Original Broadcaster Captioning (Enhanced). Treat it as a searchable index of what was broadcast, not a quotation record.
00:00:01YOU ENCORE PRESENTATION OF
00:00:02INTERVIEWS FROM THE WEEKLY Q&A
00:00:07PROGRAM. THE ONLY THING, CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR GAVIN NEWSOM TALKS ABOUT UPBRINGING, POLITICAL
00:00:11CAREER, AND EVOLVING RELATIONSHIP WITH PRESIDENT
00:00:14TRUMP ALL TOPICS HE WRITES ABOUT IN HIS LATEST MEMOIR, "YOUNG MAN
00:00:18IN A HURRY." WATCH TONIGHT AT
00:00:209:00 P.M. EASTERN ON C-SPAN 2.
00:00:29>> FRIDAY ON C-SPAN CEASEFIRE
00:00:30AND BIPARTISAN CONVERSATION WITH
00:00:35TWO CONGRESSMEN AND JOINED BY
00:00:37THE HOST DATA DASHA BURNS AND TE
00:00:40ECONOMY AND BATTLE FOR CONGRESS IN THE UPCOMING MIDTERM ELECTIONS. WATCH CEASEFIRE FRIDAY AT
00:00:447:00 P.M. AND 10:00 P.M. EASTERN
00:00:46AND PACIFIC ONLY ON C-SPAN.
00:01:04>> EVERY DAY FAVORITES FOR THOSE PASSIONATE ABOUT POLITICS
00:01:07THROUGH C-SPAN AND SOMETHING FOR EVERY C-SPAN FAN AND EVERY
00:01:11PURCHASE HELPS SUPPORT THE NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS AND SHOP
00:01:14NOW OR ANY TIME ONLINE AT CSPAN
00:01:16SHOP.ORG AND GEAR UP FOR ENGAGE
00:01:22ENGAGEMENT. >> HI, EVERYBODY.
00:01:26I'M THE EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT
00:01:28AT SAMES SMART APPROACH TO MARIJUANA AND CO-FOUNDER AT
00:01:32FOUNDATION FOR DRUG POLICY SOLUTIONS. THESE ARE OUR HEADQUARTERS
00:01:35YOU'RE AT TODAY AND I'LL TELL
00:01:39YOU, WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO HAVE THEM TALKING AT THE OFFICE
00:01:43AND WHOLE C-SPAN CAMERA THING AND THANK YOU FOR BEARING WITH
00:01:46US AND ONLY IN THE OFFICE FOR 2.5 MONTHS AND PARDON OUR DUST
00:01:50AND WE'RE FIGURING THINGS OUT
00:01:54AND YOU KNOW SAM, SMART
00:02:03APPROACHES TO MARIJUANA WAS
00:02:05CO-FOUNDED BY DR. DEVIN SEBET AND THREE TIME WHITE HOUSE
00:02:08ADVISER AND TO COUNTED BY FORMER CONGRESSMAN PATRICK KENNEDY, AND
00:02:12THEY FOUNDED OUR ORGANIZATION IN
00:02:142013 RIGHT AFTER COLORADO WHERE I'M FROM BECAME THE FIRST STATE
00:02:18TO LEGALIZE MARIJUANA. THEY WERE WORRIED THAT WHAT WAS
00:02:20GOING TO COME FROM THAT POLICY
00:02:23WAS A NEW ADDICTION FOR PROFIT
00:02:27POLICY LIKE TOBACCO AND WHAT WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON FOR A
00:02:31LITTLE MORE THAN A DECADE. THREE YEARS AGO, WE REALIZED THE ADDICTION FOR PROFIT PLAN WAS
00:02:35NOT GOING TO STOP WITH TOBACCO
00:02:40AND OPEN OPIOID AND MARIJUANA BUT GOING TO OTHER SUBSTANCES
00:02:43AND OTHER INDUSTRIES AND FOUNDED THREE YEARS AGO WITH FORMER THEN
00:02:46BIDEN DRUG CZAR AND NUMBER OF OTHER LEADERS IN DRUG POLICY AND ADDICTION POLICY IN NEW YORK
00:02:50CITY, THE FOUNDATION FOR DRUG POLICY SOLUTIONS.
00:02:53THAT IS NOW OUR SISTER ORGANIZATION AND THAT'S THE
00:02:55OTHER LOGO YOU SEE AROUND HERE. THAT ORGANIZATION IS NOW
00:02:59TACKLING BROADER ADDICTION ISSUES, BROADER DRUG ISSUES.
00:03:02IT IS UNDER THAT UMBRELLA OF THIS HOUSE THAT WE'RE TALKING
00:03:05TODAY BECAUSE AS MANY OF YOU KNOW, SPORTS BETTING, ONLINE
00:03:09GAMBLING, NOW PREDICTION MARKETS, IT'S A WIDE AND RAPIDLY
00:03:13GROWING TREND THAT WE ARE ONLY
00:03:14JUST BEGINNING TO UNDERSTAND.
00:03:19AND WHEN WE ALL CAME TOGETHER,
00:03:21PATRICK AND KEVIN AND MYSELF,
00:03:23JORDAN DAVIDSON, WE ALL CAME TOGETHER TO BUILD THIS ORGANIZATION AND THOUGHT ABOUT
00:03:26DRUGS AS ADDICTION DRIVERS. NOT THINKING ABOUT TECHNOLOGY AND
00:03:30BETTING AND THOSE THINGS, WHICH NOW HAVE BECOME REAL DRIVERS OF
00:03:33ADDICTION IN OUR SOCIETY.
00:03:35AND THAT IS THE CONTEXT FOR TODAY.
00:03:38WE'RE BEGINNING TO EXPLORE
00:03:40SPORTS BETTING AS AN ISSUE AND
00:03:47NEEDS DO BE DEALT WITH AND WITHOUT FURTHER ADIEU, I'LL TURN IT OVER TO THE PANEL.
00:03:51>> I'M MARSHA LITE LORI HARMON
00:03:54AND LEE LITE LORI
00:03:57HARMON AND WITH THE FOUNDATION
00:04:00OF -- MARSHA LEE TAYLOR AND I'M
00:04:03WITH THE PANEL FOR DRUG POLICY AND A HOT TOPIC IN THE NEWS AND
00:04:07PEOPLE'S HOUSES AND NAVIGATING YOUNG KIDS AND SOMETIMES
00:04:10GROWNUPS THAT ARE GRAPPLING WITH
00:04:13SPORTS BETTING. I WOULD LIKE TO INTRODUCE OUR PANELLISTS TODAY.
00:04:17WE HAVE FORMER CONGRESSMAN PATRICK KENNEDY WITH US.
00:04:19HE SPENT EIGHT YEARS IN THE
00:04:21HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES AND ONE
00:04:27OF THE LEADING CHAMPIONS ON MENTAL HEALTH AND ADDICTION
00:04:30ISSUES AND ON BRAIN SCIENCE WRIT LARGE.
00:04:33HE WAS THE AUTHOR OF THE MENTAL
00:04:37HEALTH PARODY AND ADDICTION EQUITY ACT AND MANDATED FOR THE
00:04:40FIRST TIME EVER THAT INSURANCE COMPANIES HAD TO COVER TREATMENT
00:04:43FOR BEHAVIORAL HEALTH ISSUES. AND WE ARE ALL VERY GRATEFUL FOR
00:04:47HIS WORK ON THAT, HIS FOUNDING
00:04:50OF ONE MIND AND SAM AND THE KENNEDY FORUM AND THANK YOU FOR
00:04:54BEING WITH US TODAY.
00:04:56AND WES HAVE DANNY FUNT, WHO IS
00:04:59A JOURNALIST WITH THE WASHINGTON POST, WORK IS ALSO APPEARING IN
00:05:03THE NEW YORKER AND WALL STREET JOURNAL AND MOST IMPORTANTLY FOR THE DISCUSSION TODAY, HE'S THE
00:05:07AUTHOR OF EVERYONE LOSES. -- EVERYBODY LOSES, SORRY.
00:05:10HAVE TO GET THE TITLE RIGHT.
00:05:12EVERYBODY LOSES AND TUMULTUOUS
00:05:16RISE OF AMERICAN SPORTS GAMBLING
00:05:19AND I JOGGED MORE PAGES THAN NOT IN THE BOOK.
00:05:22IT'S FASCINATING AND REALLY IS A HISTORY OF HOW WE GOT HERE.
00:05:24A HISTORY OF GAMBLING IN THE
00:05:26UNITED STATES WITH A FOCUS ON
00:05:30WHAT HAS HAPPENED SUSPENDED ANDS
00:05:31THEES SUPREME SINCE THE
00:05:34SUPREME COURT OVERTURNED A FEDERAL BAN ON GAMBLING BACK IN
00:05:382018 AND WITH THAT, NOT EVERYONE
00:05:41IS AN EXPERT IN SPORTS GAMBLING
00:05:43SO, DANNY, WOULD YOU TALK A BIT
00:05:49ABOUT WHERE WE ARE AND HOW BIG
00:05:56OF A PROBLEM IT IS. >> ABSOLUTELY. WHAT AN HONOR.
00:06:00I'VE BEEN COVERING FOR SEVERAL YEARS BEFORE WRITING THE BOOK AS
00:06:03A SPORTS FAN, I ASSUMED GAMBLING WOULD NEVER BE ENCOURAGED BY THE
00:06:06LEAGUES. THEY SPOKE OF IT IN ALMOST
00:06:08BIBLICAL TERMS THAT IT WAS THIS
00:06:10EVIL THAT WOULD BE THE DEADLIEST THING POSSIBLE AND THAT'S SOMETHING THE COMMISSIONER OF
00:06:14BASEBALL SAID BARELY A DECADE AGO.
00:06:17SO TO SEE THINGS FROM THAT TO WHERE WE ARE TODAY AND IT'S
00:06:20UBIQUITOUS, INESCAPABLE EVEN IF YOU'RE NOT BETTING.
00:06:23CAN'T TURN ON A GAME OR LISTEN TO YOUR FAVORITE PODCAST WITHOUT
00:06:27BEING BOMBARDED WITH APPEALS TO GAMBLE. ALL OF THAT WAS
00:06:31DIS-ORLIKOWSKI CENTING, AND I FELT LIKE DISORIENTING AND I
00:06:34FELT LIKE IN THE STATES I'VE LIVED WHERE LEGALIZATION
00:06:37EXPLODED ACROSS THE COUNTRY, WE WERE KIND OF CHEATED OUT OF THE
00:06:40SORT OF DEBATE YOU'D THINK WOULD
00:06:44BE MANDATORY BEFORE DOING
00:06:48SOMETHING LIKE THAT AND ALLOWING PEOPLE TO BET ON PHONES EVERY SECOND OF EVERY GAME IS SO
00:06:53VOLATILE OR EXPLOSIVE AND WHO
00:06:56WAS THIS IN DANGER AND HOW WILL WE PROTECT SPORTS FROM BEING CORRUPTED?
00:07:00WILL IT INCREASE ADDICTION AND ALL OF THESE BASIC QUESTIONS
00:07:03WERE BRUSHED ASIDE AND MY HOPE
00:07:05FOR THE BOOK IS TO CONFRONT
00:07:08THOSE AND HOPEFULLY GENERATE
00:07:10ENOUGH INTEREST THAT THE
00:07:13LEAGUES, VARIOUS POLITICIANS,
00:07:14ALL OF THEM IN THE SPORTS BOOKS
00:07:17OBVIOUSLY AND THERE'S TIME TO
00:07:28RECKON WITH ALL THAT'S HAPPENING
00:07:29WITH SPORTS IN JUST AMERICAN
00:07:34LIFE. >> PATRICK, YOU LIVE IN NEW
00:07:38JERSEY, THE BIRTHPLACE OF ALL THIS. NEW JERSEY PASSED THE LAW THAT
00:07:41ORIGINALLY CHALLENGED THE
00:07:44FEDERAL BAN. AND YOU HAVE BEEN AS I MENTIONED
00:07:46BEFORE, A LEADER ON ADDICTION
00:07:50ISSUES. WHAT'S YOUR PERSPECTIVE ON ALL
00:07:51THAT AND WHY ARE YOU SO
00:08:00ENERGIZED ABOUT THIS ISSUE? >> THANKS, MARSHA.
