Google Speech-to-Text API Automatic Transcription (Chirp). Treat it as a searchable index of what was broadcast, not a quotation record.
00:00:00and jewelry and
00:00:05in of of a it's always a pleasure to hear about their plans for spending all that extra cash, so call down of to gold reserves jewelers
00:00:10of of for fast and friendly quote: if you need to buy, sell or
00:00:11of a repair jewelry, visit goldreserves.co.uk.
00:00:20good morning and
00:00:21of welcome of to Sunday with Michael Portillo. Truman
00:00:24of Capote writes in Breakfast at Tiffany's aprils have never
00:00:28of meant
00:00:28of that much to me. or seen that
00:00:31of season of beginning spring. on this third
00:00:34of sunday of September, you are most welcome to two hours of culture,
00:00:38of current affairs and politics. with the discovery
00:00:41that some of Andy Burnham's initiatives had been planned by Saker
00:00:45Starmer, my
00:00:46of panel will debate whether disillusion about the new prime minister is now
00:00:50of setting in. the royal row continues as
00:00:54of al spencer
00:00:55of claims in
00:00:55to be telling the
00:00:58of of truth about what king charles said when Princess Diana
00:00:59in died of
00:00:59is of the... under siege again,
00:01:03rising inflation and the hooti's military advances in Yemen
00:01:06expose quotes the bankrupcy of labor's foreign
00:01:10of policy, and quotes, according to one defense analyst, what are the
00:01:13government's options? concking from the telegraph
00:01:18of in will appine. Canada is set to become the first associate
00:01:21member
00:01:23of of the European Union,
00:01:24of is that a marriage made in heaven or in
00:01:26hell? all of that, and indeed much
00:01:30more, but first the latest news headlines with Bethany
00:01:33of
00:01:36a Elsey.
00:01:41of of Michael, thank you. Good morning, your top stories from the GB
00:01:43of news room at one minute past
00:01:44a 11. Earl
00:01:45in Spencer says there are similarities between how both his
00:01:49of of a sister, of princess Diana, and the Duke and Dutches of
00:01:51of Sussex
00:01:52of have been treated by the media. Harry and Megan, who recently returned to the
00:01:56a UK from California six years after stepping back from royal duties.
00:02:00of have been repeatedly critical
00:02:01of the press, well speaking
00:02:03of to
00:02:03of the BBC, he said anyone being subject to constant
00:02:06criticism, it must
00:02:08of be of cancerous influence in their
00:02:12of a life. It would be really
00:02:12of beholding on people to learn from Diana's
00:02:15of example, I'm not here to speak for Harry and Megan, but for anyone who's
00:02:19of being destroyed in this way daily, it must be such
00:02:23cancerous influence in their
00:02:25of life. One
00:02:26of of of the of problems of with Diana was, she's very, very sensitive to criticism,
00:02:30"and of course,
00:02:31of I'm sure most of your viewers now
00:02:33of think, oh, she had this splendid life, and it was all amazing, and she didn't, she was so privileged
00:02:37and so perfect in so many ways, but she was
00:02:40a really
00:02:43of of brought low by in all that criticism, and yeah, I suppose it's a pity when I
00:02:45of see echos of that
00:02:47in now. Ed Sheeren has
00:02:49of apologized to fans for making mistakes as he opened a solo show
00:02:53in
00:02:54a of Philadelphia. All
00:02:55of the Singers support acts, including his band, have quit the current loop
00:02:58tour after the U.S. rapper McLamorre was dropped for making
00:03:02of pro-Palestinian comments during a show
00:03:04of in of New Jersey. Sheeren said that
00:03:08of of decision was taken by promoters, not him, but he said he was
00:03:10of sorry for his handling
00:03:15in of the controversy that of followed. I don't want to disappoint fans and I've never wanted to be an
00:03:17in activist musician, but this has put me in
00:03:19of the middle of an important and passionate argument about freedom of speech
00:03:23and the most complex political issue on the
00:03:25of
00:03:27of planet. Well, he described the October 7th. 'sled attacks as
00:03:31horrific, but
00:03:32a said Israel's treatment of residents in Gaza
00:03:35of is catastrophic and
00:03:36a unjustifiable. The conservatives are calling
00:03:40on labor to cut welfare spending
00:03:42of at of next month's budget, warning the government must
00:03:45a confront of what they've described as the grim reality of Britain's economic
00:03:49of peril. The round
00:03:50of comes in as inflation reaches five month high
00:03:52of of 3.1% with Chancellor John Healey due to deliver the
00:03:56budget at the end of October, but
00:03:58of Bridget of Philipson insists'. benefits
00:04:00me support young people into work and lifts children
00:04:04of out of
00:04:08of of
00:04:08a poverty.
00:04:10of of At least two people have been killed and six others injured
00:04:13of in one
00:04:13of the biggest Ukrainian drone attacks on the Moscow region
00:04:17of overnight. of
00:04:18of Officials in Russia say more than 200 drones had
00:04:20of been shot down, but fires were reported
00:04:23in in
00:04:23of several residential houses, local warehouse and an
00:04:27oil refinery. Flight
00:04:29of a of restrictions are also in place at two airports. Meanwhile, in Ukraine,
00:04:33mother
00:04:33of and her two three-year-old children have been killed in the Kief
00:04:37region. The governor there said that
00:04:39of area
00:04:39of of has endured
00:04:41of constant of hostile attacks for more than a day with 31 sights
00:04:44damaged
00:04:45of in five
00:04:47of districts. President Donald Trump has
00:04:49a announced he'll form an artificial intelligence force and appoint
00:04:53an AI
00:04:55of of SAR amid
00:04:57of of warnings about the technology. In a post on
00:04:58of social media he said it won't in anyway. or stifle the growth
00:05:03of
00:05:05in of the tech is he aims to keep the US a world of leader in the industry. he pushed back against
00:05:07in calls to slow down
00:05:08of the
00:05:08of development of AI until better
00:05:10of
00:05:10in safegards are in place, repeating comments that concerns around the dangers
00:05:14and risks are a hulks. You're up to date for
00:05:18now, I'll be back with more an
00:05:19hour. Take the GB News
00:05:23family with you any device. As long as you have an internet
00:05:26connection, tune into GB News anywhere on the planet or
00:05:30beyond.
00:05:44"thank you very much, bet arriving in number 10, Andy Burman
00:05:48devolved fiscal powers to mayors, he cut bus fairs and reduced
00:05:52VAT on electricity bills, portraying himself as new start
00:05:56after the lacklustter years of secure Starmer, but
00:05:59now it has emerged that such policies were being planned by his
00:06:02predecessor. two calendar months after becoming prime minister, the decision
00:06:06on permitting the development the Rose Bank Oil field is
00:06:10stalled and there's no..." to raise defense spending to
00:06:143% of GDP by 2030. reform of public
00:06:17services seems unlikely, but tax rises have begun with new
00:06:21tourist tax. so my question is, has the shine come off,
00:06:25Andy Burnam. joining
00:06:26me now is my panel journalist and broadcaster Linda Deuvely and former
00:06:30labour counselor Sebastian Salic. very good to see you
00:06:34both. Sebastian, yes, what do you think? what what is
00:06:38new about Andy Burnham? obviously the presentation is new,
00:06:42but many policies new, well he's in difficult position isn't he, because he's still
00:06:45bounds to the manifesto that Starmer stood and won on, so there's only
00:06:49so much he can do that is radically different from his predecessor, I think at the moment it's been
00:06:53around Coms as you say, and that's your job in the early days and most people
00:06:57who uh are voters in this country don't follow politics as closely as anybody
00:07:01watching this program uh and so his job now is to introduce himself to them
00:07:05and to set the right tone and that was something that Starmer got wrong, he came out very
00:07:08early um with uh with the the attacks on
00:07:12um on uh elderly people and um, I'm
00:07:16forgetting the word here, winter fuel, that's what I'm looking for, I would set the
00:07:20tone terribly, and that was a real error in the early days and Burnham's done well to avoid that
00:07:23so far, the problem is though that any prime minister from any
00:07:27party has limited goodwill in this economic environment, and so he has
00:07:30to to build that while he can, and um, hope it doesn't erode, but
00:07:34it will eventually
00:07:35come off, that's the problem, your analysis, he's avoided mistakes by avoiding policies,
00:07:39but that can't continue, no, and and that's why I think the big risk of... is the budget
00:07:43um and so I mean we we may well get into the conversation about when the next general election should
00:07:47be um there is certainly case for calling it early
00:07:51riding on that good will extending your term and then being able to do what you really want to do
00:07:55a new manifesto but before we even get to the budget do you
00:07:59think that some people are already feeling some disappointment in other words do you
00:08:02think the labor showing in the polls is likely to
00:08:06increase under present circumstances or do you think it's probably reached
00:08:10its high point? well when you look at his individual ratings, he's he's net
00:08:14positive, which is remarkable, because quite often you see new prime minister come in and
00:08:17instantly their favorability plumits and he's the only party leader who has a positive rating at
00:08:21the moment, so that's something positive to take uh, whether labor can maintain that
00:08:25position in the polls, um, hope so, but
00:08:29it's not necessarily guaranteed, because we are going to get into policy,
00:08:32it is going to get murky, there are no nice levers you can pull, he's going to
00:08:36have to make decisions that upset people, and i think that is going to road labor's poll
00:08:40poll lead, broadly speaking, do you think he
00:08:44continues to enjoy the burn and bounce, or do you think to some extent the
00:08:47shine is coming off? no, I think to some extent the shine has come off, and
00:08:51Sebastian's exactly right, when you first get into power, com's is incredibly
00:08:55important, and and he is a good communicator, it's certainly
00:08:59style-wise and he's interested in in writing good content, but the
00:09:03problem is we're a part of history now, political
00:09:06history where we need some really, really strong moves and he
00:09:10has failed to do that, you know, you can say... that normally what happens is
00:09:13this, this and this, but we are not in normal times, we know that we have to
00:09:17get defense spending to 3% of GDP by
00:09:212030, and even more, we have to get it to 3.5% by
00:09:242035. now that is incredibly difficult thing to
00:09:28do, plus we absolutely know that public spending has to be
00:09:32cut, that much must be clear to most people, and he's not really
00:09:36address that, and what worries me is that he's quite a
00:09:39performative um politician, "and that doesn't fill me with
00:09:43confidence, I'm just going to look here because I made note of it, when I listened to him in the commons
00:09:47recently, he said we do everything to support our national
00:09:51security, but it can't come at the expense of social security.
00:09:54now that's a very glib line, it it was clearly rehearsed line, and he has
00:09:58a line that you could immediately see delighted the tories,
00:10:02and indeed it may delighted people like Putin, yeah, it
00:10:06it was just, I just would not have uttered that phrase, I think you know
00:10:10what, we live in perious..." times, we need
00:10:14serious politicians, not performative politicians,
00:10:18even on the style side, what has happened to number 10 the
00:10:21north, how do we feel about him and the prime minister of Canada? wearing
00:10:25football scarves are the little videos that he makes, mean
00:10:29i don't see them, but do you think they they continue to be effective? well, what did
00:10:33um Andy Halldaine say this week? he said he was exactly the same
00:10:37as Kier Starmer only he had better tik tok, and I think that's
00:10:41true. I think Andy Burnham is very adept, you
00:10:45he'll talk about, well I have my meetings, I don't suppose he does anymore at Greg's
00:10:48and and I enjoy a cup of coffee with my mates etc
00:10:52etc. and and and he appears to have the common... touch, but
00:10:56what I am saying is right now, in these times, I think we
00:10:59need serious politicians, proper statesman like
00:11:03politicians who can take the bull by the horns and start developing
00:11:07policies, because whatever we do, whatever
00:11:10party comes up with something, it's going to be
00:11:13unpopular, the cuts we have to make will be unpopular.
