PAKISTANTV — broadcast
20261011 063000 UTC
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[00:00:00] war, then uh that uh will further constrain
[00:00:04] that roughly 70% of President Trump in the options that he has. We've seen the
[00:00:07] depletion of critical munitions worldwide, the
[00:00:10] US has lost between half and
[00:00:13] two-thirds of its supplies of
[00:00:16] critical offensive and uh defensive munitions,
[00:00:21] slip, and members of Tomahawk missiles, Patriot Pack 3 interceptors,
[00:00:24] THAAD interceptors. These
[00:00:26] which which has been a are developments that have an impact not only with regard to this,
[00:00:30] but also with regard to the strength of the US military deterrent in Asia
[00:00:42] US can, you know, continue this war
[00:00:45] at least on the military front
[00:00:47] indefinitely? Or do you think that within these
[00:00:51] constraints, no, no, I
[00:00:54] don't think, I don't think that it's sustainable. I
[00:00:58] think that it can continue
[00:01:00] uh the blockade of Iranian ports for some period of
[00:01:03] time, but I think even
[00:01:05] an age-old argument in that um will be subject to a balancing test
[00:01:08] with regard to the impact of that operation on
[00:01:12] US capabilities in other theaters around the world and
[00:01:16] in particularly East Asia, um,
[00:01:19] where the US presence has been weakened
[00:01:21] significantly by this
[00:01:24] conflict. There
[00:01:26] our history, our is not currently a single uh US aircraft carrier strike
[00:01:29] group, uh deployed
[00:01:32] there were about six or seven anywhere in the Asia Pacific Theater. Um, that's a problem
[00:01:35] um, I would say half-heartedly, a uh when most of the American foreign policy
[00:01:38] establishment remains focused on the long-term strategic
[00:01:42] competition with China um, and uh
[00:01:45] spending spending taxpayer funds in a faces and the US and its
[00:01:47] also been uh declining because of allies face other threats in the Asia Pacific region, such as uh North
[00:01:51] Korea. Um, this this is a
[00:01:55] situation that can continue for some time and cannot continue
[00:01:58] indefinitely. And the options for a significant
[00:02:02] military
[00:02:03] me, the sincerity escalation such as the introduction of ground
[00:02:06] troops are limited by military capabilities
[00:02:10] and they're limited by lack of public
[00:02:14] reaction as far as a support. How pushed is Donald Trump knowing
[00:02:17] that he is losing support for the
[00:02:20] mid-terms?
[00:02:23] Well, that's a difficult question,
[00:02:26] because I I hesitate, I hesitate to try to get
[00:02:30] into the president's
[00:02:32] seen. head. Um, if you listen to him at his rallies, um,
[00:02:35] he doesn't seem to believe that he's losing public support. Uh,
[00:02:38] clearly he is. Um, unlike in his first
[00:02:42] term, where he seemed to retain
[00:02:45] a fairly diverse
[00:02:48] be. One of set of sources of information.
[00:02:51] Um, he seems to be
[00:02:54] um, locked inside a bubble where people largely
[00:02:58] tell him what he wants to hear.
[00:03:00] Uh, so um, I don't know how much of a surprise the mid-term
[00:03:04] elections are going to be for the president. Um, clearly,
[00:03:07] when he wakes up on the morning of November 4th,
[00:03:11] um, if uh, the situation is as it seems to
[00:03:14] be at the moment, um, he's going to be dealing with a very different
[00:03:18] political reality than the one that he's been uh living with for the past two
[00:03:22] years. So what if the Republicans lose
[00:03:26] control of Congress in
[00:03:29] terms of an electoral setback? Do you think that
[00:03:34] with sincerity. it could push Trump back to the diplomatic table or do you think
[00:03:38] that it could escalate the confrontation? There seem to be divided
[00:03:41] opinions on this, on which side do you, which
[00:03:45] side would you take?
[00:03:48] I think in the short term, I think President Trump's
[00:03:51] instinct will be to rely more on his
[00:03:55] own authority, on executive power that does not
[00:03:58] require consultation and authorization from Congress,
[00:04:02] and that we could see in the short term
[00:04:04] a move toward
[00:04:08] escalation. In the long-term, however, he's going to be
[00:04:11] dependent upon the constraints and the
[00:04:15] levels of funding that he gets from the Congress.
