Google Cloud Speech-to-Text API (Chirp) + Gemini 2.5 Flash Non-Thinking. Treat it as a searchable index of what was broadcast, not a quotation record.
00:00:27Our situation is a war. If there's treason,
00:00:35we treat them like an enemy.
00:00:38The police commander of Iran issued a warning for street protests,
00:00:42saying that the security forces are even more prepared
00:00:46than before the war.
00:00:49The security atmosphere in Saqqez on the anniversary of Mahsa
00:00:52Amini's death, reports indicate the Iranian government's attempt
00:00:56to prevent a memorial ceremony.
00:01:03What has happened to them during this time, and how have the protest activities in Iran
00:01:07continued? We will also ask a
00:01:09political analyst from Iran to what extent the war-like atmosphere
00:01:13has become a pretext for the government to suppress.
00:01:17Also in tonight's program. Well, this was an opportunity
00:01:21that Iran and Oman provided.
00:01:23کردند.
00:01:26Iran's claim about the reason for canceling its meeting with the country.
00:02:0360 minutes live from the BBC in
00:02:06London. Hello everyone, I am Jamaluddin Mousavi.
00:02:10On the eve of the fourth anniversary of Mahsa
00:02:13Zhina Amini's death in the custody of the morality police in Iran, security
00:02:17officials have issued strong warnings, warnings that indicate
00:02:20their concern about a new round of protests in Iran.
00:02:23Ahmadreza Radan, the commander-in-chief of Iran's police,
00:02:27said that the police will deal with those who, according to him, act to create insecurity
00:02:31at the invitation of the enemy, like an enemy.
00:02:35Trigger-happy. Almost 4 years ago, the death
00:02:38of Mahsa Zhina Amini in the custody of the morality police
00:02:41led to widespread protests that became known as the Woman, Life, Freedom movement,
00:02:45protests that were met with bloody suppression, with hundreds
00:02:49killed. Now, reports of
00:02:52increased security measures in Saqqez, her hometown, have been published.
00:02:55Iran is under heavy economic pressure, and
00:02:58the country is involved in a war that has not yet ended.
00:03:02In recent weeks, many government officials have warned
00:03:06about the possibility of a new round of protests. Will control
00:03:10and threats be effective in dealing with the demands of a dissatisfied society?
00:03:13We will talk more about this. First, a report from Siavash
00:03:17Ardalan. Our situation is a war.
00:03:21If there is treason, threats and intimidation
00:03:24is the language that the police commander chose to speak with society.
00:03:28Ahmad.
00:04:01and the Woman, Life, Freedom movement. A movement
00:04:05that is completely different from the events of December
00:04:092020.
00:04:11But from the perspective of the government in Iran, both are a prelude to unrest
00:04:15and the possibility of resumption of popular protests.
00:04:18And a reason for the need for Ahmad
00:04:21Radan's warnings. And the police are completely ready.
00:04:25100% ready in all respects and without hesitation.
00:04:29Our finger is like
00:04:31the finger of our loved ones in the army,
00:04:35Revolutionary Guard and Basij on the trigger
00:04:38to protect the security of our people. In today's situation
00:04:41in Iran, the main problem of the people is the dire
00:04:44economic situation. Iran is under the pressure of crushing sanctions,
00:04:48the purpose of which, according to many American
00:04:51and Israeli officials, is to incite the Iranian people to revolt.
00:04:55است.
00:04:58We hope to put Iranian citizens in a situation where they have nothing to lose.
00:05:02Nothing to eat and drink.
00:05:05Nothing. That's when they will rise up and overthrow the government.
00:05:09During the war,
00:05:13Israel also tried to encourage potential protesters
00:05:17by targeting police stations in Iran.
00:05:20For example, if our voice was heard,
00:05:24we transferred it to other places. In the discussion of
00:05:27passports, well, when units are hit,
00:05:30it means that passport holders who want to renew their passports
00:05:34or those who wish to obtain a passport will face
00:05:38problems, dissatisfaction will be created. I had the honor of 10 years.
00:05:47The Green Movement is a familiar name. At that time,
00:05:50he was the commander of the Tehran police, but
00:05:54now he is the commander of the national police.
00:05:57Ahmad Radan, during the 40-day
00:06:00war, was one of the officials who attended the nightly gatherings.