00:11:17Sebastian, you're a sophisticated fellow, how how struck and impressed are you by the
00:11:21little videos and the football scarf wearing and so on? So what I'm most impressed. by is
00:11:25the comments that they get, you look any feedback underneath anything a politician puts out and
00:11:29it's usually very negative and really quite abusive, the stuff I see under
00:11:33Burnham's posts are really, really positive and it's people coming out and
00:11:36saying, i didn't think this about a prime minister before, I'm really excited,
00:11:40and but it's weird like living a dual universe, this is the
00:11:44universe we live in, no actually Sebastian, we will have
00:11:48to actually do things posting on TikTok will not be
00:11:51enoughtion, I was asking precisely about that, 'and the
00:11:55dual universe that exists there is that we live in bubbles and for the
00:11:59people who are in Andy Burnham's bubble this is doing very well
00:12:02but to do those radical political things you need the good will and he's
00:12:06building that good will to give him the runway to do that so those two things go hand in hand we live
00:12:10a world now where we're beyond the 24-hour news cycle you now can summon somebody on your
00:12:14phone whenever you want so as well as being a good politician you have
00:12:17to be a broadcaster and social media star as well and we now have a primer minister who has that
00:12:20skill set and that I think is more valuable than perhaps I gave him credit for few months
00:12:24ago'. one the things that has struck me is that there has been, think a
00:12:28subtle change in the immigration position, even over the last two months since he's
00:12:32been prime minister, the changes have been that there have there have been these
00:12:35demonstrations, citizens if you want to call them that, have
00:12:39appeared on the beaches, have waded into the surf and made
00:12:43protests about the immigrants, the immigrant boats have got
00:12:47larger, and then I think the third thing that has changed or
00:12:50continued a trend that started recently is the
00:12:54government now says that the burden these immigrants has to be
00:12:58shared around, including with more prosperous
00:13:01communities, whereas before it never said that immigration was a burden
00:13:05at all. yeah, i think that's a very strange thing to come up with, the
00:13:09burden of immigration needs somehow to be shared amongst
00:13:13all these other communities. mean a, there's the acceptance that as you
00:13:17say that it is a burden, but also the reason why there are
00:13:21big immigrant populations in certain areas
00:13:24it is. is for certain facts, I mean if you look at Hillington Burrow
00:13:28for example, it has an enormous number of immigrants because it's
00:13:32close to Heathro airport, if you look at some of those asylum hotels and I've worked, I've
00:13:36delivered English language programs in some them, they are in areas where those hotels were
00:13:39failing, so when the government scheme came up and said, okay, we'll
00:13:43pay you for seven years to take asylum seekers and we'll get Ciro in
00:13:47to run them, of course those hotels that were failing businesses
00:13:51said, many them were failing businesses, said okay, we'll do this,
00:13:55you can't now turn round and say we want all these immigrants to
00:13:59go into x, y, z chocolate box village and
00:14:02say that's because we want you to share the burden, it's utterly
00:14:06ridiculous, indeed Sebastian, that's the one I left out that Piddington has
00:14:10left the United Kingdom, we'll be shutting off
00:14:14the electricity any moment now, I'm sure it hasn't quite done so, but it is
00:14:17voted to do so, I mean I put it to you that the immigration
00:14:21situation has got worse in the two months since - has been
00:14:25prime minister, and I think he said that during the Makerfield by-election, the thing that
00:14:29stuck in his mind was that people were talking to him about
00:14:32illegal uh migration, but since he's become prime
00:14:36minister, I don't think he's found the words either to express
00:14:40what people feel about this, to associate himself with the Piddington
00:14:44people,
00:14:44of whom there are many in the country that have to live in Piddington, he hasn't found the words
00:14:48associated himself with them, nor indeed has he found a convincing way
00:14:52to say that he's going to make difference to it, and I think this is his biggest
00:14:56challenge, not just because of how difficult it is in and of itself, but also because who he's trying to
00:15:00win over both on the left and the right, um, and what's happened with immigration is it's become
00:15:04completely decoupled from reality, you you're seeing very positive
00:15:07statistics for anybody who wants to see immigration falling, both both in terms of
00:15:11legal economic migrants and um and asylum seekers, they've both come down
00:15:14drastically, but has the commotion gone away, not at all, because this is an
00:15:18emotional argument, it plays to - our very core as human beings
00:15:22of tribes coming over and that kind of... narrative that people react
00:15:26very vissly to. um, so even if we ended immigration tomorrow,
00:15:30those people who are angry about it would find something else to move to, so it's an emotional
00:15:34problem, not a policy issue here a sense. well, I have to think it is a... policy
00:15:37issue, I mean, technically you can say that the number of immigrants coming
00:15:41over has reduced, oh,
00:15:44it's drtically reduced, no, no, no, I accept that, I think that's a very important factor, but the fact
00:15:48is we've got ourselves in so deep and so badly with this
00:15:52crisis that is actually turned into organized crime,
00:15:56that's actually what you we're dealing with, and do you think the
00:15:59people um who are organized, criminals are going to let
00:16:03this go, no, they're not, so we see that they are now making bigger
00:16:06inflatable. and they taking them to different parts of France, they're making
00:16:10longer crossings, which
00:16:12is why
00:16:12the demonstrations that you spoke of were important, and that has
00:16:16to be dealt with, because the situation is evolving, you can't expect it
00:16:20to say stay the same, I accept progress has been made, but
00:16:24what happens, it's like virus, when a virus has to mutate
00:16:28to survive, this situation has to change in order to
00:16:32survive,
00:16:32and I'm sure those people, making literally millions out of it will change their tanks, let
00:16:36me move Sebastian. to the uh economy uh, how do how
00:16:40do you feel about the budget? do do you think the budget is going to be a
00:16:44net positive for the government? uh, I'm nervous about the budget because uh, they
00:16:48really are in these economic times uh, it's just series of difficult
00:16:51decisions,
00:16:52and again it's going to be a massive com's exercise in terms of what are the quick
00:16:55wins, what's the positive news we can push out, like they did in the early days,
00:16:59um, if you can if you can dress it up like that, you might get through, but the underlying
00:17:03economic reality is still very, very dicey, as it has been for years and years
00:17:07and is not exclusively a labor problem, i'd say it's been the case since
00:17:102008, really, we've never really got past that, if the
00:17:14budget represented decisions you would cheer, because decisions is what you're
00:17:18looking for, yeah, absolutely, and whilst I agree, there are
00:17:21underlying factors that have existed for a long time, I think the
00:17:25real change with for example benefits, pips benefits and benefits
00:17:29like that, there has been such an enormous esculation in the
00:17:33last two years that something has to be done about it, I'm
00:17:36very...' about the budget because you've only got three levers you can
00:17:40pull, you can increase taxes, you can cut spending, or you can
00:17:44borrow. now the red light is on about stopping borrowing,
00:17:48because that is a big big problem, so you can
00:17:52you can only cut ta boost taxes,
00:17:55increase taxes or cut spending, yeah, or both have
00:17:59been talking about labor just now, but i think this news today that it is
00:18:03predict predicted that the pips payments are going to go up by 19
00:18:07billion. 'I think between 2024 and 2030, I think it's taking the breath
00:18:11away from all political parties, it's just staggering, yeah, and you have to ask what the
00:18:14underlying causes are, I don't think everybody's woken up today and started gaming the system,
00:18:18there are reasons that this is happening on Mass and we can think about COVID, we can
00:18:22think about the general sense of people's mental health a very, very poor economic
00:18:26environment, of course you're not going to be feeling good if you can't hold down your job, if everything around
00:18:30you's falling apart, you're going to want to want to get support for that,
00:18:34um, so we have bigger problems, and this is the issue, it all stems from our'. economic
00:18:38insecurity and you look at all the cuts that we've made over the last 15 years, whether
00:18:42it's prisons, schools, libraries, councils, they will have second order effects, so just
00:18:45saying we have to cut more is not the panacea that we that some people want it to
00:18:49be, there are there are consequences, we've run out of time, one word answer from each of
00:18:53you, uh, I advise the prime minister to go to the country no
00:18:57later than May of 2027, yes or no,
00:19:00yes, yes, interesting, same as the
00:19:04panel last week, uh, thank you very much, Linda Duble. and Sebastian
00:19:08Sick. The panel will return at noon to discuss accountability or
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00:19:54claims that he's telling the truth about what was said by king charles when the princes
00:19:57of Wales, princess Diana died. this is Sunday with Mike
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00:23:26Welcome back to Sunday with Michael Portillo. I'm telling the
00:23:29truth. Those are the words of Spencer as he doubles down on
00:23:33allegations made in his upcoming memoir in the book which is said to be
00:23:36fully released on Tuesday. Princess Diana's brother makes a range of rather
00:23:40shocking accusations about the royal family, including that King
00:23:44Charles angrily remarked on the eve of Diana's funeral, we'll forget
00:23:48her soon enough. In the latest exert from the Memoir,
00:23:52El Spencer remarks on what he calls the lack of care for Prince Harry on
00:23:56the day the funeral, and he asked what the then Prince Charles was
00:24:00doing there in the first place, well the former press
00:24:04secretary to Quinn is for the second, Elsa Anderson joins me
00:24:08now uh, Elsa, welcome to the program, very, very good to speak
00:24:11to you, can you account for why,
00:24:1529 years after the death of Princess Diana, 29
00:24:19years, "this book and these allegations and these
00:24:23memories have serviced. Golly, if I had
00:24:26crystal ball, I would be able to answer that. I have absolutely no
00:24:30idea. What I do find particularly shocking
00:24:34is if we will all remember that incredible eology that El Spencer
00:24:37made in Westminster Abbey on the day of of Princess Diana's
00:24:41funeral, and he pledged to support and look after those
00:24:45two young boys, his blood family as he called it, and yet
00:24:48he's come out with the most..." shocking and i think quite mean spirited
00:24:52allegations about the king and the rest the royal family, which
00:24:56clearly will be very, very upsetting to both boys,
00:24:59um, so um, i just think it's quite
00:25:02astounding, um, and your guess is as good as mine, while he's
00:25:06chosen to do it now, but
00:25:08- reading
00:25:08in in many newspapers reports um, he looks like he's going to profit
00:25:12hugely out of this, you people are saying 30 million pounds out of this book, which
00:25:16is not even published yet, so really quite extraordinary.
