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00:00:18These are the latest headlines
00:00:20from BBC News. 12 people are killed killed and hundreds injured in a
00:00:23a missile attack on Riyadh's international international airport. Saudi authorities
00:00:27authorities blamed the Houthis for for the attack, which is the deadliest
00:00:30deadliest in more than a decade. decade. President Trump says Ukraine
00:00:33Ukraine needs a new president who who can make a deal after President
00:00:36President Zelensky's criticism of
00:00:38of the US., Russia diesel deal, the
00:00:41the leader of India's Cockroach Janta Janta Party is released along with
00:00:44with two other senior leaders after after protests in Delhi. Earlier,
00:00:48Earlier, the police said thousands thousands of protesters detained detained on Saturday had also been
00:00:52been released. An investigation is is under way after a man who entered
00:00:56entered the tiger enclosure at Yorkshire Yorkshire Wildlife Park was mauled
00:00:59mauled to death. The park remains
00:01:00remains closed today and Manchester Manchester City face Liverpool later
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00:01:19business news from the boardroom boardroom or grassroots BBC News News cuts through the jargon to add
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00:01:33technology. Talking Business. Hello
00:01:37Hello and welcome to Talking Business. Business. Here's what's on the programme
00:01:39programme this week. The damage done
00:01:41done by diesel as high prices blight blight the global economy will ask
00:01:45ask if Europe can cut its long-term
00:01:48long-term dependence on imports of of this vital fuel war in the Middle
00:01:51Middle East. And Europe has redrawn redrawn the global energy map. But
00:01:54But is the damage to the global economy
00:01:57economy also here to stay? I'll hear
00:01:59hear from this trio of experts. The
00:02:02The European Commission's energy energy spokesperson tells me how
00:02:05how the continent can limit the damage
00:02:07damage from expensive diesel. This This expert on Chinese energy policy
00:02:11policy will explain what Beijing's Beijing's restrictions on exports
00:02:14exports mean for the rest of the the world, and this leading economist
00:02:17economist lays out what it might might mean for the global economy
00:02:20economy and how businesses and consumers consumers can make ends meet, and
00:02:24and the sound of European manufacturing.
00:02:26manufacturing. The boss of one high high end German audio firm tells
00:02:30tells me how he pitches his products
00:02:32products in China amid growing trade
00:02:35trade tensions. Welcome to the programme.
00:02:41programme. Our citizens need and
00:02:44and deserve affordable energy. Those Those words could come from any number
00:02:47number of politicians around the the world right now. They were though
00:02:50though the thoughts of EU Commission Commission President Ursula von der
00:02:53der Leyen after this month's agreement agreement by leaders of the G7 advanced
00:02:57advanced economies to release 100
00:02:59100 million barrels of oil and diesel diesel from their stockpiles amid
00:03:03amid the wars in the Middle East East and Ukraine. It marked the second
00:03:06second major release this year. It It happened because high energy prices
00:03:10prices continue to put pressure on on prices right across the global
00:03:13global economy. And that inflation inflation has meant the US Federal
00:03:17Federal Reserve and other central central banks have felt the need need to push up interest rates in
00:03:20in an effort to suck money out of
00:03:23of the economy. But why has diesel diesel in particular become such
00:03:26such a crisis? And what can be done done about it in the longer term?
00:03:30term? Given it's so important to to powering the global economy? Well,
00:03:33Well, diesel prices have been climbing
00:03:36climbing steadily in the United States, States, but it's been a similar picture
00:03:39picture in Europe and other parts parts of the world since the Iran
00:03:43Iran war started earlier this year. year. War damage to refineries and
00:03:46and other infrastructure in Russia Russia and the Middle East has redrawn
00:03:50redrawn the global diesel map with with a much bigger share now coming
00:03:54coming from the United States. That That has increased President Trump's
00:03:57Trump's leverage, perhaps explaining explaining why he was able to use
00:03:59use the threat of an export ban to
00:04:01to force that release of reserves reserves ahead of the US mid-term
00:04:05mid-term elections. Europe has a a lot of diesel, and they're going
00:04:09going to be making a major world
00:04:12world contribution. And so are we.