00:08:03DANNY, THANKS AND CONGRATULATIONS ON A FANTASTIC
00:08:06BOOK AND GREAT CONTRIBUTION TO THE COUNTRY.
00:08:08YOU HAVE DONE THE I DID FINTIVE
00:08:11OUTLINE AS TO -- DEFINITIVE OUT
00:08:14LINE OF HOW WE GOT HERE GOING FROM AS YOU SAID A WORLD WHERE
00:08:17THIS WAS SEEN AS UNBELIEVABLY
00:08:20UNLIKELY TO HAPPEN TO NOW
00:08:22SOMETHING THAT IS UBIQUITOUS AND
00:08:24IT'S POSING, FROM MY VANTAGE POINTER, A HUGE DANGER TO THE
00:08:28PUBLIC HEALTH IN AMERICA.
00:08:30I HAD THE HONOR OF BEING THE SPONSOR OF THE MENTAL HEALTH
00:08:34PARODY AND ADDICTION EQUITY ACT.
00:08:37IN THAT ROLE, I FOUGHT TO MAKE SURE MENTAL HEALTH AND ADDICTION
00:08:41WAS REIMBURSED BY INSURANCE COMPANIES AND WAS TREATED IN THE
00:08:45SAME WAY AS WE'D TREAT ANY OTHER
00:08:48ILLNESS IN OUR HEALTHCARE SYSTEM.
00:08:51OF COURSE MENTAL ILLNESS AND ADDICTION, DEPRESSION, ANXIETY
00:08:55AND TRAUMA.
00:09:01NONE OF THAT WAS CONSIDERED HEALTH. IT WAS LIKE WE SEPARATED THE
00:09:04MIND FROM THE BODY IN TERMS OF COVERAGE.
00:09:07WE WERE ABLE TO -- IN 2008 IN A
00:09:10BIPARTISAN WAY, PASS A BILL THAT REQUIRED INSURANCE COMPANIES TO
00:09:15COVER THE BRAIN LIKE THEY WOULD
00:09:16ANY OTHER ORGAN OF THE BODY FOR
00:09:19ANY SET OF CHRONIC ILLNESSES.
00:09:21HERE'S THE POINT, EVERYBODY HAS
00:09:26BEEN COMPLAINING, ESPECIALLY POST COVID, THERE'S A MENTAL
00:09:30HEALTH AND ADDICTION CRISIS IN THE COUNTRY. EVERYBODY IN AMERICA IS SAYING
00:09:33OH MY GOD, OUR KIDS ARE IN AN
00:09:35EXISTENTIAL FIGHT FOR THEIR
00:09:38LIVES WITH THEIR MENTAL HEALTH.
00:09:40SO THEY ALSO SAY, WE DON'T HAVE
00:09:43ENOUGH CLINICIANS.
00:09:46TAKING CARE OF THE NEED WE HAVE IN AMERICA.
00:09:49I SAY TO MYSELF, I SEE THESE NEW
00:09:57ADDICTION FOR PROFIT COMPANIES IN AMERICA AND MY FATHER FOUGHT
00:10:01WITH HENRY WAXMAN AGAINST BIG TOBACCO AS WE ALL RECALL, THE
00:10:04CEOS CAME UP TO CAPITOL HILL AND
00:10:06LIED THROUGH THEIR TEETH ABOUT
00:10:08THIS NOT BEING AN ADDICTIVE
00:10:12PRODUCT. THEN WE SAW WITH THE OPIOID
00:10:15PSORIASIS, PURDUE FAR -- OPIOID
00:10:18CRISIS, PURDUE PHARMA, WHICH TOTALLY CAPITALIZED ON THEIR
00:10:22CEDING THE WHOLE MEDICAL ESTABLISHMENT WITH THEIR
00:10:24INDICATOR OF TREATING PAIN AS A
00:10:28PRIMARY OBLIGATION TO THE POINT WHERE THEY WERE IGNORING THE
00:10:32DOWNSTREAM IMPACT OF ADDICTION.
00:10:37QUESTION ALL COMPLAINED ABOUT PURDUE PHARMA.
00:10:40TODAY, WE'RE LETTING THE NEWLY
00:10:44TOBACCO IN MARIJUANA, THE NEW
00:10:46BIG KIND OF PHARMA ADDICTION
00:10:48FOR-PROFIT INDUSTRIES COME IN
00:10:52LIKE SPORTS BETTING AND SAYING
00:10:57WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PEOPLE TO TREAT THE PRESIDENT WE'RE POURING GASOLINE ON THE FIRE OF
00:11:01MENTAL ILLNESS AND ADDICTION.
00:11:06SO WE HAVE POLITICIANINGS SAYING
00:11:11WE NEED TO ADDRESS MENTAL HEALTH
00:11:15AND ADIRECTION AND EXPOSING AND PROMOTING THE VERY INDUSTRIES THAT ARE PUTTING MORE AMERICANS
00:11:18IN JEOPARDY FOR MENTAL ILLNESS AND ADDICTION.
00:11:21SO MY VANTAGE POINT FROM ALL OF
00:11:24THIS IS THAT WE NEED TO GET
00:11:27HONEST AND TRANSPARENT IN THIS COUNTRY.
00:11:30DO WE REALLY CARE ABOUT THE MENTAL WELLBEING OF OUR FELLOW
00:11:34CITIZENS? PARTICULARLY OUR CHILDREN
00:11:37BECAUSE WE ALL HAVE COMPLAINED
00:11:38ABOUT SOCIAL MEDIA AND THE FACT
00:11:45OUR KIDS ARE GLUES TO IPHONES AND I PADS AND NOW THEY'VE
00:11:48PRIMED THE BRAIN FOR ADDICTION. WHAT DO WE HAVE NOW?
00:11:51WE HAVE BETTING ALL ON YOUR
00:11:56PHONE IN NEW JERSEY, WE USED TO HAVE PEOPLE JUST GO TO THE
00:11:59KANSAS CITY CHIEFS VINOES.
00:12:01NOW THEY'VE GOT A CASINO IN
00:12:03THEIR POCKET.
00:12:07THE SPORTS BETTING IS JUST THE BEGINNING OF THOSE, YOU KNOW,
00:12:11VIRTUAL PLATFORMS FOR BETTING
00:12:13TAKING OFF AND NOW WE'RE SEEING
00:12:16I GAMING, WHICH IS, YOU KNOW,
00:12:18THE ROULETTE WHEEL ON YOUR
00:12:22PHONE.
00:12:22AND SEEING THIS PREDICTIVE
00:12:29MARKETS AND NOT SEEN AS GAMBLING
00:12:32BUT A LOOPHOLE THEY'VE JUMPED THROUGH AND IT'S A BIG ISSUE AND
00:12:34READING ABOUT IT WITH RESPECT TO
00:12:39THE TECH ATHLETICS SIXTYIVE --
00:12:47PREDICTIVE MARKETING AND WE HAVE SOMEONE LIKE DANNY TO BRING US THROUGH THE RESISTANCE EVIDENCE
00:12:49OF HISTORY OF WHERE WE ARE TODAY AND HOW WE GOT HERE.
00:12:52>> I WAS STRUCK READING THE BOOK ABOUT THE PARALLELS WITH
00:12:56MARIJUANA LEGALIZATION AND HERE WITH ARE AT SAM HEADQUARTERS AND
00:12:59THINK A LOT ABOUT MARIJUANA AND PUSHING BACK AGAINST THE
00:13:01STAMPEDE ACROSS THE COUNTRY.
00:13:04IN BOTH CASES, WE'VE SEEN REALLY
00:13:08RAPID SOCIAL CHANGE DRIVEN BY LEGALIZATION THAT'S BEEN FOLLOWED BY INTENSE
00:13:12COMMERCIALIZATION.
00:13:13YOU KNOW, THE ADVERTISING IS
00:13:16EVERYWHERE FOR THIS, AND THAT LEADS TO A KIND OF NORMALIZATION
00:13:20OF BEHAVIOR.
00:13:23HOW DO WE GO ABOUT REIGNING --
00:13:26OR CAN WE REIGN ANY OF THAT IN SO WE BEGIN TO HAVE COMMON SENSE
00:13:30REGULATIONS? IS THAT POSSIBLE AT THIS POINT?
00:13:32WHAT DO YOU THINK THE BEST VENUE
00:13:34FOR THAT IS?
00:13:38>> IT'S INTERESTING AS YOU COMPARE TO MARIJUANA. THE ARGUMENT FROM THE INDUSTRY
00:13:42AND VARIOUS POLITICIANS WHO SUPPORTED IT, AND THE LEAGUES
00:13:45THAT EVENTUALLY BECAME THE BIGGEST CHAMPIONS FOR
00:13:49LEGALIZATION WAS THAT THERE'S A ROBUST BLACK MARKET
00:13:53YOU HAVE THIS ROBUST BLACK MARKET THAT'S UNTAXED, UNREGULATED. WHY NOT BRING THAT INTO THE SUNLIGHT FOR THE SAKE OF
00:13:57CUSTOMERS WITHOUT ACTUALLY EXPANDING THE AMOUNT OF BETTING GOING ON?
00:14:01AND I THINK THEY VASTLY OVERSTATED THE SIZE OF THE BLACK MARKET. OF COURSE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN
00:14:04BETTING ON SPORTS FOREVER.
00:14:07BUT WHEN ADAM SILVER SAID $400
00:14:09BILLION WERE BEING WAGERED EVERY
00:14:11YEAR ON SPORTS, AND YOU THINK ABOUT NOW A LITTLE MORE THAN
00:14:15$150 BILLION ARE WAGERED LEGALLY, THE IDEA THAT DOUBLE THAT WAS BEING BET BEFORE
00:14:19BILLIONS HAD BEEN SPENT ON MARKETING AND INTEGRATING IT AND
00:14:21TELECASTS, ALL THAT, THERE WERE,
00:14:25THERE'S GOOD REASON TO THINK
00:14:26THAT WAS A LUDICROUS
00:14:32OVERSTATEMENT, BUT BEYOND THAT, SO FEW STATES IN PRACTICE ACTUALLY PURSUED THAT IDEA OF
00:14:35WE'RE NOT GOING TO GROW THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE GAMBLING, WE'RE JUST GOING TO MAKE IT SAFER AND SOMETHING WE CAN TAX.
00:14:45OHIO WAS REALLY IN A SMALL HANDFUL OF STATES THAT SEEMED LIKE THAT WAS THEIR PRIORITY, AND THEY IMMEDIATELY SAID.
00:14:49THESE DECEPTIVE PROMOTIONS LIKE CALLING A $1000 RISK FREE BET TO GET YOU THROUGH THE DOOR, THAT
00:14:52WAS VERY SEDUCTIVE.
00:14:54IN A LOT OF THE COUNTRY.
00:15:14THEY SAID THAT'S MISLEADING BECAUSE IT'S FUNDAMENTALLY NOT RISK FREE IF YOU CAN LOSE THAT $1000. PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T READ THE FINE
00:15:18PRINT WERE PRETTY UPSET TO LEARN THAT. THEY SAID OTHER FORMS OF ADVERTISING SHOULD BE RESTRICTED. NOW THEY'RE SAYING ALL THESE
00:15:22PROP BETS, WHICH ARE ESSENTIALLY CARVING UP GAMES INTO THOUSANDS OF BETTING OPPORTUNITIES WITHIN THE GAME. THAT'S OUT OF HAND, AND GOVERNOR
00:15:25DEWINE IN OHIO HAS SAID THIS IS HIS BIGGEST MISTAKE IN OFFICE WAS LEGALIZING SPORTS BETTING AND EVEN AFTER ALL OF THESE
00:15:29RESTRICTIONS THAT ARE AN OUTLIER ACROSS THE COUNTRY, THE IDEA THAT YOU MIGHT WANT IT LEGAL BUT YOU MIGHT WANT TO CONTAIN IT
00:15:33THROUGH TAXING AND THOSE REGULATIONS AND, AND THAT APPROACH IS SO FOREIGN TO SO
00:15:36MANY STATES WHERE IT'S BASICALLY BEEN LET IT RIP AND LET THIS GET
00:15:39AS BIG AS IT CAN GET.