00:25:21do you um do you know much about the relationship
00:25:24until now between the king and
00:25:27his uh, is he the former brother-in-law or brother-in-law, don't
00:25:31know whether being a brother-in-law ever is something that fades away, do you know anything about the
00:25:35relationship? mean as you say um Charles Spencer is very
00:25:39close related to the princes of course
00:25:42uh,
00:25:43and I
00:25:44was strupt by one
00:25:44the things that Charles Spencer said, I think he said I've only had Prince Charles or the
00:25:48king on the phone. twice in my life, but that seemed very
00:25:52extraordinary, so has there been no relationship between
00:25:55them, has he played a part in the upbringing the
00:25:58boys, I think again, you know,
00:26:02anyone who goes through divorce um there's going to be lot of tit for
00:26:05tat you this whole divorce um was played out in the
00:26:09media as as we will all recall and it was pretty pretty
00:26:13vicious um but just going back to the two
00:26:16conversations that el spencer talks about you no one can really
00:26:20authenticate what was said because there are only two people
00:26:23a part of that so
00:26:26you know the king can't say one thing the earl can't say one thing bause they're
00:26:30the only two so again it is you know no one can verify what
00:26:34actually went on in that conversation, but again I go back to
00:26:38it being quite mean spirited um and saying that the king was you
00:26:41giddily elated about the death of of of princess
00:26:45Diana, I mean
00:26:46what an extraordinary claim
00:26:47and actually how hurtful for the king and for those two
00:26:50boys? I suppose the allegations are in two
00:26:53parts, I mean gidderly elated is a judgement, which
00:26:57he may or may not have made at the time, but even at the time it would
00:27:00have been a matter of opinion. on the other hand, he says that he's
00:27:04quoting the present king directly when he
00:27:08says, for example that um, the
00:27:11princesses, princess Diana's memory will soon
00:27:14fade. I think Charles Spencer has made the
00:27:17point that the king has not denied that, he said that
00:27:21recollections may vary, he's used a phrase very much like that that was
00:27:25used by Queen Elizabeth II, but he's not actually said
00:27:29you're not telling the truth, what do you make of that?
00:27:33'well again, I suppose you just don't want to pour
00:27:37fuel on on the fire, and you the king did say you, he was
00:27:41mindful the pain that fraternal grief can cloud
00:27:44reason, um, which I think is quite clever phrase, and he
00:27:48reactive very, very quickly to these allegations, um,
00:27:52but again, I just go back Michael to what I said earlier, that you there were only two
00:27:56people who are party to that conversation, and uh, clearly they
00:28:00both have different recollections of that'. conversation
00:28:03um, you know, and I just would find it extraordinary that
00:28:07the king really thought that her memory, you know, would fade,
00:28:11I think, even though they were divorced, his first thoughts at that time would have
00:28:14been, you know, his two young sons, he had to break the news to
00:28:18them, and I'm sure his first thoughts were about protecting them,
00:28:22so again, I would find it quite unbelievable that he did
00:28:26react in the way that Earl Spencer said, but again,
00:28:29you know, I wasn't part of that conversation, the only two people to know the truth,
00:28:32cardiel and and his majesty. has this crisis come out of left
00:28:36field? the royal family must have thought it had enough problems with
00:28:40Andrew and very recently with Harry, but now the biggest
00:28:44problem it's got is this Charles Spencer book. did they uh did they see this
00:28:48coming? well, of course the publicity surrounding the book has
00:28:52been going on for some time. um, i
00:28:55think um uh we've had been told that
00:28:58prince Harry knew about the book but he didn't know
00:29:01what the contents were. um, all I would say, Michael, is that,
00:29:05the royal family, the monarchy has survived beheadings, survived
00:29:09abdications, divorces, so I would like to think this is
00:29:12um, this is just a tremor rather than seismic earthquake,
00:29:16um, and they will they will get over it, and they all carry out doing the most
00:29:20extraordinary work a day-to-day basis that they do, and yeah, we can't
00:29:24forget the amazing uh, state visit to the United States earlier
00:29:28this year that the king and queen undertook, uh, showing that amazing soft
00:29:31power, and... they actually, I think, mended relationship
00:29:35with the president uh of the United States that other
00:29:39politician could actually do, so I just hope people remember
00:29:43the the amazing work that the Royal Family uh does a day-to-day basis
00:29:46and uh try and forget about this book. Well, you've
00:29:50certainly um helped us to remember those things today. Elsa Anderson,
00:29:54thank you very much indeed for coming on GB news this morning.
00:29:57Thanks - coming up, rising inflation figures and the military
00:30:01advances made by the hoothi ravels in the yemen exposed
00:30:05quotes the bankrupcy of labor's foreign policy according to
00:30:08one defense analyst. this is Sunday with Mike Portillo only
00:30:12on GB
00:30:13News.
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00:33:31welcome back to Sunday with Michael Portillo. rising inflation figures and the
00:33:35military gains made by the Huiti rebels in Yemen exposed quotes the
00:33:39bankrupcy of labor's foreign policy. that's according to Con cocklin. he
00:33:43highlights that downing. street overriding priority appears to be
00:33:47avoiding involvement at all costs. he also calls on the
00:33:50government officially to prescribe the hooties as a terrorist
00:33:54organization. he is the executive defense and foreign affairs and
00:33:58telegraph and con cocklin joins me now. uh,
00:34:02welcome back to the program, con. uh, you quote, michael, good to be
00:34:06with you. it's good to see you. you quote, trotsky is saying, you may not be interested
00:34:10in war, but war is interested in you. you don't think
00:34:14much of... policy that tries to stand alof from the great
00:34:18conflicts that are gripping the world. I don't,
00:34:22and I think the the whole the whole point of having
00:34:26defense, and you'll know this from your time
00:34:28of working in this area yourself. Um, you've got to show
00:34:32strong deterrence, and when needed you need
00:34:36to act in defense of your interests and at this
00:34:39very moment, our interests are securing uh
00:34:43energy. supplies throughout the globe and these are
00:34:47being threatened by Iranian batt hooty
00:34:51terrorists, they are
00:34:53there a terror group for many European countries in the
00:34:56US, not for Andy Burnom and and David Ed Miller
00:35:00Band, but this is a terror group that is
00:35:03disrupting trade, and as you said in your introduction, this should have a
00:35:07direct bearing on energy prices at the pr pump
00:35:11in this country and energy prices through the winter for domestic.
00:35:15humors: um, there aren't that many admirers around the world
00:35:19now the war that Trump introduced against
00:35:22Iran with help the Israelis, and there might be quite a lot of people saying,
00:35:26well, labor, it was then under Sakira Starma, did jolly well
00:35:30to stay out of that conflict, um, why do you think we should be any more keen to get
00:35:34involved in the next one? well, there's a difference
00:35:38between openly supporting a war of choice, which
00:35:42is what Trump's attack on Iran was, and as
00:35:45I said, defending our interests, now we have lot of interests in the Middle
00:35:49East, we have very important military based
00:35:53Cyprus, for example, which has been attacked by Iran,
00:35:57and and the very least, even if we don't want to get directly
00:36:01involved in the war against Iran, we need to protect our
00:36:04interests, and we miserally failed to do that during the Iran
00:36:08conflict, uh, it was belatedly that the uh
00:36:12then Starmer government sent one destroyer out to the
00:36:16Mediterranean, then it broke down, so this is the state of our armed
00:36:19forces and now we have the hoothi attack in the Red Sea, it's
00:36:23important by the way, just just for your viewers, we first...
00:36:27"the Iranians have disrupted oil supplies out the straight of
00:36:31hormoose in the gulf, now fifth the world's oil comes through the
00:36:35straight for moves, so that means that the red
00:36:38sea which leads into the sewis canal becomes even more
00:36:42important as a supply route for energy uh,
00:36:46and the reason that until recently energy
00:36:50prices were starting to stabilize is because lot of oil was going
00:36:54through the red sea, the hooti offensive..." threatens
00:36:58to disrupt the red sea route, which means that we could have two
00:37:02the major navigation routes in the middle east, the red sea
00:37:05and the straight of formers closed,
00:37:09and that could have a really direct impact um on our
00:37:13economic wellbeing this winter. uh, top of that, there's
00:37:16also there was a pipeline which was very important to the
00:37:20export of Saudi oil, that pipeline has been put out of
00:37:24action too, as I read it, it might be about a month, before
00:37:28it could be brought back into action, but that's always assuming that it could be
00:37:31protected against further
00:37:32attack. well, it is very
00:37:36important pipeline, and as i said the because the straight of horm
00:37:40is closed, the soudis um, one of our
00:37:44major energy oil suppliers have been
00:37:47shipping the their their
00:37:49pro their product from the gulf to the red sea,
00:37:53745 miles. now that was blown up last weekend,
00:37:56probably by Iranian back militares, the hootes are backed by
00:38:00Iran, I should say, um, and so there are now questions
00:38:04whether
00:38:04the the Saudis can maintain oil supplies at the levels
00:38:08they were last month, so again this all adds to the
00:38:12picture, and of course behind all of this is Iran,
00:38:16Iran supports the hooters, Iran supports the militias
00:38:19in Iraq that we think attack the Saudi
00:38:23oil line and they're closing the straight to four moves,
00:38:26so 'I just don't think
00:38:28that the Burnham government can ignore this, and the other point
00:38:32I would make is that the hoosies have been attacking shipping in the Red Sea
00:38:36now for about three years, when they first
00:38:39started saying they were that they're acting in defense the
00:38:42Palestinians in Gaza, we sent a
00:38:46destroyer and we attacked their bases -
00:38:49with with our REF warplanes from Cyprus, we could do the same
00:38:53today, but you see actually none of this at the moment and all we're getting'.
00:38:57empty gestures from Ed Miller Band and Andy
00:39:00Burnham, and
00:39:02the the other point I make in my column is contrasting their complete
00:39:06inaction on this potentially
00:39:10sort of issue that could lead to national energy
00:39:12crisis, with the with the enthusiasm with which
00:39:16they recently attacked Israel with sanctions and and other
00:39:20measures because the west bank situation, so they
00:39:24they will act when when it's politically um... their
00:39:27interest, but try and when it comes to defending the national
00:39:31interest, um, they just sit in their hands.
00:39:35um, Andy Burning probably doesn't have very much experience of foreign affairs, I
00:39:39can well imagine that coming to the post he has a certain
00:39:43distase for Saudi Arabia, uh, you know, it doesn't treat it women
00:39:47does very well, it doesn't have very good human rights record, the regime
00:39:51was involved in the grizzly murder of a journalist that it
00:39:55disliked, but would you like to... describe to the prime minister,
00:39:58why Saudi Arabia matters to Britain? I'm not just thinking that it's
00:40:02got a lot of oil, why does it matter politically? why is this a
00:40:06country that we have been friendly with and should be friendly
00:40:09with? well, you make very good point, Michael and of course the
00:40:12reason that people like Burnham and Milliband
00:40:16have sort of undisties contempt really for the Saudis and
00:40:20also for Israel, it's because that they come from the left the
00:40:24party and the left the labour party... uh
00:40:28despises Israel, which again is an important
00:40:31ally uh in terms of military and security uh
00:40:34support and the Saudis and to answer your question, the
00:40:38Saudis are one of our most important
00:40:42intelligent sharing assets in the Middle East
00:40:46um
00:40:46and we've had this relationship with them for decades uh and we've
00:40:50worked on all kinds of areas such as tackling al-qaid
00:40:54and islamist uh militants, let's not forget al-qaid. was
00:40:57formed to overthrow the Saudi royal family, so the Saudis
00:41:01have very, very deep interest in tacking these
00:41:05Islamist groups, so our national security
00:41:09relies to very large degree in the Middle
00:41:13East to having a good working relationship with the Saudis
00:41:16and ignoring them in their hour of need,
00:41:20which is essentially what the Burnham government is doing at the moment is not in
00:41:24our interests. um, thank you, Very, very
00:41:28much indeed. Um, I'll just say that foreign office
00:41:31spokesman has said that the UK condemns the Huji's decision to resume
00:41:35conflict in Yemen, and the recent attacks on Saudi Arabia, we are clear that they
00:41:39must.
