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00:00:00to talk about water and electricity,
00:00:04that's the question addressed to the government, but I think the 20
00:00:07infrastructure useful for improving missions have been stopped, it's being translated
00:00:10now, it will be translated as PNDs, waiting for the PND
00:00:14to arrive, the PND should detail all this, I
00:00:16think, but it's the
00:00:20commission's number 5 concern, the
00:00:23commission, in its number
00:00:265 concern, makes the following observation: asks the government
00:00:31to set
00:00:34up a strategy for financing the electricity
00:00:38that the field of and water sectors with a view to improving
00:00:41access and quality of these public services
00:00:44as well as the list of main projects to be financed
00:00:48in the next three years, we even went further
00:00:51to ask the government to
00:00:55specifically
00:00:57concerns of state the projects that will be launched, because
00:01:00as early as 2027, we must not stick to intentions, the government said earlier,
00:01:04in the next investment budget,
00:01:08these will not be intentions that will be
00:01:11ensured. Modalities for reducing the debt of carried over into the next investment budget, these will be
00:01:15projects with studies, so this is
00:01:18the opportunity, you are right to
00:01:21of remind us, this is the opportunity to remind the government of its responsibility
00:01:23so that studies are carried out in the water
00:01:26and electricity sector to allow...
00:01:31government, the issue of that these national questions, these
00:01:34two national questions that are starting to find
00:01:37suitable solutions
00:01:40because we are waiting for solutions in the water and electricity sector,
00:01:43thank you Mr. President for giving
00:01:47us this opportunity to at
00:01:50account all the concerns of least react after
00:01:53the requests for clarification
00:01:57from our colleagues, thank you Mr. President.
00:02:02Thank you very much, honorable President, Mr.
00:02:05Minister, Head of, Prime Minister, Head of Government,
00:02:08you have the floor, it is your will,
00:02:25we will President, it was my desire, you say it so
00:02:29well. if I could be
00:02:31And regarding excused, it would be a good thing,
00:02:34thank you very much honorable President, no, we have taken very good
00:02:38note of the commission's concern,
00:02:41the rest are
00:02:46give the floor back to the president of recommendations, things
00:02:49that the commission would like us to do in the
00:02:52future, we will not go into
00:02:56explanations, for example, regarding
00:03:01the non-transmission to parliament of medium-term expenditure frameworks by
00:03:04nature, by
00:03:05function,
00:03:10the parliament, the assembly,
00:03:12Yes, the concern of the commission know
00:03:15that we are
00:03:18in management tools, management
00:03:23our debt, a true evaluation of for financing the electricity and tools in program mode
00:03:26and that there is a whole
00:03:28process, medium-term expenditure frameworks have a
00:03:32logical link with sectoral strategies structured around annual
00:03:37finance laws, thank you performance projects and as long as we have not developed the
00:03:40annual performance projects, we cannot
00:03:43be in a position to produce these
00:03:47frameworks by nature, but you can be sure that we
00:03:51are working so that in the future these things will
00:03:54be done. concern number
00:03:582
00:04:04including for the diversification of of the commission relates
00:04:07including for to the absence of budgetary implications related to the
00:04:11mobilization of revenues from
00:04:13point, the Minister of natural resources in application of the production sharing regimes contained in the mining
00:04:16codes, this partly echoes the
00:04:20concern of the honorable Bidunga
00:04:22uh
00:04:25the CBMT does not at this stage develop the budgetary implications in
00:04:28application of the regimes.
00:04:31talking about production sharing continues in the mining code because the consideration of these
00:04:34production sharing regimes by the macroeconomic projection model could
00:04:38only intervene at the end of the
00:04:41that was state's contracting with companies,
00:04:44operating in the mining and forestry sectors. We have
00:04:47not yet concluded any production sharing contracts, how can we
00:04:51already integrate them when we do not know what the content
00:04:55of these specific agreements that we will conclude with
00:04:59companies will be. especially since, as you know,
00:05:02honorable President, even
00:05:05in the oil sector, we still have a great effort to
00:05:09make in terms of modeling,
00:05:11especially for oil which we have been working on for
00:05:15years, we have an important effort to make
00:05:19in terms of modeling to be able to project ourselves on
00:05:22the different trends, especially regarding mining revenues and
00:05:26gas revenues
00:05:29and even forestry and to anticipate this question, to answer
00:05:33the honorable Bidonga,
00:05:36uh the honorable President started to say it, the
00:05:40budgets are voted here based on...