00:06:04We don't see him as a protester, etc., we see him as an enemy.
00:06:07And his threats last night he also repeated
00:06:11at that time. We will deal with them as we deal with an enemy. All
00:06:15our children are ready. Ahmad
00:06:19Radan knows today that the rise in gasoline prices and
00:06:22inflation in the midst of a legitimacy crisis
00:06:26means that at any moment there is a possibility of protests and unrest.
00:06:30That is, a situation in which the government
00:06:33has killed thousands of protesters and executed dozens
00:06:36of people to suppress it.
00:06:39Siavash Ardalan, BBC.
00:06:44Nechirvan Maaroufi, the first victim of the Woman, Life, Freedom
00:06:47movement protests in Saqqez, from Mainz, Germany,
00:06:51is with us. Mr. Maaroufi, you paid a heavy price.
00:06:54What happened to you during this time? Tell us about
00:06:58your personal experience.
00:07:10as they say, is fresh.
00:07:33But apart from making us more steadfast and enduring
00:07:36in the movement for freedom
00:07:39and justice, the demand for
00:07:43freedom for a nation has increased,
00:07:46not decreased. That's right, you said that
00:07:50your will has become stronger. How have your civil
00:07:53activities continued, especially abroad?
00:07:57Have you continued your protest activities?
00:08:00دادید؟
00:08:04Yes, 100%. Apart from
00:08:07being in the streets for every movement,
00:08:11we, as the Woman, Life, Freedom Association
00:08:14in Frankfurt, Germany,
00:08:17have protest Saturdays every Saturday,
00:08:21and apart from that, considering
00:08:25the things we can do from outside
00:08:28the country, we have done them,
00:08:32whether it is going to the streets
00:08:35or talking to televisions or social
00:08:39media, and finally the parliaments of foreign
00:08:43countries, and we, as the injured, are the voice
00:08:47of the Iranian people, and
00:08:49we will never let the voice of the Iranian
00:08:52people
00:08:55be silenced, suppressed. We are much stronger
00:08:59than the Islamic Republic. The Islamic Republic of Zahhak is 100%
00:09:03much weaker than us. Considering what
00:09:05Radan said,
00:09:09I really don't know how they can, maybe they can.
00:09:13In their own televisions, they can really suppress us.
00:09:17In the streets, even if our hands are empty, we are still stronger.
00:09:21We are fighting with heart and soul for freedom. It's not important to us. It's not important to us that
00:09:25whether it's an eye or a life,
00:09:28freedom is important to us. Mr. Maaroufi, how do you see the current
00:09:32situation, especially when you look at the situation inside
00:09:35Iran?
00:09:39In fact, considering the news we hear
00:09:43and see, the living conditions of the people
00:09:46are very bad. But the people we have,
00:09:48I don't think it's just
00:09:52the economic situation that has
00:09:56put them under pressure now. Considering the massacre
00:09:59that happened in December 2020,
00:10:02we can say that this year, I mean, considering
00:10:06what I have seen, 100%,
00:10:10the protests will start again.
00:10:14And I don't think the people of Iran can
00:10:16negotiate with the Islamic Republic
00:10:20government anymore. Thank
00:10:23you very much, Mr. Maaroufi. Chirvan Maaroufi,
00:10:26a victim of the Woman, Life, Freedom movement
00:10:29protests, from Mainz, Germany, is with us.
00:10:33We also have Sima Muradkhani, a victim of the Woman, Life, Freedom
00:10:36movement protests, who is with us from Munich, Germany. Ms. Murad,
00:10:40please tell us about your experience,
00:10:43what happened to you in these 4
00:10:57say that we were among those who were lucky
00:11:01and were able to survive and stay alive,
00:11:05but the Islamic Republic
00:11:08during all protests shot and
00:11:12killed thousands of Iranians.
00:11:15According to what they say, Mr. Radan said that we will deal with them
00:11:19like an enemy. Mr. Radan, when did you not deal with them like an enemy?
00:11:23I'm really very
00:11:26interested. In all protests, I myself
00:11:30was one of the protesters who came out empty-handed
00:11:32and had no cry but freedom.
00:11:36My hands were empty, but in a completely
00:11:39war-like situation, your forces shot me.
00:11:42Your special unit's gun was in my hand when it shot me.