00:41:40their attacks immediately kingdom of Saudi Arabia and the Republic of Yemen have the
00:41:44right to defend their security and sovereignty in accordance with international law, we
00:41:48continue to work with partners to support regional stability to protect
00:41:51civilians and support humanitarian access in Yemen,
00:41:55and Con Cochland, you are an opinion maker, an opinion
00:41:59expressor, you've expressed your opinion today, thank you very much indeed for
00:42:02that. coming up, Canada is set
00:42:06to become the first associate member the European Union.
00:42:10is it an alliance of slow growing economies?
00:42:13this is Sunday with Michael Portello, only on GB
00:42:16News.
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00:46:22Welcome back to Sunday with Michael Portillo: Canada is set to become the
00:46:25first associate member the European Union. Prime Minister Mark
00:46:29Carny says closer alliance with the European Union, is a positive process
00:46:33and will make his country a more effective partner the United
00:46:36States. What other than contempt for Donald Trump and sluggish
00:46:40economic and productivity growth unites them. Economist
00:46:44Catherine McBride joins me now. Welcome back to the
00:46:47program. I was just looking at some numbers. US growth
00:46:51since
00:46:51the pandemic. has been twice as fast as the European
00:46:55Union. US productivity growth uh in the period
00:46:582019-2024 has been seven
00:47:02times greater than the European Union, and US productivity
00:47:05growth over the last 25 years has been two and a half
00:47:09times as good as in Canada, so you might say that the
00:47:13coming together the Canadian and European economies is a marriage of
00:47:17source, a marriage, a marriage of failures. It's incredible,
00:47:21um, and it won't be much... marriage because they'll be living very separate
00:47:24lives, um, 75% of everything
00:47:28Canada exports goes to the US,
00:47:32and it sends more to the UK
00:47:35than it sends to Canada, even though we both have the same trade deal, sorry,
00:47:39sends more to the UK to the EU, we have exactly the
00:47:42same trade deal, so
00:47:46Canada is just not geared up to deal with the EU,
00:47:50and it imports 50% of everything. imports comes from
00:47:54the US, so it's absolutely tied in
00:47:57with the US economy, and it's supplying raw
00:48:01materials generally, so Canada's biggest export by
00:48:05some margin is crude oil, and yet it doesn't
00:48:09refine that oil, it all goes
00:48:10to the US where it's refined, and those pipelines go north
00:48:14south, they do not go east west, so it's the idea that they could
00:48:18suddenly
00:48:19be sending crude oil to Europe is a nonsense. "canadian
00:48:23oil
00:48:23is very thick and heavy, uh, the EU's
00:48:27refiners, mainly in Rotterdam, are used to North Sea oil, which is
00:48:31much lighter, so they don't even have the ability to refine Canadian
00:48:34oil.
00:48:36so so why are they doing all this? is it just to annoy Trump to to to
00:48:39show their defiance of Trump? yes, I suspect
00:48:43Kani thinks that Trump won't take two seconds to look
00:48:46up the trade figures, which I'm sure Jamison Greer, his
00:48:50trade representative has done. already and will be
00:48:54think that the EU could somehow take over
00:48:58the US's role in Canada and it
00:49:00can't. um Canada lives
00:49:04on behind US defense just as most of Europe
00:49:07does. there is nothing the EU can
00:49:11do for Canada that the US does, buse the
00:49:15US not only buys most of its food that it
00:49:18produces, and agricultural goods have been excluded from the deal.
00:49:23"the the European Union hasn't said lot about the details, but the
00:49:27two things we know is that um agricultural food will not be
00:49:31included, and that's one of Canada's big exports after
00:49:34oil, and that Canada will join the
00:49:38Erasmus scheme, which is something that the UK has
00:49:42decided to join as well, this is to do with university
00:49:45students, it's not actually university students, the Erasmus
00:49:49scheme is a sort of
00:49:52um ' forces where young people can travel and
00:49:55you school children often go on Erasmus schemes and they're about a month in France to
00:49:59learn French or something like that or French students will come for a couple of
00:50:03months. The courses last for two days to year, there are
00:50:07no long courses, it's not pure university, that's
00:50:10a separate issue that the EU was trying to get with the UK
00:50:13called youth mobility, and though
00:50:17Canada have also talked about youth mobility, the
00:50:21EU has has... use the word Erasmus, which is slightly
00:50:24different program. What about the so-called
00:50:28reset between the United Kingdom under Labor and the European
00:50:32Union, where have we got to with that? Well,
00:50:35it is interesting, it keeps getting pushed out. It was the the negotiation
00:50:39was meant to happen in June or July this summer. It was then
00:50:43moved to October after the Andy Burnham uh took over the
00:50:46government. Um, but um, now I believe
00:50:50it's going to happen in November. because if it happens before the
00:50:54budget, they will have to include the costs in the budget, and
00:50:58no one in government wants to talk about the cost, because nothing with the EU
00:51:02is free, as Mr. Kani will find out,
00:51:06we joined the Erasmus scheme and they decided to charges
00:51:09810 million a year, and they're trying to
00:51:13pretend that the first year of that scheme, next year, there'll be a discount
00:51:17of a mere 500 million, even though that was
00:51:21twice what we were. offered when we first left, when Brexit was
00:51:25being negotiated, they offered us half that amount to join
00:51:28erasmus. what are the headlines the reset?
00:51:31well, it's divided up into five or six different
00:51:35sections, the bit that most people will have heard about is joining the
00:51:38SBS and they will spell that out for us the
00:51:42um sanitary and phytosanitary regulations, it's
00:51:46basically food health, animal health and plant
00:51:49health um and we are... It's not just the basic
00:51:53regulation, they also want us
00:51:55to follow all their food standards, their packaging laws, their nutrition
00:51:59labeling, uh, all sorts of things that I think most
00:52:03people in the UK don't. understand, because it will
00:52:06affect all UK businesses will have to follow all
00:52:10EU laws in this area, and many
00:52:14businesses in the UK, in fact the majority, 90% of businesses
00:52:18do not export anything anywhere, right? and yet they will be just
00:52:22as affected
00:52:25to do with the EU at all, exactly. are there are there other
00:52:28headlines? oh yeah, well farmers of having to change their
00:52:32pesticide use, even though we present.
00:53:35buy allowances, you have to hand in those certificates when you import goods
00:53:38and every country and every product has different price on
00:53:42it. however,
00:53:44incredibly, the UK's
00:53:48HMRC has published their own version, which is much easier
00:53:52and much quick, cheaper, lower cost, and
00:53:56so we've got two sides of government that are sort of arguing with each other. I'm going to cut
00:54:00off there just to say that I've read out before how
00:54:03bad EU productivity... and Canadian productivity are by comparis in the
00:54:07US, this may tell us why. So that's Katherine McBry, thank you very much
00:54:10indeed, concludes the first hour, my panel will return at
00:54:14noon and they'll debate why no civil servant apparently is ever hel
00:54:18accountable. We
00:54:19got a book by Giles Milton, the chronicles the life and
00:54:23work of one the most intrepid arctic explorers, Stephan
00:54:27Kiriazis and his loyal dog will be here to share reviews
00:54:31of Thelma and Louise and Golden Boys. and there are
00:54:35growing reports that Vladimir Putin is preparing escalate against
00:54:39Ukraine and NATO. All of that in the second half at noon. This is
00:54:43Sunday with Michael Portello, only on GP News. See you at
00:54:47noon.
00:54:52Expect warm spells with the odd rude
00:54:55interruption. Fox boiler sponsors the weather
00:54:59on GB News. Hello there, good morning, welcome to your
00:55:03GB News weather update from the... at office: high pressure dominates our
00:55:07weather today, which means it should be mostly dry, lots of sunshine, feeling
00:55:11warm in the sunshine as well. high pressure will continue to build from
00:55:15the southwest and that should eventually ease away our winds as well, but still a bit
00:55:19breezy at times towards the far north and
00:55:21northeast. for most though, it should be dry, bright afternoon,
00:55:25any showers across Scotland that we've seen this morning eventually easing away. there's
00:55:29still one or two just crossing eastwards across the far northern Isles
00:55:33and much lighter winds can... compared to what we've seen over the last couple of days and
00:55:37even though temperatures are touch down compared to recent days in the lighter winds
00:55:40and in the sunshine it should feel rather pleasant eyes reaching into the low 20s
00:55:44across parts the southeast. now to finish
00:55:48off the day
00:55:49it still should remain mostly dry for many areas. still one or two
00:55:53showers just crossing across the far north of Scotland, but many areas
00:55:56should remain dry to finish off the day. we might perhaps just to start to
00:56:00see a little bit more cloud pushing to Northern Island, Northwest England towards the end of...
00:56:05the day, but elsewhere across England and Wales, there should be plenty of clear
00:56:08skies, starting to turn quite chilly under the clear skies through the
00:56:12course the evening, but different story across the north will eventually start to
00:56:16see more and more cloud build from the northwest and eventually some outbreaks of
00:56:20rain and drizzle start to push through during the early hours the morning, push into
00:56:24pushing into northern Ireland, Scotland and northern parts of England by the time we
00:56:28reach Monday morning, but to the south of this under the clear skies, feeling rather
00:56:32chilly, in rural spots we could get down to around two... to 4 degrees
00:56:35celsius, so perhaps a little bit of patchy frost, first thing, maybe a little bit of
00:56:39fog. this should clear quite quickly through the course the morning though, and for much of England
00:56:43and Wales, there should be more sunshine on the cards, but towards the north still
00:56:47rather cloudy with some rain and drizzle, particularly by the
00:56:51afternoon across any hilly areas, still feeling quite warm, quite muggy,
00:56:55temperatures pushing into the mid-20s. that's it for me,
00:56:58bye-bye. expect warm
00:57:01spells with the odd rude...
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01:00:20Hello, may be amongst the first to wish you a good afternoon. English
01:00:24poet patient strong wrote, September is the month of maturity, the
01:00:28heaped basket and the garnered shief. You're most
01:00:32welcome to another hour of seasoned discussion on arts, culture, current affairs
01:00:36and politics here on Sunday with Michael Portillo.
01:00:40The Thirlweral Inquiry into baby deaths at the countess of Chester Hospital
01:00:44is unlikely to lead to resignations or sackings. and there can't be
01:00:48much hope that its recommendations will be applied. my panel will
01:00:51debate why the public service is
01:00:54unaccountable. chiles milton has written a book
01:00:57chronicling the life and work of one the most intrepid
01:01:01arctic explorers. stepen Kiriasis
01:01:04and his loyal companion Raffa will join me to share their joint reviews
01:01:08of Thelmer and Louise and Golden
01:01:11Boy. And we examined growing reports that Vladimir Putin
01:01:15is preparing escalate the war in Ukraine. and to increase hybrid
01:01:19attacks on NATO states following parliamentary elections in
01:01:22Russia this weekend, all of that and indeed
01:01:26more, but first your latest news headlines with Bethany
01:01:29Elsie.
