TELESUR — broadcast
20260806 073000 UTC
436 transcript segments
Google Cloud Speech-to-Text API (Chirp) + Gemini 2.5 Flash Non-Thinking
Data courtesy of The GDELT Project (https://www.gdeltproject.org/), from the Internet Archive TV News Archive.
Machine transcription. Treat it as a searchable index of what was broadcast, not a verbatim quotation record.

[00:00:47] can put the entire
[00:00:56] Hello, welcome to the world from the south,
[00:01:00] Caracas, Venezuela, today talking about a topic that, of course, has marked
[00:01:03] the news dynamic in recent days, the
[00:01:06] Brazilian government rejected this Tuesday the decision
[00:01:10] of the United States to modify the visa of its
[00:01:13] ambassador in Washington, Maria Lucía Aviotti. Brasília interpreted
[00:01:16] the fact as a political retaliation and denounced a deliberate
[00:01:20] escalation by the White House for ideological reasons and with a clear
[00:01:24] intention to interfere in an electoral process in Brazil,
[00:01:28] from the executive led by.
[00:01:31] Luis Ignacio Lula da Silva called the justifications presented by the
[00:01:35] Donald Trump administration false. Let's
[00:01:36] el Sur," today talking about analyze this diplomatic pulse of
[00:01:40] Brazil against Washington's pressures and threats, which seeks electoral
[00:01:43] interference, according to analysts in that South American
[00:01:46] giant. But before the analysis, we remind you, through
[00:01:50] social networks, throughout the day we surveyed the opinion of our
[00:01:53] users, some of you have already participated, however, here is the
[00:01:56] QR code, in case you haven't done so, so you can participate. The
[00:02:00] question says, the United States revokes the visa of the Brazilian ambassador and
[00:02:04] strains diplomatic relations with the South American giant, what
[00:02:07] does this action by Washington respond to? There are the options, we
[00:02:11] invite you to participate
[00:02:13] responds, as we said, to now, your opinion is
[00:02:13] important.
[00:02:22] Let's go straight to the analysis, I am joined remotely by Roberto Gular
[00:02:25] Meneces, professor at the Institute of International Relations of the
[00:02:29] University. Brasília, thank you very much for your time with
[00:02:32] us, welcome to Telesur and El Mundo desde el
[00:02:45] first about what this represents, not in
[00:02:49] diplomatic terms, because the country that
[00:02:52] sends an ambassador consults first with the receiving
[00:02:55] nation of the candidacy before formally
[00:02:59] submitting the request. And ask for the agrément, as it is called, for their ambassador
[00:03:02] candidate. The United States, with this, skips that
[00:03:06] procedure. What to say about this whole impasse from a diplomatic
[00:03:09] point of view?
[00:03:13] For Brazil, it is
[00:03:16] an aggression against its sovereignty
[00:03:18] and also its independence, because
[00:03:22] the United States, the Trump government, tried to
[00:03:26] impose diplomatic considerations
[00:03:28] without considering the Vienna Convention
[00:03:32] of 1961 on diplomatic relations.
[00:03:35] The United States is disrespecting
[00:03:40] part of the difficulty Brazil, so eh, on June
[00:03:43] 1st, Trump went to his social network and announced
[00:03:47] that Daniel Pérez would become the new ambassador
[00:03:51] of the United States in Brazil, but, as
[00:03:54] the '61 convention states, it is
[00:03:57] necessary that a
[00:04:00] consultation process with the Brazilian government
[00:04:04] begin first, in a discreet manner,
[00:04:07] so it is not public, so
[00:04:09] that later, once Brazil confirms
[00:04:13] his name, in Daniel Pérez's case, then
[00:04:17] it becomes public that he will be an ambassador. So
[00:04:20] for Brazil, it's a very serious attack. No
[00:04:24] doubt, this was said amidst diplomatic tensions by the President
[00:04:27] of Brazil, Ignacio Lula da Silva. He strongly criticized
[00:04:30] Washington's stance regarding the sending of its ambassador
[00:04:34] and demanded mutual respect towards his country. This is what
[00:04:37] he said, let's listen.