00:11:46You killed thousands of people in December of this
00:11:50year. You killed over 50,000
00:11:53innocent people. We say 50,000 people, 50,000
00:11:57families are behind this name. Mr.
00:12:00Radan, you cannot suppress. Even if you can, you cannot
00:12:04suppress this desire that is in the hearts of these people
00:12:07with threats. That's right. I
00:12:10can tell you very clearly
00:12:13that people who have paid so much and shed so much blood
00:12:17in this path will not give up. This has been the case throughout history.
00:12:20Throughout the history of Iran's struggles,
00:12:23the people of Iran have never stood against.
00:12:34One day we will celebrate the freedom of Iran, and all my
00:12:37hope, all my faith, is in the people inside
00:12:41the country. That's right. You referred
00:12:44to the killed. Thousands of people were killed, as you
00:12:47said. No independent investigation has been conducted in Iran either.
00:12:51The government reports a low number, but
00:12:55some refer to very large numbers.
00:12:58However, what the government itself says
00:13:01in December and before that is at least thousands. Is there still
00:13:05room for protest inside, in your opinion? Meaning that
00:13:09if we consider the dangers,
00:13:12you yourself are someone whose hand was severely
00:13:16injured. Do you think that people are still
00:13:20willing to face those dangers
00:13:23and enter the field of protests, or
00:13:27is it possible that due to these threats, due to the dangers
00:13:31that exist, they might act differently?
00:13:34Look, after every
00:13:38protest that starts, for example, after Woman, Life, Freedom,
00:13:42there was really a period of time when
00:13:45I felt very hopeless, but
00:13:48in December, we again witnessed millions of people inside
00:13:52Iran who came out. With whatever political
00:13:56belief they had, they stood together in the streets
00:13:59against the Islamic Republic and chanted
00:14:02for freedom. Look, people
00:14:06who pay for protest
00:14:09with blood cannot forget and cannot
00:14:13return to their normal
00:14:16lives. A mother who has lost her child,
00:14:19do you think she forgets? No, that
00:14:22same father, that same mother, that same spouse, that same person.
00:14:26They are alive, and in my opinion, the Islamic Republic has been defeated for a long time, only its name
00:14:30and reputation remain. During this period
00:14:33when we witnessed multiple protests
00:14:37and multiple suppressions, it's interesting that society has changed a lot.
00:14:40If you look at the images coming
00:14:44from inside Iran, perhaps a few years ago, this type
00:14:47of clothing, this type of coming out
00:14:51was unimaginable. Did you achieve anything?
00:15:03Look, this achievement is not the favor of the Islamic Republic, it is the struggle of thousands
00:15:06of Iranian women. At that time, when I came
00:15:10to the street, I saw a girl who said
00:15:13I'm going to take off my headscarf and said, "Shoot me."
00:15:16It's not something I can say is a favor
00:15:20of the Islamic Republic. It's the result of the struggle of thousands
00:15:23of Iranian women. And well, there's also something that
00:15:27the Islamic Republic is beautifully deceiving and presenting something as false
00:15:31because it wants to create a positive image
00:15:35in international organizations that, no, we don't have a problem with hijab,
00:15:39but one of my main
00:15:42concerns when my daughter
00:15:45was in Iran was that with
00:15:49a headscarf and with a headscarf, we are going to
00:15:53the schools of the Islamic Republic, and this forced
00:15:55hijab that they impose on a seven-year-old is still the same. Nothing has changed.
00:15:59In offices, in
00:16:02schools, hijab must be worn. Today, I don't know
00:16:06if I'm telling the truth or a lie, that again in Isfahan,
00:16:10they have set up morality police for hijab. Look,
00:16:13women's hijab is one of the pillars of the Islamic
00:16:16Republic, and to want to portray
00:16:19something differently is just deception,
00:16:23and they want to present a positive image to international
00:16:26organizations. That's right. Do you think
00:16:30that the protesters in Iran
00:16:34who demanded freedom of dress
00:16:37and demanded civil liberties will pursue
00:16:40more demands and protest again,
00:16:44or will they pursue their demands in
00:16:47another way?
00:16:50Look, never in any
00:16:53protest was the issue only one
00:16:56thing. Four years ago, my issue was not just hijab,
00:16:59my issue was the Islamic Republic itself, a government
00:17:03whose foundations are built on blood and crime.
