TRTWORLD — Inside America
20260915 053000 UTC
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[00:00:00] on TRT
[00:00:00] World.
[00:00:12] of Welcome
[00:00:16] back. You're watching TRT World, with me Neil Harvey and these are our headlines.
[00:00:20] Three people, including two children, have been killed in Saudi Lead
[00:00:24] Coalition Air Strikes in Yemen's Tais province. According to Huthy Run
[00:00:28] Media. The strikes come as Arabia says it will
[00:00:31] of of respond firmly to hoothy attacks that injured 13 civilians in three
[00:00:35] Saudi cities. The Trump administration is ruling out direct military
[00:00:38] support for Riad. We've been in constant contact with the
[00:00:42] Emirates, the Saudis and others who are affected in the region, so
[00:00:46] of it's something the United States administration is very much top of. Uh, we've
[00:00:50] also been engaged in direct conversations with the hoothies themselves,
[00:00:54] so we
[00:00:54] of actually feel like we are top
[00:00:56] of the situation. State media says
[00:01:00] a drone strike has hit two Iranian fishing boats along the straight of
[00:01:04] Horumuz, leaving several people missing.
[00:01:07] a In separate incident, Iran's revolutionary guard says an oil tanker
[00:01:10] exploded and caught fire after hitting mines in the
[00:01:13] waterway. Ukrain president Vladimir Zelensky says
[00:01:17] that
[00:01:17] a
[00:01:18] of Kiev is ready to take steps towards deescalation, but only if
[00:01:21] Moscow also commits to halting attacks on infrastructure. Earlier, US
[00:01:25] president Donald Trump said that both sides had agreed to
[00:01:28] a mutual pause on strikes again. against energy sites. Still Kiev's
[00:01:32] mayor says a drone hit a
[00:01:33] of petrol station in the Ukrainian capital early on Tuesday, injuring
[00:01:37] one
[00:01:38] a person. The years Supreme Court has blocked President Trump's attempt to
[00:01:42] tighten Mailing voting rules just weeks before November's mid-term
[00:01:46] elections.
[00:01:47] of White House wanted to block mailing ballots from voters not on list provided
[00:01:51] in advance to the US Postal service, but critics argued the
[00:01:54] president like the authority to rewrite election rules at the last
[00:01:58] minute. Donald Trump's
[00:02:01] of also lashed out against concerns about artificial intelligence, saying
[00:02:05] efforts to limit the
[00:02:06] in technology a part of what he's calling a sick conspiracy. His comments
[00:02:10] come after the leaders of three major tech companies called for the government to have
[00:02:14] in greater oversight of AI. And
[00:02:17] Africa's richest man has launched the continent's biggest share sale with more
[00:02:21] than 4 billion shares in his Nigerian oil refinery
[00:02:24] of now of being offered to the public. Aleco Dangerte says that the IPO is designed
[00:02:28] not only to raise funds. for the refineries expansion, but also to give ordinary
[00:02:32] Nigerians a stake in the
[00:02:34] business.
[00:02:38] brings up today, do stay with us, the news continues after
[00:02:41] roundtable.
[00:02:50] in
[00:02:54] violent anti- migrant protests have been unfolding in Britain with
[00:02:57] of hundreds of mass
[00:02:58] me demonstrators discent. on UK ports, with public anger
[00:03:02] growing and people smugglers using new roots to reach the UK,
[00:03:06] can Britain get a handle its migration
[00:03:13] of problem.
[00:03:25] The UK
[00:03:26] of government has condemned
[00:03:27] of anti-migrant protests in some of its ports. cities as intimidating
[00:03:31] and thuggish. Britain has struggled for years to curb small bow
[00:03:36] in crossings from France, and now larger numbers of asylum seekers are
[00:03:39] arriving on single vessels, so-called megaadingies,
[00:03:43] using new roots to reach English
[00:03:45] shores.
