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00:00:00what you're doing, and we certainly want there to be a final
00:00:03convoy, but not because we no longer have the strength or
00:00:06desire to go to Ukraine, but because we will hear one day that
00:00:10that's it, the war is over, and evil
00:00:13is defeated. Thank you for this support, Mr.
00:00:17Oleksandr, thank you for what you also do. I would like to remind our viewers
00:00:20that the guests of our studio were Oleksandr Yatsyna, founder of the charity foundation
00:00:24"Mercy and Health", and Everard Van Zuylen, representative of
00:00:28B for Ukraine, who... help,
00:00:32bring cars to Ukraine that help save lives, these are
00:00:35reanimobiles, which are especially needed now in the
00:00:39east of the country. The 24th humanitarian convoy from
00:00:42Belgium. We thank our friends for such
00:00:45support. And let me remind you that you are now watching
00:00:48the main program on the Espresso TV channel. Olesya Vakulyuk, Roman Chaika, we are working
00:00:52in this studio for you. Now let's talk a little about how to preserve our
00:00:55past, which is necessary to understand
00:00:59who we are in our future. We will talk about preserving
00:01:02the memory, about the house- museum of Patriarch
00:01:06Mstyslav, which is currently being prepared for sale in Poltava.
00:01:08Patriarch Mstyslav Skrypnyk, for those
00:01:11people who may not be very familiar with the history of Ukraine,
00:01:15we will tell you who he is,
00:01:18the nephew of Symon Petliura, so this is
00:01:22Poltava region, we do not forget, there
00:01:24is finally a monument to the chief
00:01:27Otaman. Actually, yes, we will talk about this now with
00:01:30Valeriy Karpontsov, Doctor of Law, Professor of the Department of Law and
00:01:34Public Administration of KNBU, State Counselor of Justice of the third
00:01:37class and People's Deputy of Ukraine of the seventh and eighth convocations is already with us
00:01:41on the line. Mr. Valeriy, we welcome you. Hello,
00:01:44I welcome you, glad
00:01:48to see you. One clarification, I no longer teach at KNBU, but
00:01:51everything else is correct. Okay, we'll tell our guest
00:01:55editors. Nevertheless, you know,
00:01:58if you say now... well, a house, some house, an old
00:02:02house, standing somewhere in Poltava region, what difference does it make to
00:02:05all of Ukraine in the time of a full-scale invasion?
00:02:08Let's deal with this later, somewhere sometime, when the war
00:02:11ends. Why is this important? Why is it important to talk about this
00:02:15now and why is it important to preserve this house
00:02:18of Patriarch Mstyslav?
00:02:21Well, I am sure that most Ukrainians understand that this
00:02:25war is existential, it is for
00:02:28the survival of the Ukrainian nation. Ukrainians
00:02:31and Ukrainian identity,
00:02:34accordingly. That scoundrel Putin, he wants to destroy
00:02:38Ukraine as a state, and Ukrainians as a nation, in order to appropriate
00:02:42to himself what he wants to conquer not only
00:02:45materially, but also mentally. You know
00:02:49that Kyiv Rus bothers him
00:02:52because it is Kyiv, it is absolutely not
00:02:56Muscovite, and part of our spiritual history... and
00:03:00spiritual heritage is also an important, important foundation
00:03:04of our nation. Patriarch Mstyslav, as you have already noted,
00:03:07is our Ukrainian
00:03:10Patriarch. He, himself, in addition to being
00:03:14a clergyman, was also an active fighter for our
00:03:17restoration of independence during the times of
00:03:20the UNR, Ukrainian statehood. Yes, indeed, he
00:03:23is Symon Petliura's nephew, but in history he
00:03:27is more known not as a military ensign, but as a spiritual
00:03:30figure who is quite revered around
00:03:33the world, not only by Ukrainians. He was born in
00:03:36Poltava region, and this building, this house, in
00:03:40which he was born, you are showing it now. Indeed,
00:03:44it is not just a neglected house,
00:03:47which we see, unfortunately, like
00:03:50many things in our neglected
00:03:53history, but it is a symbol. When this house
00:03:57is destroyed, not just wood will be destroyed, not just...