00:17:08A government that provides no freedom for
00:17:11human dignity, justice, nothing in terms of
00:17:15economy, culture, education,
00:17:18I mean, I don't know,
00:17:22I mean, there was nothing for me at that time
00:17:26to have a positive view of this government and stay home and not
00:17:29protest. It wasn't like that.
00:17:32And people have also come
00:17:36to this belief a long time ago. Thank you, Ms.
00:17:39Muradkhani.
00:17:43Sima Muradkhani, a victim of the Woman, Life, Freedom movement protests,
00:17:47from Munich, Germany. Ms. Muradbeigi, I'm sorry, Sima
00:17:51Muradbeigi, a victim of the Woman, Life, Freedom
00:17:54movement protests, who kindly spoke with us from Munich. Thank you very much.
00:17:58Babak Dorbiki, an analyst of Iranian political issues, is also
00:18:01with us here from London. Mr. Dorbiki,
00:18:05has the war-like atmosphere, in your opinion, become a
00:18:09pretext for the government and the things Mr. Radan is saying now?
00:18:12Look,
00:18:14Radan, in my opinion, General Radan and
00:18:18many others are saying the same things they
00:18:22said before. That is, in fact, since 2009, Mr. Radan has not
00:18:26changed. The war situation
00:18:29in his rhetoric does not recognize seasons. In my opinion, the reason is that
00:18:33the power of people like General Radan does not come from war.
00:18:37It comes directly from the security state,
00:18:41a state that has existed for 47 years. It has worked
00:18:44in both peace and war. Its survival is tied to the continuation of the
00:18:48state of emergency. This state of emergency is not
00:18:52necessarily a military state of emergency.
00:18:55It is a state of internal security emergency. What Mr.
00:18:58Radan defends, in my opinion, is the survival of the security state,
00:19:02a state that, in any case, can call public gatherings riots,
00:19:05can call any opponent a traitor. Any action can be justified by
00:19:09war conditions without the need to declare martial law,
00:19:13without the need for parliamentary approval, without the judiciary being behind it.
00:19:17That is, if it wants to declare its position, it has also
00:19:21exercised this monopoly in peace, but war facilitates
00:19:24these conditions. Look, it's important that
00:19:27war generally securitizes the situation. Look,
00:19:30the December massacre formed the basis for this deterrence
00:19:34that Mr. Radan is now displaying. In any case, every time he talks about
00:19:38war, he is reminding us of this basis, not as a new threat,
00:19:42but in fact, an emphasis
00:19:45on the cost that society has seen the consequences of.
00:19:49And therefore, I think that the war conditions are a pretext
00:19:52in addition to previous pretexts that can
00:19:55increase pressure, increase restrictions.
00:19:59Meanwhile, we must also consider the other side of the coin in war conditions. It has had
00:20:03a very negative impact on people, and to some extent,
00:20:06it has deterred people and civil society
00:20:09from their normal activities due to the conditions.
00:20:13That's right. So now, do these threats
00:20:16silence protests and create fear and terror,
00:20:20especially in war conditions and all the points you mentioned,
00:20:24or is it possible that they will, on the contrary, fuel
00:20:27the anger of the protesters?
00:20:30Look, I think that for change,
00:20:34there are generally a series of mechanisms, one of which
00:20:38is, in any case, a crack must happen from above,
00:20:41meaning that, in fact, one factor can become
00:20:45managerial instability. Another is the issue of a crisis in
00:20:49economic failure. Well, look, right now the pressure on people's livelihoods
00:20:53is very heavy. In any case, within
00:20:56the system, the calculations they are making for continuing
00:21:00this siege of the strait, in fact, closing the Strait of Hormuz or
00:21:03continuing this current situation, well, they will make the conditions very difficult,
00:21:07but this pressure from below must
00:21:10pass the threshold of deterrence, meaning that the
00:21:14economic conditions must reach a point where parts of
00:21:18society see no difference between the cost of silence
00:21:21and the cost of protest. This equation will change. Look, now the point that one of your guests
00:21:25made was a very important point. I had nothing
00:21:29to stay home for and not protest. This is an important
00:21:32point. I think this is the breaking point, the point
00:21:36that can change everything, but consider one thing. All the mechanisms for changing
00:21:40the situation have a main condition, in my opinion, and that is that the security
00:21:44apparatus as a whole must suffer an internal
00:21:47split for a sustainable change to occur. Well, almost all
00:21:51these four points that you mentioned have happened in a way. The split from above, well,
00:21:55now we know there is a huge difference between Mr.