[00:03:49] Clad in black, faces covered, hundreds of men
[00:03:53] blocked
[00:03:54] of access to the UK's
[00:03:55] of busiest furry ports, Dover, a
[00:03:57] of mass protest against illegal migrant. crossing the English
[00:04:01] Channel from
[00:04:02] France. In
[00:04:06] Portsmoth, riot police pushed back anti-migrant
[00:04:09] protesters as they tried to stop coaches carrying
[00:04:12] 140 migrants who arrived a single mega
[00:04:16] dingy. The government has condemned the violent
[00:04:19] behavior, including assaults on police officers and damage
[00:04:23] to emergency vehicles. As a
[00:04:26] in politician, I believe in the right to peaceful protest, but what we've saw
[00:04:30] in Portsmoth obviously crosses a line, it was thuggish
[00:04:34] and intimidating behavior and I just want to thank the police and other
[00:04:38] emergency
[00:04:39] of services for bringing it under
[00:04:40] control. Anti-immigration
[00:04:44] Group Patriot Platform led by
[00:04:47] of Influencer Danny Thomas organized the
[00:04:50] of process. Why could they stop them on the beaches? They knew they were there. Migrant
[00:04:53] boats usually cross close to the French port of Calle into
[00:04:57] Dover on the UK's southeast coast. but now an
[00:05:01] alternative route has been used from near Sherboh in
[00:05:04] of western France to Portsmoth. It's
[00:05:07] a incredibly unusual
[00:05:08] of for a dingy like this to come into Portal. We haven't seen this before.
[00:05:12] um and I am concerned as police and crime commissioner that this could be the
[00:05:16] new route that people traffickers are choosing to take to avoid
[00:05:20] the processing situation that happens when people land in
[00:05:23] Dover. The rise in migrant boat
[00:05:26] arrivals has increased anti-immigrant sentiment in
[00:05:30] recent years and helped fuel the popularity of
[00:05:33] parties such as Reform UK. We
[00:05:37] will stop the boats within the first 100
[00:05:41] days of government end the number of
[00:05:45] migrant arrivals on small boats reached record highs last
[00:05:49] year, 30,000 between January and September,
[00:05:52] but for the same period this year has dropped 40% to
[00:05:56] 17,000, but the deployment of new
[00:06:00] megazingies along a different migration route risks
[00:06:03] driving those numbers right back
[00:06:05] up.
[00:06:10] Well, let's bring in our guests for this one. Piersel is a former special advisor
[00:06:14] at the UK's home office, Sebastian Salic is a former
[00:06:18] labor counselor and political journalist, and in London we're joined by
[00:06:22] Mithna Quibus, who is a senior researcher at the migration
[00:06:26] observatory at the University of Oxford, you're all very welcome to round
[00:06:30] table. Clare, to you first of all, give us your impression of
[00:06:34] public anger and opinion on this whole issue. The public
[00:06:38] are very angry, but I don't think it's quite necessarily
[00:06:42] the way. that it's meant to be, I think that they are being told there is a
[00:06:45] problem, if you look at social media, if you look at news reports, you're being
[00:06:49] told that this is huge number of people coming over or
[00:06:52] invading the UK, and so they believe that it is a
[00:06:56] problem, so the perception of it, I think is actually worse, but I think people are angry at
[00:07:00] governments generally for not being able to get a handle on the amount of people coming
[00:07:04] across the channel if we're going to talk about that root, but also those coming by
[00:07:08] legal means, the anger is now turning to those people, which I
[00:07:12] is the wrong way for any immigration conversation to go. Sebastian,
[00:07:16] these protests we've seen, these masked men turning up and disrupting
[00:07:20] towns like Dolver and cities like Portsmoth and causing problems.
[00:07:24] Andy Burnham, the prime minister describes this is the politics of poison.