00:04:13we. And we're not going to be doing
00:04:16doing the export ban. We're going going to be doing what we're supposed
00:04:19supposed to do. But I did ask them them and they're going to we're going
00:04:22going to have a lot of oil very shortly, shortly, as soon as Iran ends, which
00:04:25which won't be long. It's not going going to be long. You're going to
00:04:28to have oil go down to the price
00:04:31price it was before, maybe even lower lower than I got it at the beginning.
00:04:35beginning. The EU is one part of of the world that's heavily reliant
00:04:38reliant on imported diesel, and nearly
00:04:40nearly 40% of its imports have been been coming from the US. And because
00:04:44because diesel powers most lorries,
00:04:46lorries, tractors and buses as well
00:04:49well as 38% of EU cars, its price
00:04:51price has had an impact right through through the economy. At a minimum,
00:04:54minimum, depending on the horsepower horsepower of the vehicle. Our costs
00:04:56costs can range from 350 a day to
00:04:59to as much as 600 a day for larger larger machines and bigger farms.
00:05:02farms. Can we keep going? No we can't. can't. We're at a standstill. We
00:05:05We should already have completed completed at least half of the work work needed to prepare for sowing
00:05:09sowing the seeds. But everything's everything's come to a halt. Fuel
00:05:11Fuel used to just be another expense. expense. Now it decides how long
00:05:15long I can work. A few years ago, ago, gas was cheaper. Now, with everything
00:05:18everything else increasing, I can
00:05:20can barely make ends meet. I've got
00:05:23got to travel to work 30 minutes
00:05:25minutes nearly around. I spent 200
00:05:29200 miles per week and that cost cost me so much just to go and coming
00:05:32coming back. At the moment I'm looking looking for something now remotely
00:05:36remotely just to save money because
00:05:38because it's ridiculous. I cannot
00:05:42cannot cope you know, either you you spend it on food or fuel. So
00:05:46So you've got to balance what's what
00:05:49what is the priority? Is it the food food for the family or is it the
00:05:52the petrol? So what difference will will that release of strategic reserves
00:05:56reserves make to businesses and consumers consumers across Europe who, as we've
00:06:00we've just heard, are struggling struggling with high energy prices?
00:06:02prices? I've been speaking to the
00:06:04the European Commission's energy
00:06:07energy spokesperson Anna-Kaisa Itkonen. Itkonen. Welcome to Talking Business. Business. Good to have you here.
00:06:11here. And maybe talk to me first first of all about that release of
00:06:14of strategic reserves. Why did it it take the United States and that
00:06:17that threat from President Trump Trump to encourage maybe force the
00:06:20the EU to release those reserves?
00:06:22reserves? The main thing is that
00:06:26that G7 leaders made a commitment
00:06:28commitment not to introduce any bans
00:06:30bans for from our point of view, view, European citizens need and
00:06:34and deserve affordable energy, and and this is now a step forward. Does
00:06:37Does that now mean that prices at at the pump will fall? Because we've
00:06:41we've seen the impact of higher energy
00:06:43energy and fuel and gas prices, but
00:06:45but particularly diesel is what is
00:06:47is of concern. It is true that diesel
00:06:50diesel prices have basically doubled. doubled. I'm talking about the prices
00:06:53prices in Europe. What we have been
00:06:55been seeing since the closure of
00:06:57of Strait of Hormuz. And we trust
00:07:00trust that the decision and the subsequent subsequent action that will be taken
00:07:03taken by International Energy Agency Agency and G7 will positively impact
00:07:07impact oil and oil product prices.
00:07:09prices. But obviously, from the European
00:07:11European perspective, as long as
00:07:13as we rely and import fossil fuels, fuels, we are obviously importing
00:07:17importing the shocks and crises that
00:07:19that come with them. What are the
00:07:21the levers that you can pull? To
00:07:24To make sure there is consistent consistent supply, but that prices
00:07:28prices are affordable? Because we we know that, particularly for diesel,
00:07:31diesel, it has huge repercussions repercussions for the wider economy.