00:15:48AND I THINK IN TIME WE'VE SEEN
00:15:49SO MANY OTHER PARTS OF THE WORLD
00:16:06WHO ALLOWED THAT AND INSTALLED SUCH FLIMSY GUARDRAILS, AND THEN AFTER, AFTER FAR TOO LONG THEY SAW THIS IS AN ADDICTION CRISIS
00:16:10IN THE MAKING. IT'S CORRUPTING SPORTS, RATES OF YOUTH GAMBLING ARE FRIGHTENING. WE HAVE TO CRACK DOWN AND HAVE A WAVE OF RE-REGULATION.
00:16:13I THINK THAT'S EVENTUALLY IN STORE IN THE US, BUT WHAT IT'LL TAKE TO MOTIVATE STATES TO REALIZE THAT THIS IS OUT OF HAND
00:16:16COULD BE PRETTY GRIM.
00:16:28>> YEAH, AND PATRICIA, I'D LOVE YOUR THOUGHTS ON THAT TOO. AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE YOU'VE WORKED SO LONG IN THE
00:16:32SUBSTANCE USE FIELD, WHAT ARE THE PARALLELS FOR PREVENTION AND THE THINGS WE NEED TO BE
00:16:34TEACHING KIDS IN SCHOOLS?
00:16:41>> SO I ACTUALLY BELIEVE WE NEED A WHOLESALE CHANGE IN A WHOLE APPROACH TO ADDRESSING THIS MENTAL HEALTH AND ADDICTION CRISIS IN THIS COUNTRY WHERE WE
00:16:45PUT A PREMIUM ON EDUCATING OUR KIDS HOW TO HAVE THE TOOLS THAT FRANKLY AS SOMEONE IN RECOVERY
00:16:48MYSELF, I'VE BEEN GIVEN BY DINT
00:16:53OF BEING IN RECOVERY WHERE I HAVE TO LEARN HOW TO SELF
00:16:57MODULATE, HAVE BETTER COPING MECHANISM DEVELOPMENT, PROBLEM
00:16:59SOLVING SKILLS.
00:17:03I HAVE TO HAVE SKILLS TO BE ABLE TO INTERVENE WHEN I KNOW THERE ARE INTRUSIVE THOUGHTS THAT ARE
00:17:06COUNTERPRODUCTIVE.
00:17:26LIKE THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT THE AVERAGE PERSON LISTENING TO THIS MAY BE KIND OF, WHAT IS HE TALKING ABOUT? I'M TALKING ABOUT THE ABILITY TO SHORT CIRCUIT MY COMPULSIVE
00:17:30RESPONSE TO TRIGGERS THAT WOULD PUT ME BACK OUT AS AN ACTIVE USER OF DRUGS AND ALCOHOL. AND SO I HAVE A COPING MECHANISM.
00:17:34I GO TO 12 STEP RECOVERY. I HAVE PEERS. I EVEN HAVE AN ADDICTION TRAINED
00:17:37PSYCHIATRIST. MOST MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONALS
00:17:41ARE NOT TRAINED IN ACTUAL
00:17:42ADDICTION TREATMENT, IRONICALLY.
00:17:46SO THE POINT IN ALL THIS IS THAT IN A WORLD WHERE MORE IS GOING
00:17:49TO BE DEPENDENT ON OUR FELLOW
00:17:52AMERICANS' ABILITY TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO NAVIGATE A VERY
00:17:55TUMULTUOUS WORLD COMING WITH AI.
00:18:01POTENTIALLY DISLOCATING OVER HALF OF OUR COUNTRY'S EMPLOYEE BASE CERTAINLY WITHIN THE NEXT 5 YEARS, 60% RESKILLING OF
00:18:05AMERICA'S WORKFORCE.
00:18:18CAN YOU IMAGINE THE TRAUMA ON FAMILIES WITH THE COMING OF AI? HOW ARE WE GOING TO MANAGE THAT KIND OF TRAUMA IN THE MIDST OF
00:18:21THE TRAUMA WE'RE LIVING THROUGH POLITICALLY IN THIS COUNTRY RIGHT NOW, WHERE WE'RE ALL AT
00:18:24EACH OTHER'S THROATS IF WE
00:18:44BELONG TO THE WRONG TEAM? SO WE ARE AT A POINT NOW WHERE OUR KIDS CANNOT COPE BECAUSE THEY'VE SPENT SO MUCH OF THEIR TIME ON TECHNOLOGY.
00:18:48THEY DON'T HAVE THE SOCIAL AND EMOTIONAL SKILLS TO MANAGE THEIR OWN FEELINGS AND FEELINGS AND EMOTIONS, SO I WOULD SAY WE HAVE TO PUT A PREMIUM BECAUSE WE CAN
00:18:52SEE EDUCATION HAS TO CHANGE IN ORDER TO PREPARE OUR PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO WORK IN A MODERN WORK
00:18:54WORLD.
00:19:09AND IN A MODERN WORK WORLD, IF AI IS DOING A LOT OF CRITICAL THINKING THAT USED TO BE DONE BY PEOPLE, WHAT IS THE
00:19:12DIFFERENTIATOR ON OUR SUCCESS? IT'S THE ABILITY FOR US TO STAY FOCUSED. TO BE ABLE TO BE CREATIVE, TO BE ABLE TO CONNECT SOCIALLY, THOSE ARE SKILLS THAT HAVE BEEN
00:19:16DEPLETED BECAUSE OF THE OVERUSE OF TECHNOLOGY.
00:19:20NOW NOT ONLY DO WE HAVE THAT DEFICIT IN SOCIAL EMOTIONAL LEARNING, WE NOW HAVE THESE ADDICTION FOR PROFIT INDUSTRIES
00:19:24LIKE SPORTS BETTING.
00:19:31THAT ARE GOING TO BE FURTHER CHALLENGING THE MENTAL WHEREWITHAL THAT WE HAVE AS A COUNTRY AND AT THE END OF THE DAY OUR CAPITAL USED TO BE AN
00:19:35INFRASTRUCTURE ROADS, BRIDGES,
00:19:39AND THE LIKE OR TECHNOLOGY OR NOW OUR CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE IS OUR BRAINS.
00:19:42IT'S GOING TO BE THE BRAIN.
00:19:57CAPITAL IS GOING TO BE WHAT FUELS THE ECONOMY IN A WORLD WHERE AI IS NOW GOING TO BE ITS ADVANTAGES ARE GOING TO BE DETERMINED BY THE CREATIVITY OF OUR POPULATION, WHICH IS NOT
00:20:01GOING TO BE POSSIBLE IF WE ARE LOCKED WITH HANDS BEHIND OUR BACK BECAUSE WE HAVE NOW BEEN
00:20:03HELD HOSTAGE BY ADDICTION.
00:20:12ISSUES BY TOO MUCH MARIJUANA BEING MARKETED MORE THAN STARBUCKS, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE
00:20:15TOO MUCH, YOU KNOW, SPORTS
00:20:32BETTING WHICH IS GOING TO FUEL THE FLAMES OF ADDICTION AND MENTAL ILLNESS IN OUR COUNTRY. WHAT ARE WE THINKING AS A NATION
00:20:36IF WE WANT TO BE THE LEADER ECONOMICALLY IN THE WORLD? WE ARE DESTROYING THE LEADING ECONOMIC DRIVER OF OUR COUNTRY, WHICH IS OUR FELLOW AMERICANS'
00:20:39ABILITY TO MAXIMIZE THEIR BRAINS. AND FEEL LIKE THEY CAN MAKE CRITICAL DECISIONS, WHICH IS ALL GOING TO BE COMPROMISED IF
00:20:43THEY'RE IF THEY'RE NOW HELD
00:20:44HOSTAGE BY THINGS LIKE GAMBLING,
00:20:56THINGS LIKE MARIJUANA, AND IT'S REALLY SHOCKING TO ME WE'VE COME SO FAR HAVING A PUBLIC SAFETY, PUBLIC HEALTH PERSPECTIVE THAT
00:21:00WE'RE COMPROMISING THE VERY, YOU KNOW, WHEREWITHAL OF OUR FELLOW
00:21:02AMERICANS' ABILITY.
00:21:11AND WE TALKED ALL ABOUT PHYSICAL FITNESS. PART OF PHYSICAL FITNESS IS MENTAL FITNESS, AND THAT HAS BEEN DEGRADED BY ALL OF THIS
00:21:14SOCIAL MEDIA.
00:21:26AND NOW SOCIAL MEDIA LEADING TO THE SPORTS BETTING. MAYBE DANNY TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT HOW YOU KNOW WE'VE PRIMED
00:21:30OUR KIDS' BRAINS, YOU KNOW, FOR WIRING THEM FOR ADDICTION. WHEN I WAS GROWING UP, MY FATHER USED TO MAKE ME DO PUT THE
00:21:33FIREPLACE TOGETHER BECAUSE HE LIKED IN THE WINTERTIME WE'VE HAD SOME COLD WEATHER RECENTLY,
00:21:36A BIG FIRE, AND HE SAID PUT THE
00:21:37KINDLING IN FIRST.
00:21:53"WHAT'S THE KINDLING," DAD? "THAT'S ALL THE DRY WOOD THAT WILL GET THIS FIRE STARTED. THEN YOU CAN PUT THE BIGGER LOGS ON."
00:21:56WELL, WE HAVE PUT THE KINDLING ON IN TERMS OF OUR KIDS' BRAINS WITH RESPECT TO SOCIAL MEDIA.
00:22:00NOW WE'RE POURING GASOLINE ON THAT FIRE BY GIVING THEM ACCESS
00:22:04TO, YOU KNOW, THE SPORTS BETTING
00:22:05AND OTHER KIND OF GAMBLING.
00:22:24AND IF THEY'RE ANXIOUS NOW, WHAT CAN THEY DO? THEY CAN TAKE A GUMMY BEAR, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN DRINK MARIJUANA THROUGH WHAT THEY CALL AN
00:22:28ELIXIR, YOU KNOW, FANTA AID WITH THC IN IT. IT'S LIKE YOU COULD NOT MAKE UP A MORE TREACHEROUS GAUNTLET FOR KIDS TO WALK THROUGH TODAY THAN WHAT WE AS ADULTS HAVE PUT IN
00:22:32THE WAY OF OUR OWN KIDS'
00:22:33DEVELOPMENT IN THIS COUNTRY.
00:22:41>> LET'S TALK FOR A MOMENT ABOUT THE SAFEGUARDS THAT SHOULD BE IN PLACE AND THAT SOME OF THE
00:22:43COMPANIES SAY ARE IN PLACE.
00:22:46DANNY, IT'S AN INTERESTING STORY
00:22:49YOU TELL IN THE BOOK WHERE
00:22:52YOU'RE INTERVIEWING A WOMAN WHO'S RECENTLY LEFT ONE OF THE BIG COMPANIES THAT WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR $3 BILLION WORTH
00:22:56OF GAMBLING OVER 14 STATES AND YOU ASK HER, SHE WAS RESPONSIBLE
00:23:00FOR RESPONSIBLE GAMING AT THE
00:23:03COMPANY, AND YOU ASKED HER
00:23:06APPROXIMATELY HOW MANY PEOPLE
00:23:08WERE ON YOUR TEAM, AND YOU VERY KINDLY SAID, I KNOW YOU'VE JUST
00:23:12LEFT, SO YOU DON'T NEED TO GIVE ME AN EXACT NUMBER.
00:23:15JUST A BALLPARK IS GREAT.
00:23:22AND HER RESPONSE WAS, "WELL, IT'S EASY. IT WAS JUST ME." THAT SEEMS WOEFULLY INADEQUATE. I THINK ANYONE WOULD SAY THAT.
00:23:25BUT I THINK IT'S A VERY TELLING STORY, AND I'M GLAD YOU INCLUDED IT IN THE BOOK. CAN YOU TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE SAFEGUARDS THAT ARE IN PLACE
00:23:29NOW AND, AND, AND, AND WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE TO
00:23:31APPROPRIATELY BEEF THEM UP SO WE
00:23:35HAVE SOME INTERNAL FOLKS OR INTERNAL SYSTEMS THAT ARE
00:23:37FLAGGING PEOPLE WHO ARE, ARE
00:23:40GOING DOWN A VERY DANGEROUS PATH
00:23:41VERY QUICKLY.
00:23:48>> YEAH, WELL, FIRST OF ALL, MY JAW WAS JUST ON THE FLOOR WHEN I HEARD THAT. THIS WAS A COMPANY CALLED
00:23:52POINTSBET THAT WAS SINCE ACQUIRED BY FANATICS. IT'S ONE OF THE KIND OF SECOND
00:23:56TIER OPERATORS, AND THEY'RE GROWING PRETTY QUICKLY, AND I HAD JUST BEEN HEARING AGAIN AND
00:24:00AGAIN ALL THESE ASSURANCES FROM PEOPLE WHO'D WORKED AT
00:24:03POINTSBET.