[00:04:18] And in terms of the impact of a
[00:04:21] Republican loss in November, it's going to
[00:04:25] depend to a large extent on the magnitude of the
[00:04:28] loss. I think most observers uh now
[00:04:32] assume that uh the Democrats will take control of the House of
[00:04:36] Representatives. That's going to have a major impact in
[00:04:39] terms of funding and in terms of
[00:04:43] oversight, but right now the
[00:04:46] betting is that it's more likely than not that the Democrats will also take
[00:04:50] control of the Senate, uh and that will put concrete
[00:04:53] constraints on uh President Trump's ability
[00:04:57] to staff his administration, uh
[00:05:00] to nominate federal judges.
[00:05:03] And I think if
[00:05:06] the magnitude of the
[00:05:09] electoral loss for the Republicans is significant and
[00:05:13] uh when combined with the fact that we're entering the last two
[00:05:16] years, um, of the second term of a presidential administration
[00:05:20] where President Trump is 80 years old and not
[00:05:24] eligible to run for re-election,
[00:05:27] we may see his control
[00:05:30] of his own party start to
[00:05:33] the Republican minorities in Congress start to
[00:05:37] diverge from his policy
[00:05:39] agenda.
[00:05:42] Um, is Washington pursuing a
[00:05:46] coherent endgame with Iran in your opinion? Um, you
[00:05:49] know, of course, it seems like Iran is maintaining its
[00:05:53] posture. So no, the
[00:05:56] simple, the simple answer is no. Washington was
[00:05:59] not pursuing a coherent start game and it is not pursuing a
[00:06:03] coherent endgame. I think uh President Trump would
[00:06:06] like to find um an exit strategy. I think that was the
[00:06:10] message that he was sending um with the... Islamabad memorandum of
[00:06:13] understanding, but it's
[00:06:17] become increasingly unclear what the
[00:06:20] substantive elements of that strategy would
[00:06:23] be. There may be some additional
[00:06:27] um flexibility
[00:06:29] um in accepting uh unpopular terms, uh
[00:06:33] after the mid-terms when there's not an immediate electoral consequence.
[00:06:37] Um, but um as of now, um
[00:06:40] they've they've tried a military solution, that's
[00:06:43] failed. Um, they've tried
[00:06:48] diplomatic route, that's also failed. Um,
[00:06:51] and right now, the the primary focus
[00:06:55] seems to be on economic pressure, which has the
[00:06:58] potential uh to have an impact, but will only work over the long
[00:07:02] term.
[00:07:05] US and Iran, do you think that there's a chance that that
[00:07:09] could also change after the midterm?
[00:07:13] Yes, you think that, you know, there would be a reaction to
[00:07:17] whatever happens in the polls. You think that, you know, if
[00:07:20] if the there is the results are what we expect, there's
[00:07:24] going to be some kind of
[00:07:26] relationship between the current administration and Netanyahu,
[00:07:29] Oh, you mean US and
[00:07:33] Israel? Um, yes, I
[00:07:36] think there there will be um,
[00:07:40] well there there may potentially be a change of administration in Israel as
[00:07:44] well. So I think before we get to the US
[00:07:47] mid-terms, we have to see what the results of the
[00:07:50] Israeli elections are, and what the
[00:07:53] approach of the new Israeli government,
[00:07:57] if there is one will
[00:08:00] the problems that we've been facing in this
[00:08:03] pre-electoral period is that the pre-electoral
[00:08:07] periods in Israel and the United States have overlapped, and
[00:08:11] the interests of uh President Trump and President
[00:08:14] Netanyahu have diverged. President
[00:08:17] Trump has had an interest in de-escalating and getting this
[00:08:20] conflict out of the headlines and easing pressure on world
[00:08:24] energy markets and an attempt to bring
[00:08:28] down energy costs and inflation for American
[00:08:31] voters, whereas Prime Minister Netanyahu has had
[00:08:35] an interest in escalating and highlighting the direct
[00:08:39] threat to Israel in an attempt to rally
[00:08:43] support for his own coalition. Um, after the election
[00:08:46] uh those pressures will ease, uh
[00:08:49] so um there there will be an opportunity
[00:08:53] uh for uh the two sides to try to uh
[00:08:56] harmonize their approaches again. Uh the problem
[00:09:00] is that um Prime Minister Netanyahu for a number of
[00:09:04] reasons uh has done tremendous damage uh to the
[00:09:07] image of Israel in the United States. And I think we've seen that
[00:09:11] um play out in the mid-term election campaign.