[00:07:28] How does he stop this poison from spreading? Well, the logical answer
[00:07:32] would
[00:07:32] be to tackle the issue, but I don't think that is the real answer, because this is an emotional
[00:07:35] question. Clay, you alluded to it, if you uh, if you pull people,
[00:07:39] they will tell you that immigration is going up and that... immigration is going out when
[00:07:43] in fact both are falling uh and so even if this issue gets solved it doesn't go
[00:07:47] away. we've seen all of that progress and yet people are still standing there on
[00:07:51] the border in masks getting very angry and that's because there are certain people
[00:07:54] whose political futures rely on it and they have to find those flames to be able to stay
[00:07:58] relevant. meetna to you, how have you felt seeing
[00:08:02] these protests, these very threatening and intimidating groups of men turning up in
[00:08:06] balaclavers and masks. how how have you felt seeing
[00:08:09] this? i think it's a it's a... challenge that we've been
[00:08:13] seeing for number of years now, so we go back at least the last couple
[00:08:17] of years, we've seen these repeated outbursts of protest,
[00:08:21] whether those were about asylum hotels, about specific
[00:08:25] areas receiving small boat migrants, everything around
[00:08:28] immigration is now uh is now under a spector of
[00:08:32] of lot of frustration, it's been going on and it's been building up for number
[00:08:36] of years, so I think it's it's not necessarily surprising
[00:08:40] to to see this happen once more. "why do so many people want to
[00:08:44] come to the United Kingdom and claim asylum when they've traveled through
[00:08:48] multiple other countries across europe?
[00:08:52] there's no one single reason, there's a large number of
[00:08:55] people who all want to get to the UK for a variety of
[00:08:59] reasons, for some it's because they have friends or
[00:09:02] family here in the UK, others just want to
[00:09:06] get here because the English language or because
[00:09:10] the UK's image as safe and..." welcoming place, there's
[00:09:14] also the the issue of Brexit, now the fact that
[00:09:18] the UK is no longer part of the EU's asylum
[00:09:21] arrangements has meant that in some ways the UK is
[00:09:25] now a form of court of appeals for asylum
[00:09:29] applications in the EU, so we have two situations, either
[00:09:33] people who've applied for asylum somewhere else, whether that's France,
[00:09:37] Germany, somewhere in the EU and have gotten rejected,
[00:09:40] or we have the case of people, 'who've entered the EU through
[00:09:44] countries like Italy and Greece on the southern periphery, they were
[00:09:48] registered there, and they risk being sent back to
[00:09:52] these
[00:09:53] uh countries of first entry if they apply for asylum somewhere else in
[00:09:56] Europe. Now because we're no longer part these arrangements,
[00:10:00] that's not a problem in the UK, they cannot be sent back. The
[00:10:04] UK government does not have access to databases to
[00:10:08] tell them if people have been rejected asylum elsewhere.'
[00:10:12] for example, and we know that if you go and ask people
[00:10:16] in northern France, they do consider that that to be
[00:10:20] reason, at least some them. thank you. claire, you spent years
[00:10:24] working with. to
[00:10:25] may when she was home secretary in the home office dealing with this issue and obviously she
[00:10:29] went to become prime minister and you worked with her as well, a couple of reports this
[00:10:33] week and it was one from the UN HCR saying that the
[00:10:36] speed the work in the home office right now is
[00:10:40] far more important to the government than the quality um that they're
[00:10:44] pushing through people who not necessarily should be getting asylum, is
[00:10:48] that your experience? no it wasn't, I mean we were dealing with quite
[00:10:52] a large backlog when I was at the home office, but where near the size
[00:10:56] the uh the work in progress field that they have currently,
[00:11:00] it's always going to be a challenging area because you are
[00:11:04] reliant upon other countries giving you information. if somebody states that
[00:11:08] they're from Eritrea or from South Sudan, you have to verify that,
[00:11:12] and those countries are not always the best at record keeping, they're
[00:11:15] not always going to give you the information quickly, so there are number of
[00:11:19] challenges, but I think the home office is just too large in itself, and I said