00:05:43the president said that it was us who presented the table,
00:05:46but the budgetary nomenclature, we get it from the
00:05:50community, it's the same nomenclature in the
00:05:53CEMAC zones, we put oil revenues and the
00:05:57others appear in the other
00:06:00revenues category, these revenues are indeed taken into account, whether
00:06:04it's forestry revenues, whether it's mining revenues, but they
00:06:07appear and we indeed, you are right to raise this debate because
00:06:11even within the government, we often
00:06:14have this debate with the ministers in charge of this
00:06:18sector who believe that their
00:06:21revenues should appear much more clearly than
00:06:24to lump them into a category of other
00:06:28tax revenues, so we'll see
00:06:31when we work at the community level on a new
00:06:34presentation of our
00:06:38tables, we will take that into account without a doubt.
00:06:48So, the realism of expected revenues from the
00:06:52gas sector, in the absence of a gas code, yes, but
00:06:56it's a bit like I was saying, and we prefer to maintain a very
00:06:59cautious approach, we have, if you look, I think we
00:07:03have carried over the same estimate as
00:07:07that of the 2026 budget, remaining
00:07:09at 17 billion I think,
00:07:13in accordance
00:07:16with the 2027 budget and we will
00:07:19see when we
00:07:22have finished with
00:07:26the code and we have a clearer idea of
00:07:29how we should evaluate our gas resources, then we will
00:07:33perhaps have the appropriate
00:07:36estimates.
00:07:42The underestimation is in the same logic, a purely
00:07:46prudential approach, we want to be cautious, it is
00:07:50possible that we will benefit from the repercussions,
00:07:53that we will have a
00:07:56much more favorable
00:07:59return, much higher amounts taking
00:08:02into account the production that can indeed
00:08:06increase in terms of oil production, we
00:08:09may have a slightly more favorable market, but for now
00:08:13we... we will stick to the projections that we have
00:08:15presented.
00:08:25the honorable
00:08:29Bati certainly joins concern 5, a strategy
00:08:35water sectors as well as the list of main projects to be financed in the next three years,
00:08:39we said it, Mr. President, I believe,
00:08:43that in our
00:08:44remarks,
00:08:48allow me to quickly
00:08:49return to it,
00:08:55I read this: great attention will be paid
00:08:58to public investments in infrastructure useful for
00:09:02improving the productivity of production factors, as well as for
00:09:06diversifying the economy, useful infrastructure,
00:09:09first and foremost electricity, because
00:09:12it is the determining factor,
00:09:17the economy, improving
00:09:21productivity and on this
00:09:25Energy has a roadmap, a clear
00:09:29vision which today involves
00:09:33considering the mobilization of resources to
00:09:36be allocated in particular to the rehabilitation of the
00:09:39production units that we have, that's it. we need to
00:09:42allocate a resource to rehabilitation, it is true that we currently have
00:09:46the production units under concession, but faced with
00:09:50certain difficulties
00:09:53in implementing all these
00:09:55concessions, the state is always obliged to intervene
00:09:59and see how we can further make the bride
00:10:03beautiful and hope to consider
00:10:05other management methods or even if we have to remain in
00:10:09concession, but that we have made the maximum effort
00:10:12so that these production units are such that
00:10:16they are more functional
00:10:18and efficient, that's it. So,
00:10:22rest assured
00:10:25that when we talk about the attention that must
00:10:29be given to public investments in
00:10:32productivity, we are talking about all these
00:10:36water and electricity
00:10:38production infrastructures.
00:10:48Concern 5, the strategy for financing ex, that's it,
00:10:51I think I have answered, concern
00:10:546, necessity to integrate
00:10:57the completion of the accelerated municipalization
00:10:59cores, we have already made this commitment and the direction
00:11:03has been given to us clearly, precisely by the President of the
00:11:06Republic, I had already said on this occasion that we
00:11:10have identified 150 projects
00:11:14uh form the cores of municipalization by
00:11:17department and we will work according to the
00:11:20resources we have to ensure that these
00:11:23municipalization cores
00:11:26are indeed
00:11:36optimizing, optimizing a public debt permanently exceeding the
00:11:40CEMAC norm. Well, we are working, the honorable
00:11:43Bidunga spoke
00:11:46the commercial
00:11:48debt. Honorable, I can guarantee
00:11:52you that I believe I said it in my speech. The
00:11:56commercial debt
00:11:58and in particular the domestic debt,
00:12:02it is one of our concerns because it is
00:12:05by paying the domestic debt, in particular
00:12:08commercial debt for certain companies, for example, that we
00:12:11will relaunch the economy, these
00:12:14companies will benefit from
00:12:18cash flow, in particular by paying their
00:12:22debts, I believe I said it in my
00:12:30speech. National companies will have the
00:12:33resources to relaunch and then produce
00:12:36wealth, create more
00:12:39jobs and precisely boost growth,
00:12:43so here too, you can be assured
00:12:47that we are in
00:12:48phase.