00:07:33economy. It is true in Europe we
00:07:38we refine approximately 85% of our
00:07:40our own production. Our suppliers
00:07:44suppliers are well diversified across across global markets. So for US,
00:07:48US, we are already we're in a comfortable
00:07:51comfortable situation as regards regards getting supplies. But then then of course, as regards prices,
00:07:55prices, I mean, we're talking about about a global crisis. And then obviously
00:07:59obviously what we can do in the European
00:08:01European Commission is, is it has
00:08:03has its limits. So what we are going
00:08:05going to be doing now in short-term
00:08:08short-term is to ensure for Europeans Europeans that we take all the measures,
00:08:12measures, including temporary state state aid framework, that we are are going to be prolonging. We are
00:08:16are going to postpone our methane methane regulation by one year. So
00:08:19So these are the type of measures, measures, what we really are facing
00:08:22facing now is a crisis of high energy energy prices. What we are facing
00:08:25facing now is an affordability crisis. crisis. And I suppose for the right
00:08:29right price, anything can be made made available. I suppose that's
00:08:32that's the issue. Maybe in that focus focus on renewables. We all took
00:08:36took our eye off of the affordability
00:08:39affordability of supply of fossil fossil fuels. And that's why we're we're facing the challenge that we
00:08:43we face today, isn't it? That is
00:08:45is correct. And when we look at the
00:08:48the consumer prices for electricity, electricity, for example, in our
00:08:51our member states, the lowest prices, prices, consumer prices are in those
00:08:55those member states where the energy
00:08:57energy mix is mostly clean, meaning meaning renewables and nuclear. So
00:09:00So there is also a clear economic economic incentive to move towards
00:09:04towards cleaner energies. But obviously obviously this is the longer term
00:09:07term strategy. And now it is possibly possibly going to be a very difficult
00:09:11difficult winter as such. So therefore therefore we are now also focusing
00:09:15focusing on the shorter term measures
00:09:17measures that can have bite immediately. immediately. Anna-Kaisa Itkonen thank thank you for being on the programme
00:09:21programme with us this week. It's It's good to talk to you. Thank you
00:09:23you for having me. Thanks a lot. lot. On the other side of the world,
00:09:27world, China continues to have a a huge influence on global energy
00:09:30energy markets. It suspended most most refined fuel exports for October
00:09:34October as the country prioritises prioritises domestic supply along
00:09:38along with the US., China is one one of the world's major producers
00:09:41producers of diesel. So what impact impact could it have on the already
00:09:45already under pressure diesel price? price? My next guest is an expert
00:09:48expert on Chinese energy policy at
00:09:50at the Oxford Institute for Energy
00:09:52Energy Studies. Doctor Michal Meidan, Meidan, welcome to Talking Business.
00:09:55Business. Good to have you here. here. And maybe explain this first
00:09:58first of all, that China is one of of the biggest producers of diesel
00:10:02diesel in the world, yet it's enforced enforced an export ban. Why? So I
00:10:05I think you have to trace the ban
00:10:07ban back to March when the crisis
00:10:10crisis first started. And that was
00:10:11was about maintaining domestic supply
00:10:14supply security as the months went went by and Chinese government realised
00:10:17realised that they had enough for
00:10:19for domestic supplies, then they they increased exports. Now we're
00:10:23we're coming up. Well, this week week is the national holiday. There's
00:10:27There's a lot of travel. There's There's a lot of expectations of of more industrial activity in China.