[00:11:23] for a long time that it needs to be... split, you need to take out
[00:11:26] immigration, make an own standalone department where you can pour the
[00:11:30] resources where you need them at the times that you do need them, because otherwise you're
[00:11:34] just being spread across national security, policing,
[00:11:37] drugs, uh, passports, you name it that comes into the home
[00:11:41] office, so I think that is part the problem that nobody ever seems to want to deal
[00:11:45] with. Is that solution, Sebastian, for you, creating an immigration
[00:11:49] department, because other countries have them, and I'd be interested to see what
[00:11:52] benefits that has, because all of those issues you mention. whether it's um policing or
[00:11:56] drugs, they're all linked with immigration as well, so I would imagine having not worked in the home
[00:12:00] office that you need those people to be speaking each other, um, I know that's reform pledge
[00:12:04] as well to separate it out, um, but I think the solutions are probably lot more
[00:12:08] global as well, it's about working with people, whether they're in Europe or in the Middle
[00:12:12] East, because these are trails that start a long, long way away from the UK and
[00:12:15] end up here, and it's only by keeping those relationships strong that we can, we can
[00:12:19] tackle that that very long problem. Claire, you live in Kent, which
[00:12:23] is huge county in the... of England, Dover is one the towns there, how are local
[00:12:27] people feeling when they see these gangs of hoodlums turning up in balaletlavas and
[00:12:31] masks? I spoke to number of people when the protest
[00:12:34] happened, and they said how intimidating it was, there
[00:12:38] was somebody in their car going into the town just to do some shopping
[00:12:42] and was stopped at around about by somebody wearing a balaclava, dressed in
[00:12:46] black, just standing and staring at them, and they said, this is the kind
[00:12:50] of tactic that you would have seen in Belfast in the
[00:12:53] 1970s, not Dover. 2026 and all they were trying to
[00:12:57] do was get to the shops, so local businesses have suffered, there will be
[00:13:01] those who support them, support these protesters, but I think
[00:13:05] that grinding the town to a hause as they did, all they managed
[00:13:08] to stop were freight trucks and people coming either back from
[00:13:12] holiday or going onto their holiday, so they weren't that happy about it. who is
[00:13:16] this Danny Tomoll guy who is on this patriot
[00:13:20] platform who seems to be coordinating lot the
[00:13:23] anti-migrant responses? England, he's got an
[00:13:27] interesting character when you look, he um, I, I understand
[00:13:31] he met uh Tommy Robinson, who is another sort of right-wing
[00:13:34] agitator in prison, so it gives you the measure of the
[00:13:38] individual that you're dealing with, and he's managed to get a bunch of
[00:13:42] people who don't like anybody coming to this country via any
[00:13:45] means whatsoever, and I have to say the organization
[00:13:49] for Dover was very, very good, Kent police were caught
[00:13:53] completely on the hop, they... "know it was happening, it was incredibly
[00:13:57] organized, people were coming from long distances, they were disciplined, and
[00:14:01] I think that should be a worry for everybody, how disciplined and
[00:14:05] not that information didn't leak out in the same way that it
[00:14:09] normally would, so I think that that is a really worrying aspect, I think he
[00:14:13] will do himself more damage, I think that there are a number of legal issues that
[00:14:17] he is caught up in currently, so all these things will come to the force, so whether
[00:14:20] he's going to lead it for much longer, I think it remains to be seen. Sebastian
[00:14:24] with..." seen protest now in Dolver and the city of
[00:14:28] Portsmoth, is there a fear that every weekend that
[00:14:32] comes there will be more? I mean there was certainly people who's it's in their political
[00:14:35] interest for that to happen. What's happened in Portsmoth was was new that we haven't
[00:14:39] seen boats turning up in Portsmoth before um and it's a much longer route from
[00:14:43] from France to Portsmoth than it is from France to to Dover and the reason that's
[00:14:47] happening is because the supply chains are being frustrated the boats aren't
[00:14:50] in as much availability as they were before and um they're getting stopped.