00:21:58Pezeshkian and Qalibaf on one side and the rest of the government
00:22:02on the other. Or this economic pressure you referred
00:22:05to has reached its peak. Even in the security agencies,
00:22:09well, we know there are differences between the IRGC intelligence
00:22:12and the Ministry of Intelligence, and
00:22:15sometimes even the intelligence agencies related to the judiciary.
00:22:18The differences are very
00:22:50Control is still a tool in the hands of some forces.
00:22:54Look, it's true that a split has occurred, but keep in mind
00:22:57that this split has not yet reached a structural level, so to speak.
00:23:01Look, there's a structural dependency between
00:23:04the government and, in fact, forces like
00:23:07Radan. Look, Pezeshkian needs stability
00:23:11to conduct economic negotiations, to negotiate with the US, to improve
00:23:15the economic situation, which Radan is, in fact,
00:23:18you see. Pezeshkian himself also came back in December and said
00:23:22that the protesters are rioters, but later the same government
00:23:26declared those killed in December martyrs. These, in fact, show
00:23:30that there is a structural dependency. This gap
00:23:34exists. All these things have happened, but this does not yet mean that the
00:23:37split is complete. And remember, the government is economically
00:23:41and situationally messed up, but it is still controlling.
00:23:44It still has many, meaning it has not yet reached its peak,
00:23:48in my opinion. The government, I am saying, still has ways
00:23:52to circumvent certain pressures, and it is activating
00:23:55some of its principles
00:23:58in fact. The fact that America is constantly talking about economic
00:24:01pressure, everyday economic pressure, shows that there were
00:24:05still capacities that could not be broken.
00:24:09Therefore, I think that all those issues
00:24:13exist, and it has not yet reached the point where it is the final point, the breaking
00:24:16point. And also, when we talk about a breaking point, we have to see what point
00:24:20we are talking about. Is it the overthrow of the government, or the presence
00:24:24of protests, meaning the widespread protests and then probably suppression, or
00:24:28even the fall of the government at the cost of the entire
00:24:32society being destroyed? These also need to be defined, in my opinion. Then
00:24:35society, in my opinion, has not yet reached a single definition of this
00:24:39issue. In the end, if we want to somehow
00:24:43conclude the discussion, Mr. Radan's statements, or
00:24:46people like him, like Mr. Eje'i, sometimes say such things.
00:24:50Do these send a message of confidence to society,
00:24:53or a message of weakness? Look, I think
00:24:56that if confidence exists, in war conditions,
00:25:00when you want to show confidence, you show it with forgiveness,
00:25:04you show it with generosity, you show it with calm, you show it by stepping aside.
00:25:07An iron fist is to create fear and terror.
00:25:11Fear and terror are also in a situation where you yourself
00:25:14do not have this power. You are not sure of yourself.
00:25:18To consider everyone a spy,
00:25:21to consider everyone an enemy agent, to consider all protests
00:25:24as riots, this shows that you are even afraid
00:25:28of your own name and your own shadow, and this is where you use
00:25:31the iron fist. Otherwise, you could have easily
00:25:35from many areas, meaning if, for example, in this war,
00:25:39a general amnesty was issued, or is issued,
00:25:42this shows that confidence, in my opinion. That you
00:25:45want to reconcile with your society, that is a sign of confidence that is a weakness.
00:25:54Wherever it shows an iron fist, wherever it tries to use
00:25:58execution as a weapon to silence
00:26:02society, it shows that your hands are completely
00:26:05tied in other areas. You cannot have a healthy and proper dialogue
00:26:09with society, and in fact, you don't even think society will listen.
00:26:13The only thing you can do to protect your interests
00:26:16and your survival is massacre
00:26:19and suppression. Mr. Dorbiki, Babak Dorbiki, analyst
00:26:23of Iranian political issues.