00:24:12SOMEONE IN MARKETING WOULD SAY, "OH, IF A COMMERCIAL SEEMED LIKE WE WANTED THE RESPONSIBLE GAMBLING DEPARTMENT TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT, WE WOULD RUN IT BY
00:24:15RG." RG IS THE ACRONYM THEY USE, OR
00:24:19WITH THIS WHOLE SECTOR OF THE BUSINESS THAT CATERS TO SO-CALLED VIP CUSTOMERS, PEOPLE WHO ARE LOSING A STAGGERING
00:24:23AMOUNT OF MONEY, THERE'S A LOT OF DICEY THINGS THAT GO ON WITH THAT OF EGGING ON PEOPLE WHO
00:24:26MIGHT BE GOING OVERBOARD.
00:24:39AND THEY ALL SAID "NO, NO, IF SOMEONE IS DISPLAYING SIGNS OF A PROBLEM, WE HAVE RG STEP IN OR RUN IT BY RG." SO RUN IT BY RG WAS JUST ECHOING IN MY HEAD AND I EXPECTED THIS
00:24:43ARMY OF PEOPLE AT A COMPANY THAT BIG TO BE DEALING WITH ALL THAT RESPONSIBILITY AND AS YOU SAID
00:24:48IT WAS ONE PERSON FOR YEARS,
00:24:53EVEN AT THE COMPANIES THAT HAVE
00:24:56MORE ROBUST RG DEPARTMENTS, AND I THINK I, I SORT OF SQUIRM EVEN SAYING RG. I THINK IT'S SUCH A EUPHEMISM,
00:25:00AND IT KIND OF BRUSHES AWAY THE SERIOUSNESS OF WHAT'S AT STAKE
00:25:02WITH THAT, BUT HEARING FROM
00:25:13PEOPLE AT HIGH RANKING JOBS IN THOSE DEPARTMENTS AT SOME OF THE
00:25:15TOP SPORTS BOOKS SAYING.
00:25:25"WE SOMETIMES FEEL LIKE OUR HANDS ARE TIED BEHIND OUR BACK" BECAUSE AS ONE OF THEM PUT IT, ANYTHING BEYOND THE LOWEST COMMON DENOMINATOR OF CONSUMER
00:25:28PROTECTIONS THAT THE INDUSTRY IS ENACTING, ANYTHING BEYOND THAT IS SEEN AS A COMPETITIVE DISADVANTAGE WHERE WE'RE JUST GOING TO LOSE CUSTOMERS OR PUSH
00:25:32OUR MOST VALUABLE CUSTOMERS TO OUR COMPETITORS IF WE ARE LOOKING OUT FOR THEM BEYOND THE BARE MINIMUM, SO THAT I FIND SO
00:25:35ALARMING.
00:25:51HONESTLY, EVEN THE RELUCTANCE TO CALL THIS GAMBLING, AS ABSURD AS THAT MIGHT SOUND, SENATOR RICHARD BLUMENTHAL, HAS BEEN VERY VOCAL ABOUT THIS.
00:25:55HE, LIKE A LOT OF PEOPLE WERE
00:25:55BOTHERED WHEN IT CAME TO LIGHT
00:26:04THAT A LOT OF THESE OPERATORS WERE STRIKING DEALS WITH COLLEGES TO MARKET TO COLLEGE STUDENTS AND WHETHER THEY'RE OF, OF AGE OR NOT, THAT JUST SEEMS
00:26:07PROBABLY INAPPROPRIATE. AND I REMEMBER HE SENT ME THE LETTERS THAT THEY ALL SENT IN REPLY, AND DRAFTKINGS MADE ALMOST 50 REFERENCES TO
00:26:11RESPONSIBLE GAMING AND PROBLEM GAMING AND OUR GAMING AND ALL THAT, AND NOT ONE MENTION OF THE
00:26:13WORD GAMBLING.
00:26:30AND IF WE'RE NOT GOING TO CALL THIS GAMBLING, HOW SERIOUS COULD WE REALLY BE ABOUT THE DANGERS THAT COME WITH GAMBLING? THE BRIGHT SIDE, I GUESS, AS YOU
00:26:34WERE GETTING AT IS THERE'S A LOT OF REFORMS THAT COULD BE DONE
00:26:36AND A LOT OF OTHER PLACES IN THE
00:26:56WORLD THAT DO SO MUCH MORE THAN THE US. BECAUSE AS I SAID, THEY'VE REALIZED SELF ENTRUSTING THE INDUSTRY TO SELF-POLICE IS INADEQUATE.
00:27:00I WAS RECENTLY TALKING WITH SOMEONE WHO WANTED ME ON THEIR PODCAST IN AUSTRIA, AND I'M TRYING TO SELL EVERY BOOK I CAN, SO I SAID ABSOLUTELY, LET'S DO
00:27:03IT. AND HE'S A RESEARCHER THERE AND HAS DONE SOME WORK WITH OPERATORS IN EUROPE, AND HE WAS JUST EXPLAINING ACROSS EUROPE
00:27:07IT'S AN EXPECTATION THAT OPERATORS HAVE TO HAVE THE TECHNOLOGY IN PLACE SO THAT ONE
00:27:10OF THE UPSIDES OF ONLINE
00:27:11GAMBLING IS YOU HAVE ALL THIS
00:27:16CUSTOMER DATA YOU COULD EXPLOIT THAT IN SOME PRETTY NEFARIOUS WAYS, BUT YOU COULD ALSO USE IT
00:27:19TO IDENTIFY SIGNS OF A PROBLEM
00:27:31AND THERE'S AN ONUS ON THOSE COMPANIES IN EUROPE TO USE THAT DATA TO INTERVENE. IF SOME FLAG, RED FLAGS, YEAH, AND BY AND LARGE THAT
00:27:34RESPONSIBILITY ISN'T THE EXPECTATION IN THE US, SO WE COULD GO ON FOR A LONG TIME, BUT
00:27:37THERE'S A LOT LIKE THAT.
00:27:41>> LIKE I LIVE NEAR ATLANTIC CITY IN NEW JERSEY AND YOU HAD
00:27:43TO GO TO THE CASINO. OK, AND WHEN YOU'RE IN THE CASINO, THEY'VE GOT THE EYES IN
00:27:47THE SKY, ALL OF THE CAMERAS
00:27:49LOOKING AT YOU, HOW MUCH ARE YOU DRINKING, HOW MUCH ARE YOU
00:27:52BETTING, EVERYTHING ELSE, YOU
00:27:57KNOW, WITH THIS NOW BEING A VIRTUAL WORLD WHERE IT'S ALL
00:27:59DIGITAL, IT'S IN YOUR POCKET,
00:28:02IT'S ON YOUR COMPUTER, IT'S ON
00:28:03YOUR PHONE, THIS IS
00:28:10FUNDAMENTALLY A WHOLE DIFFERENT ISSUE, RIGHT, YOU HAVE NO ONE
00:28:12SCREENING FOR PEOPLE UNDER 21.
00:28:17YOU HAVE NO ONE, YOU KNOW, YOU
00:28:18KNOW, CHECKING YOUR ID.
00:28:27EXPLAIN A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE WE HAVE THIS OUTDATED, JUST LIKE
00:28:29WITH MARIJUANA WHERE EVERYONE'S
00:28:45LIKE, "OH, IT'S YOU'RE SMOKING MARIJUANA. IT'S 2%." TODAY, MARIJUANA CONCENTRATE AND THC IS 10 TIMES WHAT IT WAS 20
00:28:49YEARS AGO AND NO ONE WHO'S THINKING ABOUT MARIJUANA POLICY. UNDERSTANDS THAT THEY ALSO DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'RE DRINKING MARIJUANA, ESSENTIALLY DRINKING
00:28:52THC OR EATING MARIJUANA, WHICH IS IN THE FOODS. SO WHAT I'M SAYING IS LIKE PART OF OUR JOB AT SAM IS JUST TO TRY TO REFRAME FOR PEOPLE THIS IS
00:28:56NOT THE ISSUE YOU THOUGHT IT WAS. SO YEARS AGO THE ISSUE WAS
00:28:59GAMBLING WAS GAMBLING. YOU HAD BOOKIES, YOU HAD CASINOS
00:29:02AND ALL THE REST.
00:29:17THIS IS LIKE GAMBLING ON CRACK. THIS IS YOUR PHONE IS YOUR CASINO. SO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE
00:29:20CHANGE IN THE FUNDAMENTAL NATURE
00:29:21OF GAMBLING.
00:29:25>> YEAH, AND BY THE WAY, I SHOULD SAY THAT AT LEAST TO OPEN ONE OF THESE ACCOUNTS YOU DO HAVE TO GIVE YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER AND SCAN YOUR
00:29:28ID, AND THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PEOPLE SIGNING UP ARE OF AGE, WHETHER
00:29:30THAT'S 18 OR 21 IN MOST STATES.
00:29:46BUT THEN, HOW HARD IS IT TO GET YOUR OLDER BROTHER OR YOUR NEIGHBOR OR THE UPPERCLASSMAN OR YOUR OR YOUR PARENT?
00:29:50I WAS DOING AN INTERVIEW ON WNYC JUST LAST WEEK AND, THEY OPENED THE, THE PHONE LINES TO LISTENERS TO CALL IN, AND THE
00:29:54FIRST GUY CALLS IN. I'M THINKING, YOU KNOW, IT'S GONNA BE SOMEONE WHO'S SAYING I DON'T LIKE GAMBLING OR THERE'S
00:29:57TOO MANY ADS OR WHATEVER, AND HE SAYS, I'M THE FATHER OF A SON WHO STARTED BETTING AT 17.
00:29:59AND IN A FEW YEARS SINCE THEN
00:30:04HAS RACKED UP $200,000 IN
00:30:08LOSSES, AND IT'S GOTTEN SO BAD
00:30:13AND MY WIFE AND I CAN'T GET
00:30:15THROUGH TO HIM THAT HE HAS A
00:30:20PROBLEM AND NEEDS HELP AND AS A
00:30:22RESULT WE'RE ESTRANGED FROM OUR
00:30:28CHILD AND THE IDEA THAT A 17 YEAR OLD WOULD BE STARTING TO BET AT THAT LEVEL AND IT WOULD
00:30:32BE SO RUINOUS FOR HIM AND HIS FAMILY, SADLY IT'S NOT THAT UNIQUE OF A STORY. THE RATES OF GAMBLING IN WELL DON'T YOU FORGET COLLEGE, WHICH
00:30:36IS OUT OF CONTROL, BUT HIGH SCHOOL, MIDDLE SCHOOL, EVEN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL IS, I THINK,
00:30:39REALLY WHAT MIGHT BE THE THING THAT MOTIVATES LAWMAKERS AND
00:30:43REGULATORS TO SAY WE MUST
00:30:44ACTUALLY, WE MUST DO MORE HERE
00:31:16-- REGULATORS TO SAY WE MUST DO MORE. >> IN TERMS OF THE ADDICTIVE NATURE. I MEAN, I, AND I THINK YOU'RE
00:31:19GETTING TO THIS A LITTLE BIT, PATRICK, SOME OF THE DESIGN FEATURES, I THINK YOU CALLED IT THE, THE SLOT MACHINE EFFECT,1 THAT YOU KNOW SORT OF PRIME THE
00:31:23SAME PATHWAYS IN THE BRAIN AND RELEASE DOPAMINE AND IT'S THE, IT'S THE SORT OF THE CONSTANT CHALLENGE AND THE INABILITY TO WALK AWAY. CAN YOU TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT
00:31:27THAT AND HOW THAT IS REALLY TAKING WHAT WAS HAPPENING IN THE CASINOS IN ATLANTIC CITY JUST TO
00:31:30A WILD NEW LEVEL. >> YEAH, SO YOU USED TO HAVE TO
00:31:34WALK IN THE CASINO. NOW NEW JERSEY PASSED IGAMING, WHICH IS NOW YOU CAN DO IT ALL AT THE CASINO IN YOUR PHONE, AND RATES OF ADDICTION HAVE DOUBLED
00:31:37IN NEW JERSEY. SO THAT'S A DIFFERENTIATOR BETWEEN THE FORMER RATES, WHICH WERE PEOPLE WHO WERE HAVING GAMBLING ADDICTION IN THE CASINOS, NOW THAT'S OVER DOUBLED
00:31:42BECAUSE NEW JERSEY PASSED THIS IGAMING. BY THE WAY, VIRGINIA RIGHT NOW
00:31:43HAS AN IGAMING BILL THAT COULD
00:31:46GET SIGNED BY THE GOVERNOR, AND ANYONE WATCHING OUGHT TO CALL GOVERNOR SPAMBERGER AND ASK HER
00:31:50TO VETO ANY LEGISLATION
00:31:50EXPANDING.