[00:14:55] they're getting caught, so these people are business owners, they are not going to disrupt their own
[00:14:58] operations unless they really have to, and and so what we're seeing really is a is a step
[00:15:02] forward, it doesn't feel like that if you're living in Portsmoth, I grant you, um, but this
[00:15:06] is - a disruption in progress and we should be, we should be pleased with that. Thank
[00:15:10] you. Mitana, talk to me about the changing and evolving
[00:15:14] tactics these people smuggling gangs then, because we're seeing much bigger
[00:15:18] dinges with more people on them, and the route seems
[00:15:22] to be changing as well, they're launching like 200 kilometers. southwest of
[00:15:26] Cale? Absolutely, we're seeing all these
[00:15:30] changes at the same time, and this is again not necessarily
[00:15:33] new thing. It's always been the case that the dynamic.
[00:15:37] between the authorities and smugglers has always had that bit of a
[00:15:41] cat and mouse nature where you have the authorities trying to put
[00:15:45] pressure on migrants and smugglers and then you see these responses
[00:15:49] where they try to adapt to these challenges, try to circumvent these
[00:15:53] new restrictions. we've seen, we've seen changes in two big
[00:15:56] areas uh paralleling essentially what we've seen the government
[00:16:00] tried to do with enforcement, so we've had many more patrols,
[00:16:04] drones, things like that in and around. the
[00:16:07] area
[00:16:09] in in the area around Cali, so there's been an increase in stuffing on the
[00:16:12] French side, more funding from the UK side, that's made it more
[00:16:16] difficult for boats to leave from this more traditional departure
[00:16:20] points, and as you say, we've seen more and more these departures
[00:16:24] from either further down the coast uh towards the west, we also
[00:16:28] saw number of arrivals coming uh from Belgium in the first half the
[00:16:32] year, so that indicates that it's becoming harder for them to
[00:16:36] operate u in northern France, we've also seen at the
[00:16:40] same time more disruption of supply chains, we've seen more boats
[00:16:44] being seized, more engines being captured, that's
[00:16:47] meant that very likely uh there might be a bit of a shortage
[00:16:51] of equipment in northern fronce, partly as
[00:16:55] result we're seeing these so-called megaadingies arrive
[00:16:59] over the summer, essentially acceleration of a trend that we've
[00:17:03] seen for a while where they try to pack as many people as
[00:17:06] possible on to a smaller number of boats that were still
[00:17:09] available, we have this ongoing dynamic, now the real question
[00:17:13] is which side will be able to stay ahead
[00:17:17] uh in in the coming few months, are they going to find ways around
[00:17:21] these new restrictions or will the government which is aware these
[00:17:25] dynamics uh manage to stay ahead? thank you,
[00:17:28] claire, the authorities always seem to be a couple of steps
[00:17:32] behind these criminal gangs, yeah these
[00:17:36] bigger dinges, different... roots, the technology, they they
[00:17:39] clearly have very sharp business model, and they are ruthless
[00:17:43] people, they do, and and before the boats became such a big
[00:17:47] issue that we used to see people coming in via the back of a
[00:17:50] lorry or a camper van, and I was down at
[00:17:54] Dover port with the home office looking at how people had been concealing
[00:17:58] migrants in vehicles, and I have to say, if these if these criminal
[00:18:02] gangs had turned their attention to something a little bit more worthwhile, they would
[00:18:06] have been some very clever and... engineers over here, because they were
[00:18:10] so superb, but adapting and very, very quickly, and I think this
[00:18:14] is what we don't appreciate is that if their business model is threatened and
[00:18:17] Sebastian mentions it, this is their livelihood, they're going to
[00:18:21] change their model and they're going to do it pretty quick cuz they cannot afford to lose
[00:18:25] what they've got, so if you have a group of people desperate to come to the United
[00:18:29] Kingdom, you're not going to turn them away, you're going to find ever more inventive ways
[00:18:33] of doing it, so I think that we will always be two steps behind.