[00:09:15] And the incoming Congress, I think is going to be much more skeptical,
[00:09:19] particularly if Mr. Netanyahu prevails and remains Prime
[00:09:22] Minister, is going to be much more skeptical of that
[00:09:25] relationship. Right, fair enough. Please stay with us. I'm going
[00:09:29] to also introduce Dr. Jared Well, who's a former US diplomat,
[00:09:32] now joining us. Dr. Jared, when we look at the Trump
[00:09:36] administration, and of course, its permanent
[00:09:40] suspension of labor certificate applications
[00:09:43] for Microsoft, several major IT
[00:09:46] firms, while launching investigations into
[00:09:50] nine universities, what does this tell us about
[00:09:53] the administration's broader immigration strategy? And you
[00:09:57] know, how far could this crackdown really go in your
[00:10:01] opinion? Well, I think we have to look at the crackdown as what
[00:10:05] we're seeing in terms of larger US foreign policy in general. I
[00:10:08] would say this crackdown relates to economic
[00:10:11] nationalism, where President Trump is trying to move forward what
[00:10:15] what he sees as uh America First agenda, which is
[00:10:18] prioritizing Americans first. That
[00:10:22] that largely said, um, there still
[00:10:25] hasn't been necessarily a correlation to show that uh that these number of
[00:10:29] Microsoft workers are taking American jobs. This is something the administration hasn't yet
[00:10:33] proven. Um, but but more or less, I think one of the larger implications
[00:10:37] could be is that employers
[00:10:41] and as well as those seeking employment in the United States would be
[00:10:44] dissuaded from attracting any kind of international talent
[00:10:48] to the United States,
[00:10:51] um
[00:10:53] huge um advantage to the United States for for many, many decades
[00:10:57] now. Um, so I think that's a major risk to to what's happening
[00:11:01] on the part of the Trump
[00:11:02] administration.
[00:11:05] Vice President JD Vance has also accused
[00:11:08] Microsoft of benefiting from thousands of H1
[00:11:12] visas, um, green cards, while of course laying off
[00:11:16] American workers. How credible is the
[00:11:19] administration's argument that skilled workforce immigration
[00:11:22] programs are being used
[00:11:25] at the expense of US employees? Isn't it
[00:11:30] a sense? It
[00:11:32] is an age-old argument, and again, as I just said in my previous comment, that
[00:11:36] this is something that the administration hasn't actually proven in any
[00:11:39] causation between the number of actual uh
[00:11:43] green card workers or those who come on visas and actually and Microsoft
[00:11:47] and other companies laying Americans off.
[00:11:49] Another another key question would be uh the the the level of
[00:11:53] skill set. I mean, we we that currently in the United States, we we
[00:11:56] have a disenrollment in universities uh
[00:11:59] across the country as the cost of um the cost
[00:12:03] of um universities have skyrocketed, in addition to the job
[00:12:07] market even uh in in technological skills have have
[00:12:12] the growth of AI. So I think, you know, this could be
[00:12:16] a major concern moving forward uh for
[00:12:19] for uh American companies as they seek to look for tech
[00:12:23] talent.
[00:12:25] Microsoft says that about 80% of its H1
[00:12:29] B applications last physical year involved extending or
[00:12:33] changing the status of existing employees. Do you think that this
[00:12:36] complicates the administration's claim that companies are using
[00:12:40] these programs to replace American workers if they
[00:12:43] only, you know, changing them for example,
[00:12:47] extending them or changing the status?
[00:12:50] Well, again, I think it comes back to the idea that that facts matter here. In this
[00:12:54] particular instance, Microsoft is is making the case
[00:12:58] that uh that this isn't actually true, that they're just renewing visas. So they're making
[00:13:01] that clear distinction between renewing visas and bringing people back
[00:13:05] into uh to to work versus bringing
[00:13:09] people to work in the United States. So, um, so I
[00:13:12] definitely think it it complicates the
[00:13:15] the narrative from from the current administration.