00:10:30China. So the government has actually actually put a temporary pause on
00:10:34on exports again to maintain domestic domestic supply security. Yeah. And
00:10:38And is that about that diesel being being used right now, or is this
00:10:41this about making sure that there's there's enough in reserve in their
00:10:45their stockpiles to boost them, given given what we've seen in the Middle
00:10:47Middle East. Both. So the really really the idea was when refiners
00:10:51refiners were allowed to export over
00:10:53over the summer, it was on the condition condition that domestic stockpiles
00:10:57stockpiles would be enough because because China, like many other countries
00:11:00countries around the world and many many other buyers around the world world just don't know how long this
00:11:03this crisis is going to last. So
00:11:06So what are the implications then
00:11:08then for the customers of that Chinese Chinese diesel, particularly? I think
00:11:11think the European Union. So the the European Union is sort of a second
00:11:14second order effect. The primary primary customers of Chinese exports
00:11:18exports are really Asian countries, countries, Singapore. But Singapore
00:11:21Singapore is a transit hub. The Philippines, Philippines, Myanmar, Bangladesh,
00:11:25Bangladesh, Australia. And so the the impacts are actually quite differentiated.
00:11:29differentiated. If you think about about Australia for example needs
00:11:32needs diesel but also jet in Bangladesh Bangladesh in lower income countries,
00:11:36countries, it's very much about the the running of the economy and people's
00:11:39people's daily lives. So they're they're very much suffering from
00:11:41from the lack of exports. Now this
00:11:44this is a global market. So if Asian
00:11:47Asian countries don't have enough, enough, that increases prices from
00:11:49from everyone. Europe is impacted impacted because there are higher
00:11:52higher prices and because Europe Europe has lost Russian diesel exports.
00:11:56exports. And so it's all going into into a global pool that's making
00:11:59making prices higher. And there had had been hopes that China may have
00:12:02have played a pivotal role in making making sure that there was continuity
00:12:06continuity of supply. Are those hopes hopes now dashed with this export
00:12:10export ban in place? I think the the export ban is temporary, but
00:12:13but I also think we have to sort sort of bear in mind that China is
00:12:16is a relatively small exporter of of diesel. Europe is a big is a bigger
00:12:20bigger producer as is India, a bigger bigger exporters of diesel. But,
00:12:24But, again, every drop matters right
00:12:26right now. And is this politics or
00:12:29or is it about economics? It's about about logistics of keeping the Chinese
00:12:32Chinese economy going. Or is this this about something bigger? Another
00:12:36Another front in that big trade war war that China and the US and the
00:12:39the European Union and big trading
00:12:41trading blocs are facing right now? I think this is very much sort
00:12:44sort of energy security and domestic domestic economics and logistics.
00:12:48logistics. Chinese refiners demand demand sort of would love to export
00:12:51export more because of the prices prices of diesel on the global market
00:12:54market are so high, they'd actually actually fetch a nice margin and
00:12:57and that would be great for them. them. So they would like to export.
00:13:00export. But the government is looking
00:13:02looking after the domestic supply supply situation. There's been a
00:13:06a lot of talk that China has underused
00:13:08underused refining capacity and could could actually increase its refinery
00:13:12refinery runs, right? So it could could process more crude and help help out the international market.
00:13:16market. Of course, you have to buy buy the crude oil that goes into
00:13:19into those refineries, and that's that's quite expensive right now.
00:13:22now. And not all of China's refineries
00:13:24refineries are able to export. So So it's not a particularly nimble
00:13:27nimble or economically efficient efficient system. And we sometimes
00:13:30sometimes overlook that. Doctor Michal Michal Meidan, it's good to talk talk to you on the programme this
00:13:34this week. Thank you. Thank you. you. So how does all of this tie
00:13:38tie together for the global economy economy and those ambitions? Many
00:13:41Many politicians have to bring inflation inflation down to the 2% target that
00:13:45that is set by their central banks. banks. That would, of course, ease
00:13:48ease the cost of living crisis that that millions are facing right now.
00:13:52now. I've been catching up with a a renowned economist who was the
00:13:55the deputy director of the International International Monetary Fund and is
00:13:58is now chief economic adviser at
00:14:00at the insurance giant Allianz doctor doctor Muhammed El-Erian, good to
00:14:04to talk to you on the programme this
00:14:05this week. And we're looking at higher higher diesel prices, higher energy
00:14:09energy prices right around the world. world. But let's focus on diesel
00:14:13diesel and what impact that has on on the wider economy when prices
00:14:16prices are at the sort of levels levels that we're seeing today. It
00:14:20It has a huge economic impact, social
00:14:22social impact and political impact
00:14:26impact economically, everything we
00:14:27we buy in a shop has a diesel fuel
00:14:30fuel element to it. Transportation Transportation is absolutely key.