[00:18:37] the same way
[00:18:38] that we are with any other criminal gang, whether it's uh drugs or whether it's
[00:18:41] firearms or whether it's cash, we are always going to be on catch
[00:18:45] up, unless we can make a breakthrough and take somebody out who is at the head of an
[00:18:49] organization. President Macron visited Andy Burnom in London
[00:18:53] last week, how important is that relationship, because lot of people in the UK feel
[00:18:57] that the French government have had huge sums of money to fix this problem at
[00:19:01] source and have not delivered, that that's the sentiment, but when you look at the number
[00:19:04] that are decreasing, you have to give some cred credit to the friend. because it's their border that they're
[00:19:08] policing um and it's therefore the reason that we're seeing fewer people come over. now look,
[00:19:12] it's very politically convenient for anybody in this country to to have a go at
[00:19:16] the French, it sells papers, it does really well uh, but we have to remember
[00:19:20] that their problem is our problem, and look, we struck deal with Belgium this week, um,
[00:19:24] it's the deal with China that has has reduced the number of small boats because we've stopped
[00:19:28] the motors coming across, so it goes back to that international story and how critical it
[00:19:32] is to maintain those relationships, because we're only going to do it with that involvement, but there are
[00:19:35] people uh within reform. elsewhere who, I don't think see the value in
[00:19:39] that, their politics is around domestic um
[00:19:42] agenda, and um, that's why I don't feel that we we're going to tackle this issue
[00:19:46] if they were at the helm. Claire, is this an election issue next time around, do
[00:19:50] you think for Andy Barnam? I think it's always an election issue,
[00:19:54] and it's one of those questions that if you if you just go out onto the doorstep
[00:19:58] and speak to voters and you say, "I'm I'm from whichever party,
[00:20:02] I, you, how can I help?" And they will tell you that it is cost
[00:20:06] of living, it is, uh schools, it is healthcare,
[00:20:10] you have to be prompted, I think with immigration. I think people do
[00:20:14] consider it a problem, but it it's not right at the top the list. It is
[00:20:18] increasing, but I largely put that down to the fact that
[00:20:20] it is all over social media, it is all over the news, it is everywhere you
[00:20:24] turn, so it it the perception again is that it's much more of
[00:20:28] issue, especially in some areas that have absolutely next to no
[00:20:32] immigration at all, so you can't say that in those
[00:20:35] places like the southwest of England. very, very little
[00:20:39] um migrant contact, but it will still be a
[00:20:42] problem uh come the elections, so I don't think any political party can afford
[00:20:46] to just turn their noses up. Thanks Clar, me. Uh,
[00:20:50] the fact remains that the numbers are actually down this year despite what the
[00:20:54] public perception may be. Uh, exactly,
[00:20:58] we've seen quite a bit of progress in terms of bringing numbers down this
[00:21:02] year, so if we look at figures over the last 12
[00:21:05] months, uh, numbers are at their lowest level since uh
[00:21:09] 2021. The last time we were at these levels was back in December
[00:21:13] of 2021, so far in 2026, numbers
[00:21:17] are down by 47%. The... been a downward
[00:21:21] trend uh going back to September and uh they they seem to
[00:21:24] continue doing that, so that's uh that's definitely significant. And
[00:21:28] in your experience, do you think the numbers will
[00:21:31] dwindle now as we get into rougher seas and the weather changes and
[00:21:35] autumn changes to winter? I think one thing is
[00:21:39] clear is that it's impossible to predict what's going to happen over the next
[00:21:43] few months, what we do know is that generally we see
[00:21:47] more arrivals in those... former summer months, we've
[00:21:51] had very quiet summer by historical standards, the fewest number of people
[00:21:55] coming over during the summer since uh 2020,
[00:21:59] but I think in the next two or three months we need to pay attention to those
[00:22:03] numbers because there were years like 2022 when
[00:22:07] there were significant numbers of people coming uh over the channel
[00:22:10] going down to going uh to towards November, depends
[00:22:14] in the short run
[00:22:15] it depends on the weather as well so I think uh we we'll just have to wait and
[00:22:19] see. Thank you, Claire, talk to me about social media and the
[00:22:22] responsibility these companies, because these mass protesters
[00:22:26] are seeing videos are being rallied around social
[00:22:29] media, and the gangs too are selling this vision of
[00:22:33] Britain to migrants to come here, how much responsibility do
[00:22:37] social media companies bear? I think that they they bear