[00:04:41] The United States did not attach importance to its embassy in Brazil because for a year and
[00:04:45] a half, they have been in power and have not sent their representative
[00:04:48] here, and now they are trying to send one and they believe that we are obliged to accept it on the
[00:04:52] date they want. That is not correct or possible. We
[00:04:56] want to be treated with respect, with
[00:04:59] respect. There was the Brazilian president,
[00:05:02] Roberto, the timing is no coincidence. It is
[00:05:05] evident, eh, the unjustified interest of the United States in
[00:05:09] interfering in the next presidential elections, so says
[00:05:13] the Brazilian government, and well, a practice that has been seen in other
[00:05:16] countries in the region, your reading.
[00:05:20] Yes, because the United States, since it began
[00:05:23] its tariffs against Brazil, was
[00:05:26] understood, it was understood that at that first
[00:05:29] moment there was a central issue that was economic,
[00:05:33] commercial, but then the United States
[00:05:37] declared Trump's
[00:05:40] support for Flavio Bolsonaro,
[00:05:43] who is, of course, the son of Jair
[00:05:47] Bolsonaro, who is currently in prison,
[00:05:50] under house arrest. So this
[00:05:54] search by Trump for protagonism in the elections
[00:05:58] in Brazil, we know that it
[00:06:01] has been growing and that now
[00:06:05] with this measure, Trump by sending an
[00:06:08] ambassador Daniel Pérez,
[00:06:12] by trying to make Daniel Pérez take over the embassy
[00:06:16] in Brazil before the elections, this
[00:06:20] could even mean that the embassy will be
[00:06:23] used to attack or try to influence
[00:06:26] the Brazilian political process. So
[00:06:30] Brazil Lula said this morning
[00:06:33] that no
[00:06:36] no ambassador
[00:06:38] will have his credentials before the
[00:06:42] end, before the elections in Brazil
[00:06:45] close, by the end of
[00:06:49] next October, and with that, the process
[00:06:52] seems to me suspended. So
[00:06:56] Brazil has to be very attentive, the Brazilian authorities,
[00:06:59] the different powers, because
[00:07:03] Trump tries in some way to
[00:07:07] interfere in the elections in
[00:07:09] Brazil, no doubt and... He has commented
[00:07:13] again that this is part of a political retaliation,
[00:07:17] taking into account the proximity of the United States to Jair
[00:07:21] Bolsonaro and of course in the next elections,
[00:07:24] we even saw polls of Brazilians
[00:07:27] saying that the Bolsonaro family is responsible
[00:07:29] for the tariffs imposed by the government
[00:07:33] of the United States. How is Brazil, Roberto, going into these elections,
[00:07:37] taking into account this whole scenario and, of course, the tension, not
[00:07:40] only diplomatic but also with?
[00:08:12] elections, so 40, 50 countries
[00:08:16] had already recognized
[00:08:19] Lula as president-elect of
[00:08:22] Brazil. This includes the seven countries
[00:08:26] of the G7 group, with that, even beyond
[00:08:30] the G7, China, and with
[00:08:33] that, later we had other
[00:08:36] attacks on democracy in Brazil
[00:08:40] and that resulted in an attempt. An attempted
[00:08:43] coup on January
[00:08:46] 8, 2023,
[00:08:49] and now, with all
[00:08:52] we have in 2022, now
[00:08:55] this may also have another element, of course,
[00:08:59] which is the Trump government, because Trump has already declared
[00:09:03] his support for
[00:09:07] candidate Flavio Bolsonaro, and with
[00:09:10] that, Trump may. until
[00:09:13] the elections in Brazil in
[00:09:16] October next,
[00:09:20] try to impose other difficulties
[00:09:23] on the Brazilian government, so Brazil is on
[00:09:26] alert, the Brazilian government, the electoral
[00:09:30] authorities too, because we know that
[00:09:33] the United States has resources, it has means to
[00:09:37] influence the political process in some
[00:09:39] way, so this is the great
[00:09:43] difference between 2022 and now
[00:09:46] is that Trump is determined
[00:09:49] to follow up, he can
[00:09:52] also make some movement
[00:09:55] or some actions that can, with that,
[00:09:59] hinder the Brazilian political process, as
[00:10:03] you said, there is an alert and President Luis Ignacio Lula da Silva
[00:10:06] precisely said that the state must be prepared to
[00:10:10] face any threat, he said.