01:01:37Michael, thank you, good afternoon, you top stories from the GB news room at one minute past
01:01:41midday. Earl Spencer says there are similarities between how both
01:01:45his sister, princess Diana, and the duke. and Dutches of Sussex have
01:01:48been treated by the media. Harry and Megan, who recently returned to the
01:01:52UK from California six years after stepping back from royal
01:01:56duties have been repeatedly critical the press, and
01:01:59speaking to the BBC, Spencer said anyone being subject to
01:02:03constant criticism must be cancerous influence in their
01:02:07life. It would be really beholding on people to learn from
01:02:11Diana's example, I'm not here to speak for Harry Megan, but for
01:02:14anyone who's being destroyed in way daily,
01:02:18it must be such cancerous influence in their life. One
01:02:22the problems with Diana was, she's very, very sensitive to
01:02:25criticism, and of course, I'm sure most of your viewers
01:02:29now... think, oh, she had this splendid life, and it was all amazing,
01:02:32and she didn't, she was so privileged and so perfect in so
01:02:36many ways, but she was really brought low by all that criticism,
01:02:40and yeah, I suppose it's a pity when I see echos of that
01:02:43now. Ed Sheeren has apologized to fans for making
01:02:47mistakes as he opened a solo show in Philadelphia. All the
01:02:51singers support acts, including his band, have quit the current loop
01:02:55tour after the US rapper McLamore was dropped for making
01:02:58pro-Palestinian comments. during a show in New Jersey. Sheeren
01:03:02said that decision was taken by promoters, not him, but said he was
01:03:06sorry for his handling the controversy that
01:03:09followed. I don't want to disappoint fans and
01:03:13I've never wanted to be an activist musician, but this has put me in the middle of an
01:03:17important and passionate argument about freedom of speech and the most
01:03:20complex political issue on the planet. He went
01:03:24to describe the October 7th Hamasled attacks as
01:03:28horrific and added Israel. treatment of residents in Gaza
01:03:32is catastrophic and
01:03:33unjustifiable. At least two
01:03:37people have been killed and six others injured in one the biggest
01:03:40Ukrainian drone attacks on the Moscow region overnight. Officials
01:03:44in Russia say more than 200 drones had been shot down, but
01:03:48fires were reported in several residential houses and an oil
01:03:51refinery. Meanwhile, in Ukraine, mother and her two
01:03:55three-year-old children have been killed in the Kiev region. The governor there
01:03:59says that... area has endured constant hostile attacks for
01:04:03more than a day. President Donald Trump has
01:04:07announced he'll form an artificial intelligence force and appoint an
01:04:11AI SAR amid warnings about the technology. In a post on social
01:04:15media he said it won't in any way hinder or stifle the growth
01:04:18the tech as he aims to keep the US a world leader in the
01:04:22industry. He pushed back against calls to slow down the development of
01:04:26AI until better safeguards are in place, repeating comments. that
01:04:30concerns around the dangers and risks are a
01:04:33hulks. The conservatives are calling on labor to
01:04:37cut welfare spending at next month's budget warning the government must
01:04:41confront what they describe as the grim reality of Britain's
01:04:44economic peril. The route comes as inflation reaches five month
01:04:48high of 3.1% with Chancellor John Healey due to deliver the
01:04:52budget at the end of October, but Bridget Philipson insists
01:04:55benefits support young people into work and lift children out of...
01:05:00poverty: some the hardest
01:05:04working people I know are people that are in law-paid jobs, they work incredibly
01:05:08hard, they do the right thing, they don't earn huge amounts of money, and they
01:05:11deserve support to that point about child poverty, one the biggest
01:05:15indicators is to whether you will go to live a good life where you can contribute as
01:05:19whether you grow up in poverty, therefore tackling child poverty, lifting children out of
01:05:23poverty is absolutely the right thing to do,
01:05:27and national task force aimed at tackling misogyny. across society
01:05:30is being launched by the government, it's part of labor's man
01:05:34manifesto pledge to have violence against women and girls within a
01:05:37decade. the group of ministers, women's organizations, academics
01:05:41and local leaders will seek to root out harmful
01:05:45attitudes online, in schools, workplaces and within
01:05:49communities. further measures are expected to be announced this
01:05:52week. those are your latest headlines, i'll be back in
01:05:56half an hour. for all the latest from GB News,
01:06:00first on the go, get the GB News app. Scan the
01:06:04QR code now to download, or visit
01:06:06gbnews.com/App.
01:06:21Uh, thank you. Bethany Elsey. Whilst the nurse Lucy Letve has been
01:06:25convicted of multiple baby murders, it seems unlikely that the highly critical
01:06:29report by Lady Justice Thurlwall into the care failings at the campus
01:06:33of Chester Hospital will lead to resignations or sackings, nor
01:06:37affect the steady promotion of those who have failed. The
01:06:40former cabinet secretary Chris Wurmold is one the very few public
01:06:44servants that I can think of ever to have been fired and he is to be paid
01:06:48more than million pounds this year ease the pain. Why do
01:06:52public servants live a world of no blame and no
01:06:55accountability. My panel has returned, the journalist and broadcaster Linda
01:06:58Dubley and the former labor council Sebastian
01:07:01So Linda, first of all, do you accept my
01:07:05proposition that in the public sector people are not accountable? I
01:07:08think that is by large true, actually. I have
01:07:12always been a journalist, but I have done um one particular program which
01:07:16help Afghan women learn English and and British constitution, actually,
01:07:20and I did that via a local authority, and I was quite taken
01:07:24aback by the lack of accountability. I mean, I think it comes from a
01:07:28culture, there is a cultural... mindset in local
01:07:31authorities and in in um to that extent in the civil
01:07:35service where there's there are layers and layers and
01:07:39layers of structure and it's possible to hide some... things or hide in
01:07:43plain sight whenever there's a misdemean. in the commercial sector that is far less
01:07:47likely to happen because you're given targets and key
01:07:51performance indicators, you have to hit the mark all the time, and I think in
01:07:55the public sector that is not the case. we've only got to look at um
01:07:58instance like and I can't say too much because I think there's an aspect of this which is still a
01:08:02live case, the Rudol Axigalbana case, that horrendous
01:08:06case in Southport, there were six agencies there
01:08:10and none them were talking each other. "and
01:08:12as far as I know, no one has been accountable for that yet,
01:08:16and Lady Justice Thurwell here is quite right, in this
01:08:20scenario here, I think it is, there is lot of
01:08:24lack of communication between the the managers, certainly, I'm not talking about
01:08:28the clinical leads, but the managers did not
01:08:31communicate properly, they did not facilitate the safeguarding
01:08:34of whistleblowers and I doubt whether any them will be properly
01:08:38punished, that very often we think these phenomena as being..."
01:08:42kind of fairly recent, let's say 21st century at least, but I would say that when I was
01:08:46first member of parliament in the mid 1980s, I remember in
01:08:50particular case of very young man who's gone into hospital and had died there in
01:08:54circumstances which were not easy to explain, and it took me
01:08:58more than six months to get the hospital to admit that the boy
01:09:02had ever been in the hospital, let alone get to the cause of death, yeah, it seemed
01:09:06like the immediate point was to rally round, was
01:09:09denial, to to to to put the... a circle a larger
01:09:13mentality larger mentality to be defensive um and
01:09:17i fear that it's only just got worse yeah definitely think this is going to happen
01:09:21here and apart from the actual
01:09:24details the lucy letby case the
01:09:28situation in that uh unit it was said to be
01:09:32that they that Thurwell heard evidence that the neonatal units
01:09:35operated a 21% below the
01:09:39recommended nursing staffing levels 21.
01:09:42percent below, and that's not an isolated incidence, because the
01:09:46national average is 27% below. I mean, that
01:09:50is really shocking when you are talking about neonatal
01:09:53unit, and certainly when when I listened to the remarks after the court
01:09:57case when the inquiry when it finished, the consultants concerned
01:10:01were saying, hey, look, we're really, really sorry, this is just
01:10:05terrible, and we feel at fault because we could have blown the whistle
01:10:08earlier, we could have acted earlier, but I think the real blame lies here.
01:10:12with the managers,
01:10:13you know,
01:10:14so much has happened in this case, but I think very few heads will roll. The point
01:10:18you make about understaffing takes me to another point, there seems to
01:10:22be pretty low expectation that recommendations from any public
01:10:25inquiry will actually be put into place,
01:10:29and it's probably because the people on the ground say, well, here's the recommendation, but
01:10:33it bears no relation to reality. The person who wrote this report doesn't
01:10:37really understand what it's like to be working in these conditions in this hospital on this
01:10:41ward. Do you think that's a? as well that there's a disconnect between the
01:10:44recommendations and what can actually be implemented? oh, I think that's
01:10:48very, that's a very, very good point, the people who write the reports should
01:10:52actually as part their reporting go and see what it's like at the cold
01:10:56face, well they don't report back
01:10:59significantly well, I don't think, they don't do it to affect
01:11:03change, there's a solo mentality where they do their
01:11:06job and then leave it, they don't pay attention to whether this is
01:11:10likely to be implemented and that's... terrible when you consider what this
01:11:14case is about. Sebastian, you're to the left of us, how how do
01:11:18you how do you react to this question? Yeah, I mean, I think it's nuanced, and we have to be
01:11:22careful not to not to merge these two cases together. So with the Lucy Letby
01:11:26story, horrendous failings, we can all agree in the Thal report
01:11:29um, throws those up to us. We have to remember that some the senior staff at the counters of Chester
01:11:33Hospital are under investigation for um gross negligence
01:11:37manslaughter, which carries as maximum sentence life in prison, so people are being
01:11:41held to encountable. a sense here um with Chris Wurmold um
01:11:45there was no suggestions of any kind of um wrong doing on
01:11:49his part so it's essentially the equivalent of in the private sector where somebody is heavens why
01:11:53was he sack then well mean not wrong doing but yeah surely he
01:11:57wasn't doing his job otherwise he would be kept in well there's a difference between we're not
01:12:01happy with what you're doing and you have done something horrendous or you have failed
01:12:04catastrophically it happens in the private sector all the time where people are paid off rather than being
01:12:08sacked because legally you can't do that um so yeah we can quick about
01:12:12the amount that he was paid, but that that process of giving
01:12:15them a bit of money for them to leave
01:12:16you like to quible. oh,
01:12:17i don't know, i don't know, the fellow is getting a million pounds
01:12:21this year, yeah, um, the last prime minister of a party that you
01:12:25support thought that he wasn't doing his job well enough for him, yeah, and got rid
01:12:29of him, yeah, now if he wasn't doing his job well enough for the prime minister, should he really be given
01:12:33million pounds? well, again, we can we can go around in circles about how much
01:12:37you should be paid off, but the principle of being paid off is something
01:12:40that the civil service agreed with, that the government agreed with then I would agree with as well,
01:12:43because what else are you going to do, he's not going to leave of his own valition and you can't sack him because then
01:12:47you run a horrible, long expensive tribunal, so a sense it's probably the cheapest way to get rid of
01:12:51him, well he's got a contract and obviously the cont has paid out what
01:12:55is paid out, but of course this is in the mentality the civil servant, is it
01:12:59not? mean, firstly you're very unlikely to be sacked, but in the most
01:13:03unlikely event that you were sack, you would suffer no detriment, mean
01:13:07what's what the contract said in this case was he had to be uh, he
01:13:11had to have payments so that his pension would not in any way
01:13:15be affected at the end of it, yeah, which is why he's got so much money, well if you got a
01:13:18contract like that, and what's your incentive to perform well, that's my
01:13:22point, i think it's an element of pride isn't there, 'if you go into your job, especially a
01:13:26job that senior, you want to do well, you haven't got there through lazing about and
01:13:30think and and taking on that mentality, so clearly if you get to that point, you're somebody who applies
01:13:34yourself for your own self-esteem rather than for any form of economic
01:13:37gain. linda, if you were prime
01:13:39minister, you wouldn't be this prime minister, you'd be your own
01:13:43person, but if you wanted to do something about this culture of non-
01:13:46accountability, where would you
01:13:48start? i think i would
01:13:52probably start with middle managers and i would start to
01:13:55introduce proper targets, proper KPIs
01:13:59and I would start to introduce elements from the commercial sector
01:14:03into the public sector, whether it was a civil service or somewhere else, because
01:14:07this can only get worse, this culture of lack of accountability
01:14:10just seems to get worse and worse and worse. I've been in meetings where
01:14:14I'm just amazed at the lack of activity that goes
01:14:18on, it's like matework, there's not there's not enough of a
01:14:22sense that we need to achieve x, y, z. "and that's a
01:14:25really big problem. see, another thing I think about this is we're all very
01:14:29worried, we all say that we're worried about the number of people have being paid to do
01:14:32nothing, but if top of that you say that the rewards
01:14:36in the public sector are going to be greater, the accountability is going to be
01:14:40less, the pension payments are going to be greater, then apart from all the people
01:14:44you're into doing nothing, you you're a lot of other people
01:14:47from enterprise into the public sector, yeah, because
01:14:51because it's safer, it's it's safer, cosier and..." "and in
01:14:55the end, yeah, taking pensions into account better, and actually you
01:14:59need a good balance, you need the public sector to be,
01:15:03and and different, it's like the people that work each sector have
01:15:06different mindset, and I agree that if you've got a certain mindset, you
01:15:10want to go one way, you got another mindset, you go another way,
01:15:14but you do want your private sector to flourish,
01:15:18because that's that's the incubator of ideas, it's how
01:15:21business is built, it's how workforces are built, so you have to..." support
01:15:25one, you don't want everyone migrating out of that sector going into that one, but there's no
01:15:29evidence to suggest that that's happening, and indeed, if you do go from the private sector to the
01:15:33public sector, you're taking a massive paycut, you look at some the jobs that are advertised a
01:15:36senior level, you're thinking about the government building out their AI capabilities, and
01:15:40these people are paid less than what an entry level employee in the
01:15:43US, taking the whole thing together, even the
01:15:47public sector pension would protect against inflation, those are those are
01:15:51big numbers, the pensions are attractive, but you think about someone of my generation, you got to be able to...