[00:22:41] quite a lot of responsibility because they are essentially um a publisher, now
[00:22:44] they will seek to to differ from that and and will point out what
[00:22:48] laws people are breaking. is
[00:22:50] this illegal? so it's a really gray
[00:22:53] area. i worry that if you try and put too much legislation
[00:22:57] on it, you push it further into the dark where where you've got absolutely no
[00:23:00] control
[00:23:01] at all. so i think in some respects if it's there, you can see it and you can understand
[00:23:05] what you're dealing with, but unfortunately, as we all know that
[00:23:09] fake information goes around an awful lot quicker than fact, so this is where a
[00:23:13] lot these protests and lot the anger come from is that they're being told
[00:23:17] a story which may not actually be entirely true. so it it
[00:23:21] is very very difficult,
[00:23:22] I think yes they should shut some accounts down, but you will only then make a
[00:23:26] martter of those individuals and they become a much bigger success
[00:23:29] story because of it. Sebastian, talking of fake information, I
[00:23:33] saw new story this week in England that the Pakistan under 19
[00:23:37] cricket team who are here to play England under 19 a series of
[00:23:40] tests, their hotel. Word went around that
[00:23:44] migrants were staying in this hotel, people had seen a bus load of young
[00:23:48] Pakistani arriving at the hotel. tell their professional cricketers
[00:23:52] playing England and mob of 60 men turned up outside
[00:23:56] demanding to know if they were asylum seekers, that's where we are as a country, I'm afraid,
[00:24:00] and you heart back to Axel Ridber and the awful things he did a couple of summers
[00:24:03] ago, and the original rumors were that he was asylum seeker and he
[00:24:07] turned out to be have been born in this country, but it didn't stop the riots from spreading, it didn't stop people
[00:24:11] from saying awful things on social media, um, it is very,
[00:24:15] very easy because the level of fear and because the level of false
[00:24:18] information or indeed. information spun a slightly different way on social media
[00:24:22] but also within our traditional press um that that it clicks with people a certain
[00:24:26] way. this is its core very human story. it's not about numbers, it's not about reality,
[00:24:30] it's about how it makes people feel. if you say to somebody this tribe of people is going to break
[00:24:34] in and come for your tribe of people, that's going to have very visal effect and certain politicians
[00:24:38] use that incredibly successfully. meetna, just come in on social media,
[00:24:42] do you have any concerns about these companies that are allowing people to
[00:24:46] put out misinformation or indeed allowing criminal gangs?
[00:24:50] sell vision of Britain to would be
[00:24:52] migrants. I think it's it's hard to
[00:24:56] say what the solution to these matters would be as clear said there are
[00:25:00] threaded offs involved and there's no simple way to address it. What
[00:25:03] is clear is that social media has undoubtedly played a
[00:25:07] big role including uh in the small boats industry. We've
[00:25:11] seen several cases over the last few years when
[00:25:15] uh we saw spike arrivals from certain nationalities. There was a
[00:25:19] big spike in. Albanian arrivals back in
[00:25:21] 2022, there was another spike in Vietnamese
[00:25:25] arrivals in 2024. It does seem based on the
[00:25:29] evidence that these spikes were driven at least in
[00:25:32] part by social media campaign, targeting
[00:25:36] people from these countries, advertising cheap crossings
[00:25:40] and the potential benefits of getting to Britain, so it's a it's a tricky
[00:25:44] part of story, but it's something that the policy makers would have to to
[00:25:48] consider. Thank you. Claire. What does Andy Burnham do if you were
[00:25:51] him now? What would you be advising? It's it's really
[00:25:55] difficult because I don't think there is one answer that you can give that
[00:25:59] will solve this problem and successive governments have. different
[00:26:03] things, I think one important factor is -
[00:26:06] deterrent, and currently we have very little in the way of
[00:26:09] deterrant. I know that my party, the conservative party were
[00:26:13] very keen on Rwanda as a third country, but I
[00:26:17] was very critical of that, because it was ill thought through, but I do think that you need
[00:26:21] to work with partners in Europe and in the wider
[00:26:25] region to look at how you deal with the amounts of people
[00:26:28] coming across, where are they coming from, and just learning a little bit more about it, we've... got
[00:26:32] to stop worrying that we're talking to other countries,
[00:26:36] yes the United Kingdom is a stand-alone country in its own right, but we
[00:26:40] cannot do this alone and we have to have solution that is much more international.