[00:10:25] from outside that wants to interfere in our electoral process. There is something that
[00:10:29] needs to be clear, I have said many times when I spoke with President Trump
[00:10:32] that we are two men of 80 years old, we are presidents of
[00:10:36] two of the most important democracies in the region and therefore
[00:10:40] we must transmit to the people who live in our region sobriety
[00:10:43] and to the world that needs it so much, serenity
[00:10:46] and responsibility. And well, speaking of responsibility,
[00:10:50] Roberto, the President of
[00:10:54] Brazil, well... mentioned all this issue, but also
[00:10:57] the other
[00:11:00] side is how that situation and that
[00:11:04] decision to also downgrade relations with Argentina, taking into account
[00:11:07] the statements of President Javier Milei. What can you say about
[00:11:11] this situation and how it is affecting diplomatic relations between both countries?
[00:11:15] Yes, Francisco, since his government began, Milei
[00:11:18] has not had a single meeting with
[00:11:21] Lula. It's also Milei, whenever he can.
[00:11:25] The Brazilian government attacks Brazil, and now
[00:11:29] President Lula, when in the first
[00:11:32] attacks of Milei when he was here in
[00:11:36] Brazilian territory, as he was here 10 days ago
[00:11:39] in Brazilian territory, he made many attacks against
[00:11:43] the government, against President Lula, against authorities, the
[00:11:46] judiciary, against other Brazilian
[00:11:50] authorities, and the Brazilian government presented
[00:11:53] its protest
[00:11:56] to the Argentine ambassador in Brazil,
[00:12:00] but after a couple of days passed,
[00:12:03] Milei returned to attack President Lula
[00:12:07] and the authorities, and even
[00:12:10] said that Brazil has an orchestrated
[00:12:13] campaign against Argentina, and for
[00:12:16] this fact, the Brazilian government took an unprecedented
[00:12:20] measure in relation to Argentina,
[00:12:23] with which Brazil has a strategic partnership,
[00:12:27] but, at this moment,
[00:12:29] by downgrading its relations with Argentina,
[00:12:33] this implies that the Argentine
[00:12:37] ambassador in Brazil has to return to
[00:12:40] Argentina and the Brazilian ambassador, who is already
[00:12:43] in Brasília, will not return
[00:12:47] to Buenos Aires for the time being. With that, the
[00:12:50] relations between Brazil and Argentina are
[00:12:54] restricted to trade and economy.
[00:12:57] This is very bad for us, for both Brazil
[00:13:00] and Argentina, but Brazil has to take some
[00:13:04] action to demand respect from Milei,
[00:13:07] because Milei has
[00:13:11] a way of conducting
[00:13:14] relations between the two countries that is
[00:13:17] purely ideological
[00:13:20] and that also by disrespecting the
[00:13:23] president of the Republic, he is disrespecting
[00:13:27] Brazil, and with that, Brazil
[00:13:31] does not want to completely sacrifice
[00:13:34] its relations with Argentina, but it also
[00:13:38] does not have to allow something of
[00:13:40] that type. No doubt, very attentive to this whole
[00:13:44] scenario and taking into account, as we said, a sensitive
[00:13:48] moment for democracy in Brazil, upcoming elections in this
[00:13:51] Latin American country. Roberto, thank you very much for your time with us, for
[00:13:55] your insight.
[00:13:59] Talking to you and all your audience,
[00:14:01] Francisco, well, there we have then
[00:14:05] the analysis around all
[00:14:09] this topic, I remind the audience that you have time to participate in the
[00:14:12] poll that we have published on our social networks, at
[00:14:16] the end of our broadcast we will analyze the results, let's take a short break
[00:14:20] and we will invite our guest Roberto to stay with us, to continue talking
[00:14:24] about this topic. With Argentina and what this represents, not
[00:14:27] for both countries, we'll be right back.