00:04:04those windows, or curtains, a part of institutional memory will be destroyed. In order to
00:04:07prevent this from happening, this building must be preserved, and
00:04:10specifically preserved not just as a building, but as a museum.
00:04:13When you said that we have
00:04:15an existential conflict,
00:04:19and for Putin, as a Chekist,
00:04:23it is important to finally resolve the Ukrainian question. From this
00:04:26we saw the destruction of museums, the theft of
00:04:29our... monuments, the burning of books, and
00:04:32attacks on schooling. We understand all of this,
00:04:36but it was not Putin who brought the house-museum
00:04:39of Patriarch Mstyslav to this terrible state. And
00:04:43right away, who decided to
00:04:47sell it through an auction? That was also not
00:04:50Putin. Please answer these two questions. Well, that's why
00:04:52I drew attention, well, I'm trying
00:04:56to draw attention to myself in the first place... then to friends on
00:05:00social networks. Thank God, you
00:05:03responded and thank you sincerely for your initiative,
00:05:06because indeed, it was not Putin who destroyed it,
00:05:10it was us who neglected it, unfortunately.
00:05:14This house is on the balance sheet of municipal
00:05:17property of the city council, but the city council
00:05:20justifies the sale by saying that it cannot cope
00:05:24with arranging a museum, and therefore it is looking for a private
00:05:27owner. There are 75.5
00:05:30square meters of space, you can't arrange anything there except a museum.
00:05:34It needs to be a person, or
00:05:37perhaps a legal entity, but there must be
00:05:41an owner. The owner must be a patriot who would
00:05:45know what he is doing, or it would logically be for the church
00:05:49to take care of it. It's not a poor organization, we know that. Well,
00:05:52so...
00:05:55scenarios, Mr. Valeriy, look, there are three scenarios. You mentioned
00:05:59a philanthropist who understands and realizes this and will invest his
00:06:03funds. You mentioned a scenario where it's the church,
00:06:07with the money of the church community, but the question still remains, why
00:06:10in your opinion, didn't the city authorities do this with the municipal
00:06:14budget? I just love Poltava,
00:06:17I know it well. Well, when it was necessary to clean up, as
00:06:21they say, the two-headed eagles
00:06:24on the Moscow churches, there was money. When it was time to arrange
00:06:28the column of Peter the First, it was also
00:06:31all in gold and money. Yes, I mean all this
00:06:35cult of Russian history, the Battle of Poltava and everything else
00:06:39that Putin loves so much, there was always money for that.
00:06:43Well, this is really a shame, and
00:06:46our current activity is a struggle against
00:06:49inferiority, which, unfortunately, prevents us from preserving
00:06:52our shrines or our memory in a timely manner
00:06:54and keeping them in proper condition. This inferiority must be
00:06:58overcome, petty racism, this servitude, and perhaps
00:07:02then we will do everything on time. The city council,
00:07:05well, maybe a lot went to paving stones or indeed to something
00:07:08else, there is not enough for the museum. This also
00:07:11raises, well... many questions for
00:07:14the deputies, for the municipal community of Poltava
00:07:17as a whole, because after all, well, perhaps they know little
00:07:21about the patriarch, about his contribution to our
00:07:25spiritual historical heritage, and therefore they are silent, perhaps.
00:07:28I don't know, the state, I know that the Institute
00:07:32of National Memory is concerned about this issue,
00:07:36specifically Mr. Alforov, and perhaps, well, he is now
00:07:40trying to find state mechanisms to
00:07:43take it under the possible
00:07:47patronage of our Ministry of Culture, yes, well, God
00:07:51knows, but I am
00:07:54trying myself to find
00:07:57businessmen who took part in this English
00:08:00auction, which is ongoing, which ends, well, on
00:08:03October 28th, I think.