[00:13:17] Definitely.
[00:13:19] But it but does it also sort of allow them to
[00:13:23] to justify what what is happening as far as, you know,
[00:13:27] Microsoft and these technological companies are
[00:13:29] concerned? No, I think I think it doesn't. It doesn't justify
[00:13:33] that. Fair enough. Let me come back. I think it doesn't justify
[00:13:37] this. I'm sorry. Come back. Let let me just come back to.
[00:13:41] I'm also going to go to Paul Frit.
[00:13:44] Paul, when we look at what what is being said, in your
[00:13:47] opinion, this argument versus the fact that
[00:13:51] it's impacting us citizens, how do you credit this situation
[00:13:56] um when we look at this crackdown?
[00:13:59] Well, I think, um, as as my colleague
[00:14:03] said, we see it as a part of a broader
[00:14:06] crackdown on immigration from all
[00:14:09] sources. Um, that is not
[00:14:12] particularly data driven. Um,
[00:14:16] there there is no evidence for the notion
[00:14:20] that the H1B
[00:14:22] program is diverting, is um, is is displacing
[00:14:26] large numbers of uh US-born um tech
[00:14:30] workers. Um, and in fact, uh this has been um
[00:14:33] a major source of strength to the US economy has been the ability to
[00:14:37] attract um and integrate and reward um
[00:14:41] talent from around the world. Um,
[00:14:43] the uh President Trump a couple of weeks ago hosted
[00:14:47] uh Xi Jinping um in Washington and he hosted a state
[00:14:51] dinner uh that included uh CEOs
[00:14:54] of uh tech companies, and
[00:14:57] 80 to 90% of them were foreign born, were immigrants who
[00:15:01] themselves had uh come to the country through the
[00:15:04] H1B program. Um, foreign born talent uh has
[00:15:08] been a source of US leadership on uh on
[00:15:11] AI and and other uh cutting-edge uh
[00:15:14] tech sectors. Uh so um
[00:15:18] this uh approach, um, not only uh cracking down on
[00:15:22] H1Bs, but also on various forms of student visas, on
[00:15:25] F1s, on J1s, on cutting back research
[00:15:29] funds from the federal government, it all
[00:15:32] is going to have a very
[00:15:35] harmful effect on the US economy. And in the case of
[00:15:38] H1Bs, given the fact
[00:15:42] them come from India, it's going to become an
[00:15:45] irritant in that bilateral relationship as
[00:15:47] well. Fair enough. I know Dr. Jarod that you have
[00:15:51] limited time, but very quickly, the administration is also
[00:15:55] investigating nine leading universities, including Harvard,
[00:15:59] Yale, and Stanford over this
[00:16:02] alleged visa abuse and concerns about, of course, foreign
[00:16:05] influence as far as research particularly is concerned.
[00:16:09] Where should the government draw the line in your opinion between
[00:16:13] legitimate oversight and political interference in these
[00:16:16] cases? As far as particularly higher education
[00:16:20] is concerned. Well, I think that's an excellent question, and I
[00:16:24] think having been a former USAID, former
[00:16:28] foreign service officer who's managed US government funds, and also has been in also been in
[00:16:32] academia, I think it's particularly important to note that the government does have the right and we
[00:16:36] should be on the hook for how we spend US tax dollars. However, on the
[00:16:39] other side of that, there is such a notion in this country, and this is something that people come from all over the
[00:16:43] world to study here, is that we have academic freedom as which the
[00:16:46] government um doesn't interfere in what we can research,
[00:16:49] especially um on certain topics that that may be
[00:16:52] considered sensitive. Um, but this isn't the case. This this is it's a
[00:16:56] growing concern that the administration is trying to impact or or
[00:17:00] restrict what what can be funded or researched, again
[00:17:04] understanding that there there there are restrictions. How we can spend
[00:17:08] US taxpayer funds. But um, various critics
[00:17:11] have noted that there's this kind of dubious kind of connection to what the administration
[00:17:15] says, uh, the administration claims uh
[00:17:18] may infringe upon um
[00:17:23] responsible way, and also uh letting academics and student researchers
[00:17:27] have uh political freedom or or or have uh free academic