01:15:55afford a house, you got to be able to afford a family, and the pension is going to pay for that, you need a lot of that money
01:15:59up front, and that's why the private sector is so attractive. let let's indeed think about you for
01:16:02moment. mean, you
01:16:03are accountable, aren't you, because mean you're an entrepreneur of sorts, yeah, yeah, yeah, so you live or
01:16:07die by your product, don't you find that a way very very
01:16:11attractive, mean, don't you feel a way rather sorry for people who aren't
01:16:14aren't held directly accountable? mean, i love the freedom of being able to do what i
01:16:18want and build what i want, and never, i was never very good employee to start with, i just
01:16:22loved being able to kind of build and be creative. 'um, but look, I think that
01:16:26accountability isn't there in the private sector either, you look at the financial crisis and the big bosses who
01:16:30took down banks and went to thrive and we're never punished for that, and you look
01:16:34at water bosses as well, it's only in the last couple of years we've been able to sell send them
01:16:38to prison for their failings, um, so we have to look at the private sector, especially those in
01:16:41monopolies like water, who could do lot of wrong, cause lot of damage water
01:16:45company, but get away scot free, but you can, I was as had a senior executive
01:16:49post at Sky News when I was younger, I can assure you I was watched like
01:16:53a hawk if I did.' not perform, then I risked losing my
01:16:57job, there's no question about that, and that went for everyone at that level at sky,
01:17:01luckily the people who are accountable are politicians, for example,
01:17:05in 1997, I lost my seat in parliament, many
01:17:09other people too, and you've done very well since, I must say right, yes, thank you
01:17:13very much
01:17:13for my panel, that's Linda Duvely and Sebastian Salic,
01:17:17Jane Tomkinson Obe, who's the chief executive officer at the countries of
01:17:20Chester Hospital NHS Foundation Trust said, we
01:17:24know. that no apology or action can undo what happened at our hospital, we
01:17:28are however truly sorry for the events that occurred in 2015 and
01:17:322016, we acknowledge the findings the third world report and will
01:17:35approach recommendations with openness and the foam commitment to build
01:17:39on the progress we've already made in improving our hospitals governance,
01:17:43safety and culture since that time. we're a different organization today with new
01:17:46leadership, stronger governance and safety processes, more
01:17:50open culture where speaky up is encouraged and acted
01:17:54upon we. believe that changes we've made, as said now evidence
01:17:58inquiry have created a safer environment for our patients and
01:18:02staff. If I have a right to reply to that right to
01:18:05reply, it's that we always... that yes um coming up,
01:18:09Giles Milton has chronicled the life and work of one the most intrepid
01:18:13arctic explorers, he will join me shortly to discuss empire at
01:18:17the edge the world, this is Sunday with Michael Portello only on GB
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01:21:41"welcome back to Sunday with Mick Portillo. Villamoll Stepanson
01:21:45had an extraordinary life story. His obsession with Wrangle
01:21:49Island, a frozen speck of land in the Siberian Arctic, sparked
01:21:52disastrous endeavor with deadly consequences. Author
01:21:56of Empire at the edge the world, Charles Milton joins me now. Very
01:22:00good to see you, congratulations, thank you very much, there it is, hold it up
01:22:04so there we go, very nice. Now this..." fellow, tell
01:22:08a bit about his and who he was. Stephenson wanted to go and
01:22:12explore the Arctic. The Arctic was the last, unknown,
01:22:15unmapped, uncharted wilderness at the beginning the 20th century. He wanted to
01:22:19go there, explore it, and claim it for the British
01:22:22Empire. Um, and so he set off in 1913
01:22:26on this incredible expedition, the Canadian Arctic expedition,
01:22:30with some the world's greatest scientists to explore this
01:22:33land. Now, when you found an island, you...
01:22:37couldn't you could stick your union jack in the frozen forshore, but that didn't
01:22:41automatically make it British, you had to colonize it, you had to send people
01:22:45there, you had to establish bureaucracy of sorts and infrastructure,
01:22:48and so uh, Rangel Island, which he deemed to be the most
01:22:52geoc politically important in the Arctic, um, he sent
01:22:56a band of young, inexperienced colonists to go and settle
01:23:00it, when you say band, how many, and when you say young, how young, right, there were
01:23:04five them, four them uh, were in the um either
01:23:07teens or in their 20s, um, and one them
01:23:11was young female inuit
01:23:14seamstress, ada Blackjack, whose story is
01:23:18completely remarkable,
01:23:19she only signed... up for the expedition because her son uh um Bennet
01:23:23Blackjack was uh suffering from tuberculosis, he urgently needed hospital
01:23:27treatment, she urgently needed money and they were offering her year's
01:23:31salary to go and live there and sew all their clothes for
01:23:34them. I i don't how much for your book you wish to give away, but um
01:23:38I think we can say that the colonization effort was
01:23:41disastrous, absolute catastrophy for most of those
01:23:45involved, and eventually the the blame is laid at Stephenson's
01:23:49door, well... had um promoted this this expedition,
01:23:53he'd financed it um and you supported all the way through, and
01:23:57then essentially halfway through he pulls the plug, he
01:24:00runs out of money, he doesn't send a ship, he promised to send a supply
01:24:04ship, he doesn't do so, and so these five poor
01:24:08people are left on the remotest island in the world with no
01:24:11supplies, no food, nothing.
01:24:15um, before that even happened, he goes off on an expiration a
01:24:19ship, and after not very long, relatively
01:24:22speaking, he finds himself without a ship, how does that happen? he
01:24:26does, he goes off and he's following what the called leads in the ice, he's a
01:24:30cracks in the ice and nudging his ship further and further north
01:24:34hoping to discover the arctic continent that's believed to be you know up
01:24:38in the in the polar north, it's not there, the ice closes up on his
01:24:42ship and crushes it, like nut, it's snapped
01:24:45into, it sinks and the crew and the
01:24:49world's great. the scientists are left on the arctic ice pack fending
01:24:53themselves, but but when you say the the ship is caught in the ice
01:24:57and sinks, stephenson isn't on board but it happens, no he's not, buse he's
01:25:01gone back ashore, he wants to go hunting, try and find some caribu that they're
01:25:04going to need on board ships, so he goes ashore and
01:25:08then there's a blizzard, the the ship is carried
01:25:12high up into the arctic north, and stepenson never
01:25:16regains his ship, so these poor the crew in the...
01:25:20are left to fend for themselves, their ship sinks, they're on the
01:25:23iceback, and eventually they they make it to wrangle island.
01:25:27yeah, lot them survive, and actually I thought your book was
01:25:31largely about their captain, whose name slips my mind at the moment, Robert
01:25:34Bartlett, yes, a great Robert Bartlet, I mean
01:25:38controversial figure, they didn't all like him, there was talk of mutany from time to time,
01:25:42but he saved many them in circumstances which seemed improbable,
01:25:46he's one the the great heroes of arctic exploration, he leads
01:25:50rescue mission, these these men and women and children are stuck on
01:25:54Rangel Island, he uh heads across the Frozen Arctic,
01:25:58crosses Siberia, raises the alarm, gets rescue ship uh, and
01:26:02they are finally the survivors are plucked off the
01:26:04island. This all happened quite a long time ago, we're talking
01:26:08about what um this adventure is very from about
01:26:121910 to about 1920, 1913 to 23 really are the dates
01:26:16we're talking about, yeah um, but Stephanson in one way. thought was quite a
01:26:20visionary, his idea the arctic was quite visionary. well yeah, he was a good friend
01:26:24the right brothers who invented the aeroplane, he said this is going to change
01:26:28the history the world. planes flying from London to Tokyo will
01:26:32fly over the Arctic, and see said this makes the Arctic
01:26:35strategically vital for the west. um,
01:26:39gas, oil, uh, rare metals, he's talking about these things
01:26:42in in this time in the early 1920s, so he was visionary
01:26:46and he said that Rangel Island uh stands at the g' way to
01:26:50the famous northern sea route, which is the route across the top of
01:26:54Russia, now nowadays it takes about a
01:26:58week for a ship, a Chinese ship to sell across the top of Russia
01:27:02and arrive
01:27:03in in in England, so this dramatically cuts down the
01:27:07time that the ship takes to get through the far east,
01:27:09you know, if it's using the sewis canal or the cape of good hope, it's so
01:27:12much quicker, so
01:27:14much cheaper, and now of course it's
01:27:16melting fast um, and in fact last week the
01:27:19first Chinese... container vessel arrived in England using that route?
01:27:23yes, so I mean, your book obviously was well under preparation, I
01:27:26imagine before the Greenland crisis arose, yes, but you must have thought,
01:27:30my goodness, this is going to help my book sales, I thought Trump was running my PR
01:27:34campaign, this is what was talking about a century ago,
01:27:38absolutely, I mean, um, it's very odd, this new agreement, we don't quite
01:27:41know what's in it, but it doesn't seem to be any different from the agreement that America already
01:27:45had, the 1951 greenland defense agreement by which America...