00:32:00GAMBLING TO I GAMING AND THAT'S WITHIN THE NEXT MONTH. SO IF YOU'RE WATCHING AND YOU'RE
00:32:03FROM VIRGINIA, PLEASE CALL YOUR LEGISLATORS AND TELL THEM YOU DON'T WANT TO ADD MORE FUEL TO THIS EPIDEMIC OF ONLINE
00:32:07ADDICTION.
00:32:15>> THERE ARE SO MANY AREAS OF THIS WHERE TO ME THE MOST STRIKING TAKEAWAY FROM MY BOOK IS HEARING FROM PEOPLE IN THE
00:32:19INDUSTRY WHO ARE SAYING THINGS ARE OUT OF CONTROL AND WE CAN'T
00:32:21BELIEVE HOW THIS BUSINESS IS
00:32:24EVOLVING AND PARTICULARLY
00:32:50HEARING SOMEONE WHO USED TO WORK AT FANDUEL, THE TOP ONLINE SPORTS BOOK IN THE COUNTRY, SAY.
00:32:53ONLINE CASINO, WHAT YOU WERE JUST DESCRIBING IS OUR MOST ETHICALLY PROBLEMATIC PRODUCT
00:32:57JUST BECAUSE ALL OF THESE ISSUES ARE SO MAGNIFIED WHEN YOU'RE PLAYING BLACKJACK, SLOTS, ROULETTE, YOU NAME IT, FROM YOUR
00:33:00PHONE. THERE WAS ONE EXECUTIVE, WHO STANDS OUT OF JUST BEING KIND OF SHOCKINGLY CANDID ABOUT THE WAY THAT THESE PRODUCTS ARE
00:33:05ENGINEERED TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF PEOPLE AND GET THEM TO OVERDO IT. HE WAS A VENDOR THAT PROVIDES
00:33:08THESE SO-CALLED MICRO BETS LIKE
00:33:14BETTING ON WILL THE NEXT PITCH BE A BALL OR A STRIKE, WILL THIS POSSESSION IN A FOOTBALL GAME END IN A TOUCHDOWN OR A PUNT,
00:33:18ALL OF THAT IS A BIG GROWTH AREA FOR THE BUSINESS BECAUSE THE IDEA THAT YOU'RE BETTING ON A MINUTE BY MINUTE AS OPPOSED TO AN HOUR BY HOUR BASIS IS
00:33:22POTENTIALLY REALLY PROFITABLE.
00:33:35AND I SAID, GOSH, I'VE HEARD FROM SO MANY HEALTH EXPERTS THAT BETTING IN THAT FRENZIED PACE IS
00:33:38A ROAD TOWARD COMPULSIVE BEHAVIOR.
00:33:42JUST NATURALLY IT'S ALMOST LIKE BEING IN A VORTEX OF JUST BANGING AWAY HOW QUICKLY YOU
00:33:46COULD OVERDO IT.
00:33:55ON A FINANCIAL SIDE, I SAID I'D IMAGINE, LET'S SAY SOMEONE'S COMFORTABLE BETTING 50 BUCKS PREGAME.
00:33:58IF THEY'RE BETTING $10.10 TIMES
00:34:18OVER THE COURSE OF THE GAME, THEY'RE GOING TO LOOK UP AND SAY "WOW, I'VE BET TWICE AS MUCH AS I INTENDED," AND HE SAID, "YEAH,
00:34:22THAT'S EXACTLY, THAT'S THE GOAL." AND THEN I SAID, "WHAT ABOUT THIS COMPULSIVE BEHAVIOR CONCERN?" AND HE INTERJECTED AND SAID
00:34:25"STICKY, STICKY IS HOW WE'D LIKE TO THINK OF IT," THAT IT'S
00:34:28STICKY, BUT WHAT YOU KNOW IT'S A EUPHEMISM OBVIOUSLY IT'S JUST A
00:34:31SOFTER WORD FOR COMPULSION AGAIN TO THE DRUG PARALLEL, IT SEEMS
00:34:35TO ME IN DRUG POLICY WE TALK ABOUT ROUTE OF ADMINISTRATION
00:34:36AND HOW A PILL DOESN'T.
00:34:52HIT YOUR SYSTEM AS QUICKLY AS SOMETHING TAKEN INTRAVENOUSLY AND IT SEEMS LIKE THIS IS THE IV SORT OF EXAMPLE OF GAMBLING THE
00:34:55SUICIDE RISKS BECAUSE ONE THING THAT PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITY, IN THE MENTAL HEALTH WORLD ARE VERY FOCUSED ON IS THE INCREASE IN SUICIDE IN AMERICA.
00:34:59AND THE PREVALENCE, AND I HAVE HEARD JUST ANECDOTALLY THAT SUICIDE GOES UP DRAMATICALLY, SUICIDE IDEATION AND COMPLETED SUICIDE BECAUSE OF SPORTS
00:35:02BETTING AND GAMBLING ADDICTION. NOW AS A PERSON RECOVERING MYSELF, I REMEMBER, YOU KNOW,
00:35:06HAVING CAR ACCIDENTS, HAVING COURT DATES, BEING ARRESTED, HAVING ALL KINDS OF CONSEQUENCES
00:35:08THAT GOT ME INTO RECOVERY WHAT
00:35:16HAPPENS WITH SPORTS BETTING IS
00:35:27IT'S INSIDIOUS BECAUSE PEOPLE CAN BET, BET, BET, AND THEY DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE ALL THE JACKPOTS THAT PEOPLE WHO HAVE
00:35:31THE OLD FASHIONED DRUG ADDICTION HAVE WHERE THEY GET LOTS OF WARNINGS AND STOP SIGNS LIKE DON'T DO THIS, YOU'RE GOING DOWN THE WRONG ROAD.
00:35:34AND IT CAN BE SOMETHING THAT CATCHES UP WITH YOU ALL OF A SUDDEN WHEN YOU REALIZE YOU'VE JUST GAMBLED AWAY ALL YOUR STUDENT LOANS, YOU'VE JUST
00:35:38GAMBLED AWAY YOUR KIDS' TUITION,
00:35:39YOU'VE JUST LIED TO YOUR SPOUSE
00:35:51AND GAMBLED AWAY THE MORTGAGE,
00:35:58YOU'VE JUST STOLEN AND EMBEZZLED MONEY, AND NOW YOU'RE LOOKING AT
00:36:00JAIL.
00:36:12LIKE, THESE ARE CATACLYSMIC, YOU KNOW, JACKPOTS, AND THEY FRANKLY MAKE THE JACKPOTS THAT PEOPLE
00:36:15LIKE ME WITH OLD FASHIONED DRUG AND ALCOHOL ADDICTION LOOK TAME
00:36:19IN COMPARISON, WHICH IS WHY I THINK THE LEVEL OF WHAT WE CALL
00:36:23PITIFUL AND INCOMPREHENSIBLE DEMORALIZATION, THAT'S HOW WE DESCRIBE IT IN RECOVERY, THAT
00:36:26MOMENT OF CLARITY WHERE WE SAY WE CAN'T GO ON. IS KIND OF LIKE IT COMES TOO
00:36:30LATE FOR PEOPLE WITH SPORTS BETTING AND GAMBLING ADDICTION,
00:36:33AND WHEN IT COMES, IT'S AT A MAGNITUDE GREATER THAN WHEN IT COMES TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE QUOTE
00:36:37UNQUOTE OLD FASHIONED ALCOHOLISM AND ADDICTION, BUT COULD YOU TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE
00:36:39SUICIDE IDEATION?
00:36:44>> THERE'S SO MANY DISTINCT QUALITIES OF GAMBLING ADDICTION
00:36:48IN GENERAL THAT ARE SO DANGEROUS. FOR ONE, AS YOU SAID, THE SUICIDAL IDEATION RATE, THE
00:36:52EXACT NUMBER, I'VE SEEN SOME DEBATE AROUND THAT, BUT I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE BELIEVE IT HAS THE HIGHEST RATE OF SUICIDAL
00:36:55IDEATION AMONG ADDICTIONS.
00:36:57THE FACT THAT IT'S AN INVISIBLE
00:37:02ADDICTION IS SO DANGEROUS, YOU KNOW, AS PEOPLE SAY YOU CAN'T SMELL GAMBLING ON SOMEONE'S
00:37:05BREATH. YOU DON'T SEE MARKS ON THEIR
00:37:08ARMS WHERE THEY'VE BEEN SHOOTING UP. THIS MIGHT SOUND NAIVE OF ME, BUT I WAS JUST BLOWN AWAY
00:37:12SPEAKING WITH PEOPLE WITH DEVASTATING GAMBLING ADDICTIONS
00:37:14FOR YEARS, YOU KNOW, BETTING
00:37:18EVERY MINUTE THEY COULD FIND,
00:37:22AND THEIR SPOUSE HAD NO IDEA.
00:37:23AND THAT'S JUST HORRIFYING.
00:37:30AND THE OTHER SIDE OF IT IS THAT IT'S WHAT'S REFERRED TO AS A PROGRESSIVE DISORDER WHERE IT CAN TAKE YEARS FOR A PROBLEM TO
00:37:34TAKE SHAPE. I SPOKE WITH A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO SAID I WAS BETTING ON SPORTS.
00:37:37I WAS FINE, AND ACTUALLY WHEN I FINALLY GOT THAT BIG WIN, THAT
00:37:41WAS MY CURSE BECAUSE I SPENT
00:37:45EVERY SUBSEQUENT DAY CHASING NOT JUST THAT MONEY BUT THAT FEELING
00:37:46AND OBVIOUSLY THEY ENDED UP
00:37:50LOSING WAY MORE MONEY AND THIS IS MUCH BIGGER THAN MONEY, BUT
00:37:52THAT WAS A PART OF IT, SO.
00:37:56I'M NO EXPERT, BUT JUST SPEAKING
00:38:00WITH AS MANY PEOPLE AS I COULD WHO ARE IN RECOVERY FOR GAMBLING PROBLEMS, THEY'VE SAID, THERE, YOU KNOW, GAMBLING ADDICTION
00:38:03TENDS TO COINCIDE WITH OTHER SUBSTANCE ABUSE, AND PEOPLE
00:38:07WHO'VE DEALT WITH MULTIPLE ADDICTIONS SAY GAMBLING CAN BE
00:38:09THE HARDEST ONE TO OVERCOME.
00:38:16AND JUST LASTLY, ONE REASON FOR THAT YOU WERE TOUCHING ON IS OH, PROBABLY ONLY WITH GAMBLING DO
00:38:19YOU THINK THAT YOUR PROBLEM IS YOUR SOLUTION.
00:38:24YOU CONVINCE YOURSELF THAT IF I
00:38:25COULD JUST WIN ENOUGH MONEY TO
00:38:30GET OUT OF THIS HOLE, EVERYTHING WILL BE BETTER, AND THAT'S, THAT
00:38:32CAN GET REALLY OUT OF CONTROL.
00:38:36>> ONE MORE QUESTION BEFORE WE OPEN IT UP TO THE AUDIENCE.
00:38:39I HOPE PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE HAVE SOME, SOME GOOD QUESTIONS TO, TO POSE. A LOT OF STATES WHEN THEY PASSED LEGISLATION TO LEGALIZE
00:38:43GAMBLING.
00:38:44THEY SAID WE'RE GOING TO TAKE
00:38:47SOME OF THE REVENUE AND WE'RE GOING TO INVEST IT INTO
00:38:49TREATMENT.
00:38:54WE'RE GOING TO INVEST IT INTO PREVENTION.
00:38:58AND AGAIN, PARALLELS WITH MARIJUANA, A LOT OF PROMISES MADE, NOT A LOT OF PROMISES KEPT.
