrorist organization.
[00:17:48] That is, the aim here is clear.
[00:17:52] Doesn't the Kurdish movement see this? Of course, it does.
[00:17:55] In the end, they also have a tactic, they also have a strategy,
[00:17:58] but the government's aim here is really to take
[00:18:02] the Kurdish movement to its side or to neutralize
[00:18:05] it in order to win the next election. Can it take the Kurdish
[00:18:09] movement to its side? I'm not sure about that,
[00:18:13] because the social base that the Kurdish movement relies on
[00:18:16] is not a base limited to identity demands only.
[00:18:20] The urban poor in big cities have very strong
[00:18:23] class demands and sensitivities
[00:18:26] regarding democracy. That is, this process
[00:18:28] cannot easily be that Öcalan, Bahçeli, and
[00:18:32] Erdoğan agreed, and the Kurdish movement
[00:18:35] became a part of such a process at the social