[00:17:10] Thank you for following us in "El Mundo desde
[00:17:14] the situation, the diplomatic
[00:17:17] impasse between Brazil and the United States, but also about
[00:17:20] Argentina, because the diplomatic fracture between both
[00:17:24] countries, after the insults received by President Luis Ignacio
[00:17:27] Lula da Silva, from his Argentine counterpart Javier Milei, the
[00:17:31] Brazilian Foreign Ministry announced the withdrawal of its ambassador Julio
[00:17:34] Bitelli in Buenos Aires. Brazil decides
[00:17:37] to escalate diplomatic tension, limiting its
[00:17:40] representation to the commercial sphere, reducing the
[00:17:44] link to the level of chargé d'affaires. The measure by the Ministry
[00:17:48] of Foreign Relations of Brazil
[00:17:51] repeated verbal attacks, the political
[00:17:54] support of President Javier Milei for the Brazilian
[00:17:57] opposition, who also referred to Lula as a thief, as a
[00:18:01] corrupt person, something that has obviously been categorically
[00:18:04] rejected by Brazil. The Argentine Foreign
[00:18:07] Ministry describes the decision as unilateral and regretted
[00:18:10] that Brazil isolates itself for ideological reasons,
[00:18:14] maintaining that bilateral relations should not be made
[00:18:17] subject to political or personal interests of the rulers,
[00:18:20] Argentina has said regarding all
[00:18:24] this issue, contrary to what Javier Milei said at the time
[00:18:27] about the Argentine president and all the
[00:18:31] improprieties he made towards
[00:18:34] the Brazilian ruler. This is part of the analysis.
[00:18:37] I had said goodbye to Roberto at the time, Roberto, but
[00:18:41] we have you with us again, thank you very much for being
[00:18:45] here to analyze this topic, Roberto Gular Meneces, professor at the Institute of
[00:18:48] International Relations at the University of Brasília. Let's talk precisely about this,
[00:18:52] you already anticipated something, but I wanted to delve a little deeper because this
[00:18:56] diplomatic crisis between Brazil and Argentina reaches unprecedented
[00:18:59] levels, not since the return of democracy for both Argentina and
[00:19:03] Brazil, but it is an issue that we said goes beyond diplomacy,
[00:19:06] it has to do with trade, security,
[00:19:10] other issues that can also affect the continent,
[00:19:13] how do you see the impact
[00:19:15] on the whole region, because this is obviously unprecedented? Yes, Francisco,
[00:19:19] because, Argentina with Javier Milei,
[00:19:23] since his government began, also had
[00:19:26] a disagreement with Mercosur,
[00:19:30] and the Brazilian government since December
[00:19:33] 2023 has been living
[00:19:36] with Javier Milei and seeks to conduct
[00:19:40] relations from the Brazilian state with the Argentine
[00:19:43] state. However, with the economic crisis
[00:19:46] in Argentina, the Brazilian government also continued working
[00:19:50] as much as possible through a very strong
[00:19:54] pragmatism with the Argentine authorities.
[00:19:58] In the most recent period,
[00:20:02] we had the signing of the Mercosur-European Union agreement,
[00:20:05] so for Mercosur, it is very important that it remains
[00:20:09] united, cohesive to be able to continue
[00:20:12] negotiating, working with the European Union, but
[00:20:16] the fact is that Javier Milei recently
[00:20:19] announced an individual agreement
[00:20:22] with his country and the United States,
[00:20:26] and Lula, at the last Mercosur summit now in
[00:20:30] Asunción, asked that the Mercosur countries
[00:20:34] negotiate with
[00:20:38] China. So this stance
[00:20:41] of Javier Milei tends to complicate the
[00:20:45] functioning of Mercosur, this is also
[00:20:48] expressed in the most recent economic
[00:20:52] relations between Brazil and Argentina, because this
[00:20:55] year in the first half of 2026,
[00:20:57] Brasília has already
[00:21:00] reduced its exports to Argentina by about
[00:21:03] 20%, from about
[00:21:07] 9 billion to
[00:21:10] 7.8 billion dollars, and Argentina maintains
[00:21:13] about 6.4
[00:21:16] million dollars.