00:39:02WHAT, WHAT CAN WE DO TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE IS MORE RESPONSIBILITY ON THE STATE LEVEL AND THAT THERE ARE MORE
00:39:06RESOURCES FOR PEOPLE WHO DO WIND UP DOWN THIS VERY DANGEROUS
00:39:07SPIRAL.
00:39:16>> YEAH, FIRST OF ALL, WE WERE ALL SOLD THAT THIS WAS GOING TO BE A BIG REVENUE GENERATOR FOR STATES.
00:39:19IT'S WHY WE BOUGHT LEGALIZATION OF MARIJUANA. IT'S WHY WE'VE BOUGHT, YOU KNOW,
00:39:23GAMBLING.
00:39:28IT'S BECAUSE IT'S A QUICK FIX FOR STATE BUDGETS, THIS IDEA THAT YOU GET TO GET MORE REVENUE
00:39:32WITHOUT HAVING TO DO THE TOUGH
00:39:33STUFF WHICH IS RAISE TAXES.
00:39:38THE PROBLEM IS IT'S NOT FOR
00:39:39FREE.
00:39:43AND ANYTHING THAT GLITTERS ISN'T
00:39:46ALWAYS GOLD, AND THE TRUE COST OF GAMBLING ADDICTION AND
00:39:50COMMERCIALIZATION OF MARIJUANA
00:39:51IS GOING TO OVERWHELM IN TERMS
00:39:54OF SOCIETAL COST AND COST TO
00:39:55STATE BUDGETS.
00:40:03COMPARED TO THE REVENUE THAT THEY'RE BRINGING IN FROM, FROM SPORTS BETTING AND GAMBLING, SO MAYBE DANNY, TALK A LITTLE BIT
00:40:07ABOUT THAT BECAUSE I DON'T THINK
00:40:09IN OUR MOVEMENT AS ADVOCATES
00:40:14WE'VE DONE A GOOD ENOUGH JOB PUTTING THE PRICE TAG SO THAT LEGISLATORS LIKE MY FORMER
00:40:18COLLEAGUES KNOW THAT IT REALLY
00:40:19ISN'T A WINDFALL OF FREE MONEY.
00:40:25THEY'RE GOING TO END UP SPENDING
00:40:33MORE MONEY ON ALL KINDS OF HUMAN SOCIAL SERVICES, CRIMINAL JUSTICE COSTS, AND OF COURSE THE TERRIBLE TRAGEDY OF BROKEN FAMILIES AND THE IMPACT ON REAL
00:40:37PEOPLE AND THEIR WHOLE LIVES.
00:40:46SO AND OF COURSE, THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY PROBABLY HASN'T TRULY
00:40:49FACTORED IN WHAT THIS IS DOING TO PRODUCTIVITY IN OUR COUNTRY
00:40:51AND ABILITY FOR WORKERS TO PAY ATTENTION WHEN THEY'RE AT WORK TO WHAT THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE
00:40:55DOING.
00:41:01SO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT.
00:41:08>> ONE SIDE OF THIS THAT I THINK IS SO ESSENTIAL AND SO REVEALING. IS WHENEVER WE TALK ABOUT, YOU
00:41:12KNOW, HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE GAMBLING NOW OR HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE GAMBLING PROBLEMS, THESE ARE REALLY EDUCATED GUESSES
00:41:16BECAUSE THERE HASN'T BEEN, AS REMARKABLE AS THIS IS, THERE HASN'T BEEN A FEDERAL STUDY OF THE PREVALENCE OF GAMBLING SINCE
00:41:201999.
00:41:27AND A FEW YEARS AGO, THERE'S BEEN A, THERE'S BEEN A FEDERAL EXCISE TAX ON SPORTS BETTING
00:41:30SINCE I THINK THE 40S OR 50S. IT'S BEEN AROUND FOREVER, EVEN
00:41:34WHEN IT WAS CONFINED TO NEVADA, BUT DEFINITELY NOW. AND A FEW MEMBERS OF CONGRESS
00:41:38SAID THE MONEY JUST GOES TO THE GENERAL FUNDS.
00:41:39WHY NOT DIVERT?
00:41:47I THINK IT WAS HALF OF IT TOWARD RESEARCH SO WE HAVE A BETTER
00:41:50HANDLE OF QUESTIONS AS BASIC AS HOW MUCH GAMBLING IS GOING ON AND HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE
00:41:54PROBLEMS AND ALSO SOME OF THAT
00:41:55COULD GO TOWARD TREATMENT AND
00:42:07PREVENTION. AND THE INDUSTRY JUST POSED THIS INCREDIBLY AGGRESSIVE FIGHT TO STOP THAT, SAYING THIS IS UNNECESSARY.
00:42:10WE ALREADY RESEARCHED THAT, BLAH. I JUST FIND IT SO REVEALING AGAIN THAT THE IDEA OF JUST TRYING TO HAVE A CLEARER SENSE OF HOW MUCH GAMBLING IS GOING ON
00:42:14IS SUCH A THREAT TO THE INDUSTRY AND AS KEITH WHITE, THE LONG TIME DIRECTOR OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL ON PROBLEM GAMBLING, I
00:42:18QUOTE HIM IN MY BOOK SAYING,
00:42:30"THEY WANT TO COUNT THE REVENUE, THEY DON'T WANT TO COUNT THE BODIES," AND A LOT OF PEOPLE ECHOED THAT, THAT IF WE ACTUALLY
00:42:34KNEW THE DAMAGE THIS IS DOING
00:42:35AND THIS SURGE OF ADDICTION AND
00:42:39OTHER HEALTH PROBLEMS ACROSS THE COUNTRY, THE INDUSTRY WOULD FACE
00:42:41SO MUCH MORE SCRUTINY.
00:42:51>> AND OF COURSE THIS WHOLE ISSUE OF PREDICTION MARKETS ISN'T EVEN CONSIDERED GAMBLING, SO THEY GET OUT FROM UNDERNEATH
00:42:55IN A HUGE LOOPHOLE THE IDEA THAT THEY OUGHT TO BE REGULATED LIKE
00:42:58GAMBLING COMPANIES, AND IT'S PROBABLY THE RISK IS HIGHER FOR THIS PREDICTION MARKET BUSINESS
00:43:01THAN EVEN SPORTS BETTING.
00:43:13WOULDN'T YOU SAY? >> IT COULD BE, I MEAN, IT'S EXPLODED IN THE PAST YEAR, SO I DON'T WANT TO, I DON'T WANT TO
00:43:17SPECULATE, YOU KNOW, TOO MUCH,
00:43:32BUT -- >> THAT'S MY JOB. AND OF COURSE IT'S BASED ON VERY LITTLE THAN MY INTUITION, WHICH
00:43:35COULD GET YOU IN TROUBLE, BUT I THINK ANYBODY WATCHING THIS, COMMON SENSE TELLS YOU THIS IS DEADLY. AND NOW WE'VE GOT WALL STREET
00:43:39JOURNAL, CNN, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE BETTING ON WHAT'S THE NEXT STORY. IT'S GOING TO NOT ONLY CORRUPT SPORTS, CORRUPT SPORTS, IT'S GOING TO CORRUPT OUR CULTURE.
00:43:43IT'S GOING TO CORRUPT OUR NEWS. THIS HAS GOT A CORROSIVE IMPACT NOT ONLY ON OUR PUBLIC HEALTH AND THE MENTAL HEALTH OF OUR YOUNG PEOPLE, BUT, BUT FOR OUR
00:43:47COUNTRY ON SO MANY LEVELS. SO GLAD SO MANY OF YOU ARE HERE. I KNOW MANY OF YOU MAY HAVE SOME QUESTIONS TO ADD TO THIS, SO I
00:43:50THINK THAT'S WHERE WE'LL, WE'LL
00:43:51MOVE TO RIGHT NOW.
00:44:09>> THANK YOU, LIFELONG CLEVELAND GUARDIANS, INDIANS AND GUARDIANS FANS. SO WE'RE WATCHING EMMANUEL CLASSE AND LUIS ORTIZ, WHO WERE
00:44:13BOTH FACING 65 YEARS IN JAIL.
00:44:16MY QUESTION IS HOW MUCH OF THE SPORTS GAMBLING ISSUE WOULD BE CURTAILED IF YOU COULD ONLY BET
00:44:19ON WHO WINS AND WHO LOSES?
00:44:29YOU CAN'T DO THE IS THIS PITCH A BALL OR A STRIKE? YOU CAN'T DO THE IS SHE GOING TO HIT THE HIGH NOTE IN THE
00:44:33NATIONAL ANTHEM. YOU CAN'T, YOU CAN'T BET LITERALLY ON EVERYTHING. YOU CAN ONLY PLACE A BET ON WHO
00:44:35WINS AND WHO LOSES.
00:44:43>> I THINK GOING TO THAT LEVEL MIGHT BE A BIT EXTREME, BUT YOU
00:44:47COULD DEFINITELY REIN IN BETS ON WILL THE NEXT PITCH BE A BALL OR A STRIKE, OR WILL, YOU KNOW, A
00:44:50BENCH PLAYER GET A CERTAIN NUMBER OF REBOUNDS IN THE 1ST
00:44:52QUARTER OF A BASKETBALL GAME.
00:44:58I MENTIONED EARLIER THAT THE INDUSTRY USES THE BLACK MARKET AS A BOOGEYMAN OFTENTIMES TO SAY WELL THEY DON'T HAVE THESE
00:45:01RESTRICTIONS AND WHY SHOULD WE?
00:45:05WE'RE IN COMPETITION WITH THE BLACK MARKET. SENATOR BLUMENTHAL DESCRIBED THAT AS A RACE TO THE BOTTOM. I THINK THAT'S AN APT
00:45:09DESCRIPTION, BUT IN THIS CASE IN PARTICULAR, I RAN THAT IDEA BY CERTAIN EXPERTS IN THE BETTING
00:45:12INDUSTRY AFTER CLAUSE AND HIS
00:45:17TEAMMATE WERE ARRESTED FOR FIXING PITCHES, AND I SAID THE INDUSTRY ARGUES THAT IF WE
00:45:20RESTRICTED THOSE TYPES OF BETS.
00:45:30CUSTOMERS WOULD JUST RUN TO OFFSHORE OPERATORS OR STREET BOOKIES AND NOTHING WOULD ACTUALLY BE SOLVED, AND I WAS
00:45:33ASKING THIS TO SOMEONE WHO WORKS IN WHAT'S CALLED INTEGRITY MONITORING, THIS BIG BUSINESS OF PREVENTING IMPROPER BETTING AND
00:45:36THE CORRUPTION OF SPORTS, THE
00:45:41COMPANIES THAT WERE SUPPOSEDLY ENTRUSTED TO STOP THAT SORT OF
00:45:43THING FROM HAPPENING.
00:45:49AND I DON'T KNOW THAT I CAN USE THE WORD ON C-SPAN TO QUOTE HIM EXACTLY, BUT HE JUST SAID ESSENTIALLY THAT'S NONSENSE THAT
00:45:52YEAH THERE ARE SOME DETERMINED BETTORS WHO WILL GO TO THE BLACK
00:45:56MARKET ANYWAY. THAT'S WHY IT'S STILL THRIVING,
00:45:58BUT A LOT OF ORDINARY PEOPLE WHO
00:46:05ARE COMFORTABLE DOWNLOADING AN APP FROM THE APP STORE AND THEN USING VENMO AND PAYPAL TO
00:46:07DEPOSIT THEIR MONEY.
00:46:13ARE NOT GOING TO GO TO SOME SKETCHY OFFSHORE WEBSITE AND BET WITH CRYPTO JUST SO THEY CAN BET ON THOSE SORTS OF FRIVOLOUS PROPS.
00:46:18SO YEAH, I THINK THERE'S SOME REAL LOGIC TO THAT TO SOME
00:46:19EXTENT.
00:46:29>> HI THERE, MY NAME IS TIM GIGLE. I'M A LOBBYIST HERE FOR OFFHILL STRATEGIES AND SMART APPROACHES TO MARIJUANA AS ONE OF OUR CLIENTS.
00:46:32SO IT'S A REAL HONOR TO BE ABLE TO WORK FOR AND WITH THEM. CONGRESSMAN, AND DANNY, THANK
00:46:35YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME TODAY.