00:14:33key. That uses mainly diesel farming.
00:14:35farming. It is all over the economy. economy. It's a price we don't normally
00:14:39normally look at, but now it's the the first price I check every morning.
00:14:43morning. It has a social impact too too because it hits the lower income
00:14:47income households particularly hard, hard, and then you get the political
00:14:50political impact. It adds to this
00:14:53this affordability pressure that's that's driving a lot of the politics politics we're seeing around the
00:14:56the world. But this is an everyday everyday cost, isn't it? And already
00:15:00already coming on top of a cost of
00:15:01of living crisis. It is. And it's
00:15:04it's ironic because you will hear,
00:15:06hear, for example, the US President
00:15:09President saying that the tanker tanker flow out of the Middle East
00:15:12East is back to pre-war level. And And that's true for crude oil. The
00:15:16The problem is refined products. products. And there's two issues
00:15:19issues here. One is the flow out
00:15:21out is at about 50% of what it was.
00:15:24was. And secondly, refineries are
00:15:26are not operating the way they should
00:15:28should be. So suddenly it is refined
00:15:31refined products that become important. important. And the most important important of all refined product
00:15:35product is diesel because its impact impact is so widespread. Traditionally,
00:15:38Traditionally, of course, central central banks would raise interest
00:15:40interest rates to try and keep a a lid on rising prices to tackle
00:15:44tackle inflation. But you're suggesting suggesting that this time around
00:15:48around it's very different and they they shouldn't do that. First of
00:15:51of all, it won't do anything for
00:15:52for the supply of diesel. Second,
00:15:56Second, it's the wrong policy response. response. The right policy response
00:16:00response is a fiscal adjustment and and the advantage of a fiscal adjustment
00:16:04adjustment is it helps a second price. price. That's really problematic problematic all over the world right
00:16:08right now. And that is government
00:16:10government bond yields, which defines
00:16:13defines what our mortgages cost, cost, how much corporate lending
00:16:16lending costs. So if the government government doesn't reduce its claim,
00:16:19claim, we're going to see interest interest rates continuing to go up.
00:16:22up. And that's going to add yet another another leg to the affordability
00:16:26affordability crisis that a lot of of people are feeling. And which which taxes would you look at changing
00:16:30changing as part of that fiscal response?
00:16:33response? So it varies enormously enormously from country to country.
00:16:37country. In some cases, you're able
00:16:39able to raise the income tax on the
00:16:42the wealthiest part of the population.
00:16:45population. In other cases, like like the UK, there's a case for an
00:16:49an extra levy on banks. It really
00:16:51really does vary from country to
00:16:53to country. And many of these countries
00:16:56countries can benefit from more efficient efficient and rational expenditure.
00:17:00expenditure. You know, I'm not saying saying it's easy. It requires political
00:17:04political leadership, but better
00:17:05better do it now than when you have
00:17:08have a crisis. And if you look around around the world, there are three
00:17:12three G7 economies that are particularly particularly vulnerable. And who who would have thought a G7 economy
00:17:15economy would be vulnerable? And And that is France. We see what's what's happening in France, Japan
00:17:19Japan and the UK. You say that better
00:17:22better to do now than before. We're We're in a crisis. Is this not a
00:17:26a crisis already. By a crisis I mean
00:17:30mean that financial instability and
00:17:34and prices start hurting the real real economy in a fundamental way.