00:08:06It's a closed English auction, in order not to lose,
00:08:10you understand? I have seen a lot in
00:08:13my life, how under
00:08:16the guise of, you know,
00:08:19allocating land for the museum of the history of Kyiv,
00:08:22land was allocated supposedly for a museum, but then it turned out that it was just
00:08:26a company, and Chernovetsky allocated such land to
00:08:29his controlled structure on Khreshchatyk, and I saw that, and
00:08:32well, moreover, the private owner, he will acquire ownership of this building, he
00:08:36will not just immediately, well, like with Harry Potter's wand,
00:08:40create a museum, yes, it will take some time. We are currently
00:08:43at war. Will he do any
00:08:46actions, or not, or will it just collapse, and then
00:08:50the land will simply be freed up, you understand? I have
00:08:53seen, we have seen in Kyiv, this place where this house-museum stands,
00:08:57for Poltava, for people who are not from
00:09:00Poltava, how much it is, I don't know,
00:09:04for Poltava residents themselves, rather, we should have asked
00:09:07Poltava residents, they understand this issue better. For me, it's
00:09:10absolutely incomprehensible
00:09:12whether this is a desirable piece for development, but in Kyiv I have seen dozens
00:09:16of times, and Roman will not let me lie either, when
00:09:20buildings burned, and Zelensky's estate,
00:09:23Zelensky's, also such an interesting,
00:09:26yes, here's a parallel. It was
00:09:30a historical building, it burned down, and now there will be construction
00:09:33on its place. This is from recent times, dozens
00:09:36burned down, and such a practice unfortunately operates here, no one
00:09:40bears responsibility, and therefore I am ringing all the bells I can.
00:09:44And I also wanted to once again call on the church to address Epiphanius, I don't
00:09:48know, I sent a message to Metropolitan Zari
00:09:51on an old phone, but there is no answer from him. Well, maybe
00:09:55I will tell him after our conversation, possibly,
00:09:58possibly. In
00:10:002021, I know the local diocese
00:10:04was collecting something at an auction, collecting money. Well,
00:10:07then it was obviously the Kyiv Patriarchate, but it's funny, they collected 5 thousand
00:10:11hryvnias. Well, judging by the condition of the house,
00:10:14where did the 500 hryvnias go?
00:10:18It's really terrible, well, I'm in shock myself. Your
00:10:21colleague is shaking her head, I really feel like crying.
00:10:26We are short on time, but I hope that we have been
00:10:29heard. We also ask everyone who can help. You mentioned
00:10:32the Institute of National Memory, the government might find something,
00:10:35100 million was found
00:10:38for the single telethon, so maybe they could allocate something here. In
00:10:42short, we ask all people of good
00:10:45will to respond to this story, but I wanted to ask you only one thing:
00:10:49do you see that the situation has changed? Because this
00:10:52is a very Poltava... a tricky story. We saw
00:10:56resistance, resistance, for example,
00:10:59to honoring the memory of Hetman Ivan Mazepa,
00:11:03a Poltava native. We saw resistance regarding Petliura, a Poltava native.
00:11:07Has the situation changed now, when
00:11:10we are again talking about the native of Poltava,
00:11:13Patriarch Mstyslav? Has anything
00:11:16changed in people's minds? Well, I think the condition of this
00:11:20building speaks for itself about what's in people's minds.
00:11:23That's all, unfortunately. Mr. Valeriy, thank you for sounding the alarm.
00:11:27You initiated such an important matter. Valeriy
00:11:30Karpontsov, Doctor of Law,
00:11:33a politician, People's Deputy
00:11:36of Ukraine.
00:11:39Yes, we talked about the house-museum
00:11:42that can be sold in Poltava. This is the house-museum
00:11:46of Patriarch Mstyslav, and this might even be a good decision. The main thing
00:11:50is who will control it so that it doesn't become a targeted demolition
00:11:54of the house-museum.