00:46:39I HAVE TWO QUESTIONS THAT I HOPE INTERSECT, AND I'LL BE AS CONCISE AS I CAN BE.
00:46:42THE FIRST QUESTION I HAVE, BUILDING A LITTLE BIT OFF LUKE
00:46:44ALBY'S QUESTION HERE HAS TO DO
00:46:52WITH THE STATE OF ORGANIZED CRIME IN THE UNITED STATES AND I
00:46:54LOOK FORWARD TO READING THE BOOK
00:46:59AND I DON'T KNOW IF YOU ADDRESS THIS IN THE BOOK, SO FORGIVE ME, BUT YOU KNOW, OF COURSE, THERE
00:47:03WAS THE MAJOR FBI.
00:47:08STING THAT HAPPENED IN OCTOBER WHERE I THINK 31, 32, OR 33 SOMEWHERE IN THERE, CURRENT AND FORMER NBA PLAYERS AND COACHES
00:47:11AS WELL.
00:47:16CHAUNCEY BILLUPS OF THE, OF THE, OF THE TRAIL BLAZERS WERE CAUGHT IN THIS SPORTS GAMBLING SCHEME
00:47:19WITH, WITH ORGANIZED CRIME.
00:47:24AND SO I GUESS THE FIRST QUESTION, AND I'LL GO INTO MY SECOND, JUST RIGHT AFTER WHICH
00:47:27IS. TO WHAT EXTENT HAS THE EXPLOSION
00:47:30AND THE NORMALIZATION OF ONLINE
00:47:31SPORTS GAMBLING HELPED HER, OR
00:47:37WHAT, WHAT IS ITS RELATIONSHIP TO THE MOB? HAS IT, HAS IT REALLY BEEN A BOON FOR ORGANIZED CRIME IN
00:47:40AMERICA? AND I GUESS THE SECOND QUESTION
00:47:43IS RELATED TO THAT.
00:47:50A LITTLE OVER A MONTH AGO, IT WAS THE FIRST PAY PER VIEW OF THE UNITED FIGHTING CHAMPIONSHIPS OR THE UFC. THERE WAS A FIGHT SCHEDULED ON
00:47:54THE UNDERCARD. IT WAS A FEATHERWEIGHT BOUT
00:47:57BETWEEN TWO FIGHTERS. AT THE LAST MOMENT, THE FIGHT WAS PULLED, AND THE REASON THAT
00:48:00DANA WHITE, PRESIDENT, CEO OF
00:48:03THE UFC, PULLED IT IS HE SAID
00:48:05THAT THERE WAS AN UNUSUAL AMOUNT OF SPORTS GAMBLING ACTIVITY
00:48:09RIGHT BEFORE LEADING UP TO THE FIGHT, SUGGESTING PERHAPS A FIGHTER WAS INJURED AND HAD NOT BEEN DISCLOSED, AND BANNERS KNEW
00:48:13ABOUT IT, AND THAT WAS, THAT'S
00:48:17WHAT HAPPENED. OBVIOUSLY PRESIDENT TRUMP IS
00:48:20VERY CLOSE TO DANA WHITE. IS IT YOUR SENSE THAT PRESIDENT TRUMP, THAT THIS IS ON HIS RADAR
00:48:23AT ALL?
00:48:32I KNOW IN THEORY HE REMAINS OPPOSED TO LEGALIZATION OF MARIJUANA EVEN THOUGH HE RESCHEDULED MARIJUANA IN LATE 2025, WHICH IS A MASSIVE
00:48:35DEREGULATION FOR IT. I GUESS MY QUESTION IS TO WHAT EXTENT IS IT ON HIS RADAR, AND ARE YOU HOPEFUL AT ALL THAT IT
00:48:39WILL BE AND THAT HE'LL WANT TO
00:48:39DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT?
00:48:46>> LET ME SAY, THAT THE MOB USED
00:48:51TO MAKE THEIR MONEY.
00:48:52ON GAMBLING AND DRUGS.
00:48:57NOW THE STATES MAKE THEIR MONEY ON GAMBLING AND DRUGS. IF YOU WANT TO MAKE THE CASE, IS THE MOB GROWING, IT DEPENDS ON
00:49:00HOW YOU DEFINE THE MOB, BECAUSE
00:49:07NOW ORGANIZED CRIME IS NOT RAYMOND PATRIARCA IN RHODE
00:49:09ISLAND. ORGANIZED CRIME ARE THE STATES
00:49:13THAT HAVE DECIDED TO PUT THEIR CITIZENS AT RISK BY MAKING THE
00:49:16ACCESS TO BOTH DRUGS AND
00:49:20GAMBLING AND THIS OTHER DIGITAL
00:49:22ADDICTION.
00:49:32UBIQUITOUS TO THEIR PEOPLE AND MY SENSE IS THEY ARE FOREGOING
00:49:34THEIR TRUST RESPONSIBILITY TO
00:49:36PROTECT THE WELFARE AND
00:49:39WELL-BEING OF THEIR CONSTITUENTS BY ESSENTIALLY MONETIZING THE
00:49:43DESTRUCTION WHICH WILL COME
00:49:53FROM, TELL ABOUT LIKE THE PERCENTAGE OF GAMBLERS AND THE REVENUE THAT'S GENERATED BY A SMALL PERCENTAGE BECAUSE I THINK
00:49:57THAT TELLS THE REAL STORY THAT THIS IS REALLY ABOUT EXPLOITING ADDICTION. THIS IS NOT ABOUT SOME SUNDAY
00:49:59AFTERNOON JOINT.
00:50:07IN THE CASE OF MARIJUANA, IT'S NOT SOME SUNDAY AFTERNOON BET,
00:50:09YOU KNOW, ON A SPORTS.
00:50:25--
00:50:30THIS IS NOT ABOUT SOME SUNDAY AFTERNOON JOINT, IN THE CASE OF MARIJUANA. IT'S NOT SOME SUNDAY AFTERNOON BET, YOU KNOW, ON A SPORT.
00:50:34THIS IS NOW WE'VE GOT HEAVY DAY TO DAY USERS FOR MARIJUANA HAS PASSED OUT OF ALCOHOL. HEAVY USERS, MORE HEAVY MARIJUANA USERS THAN ALCOHOL
00:50:38USERS IN AMERICA, AND IT WOULD SEEM TO ME, AND WHAT ARE THEY
00:50:42DOING? THEY'RE MAKING THEIR MONEY WHEN THEY SAY, YOU KNOW, DRINK RESPONSIBLY. NO, NO, THEY DON'T MAKE THEIR
00:50:46MONEY OFF OF DRINKING RESPONSIBLY. THEY MAKE THEIR MONEY OFF OF PEOPLE LIKE ME. THAT DRANK IRRESPONSIBLY.
00:50:49WE'RE THE ONES WHO HAVE ADDICTION THAT ARE DRIVING THE
00:50:53PROFIT OF THESE ADDICTION FOR PROFITS, AND I IMAGINE IN SPORTS BETTING IT'S THE SAME WAY. YOU HAVE A VERY SMALL PERCENTAGE OF THE BETTING POPULATION WITH
00:50:57ADDICTION WHO ARE GENERATING A
00:50:58BIG PERCENTAGE OF THE PROFITS
00:51:15FOR THOSE COMPANIES. >> YEAH, THE NUMBER I'VE HEARD IS 1% OF CUSTOMERS ACCOUNT FOR HALF OF REVENUE. SOME OF THEM OBVIOUSLY ARE ULTRA WEALTHY PEOPLE WHO JUST ARE
00:51:20BETTING AT A WHOLE OTHER LEVEL. SOME OF THEM AREN'T.
00:51:23AND AS I MENTIONED, ONE OF THOSE JAW DROPPERS WAS THE FACT THAT THIS COMPANY HAD ONE RESPONSIBLE GAMING OFFICIAL.
00:51:27ANOTHER WAS1 THERE'S THIS WHOLE CHAPTER DEVOTED TO VIP CUSTOMERS, THE PEOPLE WHO ARE LOSING AT THAT RATE, AND THE UNBELIEVABLE PERKS AND WHITE GLOVE TREATMENT THAT THEY GET
00:51:31FROM THESE COMPANIES TO KEEP THEM LOSING AT THAT LEVEL, AND I
00:51:33HAD HEARD ONE REASSURANCE AFTER
00:51:39ANOTHER FROM THE OPERATORS THAT THEY VET THOSE CUSTOMERS TO MAKE SURE THEY CAN AFFORD TO BE LOSING THAT AMOUNT OF MONEY.
00:51:43AND YOU MIGHT SAY YOU COULD HAVE A GAMBLING PROBLEM EVEN IF YOU CAN AFFORD TO BE LOSING ALL THAT
00:51:45MONEY, BUT THAT'S ANOTHER POINT.
00:51:54BUT AT LEAST THEY CLAIM THEY ARE CHECKING THAT PEOPLE HAVE THE MEANS TO BET AT THAT LEVEL. AND I WAS SPEAKING WITH SOMEONE
00:51:57WHO LOST 100 GRAND AT FANDUEL IN A YEAR, AND I WAS JUST AGAIN IN
00:52:00THE BACK OF MY HEAD REMEMBERING
00:52:05ALL THE TIMES I'VE BEEN TOLD THAT THEY WOULD MAKE SURE SOMEONE LIKE THAT COULD AFFORD
00:52:09TO LOSE THAT.
00:52:21SO I SAID, "WHAT WERE YOU DOING TO EARN A LIVING WHEN YOU LOST ALL THAT MONEY AT FANDUEL?" AND HE SAID, "I WAS A SERVER AT
00:52:24THE CHEESECAKE FACTORY MAKING $650 A YEAR." AND OBVIOUSLY HE CLAIMS FANDUEL NEVER MADE ANY EFFORT TO CONFIRM THAT WITH HIM.
00:52:28TO YOUR QUESTION ABOUT THE MOB, THE THING THAT CAME TO MIND FOR ME IS THERE'S SO MUCH MORE OPPORTUNITY TO CORRUPT SPORTS NOW BECAUSE YOU CAN BET ON SO
00:52:32MANY DIFFERENT THINGS AND INSIDE
00:52:35INFORMATION IS SO VALUABLE AND THE OPPORTUNITY TO GET THAT FROM PEOPLE TO EXTORT THEM SO THAT THEY'LL GIVE THAT UP.
00:52:39WHEN WE'RE, YOU KNOW, UNDER THIS LARGE HEALTH UMBRELLA OF WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH GAMBLING, THAT'S A PIECE OF IT TOO, THE DANGER
00:52:42THAT IT PRESENTS TO ATHLETES,
00:52:51COACHES, ANYONE WHO WORKS IN SPORTS IS NOW FACING UNBELIEVABLE LEVELS OF
00:52:53HARASSMENT AND THREATS FROM GAMBLERS AND PRESSURE FROM
00:52:57PEOPLE WHO WANT THEM TO DO SOMETHING TO HELP THEM WIN MONEY. SO THAT'S A BIG PIECE OF THE
00:53:01STORY TOO.
00:53:09>> I THINK WE MIGHT HAVE TIME
00:53:22FOR ONE MORE QUESTION. >> YEAH, THANK YOU BOTH. CONNOR SEMMELSBERGER WITH THE HERITAGE FOUNDATION, REPRESENTATIVE KENNEDY, WHAT
00:53:26STRUCK ME IS WHAT YOU TALKED
00:53:30ABOUT THE AI RATE CHANGING AND DISPLACING PEOPLE AT WORK. I'M FROM WESTERN PENNSYLVANIA COAL MINES AND STEEL MILLS, SO WE SAW OUR INDUSTRIES LEFT, AND
00:53:34THEN WE WERE RAVAGED BY THE OPIOID CRISIS RIGHT AFTER THAT. AND SO, BUT WHAT STRUCK ME TYING THIS BACK TO SPORTS BETTING, HOW QUICKLY THEY MOVE INTO A
00:53:37COMMUNITY THAT'S ALREADY, MANY OF THESE COMMUNITIES ALREADY SUFFERING IS I WAS HOME OVER CHRISTMAS VISITING FAMILY, AND YOU KNOW EVERY SMALL TOWN WHERE
00:53:41I GREW UP HAS A CATHOLIC CHURCH,
00:53:48A SHEETS GAS STATION, AND DOLLAR GENERAL, BUT NOW I CAN ADD TWO MORE THINGS TO THIS LIST A VAPE SHOP AND WHAT SURPRISED ME IS EVEN JUST OUR LOCAL, LOCALLY
00:53:52OWNED GROCERY STORES IN THE BACK ARE GAMBLING MACHINES. JUST YOU WANT TO GO TO THE LOCAL GROCERY STORE. THESE COMMUNITIES, YOU KNOW,
00:53:55ELDERLY POPULATIONS ALREADY
00:53:56RAVAGING.