00:12:56the debt, we
00:12:59are currently working on the re-basing of our
00:13:02debt, that seems to us an
00:13:06important exercise and the Minister of Economy and
00:13:09Planning is working seriously on the matter,
00:13:13because as long as we have not
00:13:15succeeded in better evaluating our
00:13:18debt, we will always be lagging behind
00:13:22and then it will
00:13:25block us, the fact of knowing that we have a debt
00:13:28beyond the CEMAC norm,
00:13:31someone who already knows that he is burdened with debt, he will not make
00:13:34more effort, he risks waiting for "just take me to
00:13:37court", the country is also like that, but
00:13:40yet if we have
00:13:44uh a good system of re-basing
00:13:48the debt, we realize that indeed our debt
00:13:51is not as it is presented, it is not beyond... of
00:13:5598%, other countries have done it, it remains only
00:13:59for us to do it too, and to
00:14:02do it we must try to review our calculation
00:14:06benchmarks for this debt, we are still working on a benchmark from
00:14:091993 while other countries
00:14:13are at the 2008 benchmark and are in the process of moving to the 2025
00:14:16benchmark, they will find that for them, by
00:14:20having moved from the 1993 benchmark to 2008 and from
00:14:232008 to... 2025, their debt is
00:14:27presented in a relatively
00:14:30correct trend, so this is a work that we are doing and we want to
00:14:34reassure you that uh
00:14:37shortly certainly
00:14:39our the evaluation, the estimation of our debt will
00:14:43not be such when we have met these conditions of
00:14:46re-basing and reform of the
00:14:48benchmark, you can be sure that our
00:14:52debt will no longer be presented according to the
00:14:55trends in which it is presented now, but that
00:14:58said, this is only
00:15:01to uh uh
00:15:05determine the level of the debt, the percentage, but we
00:15:09are also making an effort to reduce this debt,
00:15:12in particular, as I said, first by starting with the domestic debt,
00:15:16but also for the commitments that we are taking, by
00:15:19honoring the fact of honoring our commitments towards our
00:15:22partners, to pay the external debt,
00:15:25and to have control over the management
00:15:29of this debt, that's it, we want to control indebtedness,
00:15:32resort to more concessional loans, you
00:15:36challenge us on the IMF, but of course, it is all this that allows
00:15:40us to better control our indebtedness and to only resort to
00:15:43concessional loans so as not to always be at the mercy
00:15:47of partners who would
00:15:50lend us resources, who would give us resources at concessional
00:15:53rates. That's it for
00:15:57everything, honorable President, on the other questions, I
00:16:01believe we don't have much to say,
00:16:05despite the efforts we make in terms of... funding or
00:16:08budgeting for sectors, social services,
00:16:12well, we know that we must continue
00:16:15these efforts, education,
00:16:19health, the problems we have at the CHU, the
00:16:23problems our universities pose are
00:16:26real problems, the problems that retirees pose are
00:16:30real problems,
00:16:32but it's not necessarily a question of budgeting, here we look at the
00:16:35budgets, but when you see the... budget, our intentions are
00:16:39good, we can increase as much as you want, but if the
00:16:42treasury doesn't follow, it can always be difficult, the problem we have is
00:16:46treasury issues, there you go, we have
00:16:49increased the budgets, we have put everything in, but uh, we are sometimes confronted with
00:16:53real treasury problems to meet these
00:16:56commitments, but we take them into account, we take
00:16:59note of them, honorable
00:17:01President.
00:17:05Here, honorable President, we extend our questions,
00:17:09we will continue the discussions with the commission, but the answers I
00:17:13wanted to give to the honorable deputies who asked the
00:17:16questions, I hope
00:17:20to have met their expectations, and
00:17:24uh we can, we take into
00:17:28the commission and we can continue discussions with the commission
00:17:31to refine the report and
00:17:34especially to present the
00:17:37documents of the medium-term budgetary framework well, thank you
00:17:41honorable President.