00:17:38way. So let's assume that these affordability
00:17:41affordability pressures persist. persist. What's going to happen? happen? What economists call demand
00:17:45demand destruction. People will buy
00:17:47buy less, people will not be able
00:17:49able to afford what they have. Companies
00:17:52Companies seeing this will invest invest less. And next thing you know, know, you're getting closer to either
00:17:56either stall speed, meaning the economy
00:17:58economy slows down and is very, very
00:18:01very exposed to recession. We don't don't want to get there. So what
00:18:04what is the solution here? What happens happens next? They take a page from
00:18:07from what you've been advocating advocating to others for such a long
00:18:11long time. Fiscal responsibility
00:18:13responsibility matters. Economic Economic growth matters, productivity
00:18:17productivity growth matters. And And this all can be done through
00:18:19through policies. It just requires requires political leadership. Doctor Doctor Muhammed El-Erian really good
00:18:23good to talk to you. Good to get get your insight this week. Thank
00:18:26Thank you so much. Thank you. Still
00:18:28Still to come after the break why
00:18:30why Made in Berlin is music to Chinese
00:18:32Chinese ears. The boss of a top German
00:18:35German audio firm tells me why high
00:18:37high end prices aren't drowning his his company out of a competitive
00:19:41will it all mean for Europe's economy? economy? That's this week on Talking
00:19:45Talking Business here on BBC News.
00:19:58News. Welcome back to Talking Business. Business. Now if you think of home
00:20:01home audio products, you may think
00:20:03think of China and no wonder it's
00:20:06it's estimated 80% of such products
00:20:08products are manufactured there. there. But there are exceptions.
00:20:11exceptions. Burmester is one of Germany's Germany's best known high end audio
00:20:14audio brands. It makes all of its its products in Berlin and sells
00:20:17sells them all over the world, even
00:20:20even in China. But China's domestic
00:20:22domestic brands are becoming increasingly
00:20:25increasingly innovative and so can can European manufacturing and heritage
00:20:29heritage compete with a new high high tech players? I've been speaking
00:20:32speaking to Burmester chief executive executive Thorsten Poenig. Welcome
00:20:35Welcome to Talking Business. Good Good to have you here. And look,
00:20:38look, if someone's not heard of the the company, what is it that you
00:20:41you do? Burmester is or has the privilege
00:20:45privilege for almost 50 years now
00:20:46now to build some of the most sophisticated
00:20:50sophisticated and prestigious stereo stereo systems in the world, equipping
00:20:54equipping some of the most beautiful beautiful cars in the world with
00:20:57with sound, with music. That's what
00:20:59what we do from a source, a device
00:21:02device to a speaker. And who are are you selling them to? Because
00:21:05Because already I get a sense that that these don't come cheap, do they?
00:21:08they? They come with a lot of quality quality and this quality comes at
00:21:12at a certain price. That's correct. correct. Nevertheless, the let's
00:21:15let's say the bandwidth of customers
00:21:17customers is huge. We have very wealthy wealthy people, of course, among
00:21:21among our customers, but we also also have people in them always proud
00:21:24proud when I see this that come here here with their kind of working gear
00:21:27gear and they really save their money money to be able to afford a component
00:21:31component or a system of ours to to enrich their life with the way way they want to experience their
00:21:35their music with. OK, so tell me me if I brought my car to you and
00:21:38and I said, kit it up with a good good sound system. Torsten how much
00:21:41much is it going to set me back roughly? roughly? Well, it sets you back the
00:21:44the entire price of the car because because we are not doing anything
00:21:48anything after sales. We are supplying
00:21:52supplying Mercedes AMG, Porsche Maybach,
00:21:56Maybach, Ferrari with systems and and they are built in from the factory.
00:22:00factory. But we are not doing any any after sales systems. So I regret
00:22:04regret when you will have to go with with a completely new car. OK, I
00:22:06I take your point. Maybe I can't can't afford the car, but you know,
00:22:09know, give me a sense. What does does a system like this cost? How
00:22:13How much would it set me back? The The surcharge of Burmester system
00:22:16system in a car is between 1,000
00:22:201,000 and 8 or 9000. So it's a lot
00:22:23lot less than actually than the home home components or the integrated
00:22:26integrated components that we're we're that we are doing. But it's it's a completely different system.
00:22:30system. It's a completely different different quantity, of course. And
00:22:32And as well as cars, you put them them in people's houses as well.
00:22:35well. And that's an important market market for you, isn't it? It is.