01:27:50can build bases and station soldiers on greenland and what have you? so we need to see
01:27:54the fine print, but um yeah, it's clearly America is
01:27:58going to start reopening some the bases it's shut in the arctic. i
01:28:02don't want to distract you from your book really. what what what do you make the
01:28:05psychology of Stephenson? mean, he was clearly very, very
01:28:09brave, he was clearly obsessive, he had
01:28:13extraordinary talents, mean as a navigator, he was second, he could just set
01:28:17off across the ice and somehow... where he was going and get to the place
01:28:21he wanted to get to, and even after he lost his ship, he didn't abandon the
01:28:25mission, he just continued it on foot, yeah with his dogs and
01:28:28sledges, what is the role the obsessive in
01:28:31in in in? discovery do you think? it's hugely
01:28:34important and I think the
01:28:35one thing that's so fascinating about Steffenson is at this period the
01:28:39Inuit or the eskimo as they were always called at the time we look down
01:28:43upon as sort of primitive savages and Stephanson said no, these
01:28:46are masters of survival, they can survive in the harshest possible
01:28:50climate, and he spent several years living with them learning
01:28:54particularly how to hunt seals, he said if you can kill seal, you've got um
01:28:58oil for your food and for your heating, you've got meat for your food and you've got
01:29:01skin your clothes, you know, so if you can kill seel, which is an
01:29:05art uh, then then you're you know you're well on your way to surviving in the
01:29:09Arctic. He was absolutely driven, he was charismatic, he
01:29:13persuaded people to go along with him, often people who are not well equipped to
01:29:17deal with the arctic, which is why so many them died,
01:29:20um, he was also master manipulator the press, which
01:29:23first drew me to the story, he knew how to use the media to his own
01:29:27end, and that makes him a very fascinating, modern character, I
01:29:31think, yeah.
01:29:32It is, it is very fascinating story, it's a man of enormous celebrity
01:29:36of global fame who eventually has terrible
01:29:40fall. Well, this is what's so wonderful, because he starts the book
01:29:43as the ultimate hero. He really is an extraordinary character, a
01:29:47leader, you know, can pull pull people along with him,
01:29:50by the end the book, he is the anti-hero. Will you please hold up the
01:29:53book? Here it is, empire at the edge the world at edge
01:29:56the the world, and thank you very much indeed, Charles
01:30:00Milton. Thank you very much. Uh, coming up, we
01:30:04will, we will examine the growing reports that Vladimir Putin
01:30:08is preparing escalate the war in Ukraine and to ramp up hybrid attacks against
01:30:12NATO states once the parliamentary elections in Russia of this weekend
01:30:16are behind him, but first we're going to have news headlines with
01:30:19Bethany
01:30:20Elsey.
01:30:28Thank you, the headlines from the GB news room. Earl Spencer says there are
01:30:31similarities. between how both his sister, princess Diana, and
01:30:35the Duke and Duchess of Sussex have been treated by the media, morning
01:30:39lessons should be learned. Ed Sheeren has apologized
01:30:43to fans for making mistakes as he opened a solo show in
01:30:47Philadelphia after the U.S. rapper McLamore was dropped from the tour for
01:30:51making pro-Palestinian comments. At least two
01:30:55people have been killed and six others injured in one the biggest Ukrainian drone
01:30:59attacks on the Moscow region. Meanwhile, mother... and her
01:31:02two three-year-old children have been killed in
01:31:05Kiev. President Donald Trump has announced he'll
01:31:09form an artificial intelligence force and appoint an AI
01:31:13SAR to ensure the U.S. remains a world leader in the
01:31:16technology, dismissing recent warnings and risks as a
01:31:20hulks. Europe to date for now, more for
01:31:24you at 1 o'clock. You can now watch GB News live
01:31:28across the United States of America and the world on Truth
01:31:31Plus. Scan the QR code to find out more or visit
01:31:35gbnews.com/truth.
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01:34:53and welcome back to Sunday with Michael Portillo. Worrying reports suggest that Russia is
01:34:57preparing escalate its war in Ukraine and to increase hybrid
01:35:00attacks on European countries. Allies across the continent
01:35:04anticipate an imminent war of cyber attacks, sabotage and
01:35:07misinformation from the Russian regime, and a bit
01:35:10to hold support for Ukraine. Putin hopes to bolster support.
01:35:15following parliamentary elections this weekend, the author of
01:35:19American overthrow, Moscow's end game in its long war with
01:35:23Washington, Kier Giles joins me
01:35:26now. Hello, Kier, welcome to the
01:35:29program. Um, so what kind of things are we
01:35:32expecting and who's expecting it? I mean, are we actually
01:35:36looking at drones and rockets arriving in places like Poland
01:35:40or Lithuania? Well, it's a bit of a complicated picture because
01:35:44different European. does are saying different things about it, there isn't a common picture across
01:35:48the whole the continent, that threat of drone and missile attacks, which nobody is
01:35:52going to describe as hybrid, it's more an overtact of war, came from
01:35:55Poland, but it's not completely clear if that's rehashing intelligence
01:35:59warnings about a potential false flag operation where Russia blames out in
01:36:02Ukraine that we heard in the summer, meanwhile at the other end of Europe you've got France
01:36:06saying what they do call hybrid attacks, everything that's below the threshold of
01:36:10open warfare is going to step up and they're getting ready for it, and then you
01:36:14have the... states, Estonia and Latvia, which are saying, even though they
01:36:18might be in the front line for some of this stuff, calm down, cool your boots,
01:36:22we haven't noticed anything getting any worse than it was before, and if we do
01:36:25we'll let you know, so there is a mismatch between some the promises of what
01:36:29Putin is supposed to be about to be planning, and the the reaction
01:36:33to it from some these European countries. Now, what about the war
01:36:37in Ukraine? Do you think Putin is going to go for the call up? I
01:36:41think we've been talking about 300,000 extra recruits for.
01:36:45war, I suppose there are some dangers and and and
01:36:48traps for him in that, and by the way, what's it going to achieve,
01:36:52because the the front appears
01:36:54to be pretty much frozen? well, all of those are very good questions, and
01:36:58this mobilization story is another one that seems to have taken a bit of life of
01:37:02its own and become a little bit divorced from any the evidence behind it. there's
01:37:06this wide spread expectation that as soon as Russia gets the elections,
01:37:10the state dooma out the way, the so-called elections that are happening at the moment,
01:37:14then Putin will find that he's - better able to do something really
01:37:17unpopular like call up hundreds of thousands more people, but what he would
01:37:21then do with them, of course is a big question. lot of people are focusing on the front line,
01:37:25just as you just suggested, the front line is stable and the
01:37:29character the war has changed, so a massive increase in mind power might not be
01:37:33that helpful there, but the other thing it would allow Russia to do is
01:37:36fill in all the military infrastructure that it's been building along
01:37:40its western frontier, along the eastern periphery of NATO, ready and waiting for.
01:37:45a time when they have the troops and the equipment ready to man it. now lot of people are
01:37:48expecting that would be after some kind of ceasefire in Ukraine, but if
01:37:52there is major new wave of mobilization in Russia, that would give
01:37:56Russia the people to do that and pose a more direct threat to NATO
01:38:00without having to wait for the end the war in Ukraine. the Russian
01:38:04advantage of late, Russian advantage of late has been that um
01:38:08air defenses seem to have run out uh over Ukrainian cities, and
01:38:12so the Russians have been able to penetrate uh Ukrainian. cities pretty much
01:38:15at will, is there any chance that Ukraine's allies will
01:38:19fill in the gaps so that it can again counter the threats
01:38:23from missiles and drones? yes, it's not quite at
01:38:27will, there are some new Russian capabilities that match some deficiencies
01:38:31and Ukrainian air defense, but still Ukraine is stopping most of what Russia is
01:38:34throwing at it, trying to make life unlivable in Ukrainian cities, and European
01:38:38partners across the whole the continent have actually stepped up and said,
01:38:42yes, we recognize this is major problem, ahead of winter if Russia is going
01:38:46to target the energy and heating infrastructure that keeps Ukrainians alive and so
01:38:50they're promising money and they're promising supplies. The question of course
01:38:54is whether those European countries are actually agile enough. fast
01:38:58enough to get that help there before it's needed and contribute to this
01:39:01technological race that's ongoing between the two countries at incredible
01:39:05pace. what what can the British expect in all of this?
01:39:09let's divide this in two parts: what could we expect of
01:39:12assets that belong to Britain outside Britain and what can British
01:39:16people expect to to encounter from the Russian
01:39:20threat? well one the problems of course when looking at where
01:39:24Russia might choose to get its way, whether it might like to challenge from example,
01:39:27NATO as an alliance as a whole, is that lot of people are thinking this will come in
01:39:31the frontline states, the ones neighboring Russia, but if you're sitting in the
01:39:35Kremlin, and you want to show that NATO can't fulfill its function,
01:39:39you'd look instead for the soft, juicy targets, and those are not the ones that are
01:39:42spent decades, now making themselves ready for the attack, it's the places west of
01:39:46Warsaw, it's the places like the UK would have which have declined to reinvest
01:39:50in defense and therefore falling behind the preparations the rest of
01:39:54Europe. Now coming up over the next week, if I'm allowed to... another
01:39:57broadcaster, there's going to be Sky News's war game series, which
01:40:01plays out what would happen if Russia did seek to coerce the UK, to
01:40:05demonstrate that NATO doesn't work, and frankly how little the UK would
01:40:09actually be able to do about it. the the title of your
01:40:13book, American overthrow, what does it mean? that's
01:40:17about the way Russia seems to have achieved its objectives
01:40:20in the United States getting America under the Trump administration to do
01:40:24so many things that remove obstacles to Russia. an ambition, it's
01:40:28about the way the United States in its national security strategy is talking about
01:40:32retreating from its global presence and leaving Europe to the
01:40:36Europeans and by extension to Russia. Now everybody sees the ways in which
01:40:39Trump is and those around him are carrying out lot the
01:40:43things that Russia wanted them to do and have effectively switched sides in some the
01:40:47conversations about protecting Ukraine and Europe from Russia, but
01:40:51another thing that's happening that lot of people from outside the United States don't see is
01:40:55the way that the US itself is trans forming domestically, the way
01:40:59politics has been overhauled, the way democracy has been sidelined in some
01:41:02cases, concentration of power in the hands the president and
01:41:06sidelining everything else, and that's what's led some the reviewers the book to
01:41:10say, it seems preposterous, but they say
01:41:14Donald Trump's playbook is Vladimir Putins, an
01:41:18extraordinary assertion, obviously very important book to
01:41:21read. Thank you very much, Kier Charles, thank you. Uh,
01:41:25coming up, seven curiasis. and his lawyer companion rafa will join me to
01:41:29share their joint reviews of Thelmer and Louise and Golden Boy. This is
01:41:33Sunday with Michael Portillo only on GB
01:41:35News.
01:41:40Be nice escape the gray. Clear skies. Here we come. As clear
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01:41:51occasional shower expected across parts of Greece and southern areas of Italy,
01:41:55but for most across Europe. It should be. dry with some sunshine, feeling
01:41:59very warm in places, temperatures pushing into the mid-30s across parts of
01:42:03Spain and Portugal and into the high 20s for many areas,
01:42:07like I say, the odd shower across parts of Italy and parts of Greece, but for
01:42:11most it should be dry, bright, plenty of sunshine, that sunshine will
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01:45:37welcome back to Sunday with Michael Portillo, Rapa. and his faithful companion Stephan
01:45:41ke have paded into the studio to share their
01:45:45weekly theater review. Welcome to you. Thank you very much. What
01:45:49have you seen this week? Thelmer and Louise. First up is Thelmer and Louise, so 1981 film,
01:45:52Ridley Scott, Susan Sarand and Gina Davis,
01:45:55extraordinary, extraordinary story, extraordinary visuals, extraordinary
01:45:59everything. We've got a little clip the two leads, Rachel Tucker
01:46:03and Lucy Lennox, singing uh, refrain from the
01:46:07show. I'll let you listen and then I shall discuss.