00:17:55Thank you, Mr. Prime Minister and Head of
00:17:57Government.
00:18:00The concerns have been submitted to the commission and to
00:18:04the government, I will therefore give the floor:
00:18:09the floor to the first secretary so that he can ask the plenary
00:18:12if, to know if the answers given are
00:18:15satisfactory to the plenary, in which case we
00:18:19will
00:18:23the commission for
00:18:27the conclusions, the 2nd secretary will ask the plenary
00:18:30the question.
00:18:35Thank you, honorable President, the question is well asked to the
00:18:38plenary,
00:18:42are there any speakers, that's the question, exactly, to my
00:18:46left,
00:18:48ah
00:18:52honorable, please introduce
00:18:55yourself,
00:19:00honorable,
00:19:06the microphone, Yes, honorable,
00:19:20still on the left,
00:19:24opposite, yes, opposite, opposite
00:19:27us, in the center if you will,
00:19:30in the center, no
00:19:32speakers, honorable president, opposite.
00:19:36Sole speaker, honorable Ganceelle,
00:19:40honorable Gancelet, you have the floor. Uh
00:19:43thank you, honorable President,
00:19:46I would first like to apologize uh to
00:19:49the President
00:19:52uh of the parliamentary
00:19:54group, but there is a
00:19:57concern that seems very
00:20:00important uh which has not been mentioned
00:20:03here, I'm
00:20:09agriculture,
00:20:12uh, I didn't hear anything about agriculture in everything
00:20:18said,
00:20:21uh, I think that this
00:20:24concern about agriculture should be
00:20:39"I think that we
00:20:42are,
00:20:47please, honorable deputy, following our..."
00:20:50colleague, everyone talks about
00:20:53agriculture, we are
00:20:55uh
00:21:00on
00:21:03the
00:21:20speak and honorable President, we are talking about the
00:21:23diversification of our economy, I think
00:21:28agriculture is the most
00:21:31important aspect, very good, and I think that we should
00:21:35talk about it and we have not made any mention of it
00:21:38uh during our session
00:21:42today, that's why I would like to raise this concern,
00:21:46thank you honorable President, thank you, but I think we all understood that it
00:21:51is not an oral question session for the government,
00:21:55firstly, and that we are discussing the budgetary
00:21:58orientation debate, so if
00:22:01he wishes that agricultural issues be taken into account in the framework of the
00:22:04budgetary programming, that's what he
00:22:07means, so in this case it's noted, well now I
00:22:11would like to give the floor to the president of the
00:22:14commission who will certainly answer
00:22:17quickly, present the
00:22:20conclusions.
00:22:25You have the
00:22:25floor.
00:22:30Thank you, honorable
00:22:32President, honorable President, in response
00:22:36to the observation made by our
00:22:39colleague, I would like to refer him to page 15 of our
00:22:43report, where the government's action
00:22:45program presented in this
00:22:49room a little over a month ago is
00:22:53included, and in mission,
00:22:55mission number 5 of the government, the government
00:22:59talks about prioritizing agriculture and
00:23:02industry,
00:23:03I think that
00:23:07our colleague talks about matters of great
00:23:10importance, but since the government talks about prioritizing
00:23:14agriculture and industry, I think he should find an answer to his
00:23:17concern and... uh he had the
00:23:21report, I think the debate should open on the basis of the report on
00:23:24page 15, he would open a debate on that,
00:23:28please, thank you honorable President, and
00:23:32in conclusion, what can we say, honorable President? No, the commission is fully
00:23:36satisfied
00:23:37with
00:23:40the elements of response formulated by the
00:23:44government, and we believe
00:23:47that the opinions and...
00:23:50recommendations uh adopted during
00:23:54this working
00:23:55session should
00:23:59not
00:24:02suffer any difficulty for them to be taken into account in
00:24:05the CBMT, so the definitive medium-term budgetary
00:24:09framework, and that the annual tranche
00:24:12of 2027
00:24:16should reflect what was said
00:24:19here. In accordance with article 11 of our financial
00:24:23constitution, which is the organic law relating to the State's
00:24:27Mr. President.