00:26:26On the eve of the fourth anniversary of Mahsa Zhina Amini's death in the custody
00:26:30of the morality police, reports indicate an escalation of security measures
00:26:34in Saqqez, her hometown. According to reports,
00:26:37security agencies have asked many families of those killed in the Woman, Life,
00:26:41Freedom movement to refrain from holding
00:26:44anniversary ceremonies. Zhiar Gol, our senior
00:26:47international correspondent, who has been following the issue, is here
00:26:50in the studio. The security situation is reported
00:26:54to be a bit tense. Tell us more. Well, Jamal, as you mentioned, it seems that
00:26:58in the past few days, security measures,
00:27:00especially in Saqqez, the hometown of Mahsa
00:27:04Zhina Amini, have been intensified. Security cameras have been installed
00:27:07there, at the entrances to the
00:27:10Aychi cemetery, where Mahsa is buried.
00:27:14At the same time, what we have heard from people who
00:27:17are close to her family is that there is a lot of pressure on the family
00:27:21not to hold a ceremony. And it's not just
00:27:24Mahsa's family. Also, the families of those
00:27:27killed in the Woman, Life, Freedom movement have been pressured
00:27:31not to hold anniversary ceremonies.
00:27:34And if you even look at the messages that
00:27:37Mahsa's family, her father Amjad Amini
00:27:40or Mojgan Eftekhari, her mother, used to publish
00:27:44in the past, this year was very different. For example, her father
00:27:48spoke more about Mahsa and that
00:27:52with her death, the blood of thousands of other young people
00:27:55came to their homes from all over Iran, or that the cause of her death
00:27:59would not be hidden. They somehow refrained
00:28:03from the severe criticisms they had in the past, and this itself shows
00:28:06that there was a lot of pressure on the families
00:28:09of those killed in this movement. When
00:28:12Mahsa
00:28:14Zhina Amini died in the custody of the morality police,
00:28:18Iranian society and even the world were shocked. Then it was said
00:28:21that this case would be pursued and prosecuted.
00:28:25Those who are responsible or those who
00:28:28are involved, what happened to that case?
00:28:32Well, as you mentioned, it was supposed
00:28:35to be investigated. Her family had lawyers, but well, in these
00:28:39few years, one of their lawyers was sentenced to one year in prison.
00:28:42The reason, he told me when I spoke with him,
00:28:46was that he had taken on this case.
00:28:50But well, it seems that investigations were conducted
00:28:53and a prosecutor was appointed
00:28:57to investigate this case. Six people who were members
00:29:00of the morality police, men and women,
00:29:04were summoned for questioning. It seems that
00:29:07even the police inspection
00:29:10department had said that it's unusual that all six
00:29:13of these cameras that are attached to the chest were off
00:29:17or that they had erased the footage,
00:29:20and this was a type of
00:29:23expert opinion that came from there. But it seems that after
00:29:27a long time, the person who was the prosecutor, in a 52-page
00:29:31report, came and said that these people who were members
00:29:35of the morality police, he exonerated them, and
00:29:38he said that even if someone said
00:29:41that the cause of Mahsa
00:29:44Amini's death was murder, this is counter-revolutionary.
00:29:47It's interesting, Jamal, from Hashtgerd. from where her aunt was,
00:29:50she had traveled that day to the Haqani Metro Station,
00:29:54Haqani in Tehran. All those images exist.
00:29:57Exactly from where Mahsa was arrested and
00:30:00beaten there. She was beaten. These
00:30:04images fade, and the people I spoke with
00:30:07who are familiar with this judicial case
00:30:11said it seems there is a will not to pursue this.
00:30:14But in the past few months, there was another meeting
00:30:18with the head of Tehran's judicial complex to review this
00:30:21case, but it seems it has not yet reached
00:30:25a conclusion, and they even requested a review after
00:30:28the investigator's report. They said they went to various
00:30:31branches in Tehran, and they said no case has been referred
00:30:35to us in court. Thank you, Zhyar
00:30:38Gol. In Iran, women have long been riding motorcycles
00:30:42without licenses, without formal training, and without insurance,
00:30:46and they have come to the streets with colorful motorcycles.
00:30:49Their insistence on the right to ride motorcycles has been such that
00:30:52it finally forced the government to remove the legal obstacles
00:30:56to issuing motorcycle licenses for women. However, the process of
00:30:59issuing licenses has not yet begun. Taraneh.