00:22:38is. It is where we are coming from from actually. And today we're one
00:22:41one of the few companies that is
00:22:44is supplying and manufacturing every every type of device in this industry,
00:22:47industry, from a turntable to speakers
00:22:49speakers to amplifiers to music servers.
00:22:52servers. Basically anything. Where Where in the world are you selling
00:22:55selling as well? Where are your customers customers right now? I guess there
00:22:58there are audio lovers all over the the world, but where are key markets
00:23:01markets for your business? Since Since Germany is our domestic market,
00:23:04market, Germany is still a relevant
00:23:06relevant market for US, but it has
00:23:09has been outrun by the United States
00:23:13States and especially by China. Asia Asia in general is a very strong
00:23:16strong region for us. We have founded founded our own entities in the United
00:23:20United States and this year also also in China to expand our business
00:23:23business there and fulfilling the the promise that comes with Burmester
00:23:26Burmester when it comes to experience experience also around the product,
00:23:30product, we had to go this step. step. How challenging is the Chinese
00:23:34Chinese market for you, though, as as an outsider going to a place that
00:23:37that I think makes about 80% of the
00:23:40the world's audio equipment. It is
00:23:41is a very tough market to be in.
00:23:44in. Luckily, the Chinese customers customers appreciate the quality
00:23:47quality that we are providing and and the challenge comes with the
00:23:51the lack of patience of the customers. customers. The Chinese customers,
00:23:54customers, more than any other customer
00:23:56customer in the world, wants to be
00:23:59be quick with getting his or her her individual product. So also in
00:24:02in order to adapt to this demand,
00:24:06demand, we had to found our entity
00:24:07entity there. And do you worry that
00:24:10that as a business trading with the the US and China, but being based
00:24:13based there in Europe, you end up up getting caught up. You're collateral
00:24:17collateral damage in the huge trade trade disputes between three huge
00:24:20huge trading blocs. We don't know know what the future brings. Of course, course, you're right. There is a
00:24:24a lot of tension when it comes to
00:24:25to this. What I can say at the moment
00:24:28moment is that it's running very
00:24:30very well. Also on a daily basis
00:24:33basis when it comes to financial financial transactions, when it comes
00:24:36comes to delivering shipping products
00:24:39products everything is well in place
00:24:41place and things down there are running
00:24:45running well. When you adapt to the
00:24:48the rules and this is what we do do right now. Those threats of things
00:24:52things like tariffs from the White White House have a big effect on
00:24:55on firms that are importing and exporting. exporting. I mean, what has it meant
00:24:58meant for you? For US, the situation
00:25:02situation turned out positively because
00:25:05because our the category of products products that we are doing is at
00:25:08at a 10% tariff and we could compensate
00:25:12compensate this in the market through
00:25:13through adapting prices through taking
00:25:16taking some of the tariffs and on
00:25:19on our shoulders. So the growth in
00:25:22in the market and the still existing
00:25:24existing high demand for our product
00:25:28product over there. Made this situation
00:25:31situation by far not as serious as
00:25:35as we were fearing it initially. initially. Thorsten Poenig really
00:25:38really good to talk to you on the the programme this week. My pleasure.
00:25:42pleasure. Thanks for having me. That's That's all for this week. You can can keep up to date with all the
00:25:46the latest on the global economy economy on the BBC News website and
00:25:49and app. But until next time, thanks thanks for watching and we'll see
00:25:52see you soon. Bye-bye.
00:29:31MUSIC
00:29:44Being able. To inspire someone
00:29:46is always the greatest joy. I saw saw Souza one
00:29:54Saw Souza one time at the Grammys and she said that she studied studied some of my songs for their
00:29:58their songwriting, and I thought thought that that was the biggest biggest compliment ever. My support support for Ukraine is unwavering.
00:30:01unwavering. It is 100% when the big
00:30:02big names talk, they talk to us.
00:30:08us. MUSIC
00:30:14MUSIC Live Live from London. This is BBC News.
00:30:18News. 12 people are killed and hundreds hundreds injured in a missile attack
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