00:24:29Well, for this late intervention
00:24:32from the honorable Ganceelle, I think the answer has been given, there's
00:24:35no need to ask the Prime Minister, head of government to intervene
00:24:39again, I think that is taken into account, please,
00:24:43that is taken into account, the answer is therefore
00:24:46in the... document,
00:24:50so this being said,
00:24:52we have reached the end of our
00:24:56meeting, of our
00:25:00session, and we simply want to remind
00:25:03that
00:25:05this session, as was
00:25:09recalled in the report that was
00:25:12read to
00:25:14us, fully
00:25:17integrates the will of the National Assembly
00:25:21to participate in the budget
00:25:25elaboration process
00:25:27and therefore upstream we discuss with the
00:25:31government and we agree on the broad
00:25:34orientations that will
00:25:36therefore support
00:25:40the budget elaboration and in this specific case it concerns
00:25:43therefore the medium-term budgetary
00:25:46framework 2027.
00:25:502029,
00:25:53so this is the first
00:25:56observation, the first thing that we should
00:25:59remember,
00:26:02secondly, how the National
00:26:05Assembly takes note, Mr. Minister, Prime Minister, Head of
00:26:09Government, that this debate
00:26:12took place
00:26:15after the regulatory date of July
00:26:1731st, since
00:26:20we understood from your presentation,
00:26:24your government was set up in April after
00:26:28the President of the
00:26:31Republic was elected in March, and therefore between
00:26:35April and May 30th, the deadline for submitting the
00:26:39document here to the assembly,
00:26:43uh
00:26:45circumstances meant that the deadline was not met, so we take note of
00:26:49that.
00:26:51Thirdly,
00:26:54overall we have followed the various
00:27:00the commission of the honorable
00:27:02deputies and we have also followed the
00:27:05answers uh proposed by the
00:27:09government, so concerns should
00:27:13be
00:27:15taken into account in the development of the different
00:27:19budgets,
00:27:22notably 2027 which is approaching and 2028 and
00:27:252029.
00:27:28Important points were raised and recognized
00:27:31by the
00:27:34water and electricity, it must be taken into account, it is an
00:27:37important
00:27:39social issue,
00:27:43the issue of municipalization, the
00:27:46government has recognized
00:27:49its importance, and this issue has already been
00:27:52the subject of
00:27:54directives from the President of the Republic, I think it's a
00:27:58good thing because this is an important
00:28:02issue. So among the
00:28:05concerns, there is the issue of recruitment in the
00:28:09civil service, this is one of the points of concern, of
00:28:13concerns and we
00:28:16hope that this issue will be truly well taken
00:28:20into account in the different budgets. Of
00:28:23course, the issue of the business climate, this was raised by the
00:28:27honorable deputies, the issue of debt also
00:28:31internally,
00:28:33this was also taken into account, so these are concerns that
00:28:37were indeed
00:28:40raised by the commission and the
00:28:43deputies, and what the National Assembly can
00:28:46retain is that for the development of the different
00:28:49budgets, these concerns can be taken into account to
00:28:53be able to find answers to the
00:28:55questions that arise, to the solutions that are
00:28:58proposed. Fourthly, the National Assembly
00:29:02notes
00:29:04the government's will, since it was expressed on May
00:29:0811, 2026,
00:29:11to engage in a project to conclude a
00:29:15new program with the IMF, and this also
00:29:18is something that was raised by the chairman of the
00:29:22commission and recognized by the government, and the National
00:29:25Assembly therefore notes its
00:29:28interest,
00:29:30and finally, a question was raised here
00:29:33related to the deposit and
00:29:35consignment fund,
00:29:37the deposit and consignment fund. I would like, we would like
00:29:41to reassure the
00:29:44government that
00:29:46we will deal with this
00:29:50issue diligently by ensuring that by the end
00:29:54of our session we
00:29:56can finally have the report because
00:30:00the report had arrived but... just after this
00:30:03session we will meet with the president, I announce already with the
00:30:07president of the administrative and legal affairs commission, the president of the
00:30:11economy and finance commission and the bureau so
00:30:15that we can find a
00:30:16modus
00:30:19operandi that would allow us to indeed
00:30:23have a definitive report because there are
00:30:25between the government commission certain questions to clarify, so we
00:30:29will meet quickly for a few minutes.
00:30:32on this question, so that being said, we can
00:30:36therefore consider that the budget
00:30:40orientation debate which lays the
00:30:43foundations of a budgetary inscription process
00:30:47for the medium-term budgetary framework
00:30:512027 and
00:30:522029 has therefore
00:30:56taken place and if everyone agrees