00:12:03We must do everything possible to preserve it, because it is the preservation of our identity,
00:12:07which Vladimir Putin is trying to destroy. Yuriy Romaniuk,
00:12:11expert on international issues, head of the all-Ukrainian public organization "Ukraine in NATO," is with us
00:12:14on the line. Mr. Yuriy, we greet you. Hello, good
00:12:17evening, Mrs. Lesia, Mr. Roman, glad to see you. They didn't let us calmly conduct
00:12:21the program, they just poked something with a finger
00:12:25in the trash, and now we can't understand if it's true or
00:12:28false. The world of fantasy says that there is an energy
00:12:32truce between Ukraine and Russia, two sides allegedly
00:12:36agreed to it. In short, well, Zelensky
00:12:39replied that he hears about it for the first time, it's very strange to
00:12:42hear. This means that Washington and Moscow agreed on something
00:12:45behind Kyiv's back, and if it's
00:12:48true, then Ukraine is allegedly ready to support an energy
00:12:52truce on condition that Russia does not destroy
00:12:55energy facilities inside Ukraine. If
00:12:58Russia does not destroy energy
00:13:01facilities inside Ukraine, well, we understand that this is again
00:13:05another statement by Trump, not
00:13:08yet confirmed by any facts and evidence, and
00:13:12Ukraine... Mr. Yuriy, the Americans at
00:13:16this very moment, as they say, while we are asking you, Axios
00:13:19found out, and
00:13:22Axios writes, Zelensky stated
00:13:25that he first heard about the cessation of attacks on energy infrastructure, which
00:13:29Trump announced, well, actually
00:13:32from the media.
00:13:35Well, this is the story, he married me without me, and here
00:13:39Ukraine finds out that it agreed on something, and the Iranians also
00:13:42learn a lot from Trump's statements that they agreed on something, that they want
00:13:46peace, and we heard a lot from Trump that Putin very
00:13:50much wants peace and an end to the war, so these statements should be
00:13:54treated not even philosophically, but
00:13:57clinically. But what is Trump counting on
00:14:00when he makes such statements? Is he making them
00:14:04for us, for the Russians, or is he making them for his
00:14:07voters again? He is making them, you correctly said, for November
00:14:113rd. His rating has fallen to 30-31%,
00:14:14in Congress the gap between Democrats and
00:14:18Republicans is in favor of Democrats, sociology
00:14:21shows at least 9 to 11%.
00:14:25Percentage points, I emphasize, this means that the difference in mandates will be
00:14:28more than 40 mandates. Currently, there are only four mandates,
00:14:31Republicans defeat Democrats in the current Congress, in
00:14:35the next one, Democrats may defeat Republicans
00:14:38by 40-45 mandates, this is what it means in terms of
00:14:42absolute numbers. Therefore, this is and
00:14:45Republicans will most likely completely lose the Senate,
00:14:49meaning Democrats will take full
00:14:52control of both the Senate and Congress. Houses.
00:14:56And as soon as they take the oath in the first week
00:14:59of January 2027, the new parliament will
00:15:03adopt new laws, including one that will cancel
00:15:07this agreement, it is unclear
00:15:10what the legal status is between Trump and Putin,
00:15:13between Washington and Moscow regarding the purchase of diesel,
00:15:17because the current legislation, which
00:15:20was adopted back in 2022,
00:15:23literally within the first weeks, months of the war, during
00:15:27Biden's cadence,
00:15:30directly prohibits the US from buying any oil
00:15:33and oil products from Russia, if Russia
00:15:37does not fulfill a whole list of corresponding requirements. This is not the case, and now
00:15:41both chambers of the US Congress
00:15:44have prepared bills that they must
00:15:47vote on, which will completely negate these statements by Trump and this
00:15:51agreement by Putin, which will not allow, in essence, in
00:15:54the US it is impossible to even clear customs, what they say, that tomorrow a
00:15:57tanker will arrive allegedly with diesel fuel from Russia, which
00:16:01left back on September 18,
00:16:04September 23, but it's not with diesel, Mr. Yuriy, there is already...
00:16:07Yes, let me, let me finish.