[00:26:44] Sebastian, reform UK have their problems at the moment, there is
[00:26:47] investigation into allegations of foreign donation
[00:26:51] seeking, there's also a parliamentary investigation into Nigel Farage
[00:26:55] and he denies any wrong-doing as does the party, but this whole situation
[00:26:59] plays into their hands doesn't it in terms of... what the public
[00:27:03] think and what they want to hear from political leaders? oh, definitely, and anytime
[00:27:07] immigration is discussed in whatever way, whether there's reform representative there or
[00:27:10] not, it is good for them, because as long as that issue remains salient and it remains front
[00:27:14] of people's minds, and they are the people who are going to sweep up the the political goodwill
[00:27:18] from that. play, do you think that's why reform are so high in the poles
[00:27:21] still? i think it's got a lot to do with it. uh,
[00:27:25] people like to, they think that they're saying what
[00:27:29] the average person wants to hear, and i think it's plays well
[00:27:33] in some audiences, they have other details, so immigration is their
[00:27:37] one issue, and I think if you take that away, the party is left with very little
[00:27:41] else, and mehna, just talk to me about how migrants
[00:27:45] when they come ashore will be feeling if they see these gangs of mass young
[00:27:48] men turning up very aggressively. I
[00:27:52] think it's it's difficult to speak and and to relate that to
[00:27:56] that kind of situation. I think to a certain extent in
[00:28:00] in that immediate period after... arrival, it is a more limited
[00:28:04] problem, all those uh processing facilities at Mars
[00:28:07] and a round over, those tend to be
[00:28:11] relatively self-contained, what we have seen though
[00:28:14] is uh, in terms of intimidation happening
[00:28:18] around the country, once asylum seekers are dispersed,
[00:28:22] especially around hotels, hotels have been a focal
[00:28:26] point of protests over the last few years, now the number
[00:28:30] of active asylum hotels has gone down, significantly, we've seen
[00:28:34] a two-thirds decline in the number of asylum seekers in
[00:28:37] hotels over the last two years, that will
[00:28:40] keep that issue limited to a certain extent, but it's always been
[00:28:44] a moving target, and anything to do with with
[00:28:48] asylum seekers with small boats arrivals around the country,
[00:28:51] particularly in smaller communities, it's
[00:28:55] going to
[00:28:55] to be a significant point of tension. mina, thank you, and my thanks to clarent
[00:28:59] sebastian as well, remember you can see more discussion debate on our
[00:29:03] YouTube channel, just search for Roundtable TRT World, but for now from me and the
[00:29:07] Brady and all the team here, goodbye and thank you for
[00:29:10] watching,
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[00:29:58] Straight talk on TRT World.
[00:30:16] Saudi Arabia strikes in Yemen's Taiz province after hoothi
[00:30:20] attacks injured 13 civilians as fighting escalates across
[00:30:24] Yemen. Hello there and welcome to TRT World live from
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[00:30:42] deescalate the war if Russia does the same. As president Trump says
[00:30:46] that both sides have agreed to halt strikes on energy
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