[00:17:30] freedom to be able to write about or do research on on these different
[00:17:34] topics. So I think we're seeing we're seeing something that that that has
[00:17:37] largely un unprecedented um here in the in in the United
[00:17:41] States where universities who um rely
[00:17:45] especially for certain research programs larger on federal funding either
[00:17:48] have to comply or they have to stop research, which is a major
[00:17:51] disadvantage to um the the American people. You one
[00:17:55] other aspect to add to this part is that, you know, lest we forget that
[00:17:59] American universities, um, and and those who come to study here are
[00:18:02] are it's a part of US soft power. Um, US
[00:18:06] American education as it's a huge part of that and those who are educated
[00:18:10] in the United States, um they when they finish their education,
[00:18:13] they go back to their native countries, um and they take that experience and they take living in
[00:18:17] the United States and they take those relationships with them. Um, and
[00:18:21] so when when we malign that relationship, that we're maligning these
[00:18:24] experiences, uh we're really doing long-term harm to American
[00:18:28] interest and to the American people
[00:19:38] came to the meeting. We haven't been able to hold a
[00:19:42] cabinet meeting for some time now. There
[00:19:44] are two reasons for this. I had to go to America for a
[00:19:48] UN session, and I was a bit busy
[00:19:52] there, and then I had some other engagements
[00:19:55] too.
[00:19:58] So, during this time, some important events took place
[00:20:02] that I would like to bring
[00:20:03] to your attention. First of all,
[00:20:37] the MD praised Pakistan for its efforts
[00:20:41] in these circumstances, as a team, to stabilize
[00:20:45] the economy. I consider
[00:20:49] these words as an acknowledgment
[00:21:22] that we all, including the political
[00:21:26] leadership and military leadership,
[00:21:28] worked day and night
[00:21:32] and brought a physical
[00:21:35] discipline to Pakistan
[00:21:38] that was long
[00:21:40] overdue.
[00:21:43] We brought in the structural
[00:21:47] changes that were due.
[00:21:50] But it's an old wound,
[00:21:53] an 80-year-old burden.
[00:21:56] You can't cover that distance overnight.
[00:22:00] But if we work day and night,
[00:22:03] Insha'Allah, we will reach our destination.
[00:22:05] In this regard, when I came to
[00:22:09] London, the CEO of the London Stock Exchange invited
[00:22:13] me. After the ceremony that you see every day
[00:22:16] on TV in New York, London, and Japan,
[00:22:22] delegations of
[00:22:25] top-class bankers during the opening ceremony of the Stock Exchange,
[00:22:28] including Barclays Bank. Various
[00:22:31] banks came, including Citi Bank
[00:22:34] and JP Morgan.
[00:22:37] And they said in various
[00:22:40] words, but one thing they said was, "Prime Minister,
[00:22:44] the economic reforms
[00:22:47] you have brought in Pakistan
[00:23:20] is being
[00:23:22] And in recent months,
[00:23:25] I have met many heads of state and international
[00:23:29] delegations. Not a single
[00:23:32] one of them started the conversation
[00:23:34] without first congratulating me and saying, "We
[00:23:38] highly appreciate Pakistan's diplomacy.
[00:23:42] We are
[00:23:44] well aware of it, and we are grateful to you for playing a big
[00:23:48] role in the ceasefire." The current situation
[00:23:52] in this regard is before you.
[00:23:55] Unfortunately, things got worse again
[00:23:59] and escalated. From the Strait of Hormuz, they
[00:24:03] went to Bab-el-Mandeb. There, the situation got even
[00:24:06] worse. So, Pakistan
[00:24:09] is still playing its role
[00:24:12] with full effort and sincerity. The rest is in
[00:24:16] Allah's hands. Other brotherly countries
[00:24:20] are fully contributing
[00:24:24] And today, I want to say
[00:24:27] again,
[00:24:28] please
[00:24:33] register this point that in this whole diplomacy,
[00:24:36] Field Marshal Syed Asim Munir has a pivotal role. There is no
[00:24:40] doubt about it. Absolutely. Deputy Prime Minister
[00:24:44] has made a great effort. Mohsin Naqvi is sitting here. He has made efforts regarding
[00:24:47] Iran. So, this is a great
[00:25:20] thing that even strangers cannot imagine
[00:25:23] such a thing.