00:16:11Allegedly, I said allegedly with diesel, in fact, there are no
00:16:15yellow documents, no documents confirming that it is diesel, they even say
00:16:18that it could be mineral fertilizers. So, on September 19,
00:16:22Trump signed, by the way, so that our
00:16:25viewers know, the Lindsey Graham law. That is,
00:16:29the day before signing the Lindsey Graham law,
00:16:33Trump agreed with Putin, already knew that Russia from Leningrad
00:16:36was sending to the United States of
00:16:40America a tanker, well, most likely with mineral fertilizers, and
00:16:43now Trump calls it fuel, diesel
00:16:46fuel. He wants to allegedly calm down his voters three weeks before
00:16:50the catastrophic defeat in the midterm elections. His
00:16:53rating is very low, within 30-31%
00:16:57support, this is an absolute failure of all candidates from
00:17:00the Republicans, who are now distancing themselves, conducting
00:17:03their election campaigns from Trump's name and not showing their
00:17:06photos anywhere. With Trump, but leading their election
00:17:10campaign independently, so as not to
00:17:12fail, and all key Republican
00:17:16states, including Texas, may for
00:17:19the first time in 100 years, uh,
00:17:23where Democrats can win in districts that they have never won in over 100 years,
00:17:27meaning this is a huge catastrophe for Republicans and for Trump, so he
00:17:30made this whole deal with Putin. In fact,
00:17:34he is not going to buy any diesel fuel from Russia, because... the USA
00:17:38is the largest exporter of diesel fuel in the world, they
00:17:41sell the most diesel fuel to Europe,
00:17:45Russia, which does not have diesel fuel, or at some point did not have it,
00:17:48even bought from South Korea, not, I emphasize, not
00:17:52North, but South, that is, a democratic
00:17:55republic, and they bought fuel there,
00:17:58which Korea itself does not have a single liter of oil, that is,
00:18:02Korea itself buys oil somewhere, oil products, processes
00:18:05them itself, and sells them to...
00:18:08Russia. And at the same time, Putin agrees to
00:18:12help Putin, but I want to say, Mr. Roman, if you allow me, the most
00:18:15important quintessence of all this absurdity in which we live, so that
00:18:19viewers understand, this is not about diesel fuel, this
00:18:22is about preventing Trump from imposing
00:18:26sanctions against Russia on October 18,
00:18:28against the background of Putin helping Trump and
00:18:32Republicans win the midterm elections, how much
00:18:35this can help and be accomplished. Trump
00:18:39does not want to implement the Lindsey Graham law. In order not to implement the Lindsey
00:18:43Graham law, which should essentially automatically
00:18:46enter into force 30 days after its signing, which
00:18:50expires on October 18, I emphasize, in 8 days,
00:18:53in 7 days, in a week, next Sunday, he
00:18:57wants, they instigated this conversation behind
00:19:01Ukraine's back, where we were used blindly, that
00:19:04Russia will allegedly supply oil products to the US market,
00:19:07and against this background, to imitate the negotiation process between Russia and
00:19:11Ukraine, and on this, at the initiative of Trump, of course,
00:19:14his cabinet of Republicans, and against this background, they want to show,
00:19:18well, how can we, against this background, when Russia is helping the US with
00:19:22diesel fuel, when they started peace talks between
00:19:25Russia and Ukraine about at least an energy truce, how can
00:19:29we impose sanctions against Russia on October 18?
00:19:33This is what this whole play is for, not for...
00:19:36Are we already on the verge
00:19:46of World War III, as for example, a Republican congressman
00:19:49warns, that not supporting Ukraine
00:19:53leads to World War III, because you know how those
00:19:56prices will be, whether rednecks will understand how
00:20:00the price of diesel is formed in America and on whom it
00:20:03depends, what Trump writes, how it will affect
00:20:07anyone, these
00:20:11desires of his and so on. But what
00:20:14do all his insane actions and
00:20:17statements mean for us?