[00:21:20] for Brazil, so Mercosur is
[00:21:23] fundamental for Argentina and the Brazilian market
[00:21:26] as well.
[00:21:28] And with that, Milei, by trying to create more
[00:21:32] difficulties in the relations between Brazil and Argentina,
[00:21:37] set of relations between Brazil
[00:21:40] and Argentina in difficulty and thus harm
[00:21:44] economic sectors in Argentina,
[00:21:47] also harm the automotive sector, which is between Brazil
[00:21:51] and Argentina and is very important, and with that
[00:21:53] also end up hindering, for example,
[00:21:57] extra-bloc relations such as with Singapore, with Korea
[00:22:01] del Sur, with India, and with
[00:22:04] Canada. So it is a very difficult moment
[00:22:08] for Brazil-Argentina relations and this cannot
[00:22:11] but reflect in
[00:22:15] reflect in Mercosur, so for
[00:22:18] Brazil, there is a limit that
[00:22:21] is not yet the final limit, but it is an important
[00:22:25] limit that the government of Milei, his
[00:22:28] foreign minister has also
[00:22:32] said things, has spoken things that
[00:22:35] displease and offend Brazil, so
[00:22:38] it is necessary, it is necessary that
[00:22:42] Argentina resume the normal
[00:22:45] diplomatic relations with Brazil,
[00:22:48] because Brazil did not attack Argentina,
[00:22:52] Brazil even continues to support, for example,
[00:22:55] supporting the claim of Argentina for the
[00:22:59] Malvinas, and even the Brazilian government
[00:23:02] recently spoke about this topic,
[00:23:05] so it is very difficult to understand
[00:23:09] that Javier Milei has some
[00:23:12] difficulty in understanding that Mercosur is
[00:23:16] fundamental for Argentina, even
[00:23:19] more so at this difficult time
[00:23:22] with many economic difficulties in his
[00:23:25] country, no doubt. And Luis Ignacio Lula da Silva
[00:23:29] said, leave ideologies aside regarding
[00:23:33] the Mercosur issue, at a time when, as we said, the commercial
[00:23:36] data is also important, Brazil has maintained uninterruptedly its position as
[00:23:40] Argentina's main trading partner since 1991,
[00:23:42] with vital sectors in
[00:23:46] automotive, energy and agro-industrial, which
[00:23:49] of course. This could be affected by this impasse, but the Argentine
[00:23:53] government, Roberto, disregarded the diplomatic tension
[00:23:56] with Brazil after the decision by Brasilia to
[00:23:59] withdraw its ambassador and to reduce diplomatic representation
[00:24:02] to chargés d'affaires. Argentine Foreign Minister
[00:24:06] Pablo Quirno refused to apologize
[00:24:10] for the epithets uttered by Javier
[00:24:13] Milei against Luis Ignacio Lula da Silva and called the Brazilian
[00:24:16] measure a unilateral decision based on ideological differences,
[00:24:20] accusing the president of that country of having supposedly
[00:24:24] verbally attacked and of having previously interfered in Argentine
[00:24:27] internal politics. I also wanted to ask you about this because it's contradictory, isn't it, that Javier
[00:24:31] Milei, who of course has openly
[00:24:34] shown support directly for the opposition in Brazil,
[00:24:38] now through his government this
[00:24:41] communiqué is given. What can you say about
[00:24:45] this as well?