01:46:11We are to live before we die, time
01:46:14doesn't wait for us, it flies, let's catch a
01:46:18piece of our own
01:46:20life, it
01:46:23could do you some good, but I don't
01:46:27know about me, I've
01:46:31got Daryl to think of, it's not like I can just
01:46:35leave him all
01:46:38alone. lucky leaves me
01:46:42every day and the nights, when i say it out loud, i'm
01:46:46not too proud of myself, let's make him wonder
01:46:48where we
01:46:51are,
01:46:56aha, so the young, yes,
01:46:59so music is by Nico case, she is a sort of cult
01:47:02indie alternative artist, which always
01:47:06makes me slightly worry, um, she's also sort of known
01:47:10for breaking the traditional song
01:47:13structure and melody patterns, so you have
01:47:17songs that sort of stop and start, you get half a song, you get an
01:47:21awful lot of melodies that go laal all the way down the
01:47:25whole time, it's kind of for me rather miserable, um,
01:47:28and no disrespect to fabulous 12, 13-year-old
01:47:32poets out there, but we have lines like, I
01:47:36became an iron lake, or the hairs on my neck...
01:47:40stood up in murmoration, which is impossible because murmoration is
01:47:43flying birds. there are things we say between the
01:47:47lifeboat and the sea Michael, which I might think,
01:47:50ah, and that's pretty much how I felt about most of this show,
01:47:54so we have no car, we get the car at the start, we we have this sort of
01:47:58ho down in a western bar, which is the entire set that never changes,
01:48:02pulls back, our two lead ladies are sat top of an upside down crashed
01:48:06car, because we know how the film ends, I hope,
01:48:10um and they kind of wave merily to everybody and everybody cheers, and I'm
01:48:14like, you're using a really dramatic, tragic
01:48:17ending for sort of fan service
01:48:21familiarity to start the show, so for me it really went off the
01:48:25cliff from there, there's no car for the rest the show, so they are
01:48:29literally a huge hundreds and thousands of miles road trip across
01:48:32America, but we have no car, just the same static set, we get
01:48:36this these lights that kind of go around the edge the stage,
01:48:40It's okay, but we also the film was also famous for extraordinary
01:48:44wide screen vistas, you had this sense of it was almost epic, it was
01:48:48kind of mythical story against the skies, against the gods, against the
01:48:52whole world that these two women were battling against and then with
01:48:55wonderful soundtrack,
01:48:57I mean if I say so even greater than the one we just heard that, yes not
01:49:00difficult, um, yes, so everything that was in the film is not in
01:49:04the show, um, they absolutely the two leads are electrifying, they do
01:49:08really well with it, other characters are so painfully
01:49:11two-dimensional, it's just pointless, they turn Thelma's abusive husband
01:49:15into a sort of comedy sitcom prat, which is just
01:49:19incredibly frustrating, and it just doesn't know what it wants to do with the toe. "we obviously have
01:49:23rape early on, we have a man shot dead, we have two women
01:49:27that are literally bonny and cliding it across the west once all their money is
01:49:30stolen, there's this sense of building tragedy in the
01:49:34story that they cannot escape, but we're still rooting for them. i
01:49:38just got none of that from the show, i know some people have liked it, took, i tried to
01:49:41take relevant people, took a very great woman with me, she
01:49:45hated it as well, so it's not just my sadly male view of it, that's
01:49:49at the young vick, that's at the young vick, if you want to go" until October the
01:49:5324th, what else we got? So then we've got um Golden Boy which is up at the
01:49:57Almada and the interesting thing about this to some extent is toxic
01:50:00masculinity. Thelmer and Louise is obviously oh the dreadful men they
01:50:04have to deal with all the way through. This one is slightly different. This is depression
01:50:08Ara in New York. It's written by Clifford Odetz who sort of disappeared from the
01:50:12canon now, but he was a precursor, 1930s,
01:50:16marxist, socialist, anti-establishment, anti-the American dream, and
01:50:20people like Arthur Miller have spoken that he and hired them, so
01:50:24Joshua Carnor plays an incredibly talented 21 year old
01:50:27violinist who has always suffered from being marked, he has a funny
01:50:31squinty eye, but also he's playing the violin, so we've got
01:50:34him sort of giving us the atmosphere of what this guy's going
01:50:38through, is the clip, you're just like dead if he ain't got a
01:50:41dollar,
01:50:46tomorrow is my birthday, everything moves too quickly,
01:50:50life goes by 200 miles per hour and you want.
01:50:52need to wait for the future, it might never
01:50:54come. i want
01:50:58to live and in this country that means
01:51:01money. you just like dead if you ain't got a
01:51:04dollar.
01:51:08tomorrow is my birthday, i changed my
01:51:11life.
01:51:15you b to this one. there was lots that i liked about it. so
01:51:19joshuaner, always phenomenal. um, there's really great.
01:51:23um Haley Squires plays Launa who's the kind of dame the show and she brings
01:51:27a lot to it, their scenes together are great, so adets was famous for sort of
01:51:30taking bringing in colloquial street talk but with
01:51:34poetic phrasing, it probably great then for
01:51:38me, it started to sound
01:51:39a bit like buggy malone, it just was sort of all these kind of wide
01:51:43broad sort of gangsters, daniel mayze places one them doing very
01:51:47much what he does very well and then um zubinv comes
01:51:51in as this map so boxer wants to take the boxer and make
01:51:55him famous, but it's just
01:51:57a there is bizarrely towering performance that is so
01:52:00ridiculously over the top that I loved, but everyone for me seems to be a different
01:52:04show and I kind of I I get the themes, I love the themes,
01:52:08it's Michael, you can talk to this, it's whether you take your artistic
01:52:12integrity or you take the money and the fame, how do you balance that in your
01:52:15life? it's it's such difficult, it's a struggle, you take the
01:52:19money um so it's all about that and the American dream. but I
01:52:23just felt I don't, I don't particu, I'm not draw to the way that odetz writes,
01:52:27but it's it's fabulously screen, the punch bag has camera in it, so whenever
01:52:31he's fighting himself or others, it whirls around, projections everywhere, and when
01:52:34he thinks about his music, shutters pull back,
01:52:38incredible string quartet playing Isabelle Wallerbridge's
01:52:42own compositions, lots to like, very classy production, I
01:52:46didn't land for me, but that's at the Almada until October the
01:52:4831st, we haven't got time for any.
01:52:52but just you want to talk about Hadiestown, so the double
01:52:56Hadestown, it's one of my favorite, favorite, favorite all-time shows, this is how you do
01:53:00story, this is how you do themes, this is how you do a musical, so the picture we've got is
01:53:04Danielle Denise who we both know is an extraordinary international
01:53:07operar, she's going into Hady's town as percephany,
01:53:11which number one, hurrah, incredible, everybody please
01:53:15go and see it, but also which I love, from
01:53:18October, it's going into cinemas for about three
01:53:21weeks. when the original broadway cast came over this summer,
01:53:25they were filmed live with the London cast who are extraordinary, so if you can't
01:53:29get to London for the show, please go and see it at cinema, look online for
01:53:32information, but that wipes the floor with everything else. yeah, people sometimes
01:53:36complain that we're very London centric, so I'm very pleased when you accentuate either shows
01:53:40that are out of town or that are touring or that can be seen in
01:53:44cinemas. thank you very much, thank you very much Stephan Kiriasis, thanks
01:53:48to all my guests today for joining me, it's been an excellent couple of hours of fascinated.
01:53:53coming up next on GB News, it's the weekend, and that's with Dawn
01:53:56Neeson, and so the question is, Dawn, what's coming up on the show? Thank
01:54:00you so much Michael, it is going to be a brilliant show, we've got some cracking stories for
01:54:04you - we're starting with the Muslim fan group
01:54:08that want the Man United owner to be sacked over some of
01:54:12his recent controversial comments, we're also talking about the
01:54:15fact that the legal, we the UK faces legal
01:54:19challenge from the Caribbean over slave. because
01:54:23we are racist, evidently, yes, you knew that was coming,
01:54:26and we're also talking a little bit about the ongoing saga,
01:54:30obviously of Ed Sheiren, and that's a debate that is getting
01:54:33incredibly toxic,
01:54:34and we're talking about. cake, because beware, people
01:54:38bringing cake, they are very dangerous a work environment,
01:54:41evidently all of that, and much, much more to come after the weather, see you
01:54:44then,
01:54:52today clouds overhead, total
01:54:55zen within, box solar sponsors the
01:54:59weather on GB News, hello there, good afternoon,
01:55:03welcome to our GB News weather update for the met office. It should be quite a
01:55:06fine end to the day for many of us, so a change coming through tonight in
01:55:10the north where we'll eventually see more rain coming through, but under cleareer
01:55:14skies it will be turning a bit chillier than of late. For the time being though, high
01:55:18pressure continues to build across the southwest, meaning it should be quite a fine
01:55:22end to the day, plenty of clear skies, so eventually across the north we'll start to
01:55:26see more cloud push through towards the north-west and eventually through the early
01:55:30hours the morning we'll see rain progress through here, eventually into northern
01:55:33island, parts of scotland and northwest England. To the south of
01:55:37this though, plenty of clear skies, so turning a bit chillier here, rural areas
01:55:41under the clearer skies could drop down to around 2 to 4°grees celsius, so
01:55:45quite a chilly start by the time we reach Monday morning for some,
01:55:49but
01:55:49it is eventually going to start to turn a bit warmer, a bit muggier, particularly across the
01:55:53north where we'll see some clouds, some rain. This could turn quite persistent across the
01:55:57hills of Scotland. Also, quite cloudy and damp start across Northern
01:56:01Ireland. Northern England we'll see some patchy cloud and possibly... some
01:56:05light outbacks of rain towards the far northwest, elsewhere across England and
01:56:09Wales though, it should be quite a bright start to
01:56:11the day, a little bit chilly, some patchy fog in places, though this should soon
01:56:14clear through the course the morning and remaining quite dry and settled here with some
01:56:18sunshine, towards the north though, different story remaining quite cloudy
01:56:22with some rain and drizzle, this quite persistent around western hills through
01:56:26the course the day, much lighter winds and feeling warm in the sunshine
01:56:30once again, but return of that muggy feel, temperatures pushing into the
01:56:33mid-20s for many. areas, including eastern areas of Scotland where they might start to
01:56:37see some breaks in the cloud later on into the day.
01:56:41now through Monday night, there's not much change, there's still this north south split
01:56:45in the weather, so plenty of cloud towards the north, some rain and drizzle, but some
01:56:49clearer skies towards the south, we'll still see plenty of fine weather
01:56:53into next week, though some rain and showers across the north at times and temperatures
01:56:56eventually returning to more average for this point the
01:56:59year. today, clouds
01:57:02overhead, turtals. and within
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02:00:20"good afternoon, it's 1 o'clock on Sunday the 20th of September and
02:00:24this is the weekend on GB News, hello and welcome and I hope you're having
02:00:28a wonderful Sunday out, we've got a great show coming up, starting with the story, it's really
02:00:32going to annoy you - Manchester United co-owner sir Jim Ratcliff has
02:00:36sparked a political round over Britain's economic decline, immigration
02:00:40and tax, uh, Brigit Philipson and
02:00:42has hit back, but is Radcliff right, and why do the Muslim supports
02:00:46of his club, what?" " act and there's
02:00:50a growing evidence that Andy Burnham is considering a general
02:00:54election in the next year as he seeks a mandate to raise
02:00:57taxes, so is an...