00:20:21Everything that happens is for the best. Trump
00:20:25with his policy is essentially destroying the Republican party, he
00:20:28leads to the triumph of Democrats in Congress and
00:20:31the Senate, who, I emphasize, so that our viewers clearly
00:20:35understand what will happen in 3 months. Let's live by January
00:20:382027. They will vote in Congress,
00:20:42because only Congress adopts laws related to funding, and
00:20:46Democrats, together with, most likely,
00:20:49demoralized Republicans, with those remnants that will be in
00:20:52Congress, will vote for allocating Ukraine a minimum of
00:20:5530-40 billion dollars in military and financial aid
00:20:59to Ukraine. Therefore, this is a huge victory, and Trump will not be able to
00:21:02prevent this, because Democrats, most likely with the remnants of
00:21:06Republicans, will fully have 2/3 of
00:21:10Congress in the United States of America
00:21:13and will not be able to block anything. Moreover, Republicans will vote,
00:21:17because Democrats will not vote for Republican projects and will not
00:21:21finance their Republican states, and they
00:21:24will be forced to put up with it, provide aid to Ukraine, and Trump
00:21:28will be forced to sign it, especially since by the time he signs
00:21:31this law on aid to Ukraine, he will be under
00:21:35numerous impeachment accusations, at least
00:21:39under three to five articles of the criminal codes
00:21:42of the United States of America. Therefore, he will no longer care about Ukraine, and
00:21:46Ukraine will win in the long run. Therefore,
00:21:50today Trump is creating a positive springboard for
00:21:53Ukraine's victory, but they don't understand it yet. He
00:21:56uses Russia to have Putin save him in the midterm
00:21:59elections, but Republicans and Democrats both know this, they
00:22:03all see and clearly understand and read this, but all this
00:22:07will not help them. Therefore, Ukraine must stand, at
00:22:10least until January 2027, when there will be a new Congress and Senate in
00:22:14the United States of America, and then you will see how the pendulum
00:22:18will swing completely
00:22:20in the other direction in favor of Ukraine against Russia, when Russia will really
00:22:24begin to be torn apart by the new Congress and
00:22:27Senate. Yes, and literally to confirm your
00:22:31words, Laura Loomer - she's a mega
00:22:34blogger, but unlike all those
00:22:37redneck bloggers, she visited
00:22:40Ukraine and saw how much the idiocy in
00:22:44Carlson's blogs or on Fox
00:22:47News differs from reality, and she wrote: people
00:22:50want elections in Ukraine, then they should pressure Putin. She
00:22:53wonders why we suddenly, why
00:22:57more people are angry at Zelensky than at Putin, she
00:23:00writes. He is the source of every problem, and when the war ends, there will be
00:23:04elections. If a mega blogger writes such things,
00:23:07and she just stood next to Trump at the Texas rally,
00:23:11you know, the election one, in short, your words
00:23:14are confirmed in turbo mode, and Donald Trump is the initiator
00:23:18of that turbo mode. Thank you, Yuriy Romaniuk, expert on
00:23:21international issues, head of the all-Ukrainian public organization "Ukraine in NATO," was with us on the line.
00:23:25Friends, thank you for being with us this week,
00:23:28this crazy week is ending, and we hope that the next one will be
00:23:31better. Thank you for being with us. Lesya Vakulyuk, Roman Chaika, worked in this studio
00:23:35for you. We hope to see you in a
00:23:38week, and stay with
00:23:40Espresso.
00:23:56War. Missiles for patriots are in the world.
00:24:00Strikes on
00:24:02Russia.
00:24:05Dialogue between government and
00:24:07society.
00:24:15Support for Ukraine. Behind every high-profile
00:24:18event, the main question: what's next? on
00:24:22weekdays at 8:15 PM on Espresso.
00:24:25We are raising funds for a Rep and two engines for medical evacuation
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00:29:43Greetings to Espresso viewers. My name is Kateryna Nykrecha and this is
00:29:47Black Box. This is the format, the podcast, in which
00:29:51we analyze important social events,
00:29:54statements. We also delve into historical
00:29:58events in order to understand more deeply what
00:30:01is happening. And of course, we cannot do this deep analysis
00:30:05without Vitaliy Portnikov, and Vitaliy is here with me today. Greetings
00:30:08to you. Greetings. So, last week we
00:30:11actually heard a lot of different statements regarding
00:30:15the peace plan, regarding negotiations of different
00:30:18formats, and some of them, these statements were very loudly
00:30:22discussed in society. We will analyze all
00:30:25the proposals in detail, compare them with
00:30:29reality, let's say, yes. And here is my first question.
00:30:32For a start, a short one, what do you generally associate
00:30:36such intensity of this topic with, is it a coincidence,
00:30:40perhaps there are some external factors, perhaps internal factors, or
00:30:44is it still some kind of inspired wave?
00:30:48I think there are always politicians who
00:30:51want to find for themselves, well, if you want, such
00:30:55a hidden electoral niche, now it is clear that
00:30:58people are in favor of negotiations, not that...