[00:25:27] It became a story of destruction. There were ruins when
[00:25:30] we came into government. I don't
[00:25:33] want to boast. The entire
[00:25:36] team, the concerned ministers,
[00:25:40] secretaries, including Madam Shehza
[00:25:43] Khawaja, played a big role, and her secretary,
[00:25:47] Mr. Jiva, and gradually the Minister of Finance.
[00:25:55] Everyone worked together on this, but I think
[00:25:58] in my life, many big projects came that troubled
[00:26:02] me a lot. But this was one of those
[00:26:05] projects that caused a lot of weakness and pain,
[00:26:08] but Alhamdulillah, it is now complete, and
[00:26:12] Insha'Allah, we will now replicate it across
[00:26:16] Pakistan. I have told Ahsan Iqbal that he should
[00:26:20] be ready to build similar ones in Karachi,
[00:26:24] Lahore, Peshawar, Quetta, and other places,
[00:26:27] and in this way, not thousands, not lakhs, but
[00:26:30] crores of young boys and girls will get a start
[00:27:09] brotherly country of
[00:27:11] Pakistan
[00:27:14] and an extremely trusted friend.
[00:27:18] Just as China is an extremely trusted friend of Pakistan,
[00:27:21] Saudi Arabia is an extremely trusted friend of
[00:27:24] Pakistan. Throughout
[00:27:28] relations with them have been extremely affectionate.
[00:27:33] And you and some of the senior people sitting
[00:27:37] here are witnesses to how
[00:27:40] at various times the Saudi royal
[00:27:44] family, the Saudi government, and the Saudi people
[00:27:47] have always supported Pakistan.
[00:27:50] We, with full caution, played
[00:27:53] our role as a mediator.
[00:27:56] We have a brotherly country,
[00:27:59] Iran, which is our neighboring country. And believe
[00:28:05] and relationship with Iran have grown
[00:28:09] so much in these months during this government,
[00:28:13] I don't remember any other time like
[00:28:16] this. And this journey
[00:28:20] continues. The Deputy Prime Minister
[00:28:22] keeps talking to Mr. Rakesh. Mohsin Naqvi
[00:28:26] talks to his counterpart, they visit. The Field Marshal himself has made
[00:28:30] visits. He stays in contact. So, our only goal
[00:28:34] is to establish peace in the region.
[00:28:37] But after the Strait of Hormuz, the bloody game
[00:28:40] that is being played in Bab-el-Mandeb
[00:28:43] is extremely regrettable. And for this,
[00:28:47] Pakistan's relationship with Saudi Arabia, as I
[00:28:50] mentioned, is not 80
[00:28:53] years old, but centuries old, based
[00:28:56] on brotherhood, religion, and fraternity.
[00:29:00] And now Pakistan
[00:29:03] is now connected, and in this we have
[00:29:07] bilateral agreements,
[00:29:10] trilateral agreements regarding defense, so I
[00:29:13] believe that in this regard, what the Houthi are
[00:29:17] doing is extremely regrettable.
[00:29:21] No matter how much it is condemned, it is not enough. Pakistan has
[00:29:24] repeatedly said, even today, that
[00:29:28] this aggression against Saudi Arabia by the Houthis
[00:29:32] has no justification. A few weeks
[00:29:35] ago, there was a drone over Makkah, which they
[00:29:39] successfully negotiated.
[00:29:42] So who? I mean, from Kuala Lumpur
[00:29:45] to the West,
[00:29:48] you can go. So
[00:29:51] the entire Muslim Ummah is
[00:29:54] Makkah, Baitullah, Baitullah, which is the house
[00:29:58] of the Holy Prophet (PBUH) in Madinah Munawwarah. Which Muslim is
[00:30:33] ready and especially the sanctity of Madinah Munawwarah and Makkah
[00:30:37] and its protection is the responsibility of
[00:30:41] billions of Muslims around the world. So I
[00:30:45] believe that in this regard, this is a red
[00:30:48] line. We all pray to Allah Almighty that
[00:30:52] this matter will be resolved peacefully, otherwise
[00:30:55] Pakistan will always stand with its
[00:30:58] Saudi brothers and sisters.