00:54:02SO JUST COULD YOU ADD FURTHER COMMENTARY? I THOUGHT THAT'S VERY INTERESTING THAT JUST THESE SAME
00:54:06COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE BEEN HIT BY THE ECONOMIC WOES LEAD TO
00:54:09THESE ADDICTIONS, AND IT'S
00:54:18DRUGS, AS WE'VE SEEN IN THE PAST, BUT NOW IT'S GAMBLING BOTH
00:54:20THE YOUNG GENERATION ONLINE
00:54:25SPORTS BETTING, BUT THEN ALSO JUST THOSE THAT HAVE VERY LITTLE MONEY BEING EXTORTED TO JUST,
00:54:29YEAH, YOU'RE PICKING UP FOOD AT YOUR GROCERY STORE. WHY DON'T YOU THROW A COUPLE OF BETS DOWN WHILE YOU'RE WAITING IN LINE BEFORE YOU CHECK OUT THE
00:54:32GROCERY STORE.
00:54:34>> THE INTERESTING THING IS THIS
00:54:41IS LIKE, ESPECIALLY WITH THIS PREDICTION MARKET, IT'S BEING MARKETED AS A FINANCIAL STRATEGY. BETTING IS THE WAY YOU MAKE
00:54:45MONEY HAS ACTUALLY BECOME
00:54:49COMMONPLACE IN TERMS OF OUR UNDERSTANDING. SO YOU EVEN HAVE PAYDAY LOAN VENDORS. YOU HAVE THESE MAJOR CREDIT CARD
00:54:53COMPANIES, BANKS. GETTING INTO THIS BUSINESS BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE PROFIT OFF OF GETTING PEOPLE MORE IN HOC TO PAY THE HIGHER
00:54:57INTEREST RATES AND BILLS AS A RESULT OF THIS.
00:54:59SO THERE'S UNSEEMLY PARTNERSHIPS
00:55:03BETWEEN THE FINANCIAL SECTOR AND
00:55:04THE GAMBLING, GAMBLING SECTOR.
00:55:09BUT THE TOTAL IMPACT ON THE FINANCIAL WHEREWITHAL OF AMERICANS WOULD BE SOMETHING I'D BE REALLY INTERESTED IN KNOWING. I'D LIKE TO KNOW HOW MUCH THE
00:55:13RELATIVE PERSONAL DEBT THAT
00:55:18AMERICANS ARE GOING TO CARRY AFTER THE ONSET OF THIS SPORTS BETTING.
00:55:21WHO IS TRACKING THAT? WHO IS TRACKING THE
00:55:23BANKRUPTCIES?
00:55:35WHO'S TRACKING ALL THE COSTS THE GOVERNMENT'S GOING TO BE PAYING OUT IN ORDER TO HELP REPAIR THE DAMAGE THAT'S GOING TO BE LEFT
00:55:38IN THE WAKE OF THESE COMPANIES? BUT DANNY, I KNOW YOU COULD TALK
00:55:51. >> WELL, THERE'S BEEN VERY COMPELLING STUDIES. I WISH I'D REMEMBERED THE UNIVERSITIES OFFHAND TO GIVE THEM THEIR CREDIT, BUT COMPARING
00:55:55STATES WITH LEGAL SPORTS BETTING AND THOSE WITHOUT IT. AND THEY HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT WHERE IT'S LEGAL THERE'S HIGHER BANKRUPTCY RATES, LOWER CREDIT
00:55:59SCORES, LESS HOUSEHOLD SAVINGS, EVEN HIGHER INSTANCES OF
00:56:01DOMESTIC VIOLENCE IN STATES WITH
00:56:05LEGAL SPORTS BETTING. NOW THE POTENTIALLY PREDICTION MARKETS WILL BE IN ALL 50 STATES AND MAYBE IT'LL RENDER THOSE
00:56:08DISTINCTIONS MOOT, BUT AT LEAST FOR NOW YOU CAN SEE THAT CLEAR DISPARITY.
00:56:12>> MARCIA LEE TAYLOR MAGGIE
00:56:18--
00:56:28>> MAGGIE WITH CONCERNED WOMEN FOR AMERICA, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS. I THINK THIS IS ONE OF THE MOST
00:56:31INSIDIOUS PROBLEMS WE'RE FACING TODAY THAT'S FLYING COMPLETELY UNDER THE RADAR. SO PERHAPS TO TURN THE CONVERSATION TO WHAT CAN WE AS
00:56:35DC PEOPLE DO, TO MY KNOWLEDGE, THE ONLY GOOD THING THAT
00:56:39CONGRESS HAS DONE ON THIS IN THE PAST FEW YEARS WAS A PROVISION IN THE ONE BIG BEAUTIFUL BILL THAT CURBED THE AMOUNT OF DEDUCTIONS THAT GAMBLERS CAN
00:56:42TAKE OFF OF THEIR WINNINGS. IS THERE, ARE THERE ANY OTHER LIVE LEGISLATIVE SOLUTIONS IN CONGRESS RIGHT NOW? AND IF NOT, WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE
00:56:46TO SEE DONE AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL
00:56:47ON THIS?
00:56:50>> WELL, I HONESTLY, WE HAVE TO COME TO A GENERAL MORAL UNDERSTANDING OF WHETHER WE
00:56:54BELIEVE IT'S IN OUR NATION'S
00:56:56BEST INTEREST TO HAVE ALL THIS
00:57:05ADDICTION FOR PROFIT THAT'S GOING TO KILL OUR PEOPLE'S ABILITY TO MANAGE THEIR OWN
00:57:08MENTAL HEALTH IN A WORLD THAT'S GOING TO DEMAND THEIR OWN MENTAL
00:57:11HEALTH BE AT A PREMIUM TO MANAGE ALL THE TOXIC STRESSES THAT EVERYBODY IS LIVING THROUGH TODAY.
00:57:15SO I THINK WE NEED TO, BEFORE WE DIVE INTO THE RED FLAG
00:57:16OPPORTUNITIES.
00:57:24THE ADVERTISING, THE UBIQUITOUS NATURE OF ADVERTISING, THE TYPES OF BETS, ALL OF THE KIND OF REGULATION THAT CAN GET INTO THIS. WE HAVE TO FIRST COME TO AN
00:57:28APPRECIATION THIS IS A PROBLEM LIKE YOU SAID THROUGH YOUR QUESTION. IT'S UNDER THE RADAR THANKS TO
00:57:32DANNY AND HIS BOOK EVERYBODY
00:57:33LOSS.
00:57:47WE HAVE TO GET THE MESSAGE
00:57:48ACROSS.
00:57:53EVERYBODY LOSES. THE PEOPLE, THEIR FAMILIES. AND THIS COUNTRY, EMPLOYERS AND TAXPAYERS, EVERYBODY LOSES. AND UNTIL WE GRASP THAT, WE'RE
00:57:57NOT GOING TO HAVE CLARITY ON WHAT THE SOLUTION IS BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, KEEP IN MIND WE NEVER
00:58:00THOUGHT WE COULD GET WHERE WE
00:58:08GOT WITH TOBACCO. WE NEVER THOUGHT EVEN TODAY WE'D GET WHERE WE GOT WITH ALCOHOL, WHERE THEY'RE ADVERTISING ZERO
00:58:11ALCOHOL IN MAJOR ALCOHOL ADS.
00:58:12YOU'RE LIKE THIS IS QUITE A
00:58:17DIFFERENCE. NOW THEY'VE ALL MOVED TOWARDS MARIJUANA, WHICH IS ANOTHER ISSUE, WHICH IS WHY THIS THING KEEPS POPPING UP.
00:58:20BUT WE HAVE TO HAVE APPRECIATION THAT THERE ARE MONEYED INTERESTS WHOSE INTEREST IS TO ADDICT
00:58:23PEOPLE IN AMERICA.
00:58:35AND WE HAVE NO PUBLIC HEALTH STRATEGY TO COUNTERACT THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT THESE GAMBLING COMPANIES AND BIG
00:58:39MARIJUANA COMPANIES ARE SPENDING
00:58:39TO ADDICT OUR FELLOW AMERICANS,
00:58:44AND WHATEVER SOLUTIONS WE COME UP WITH, WE'RE UP AGAINST A
00:58:46MONOLITH OF MONEY.
00:58:56TO TRY TO MANAGE IN A COUNTERVAILING WAY THAT AMOUNT OF SPEND. YOU'RE YOU'RE AN ADVOCATE, A LOBBYIST ON THE HILL.
00:59:00CAN YOU IMAGINE WHO THEY CAN
00:59:09HIRE, HOW MANY PEOPLE THEY CAN HIRE AN ARMY TO PUT LOOPHOLES IN ANY EFFORT THAT CONGRESS MAKES TO MANAGE THIS. IT'S GOING TO BE THAT'S WHY WE
00:59:12NEED A PUBLIC.
00:59:23RECKONING WITH THESE ISSUES AND SMART APPROACHES TO MARIJUANA HAS BEEN A BIG CHAMPION OF MOBILIZING ADVOCACY AND NOW MORE
00:59:26SO NOW ON THE SPORTS BETTING SIDE AS WELL. >> I THINK THAT'S A TERRIFIC NOTE TO END ON, AND THANK YOU BOTH FOR A REALLY INTERESTING
00:59:30CONVERSATION, AND I ENCOURAGE
00:59:31EVERYONE TO READ THE BOOK.
00:59:38WE HAVE COPIES UP HERE, AND THANK YOU ALL FOR COMING. [APPLAUSE]
00:59:47>> THANK YOU ALL FOR COMING. IT WAS AN AMAZING PANEL. THANK YOU AGAIN, PATRICK AND
00:59:51MARSHA. IT WAS WONDERFUL. TWO QUICK THINGS I WANTED TO JUST THROW OUT THERE.
00:59:54FIRST OF ALL, WE DO WANT TO
00:59:56ACKNOWLEDGE, SENATOR BILL
01:00:03BRADLEY, THE FORMER SENATOR AND NBA STAR WHO DID A LOT OF GREAT WORK ON THESE GAMBLING ISSUES DURING HIS TIME, SO WE DEFINITELY WANTED TO ACKNOWLEDGE HIS WORK.
01:00:07THE SECOND THING I WANT TO MENTION IS THE DISCUSSION OF
01:00:08LEGISLATION.
01:00:13SO THE SAFE BET ACT IS LEGISLATION THAT'S BEEN INTRODUCED IN THE HOUSE AND THE SENATE. THAT IS LEGISLATION WE ARE
01:00:17ABSOLUTELY SUPPORTING, AND THAT'S ONE STEP FORWARD IN BEGINNING TO DEAL WITH THESE PROBLEMS. SO THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH AND PLEASE GRAB A BOOK.
01:00:21THEY'RE FREE.
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01:01:54GILDED AGE, THE AMERICAN WEST,
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01:02:05RUBENSTEIN. DAVID: SOME PEOPLE HAVE WRITTEN ABOUT THE REVOLUTIONARY WAR AND SAY THE INDISPENSABLE PERSON WAS
01:02:10GEORGE WASHINGTON. HAD HE NOT BEEN THE GENERAL, WE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE LOST THE WAR
01:02:14AND SO FORTH. DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT?
01:02:16HEATHER: IN TERMS OF HIS
01:02:30IDEOLOGY, THE PERSON HE WAS, AND HIS WILLINGNESS TO WALK AWAY FROM POWER, THAT WAS EXTRAORDINARY. I ALWAYS TELL MY STUDENTS AMERICA HAS LUCKED OUT A NUMBER
01:02:34OF TIMES AND THE FIRST TIME WAS WITH GEORGE WASHINGTON IN THE POSITION OF EXTRAORDINARY POWER, WALKING AWAY FROM THE ARMY
01:02:37FIRST, AND THEN WALKING AWAY FROM THE PRESIDENCY IS AN
01:02:40EXTRAORDINARY THING. >> WATCH "AMERICA'S BOOK CLUB"
01:02:43WITH HEATHER COX RICHARDSON.
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