[00:24:48] even. important this highlight, because in
[00:24:52] Brazil's case, President Lula left it to the Ministry
[00:24:56] of Foreign Affairs to deal with
[00:24:58] this matter directly with the Argentine
[00:25:02] Foreign Ministry, and in Milei's case, since he
[00:25:06] was the president who uttered the insults against
[00:25:09] Lula, now the Foreign Minister not only reaffirms
[00:25:13] that Milei spoke, but even accuses Brazil of
[00:25:17] having provoked Milei's government. He did not provoke
[00:25:20] Milei, President Lula did not provoke him,
[00:25:23] and also because Milei has a
[00:25:26] summit that is scheduled for the extreme
[00:25:30] right in Latin America in Buenos Aires,
[00:25:33] so this also seems to me that there
[00:25:37] are some relationships where the idea that given the geopolitical
[00:25:41] importance of Brazil in South America and given
[00:25:44] the geopolitical importance of Brazil, for example, in
[00:25:47] other in BRICS and other parts. of
[00:25:51] other agreements in the world, Argentina then seeks
[00:25:55] to gather in Buenos
[00:25:58] Aires leaders of the extreme right so that they can.
[00:26:02] can also show their support for candidate
[00:26:05] Flavio Bolsonaro, this they can do, it's
[00:26:08] legitimate, but this idea of Milei
[00:26:12] trying to confuse things and also public
[00:26:15] opinion, even because Milei when he attacked
[00:26:19] Lula for the first time about 15 days
[00:26:22] ago, the Argentine press
[00:26:25] also criticized Milei, there are commercial
[00:26:28] associations, there is another part of public opinion.
[00:26:33] in Argentina that criticized Milei's stance,
[00:26:36] even the governor of the autonomous city of
[00:26:40] Buenos Aires, and with that, Milei
[00:26:44] tries to reverse things and it is very clear
[00:26:47] that Brazil does not want to create more facts, more
[00:26:51] difficulties in relations with Argentina, but Lula
[00:26:55] said when Milei
[00:26:58] apologizes and with that, okay,
[00:27:01] we will establish better relations, but
[00:27:05] I also believe that Milei will not apologize
[00:27:07] because Milei's stance is one of confrontation,
[00:27:10] it is not it is
[00:27:14] not one of cordiality. He should
[00:27:17] also leave this to the Ministry
[00:27:20] of Foreign Affairs so that both Brazil
[00:27:23] and Argentina can find the points
[00:27:26] and the possibilities
[00:27:29] of working
[00:27:33] on relations, because as long as Milei
[00:27:36] continues speaking, attacking, criticizing,
[00:27:39] even
[00:27:41] declaring that Brazil is orchestrating a campaign against
[00:27:45] his country, this is an unacceptable attack.
[00:27:48] undoubtedly, eh, an attack that
[00:27:52] of course has many facets and that continues
[00:27:55] to mark informational dynamics, not only in our multi-media but also
[00:27:59] worldwide, Roberto, thank you very much for your time and for your insight.
[00:28:12] professor at the Institute of International Relations at the
[00:28:15] University of Brasilia. We also asked our
[00:28:19] audience about this topic because the United States revokes
[00:28:22] the visa of the Brazilian ambassador and thereby strains diplomatic
[00:28:25] relations with the South American Giant. What is this action
[00:28:29] by Washington responding to? 75% of
[00:28:32] users say: clear intention of electoral interference in
[00:28:36] Brazil, with 20%, some think
[00:28:39] and disrespect for Brazilian sovereignty, as we commented with
[00:28:43] Roberto, and with 5% political
[00:28:46] retaliation for ideological reasons, this is what our
[00:28:49] audience said in the world from the south, we thank
[00:28:52] everyone for their comments and with that we conclude our
[00:28:56] broadcast, I remind you as always www.telesurtv.net
[00:29:00] with our real-time signal from anywhere in the world. Also on Telegram
[00:29:03] the Telesur news service 24 hours a day always with a
[00:29:07] perspective of the world from the south I am Francisco Blandón thanks for following us
[00:30:47] The decision of the US Consulate in Sao Paulo to
[00:30:51] summon anti-Lula influencers for a suspicious meeting on
[00:30:55] freedom of expression, raises the thermometer of concerns about
[00:30:58] possible interference.