Google Cloud Speech-to-Text API (Chirp) + Gemini 2.5 Flash Non-Thinking. Treat it as a searchable index of what was broadcast, not a quotation record.
00:00:00Live
00:00:00to the fullest
00:00:09Turkey's energy storage Orbus
00:00:27would also vote storm continues.
00:00:30"The price per liter of diesel has approached 100 liras. So,
00:00:33how will this situation affect citizens,
00:00:37producers, industrialists and even the entire country? The
00:00:40headlines of politics are quite hot, but we will try to talk about the real agenda of the citizens,
00:00:43which is the economy, in tonight's
00:00:46uncensored program. Of course, there is a name
00:00:49issue for the new party. As you know, the Central Executive Board met today and
00:00:53it was decided not to change the name for now
00:00:57regarding this name issue in the new party. You will remember that in the past
00:01:00days, an event occurred in Turkish politics that would be talked about for many
00:01:03years. In Üsküdar, upon the objection of the AK Party,
00:01:07the election for the Deputy Mayor
00:01:10was renewed, and the position of
00:01:12Deputy Mayor changed from CHP to AK Party. Now, in this
00:01:16transition, two arrests and four transfers were very
00:01:19effective. An explanation like a confession came from
00:01:23one of those transfers. He said, "They offered me the position of Deputy Mayor,
00:01:27and I accepted." So, what exactly
00:02:00did you find? Welcome. Welcome, and good broadcasts.
00:02:03Now, of course, as I said, we will talk about the real agenda of the citizens,
00:02:07the headlines of the economy, tonight, for sure, but today
00:02:10one really marvels at what
00:02:13we witnessed. As you know, these Üsküdar elections
00:02:17were renewed. Why were they renewed? They were renewed with the objection of the AK Party.
00:02:20After Sinem Bedetaş was arrested, CHP Council Member
00:02:24Sibeltan Çetinkaya was elected Deputy Mayor. As a result
00:02:28of the objection, that objection has not yet been concluded.
00:02:30Two council members were arrested, and four members were transferred, and
00:02:34while being transferred, one of those members, Tahsin
00:02:37Usta, said that they decided to switch to the AK Party
00:02:40without any pressure or coercion, and without any
00:02:44bargaining. However, in his statement today,
00:02:48he said he was offered the position of Deputy Mayor. The archive does not forget.
00:02:51Let's first look at what he said on the day he decided to transfer,
00:02:55before the badge was pinned, and then what he said today.
00:02:58Please. "When making this decision, I would
00:03:02especially like to state, along with my fellow council members,
00:03:04that we were not under any pressure,
00:03:08not under any threat, and not
00:03:12involved in any bargaining. Our aim is
00:03:16to serve Üsküdar more."
00:03:19"Without any pressure, without any bargaining,
00:03:22we are joining the ranks of the AK Party. Our intention
00:03:26is good, sir, our aim is to serve Üsküdar better," he said.
00:03:28However, in his statement today, let's
00:03:32quickly see, I'll ask my director, he says
00:03:36that he was upset, first he was made to
00:03:39resign from his position as Deputy Mayor, and then such an
00:03:42offer came, he says he was actually collecting hazelnuts in Trabzon,
00:03:46then suddenly he found himself in a hotel room in Izmit,
00:03:49he stayed for 3 days, even his wife didn't know,
00:03:53he was offered the position of Deputy Mayor, and
00:03:56he accepted this offer, believing he could serve.
00:04:00He says there are areas where he is experienced.
00:04:03Now, Ali Gökçek, of course, let's address
00:04:07the contradictions in his speech, he says there was absolutely no bargaining,
00:04:10then he says he was offered the position of Deputy Mayor, he says there are issues where
00:04:14he can help for the disabled, many issues he is an expert
00:04:17on, but on the one hand, inevitably,
00:04:21we are reminded of the 38th Convention
00:04:24and the lawsuit filed with the allegation and accusation
00:04:28that the will of the delegates was invalidated. There was a decision of annulment. Now, I
00:04:31couldn't quite understand what
00:04:34like everyone else, when I was invalidated here. If you could explain,
00:04:36I would be grateful. Actually, I was going
00:04:39to start from there. Let's
00:04:42say what we were going to say at the end, at the beginning.
00:04:45Only in Üsküdar, 4 council members decided
00:04:49to switch from CHP to AKP.
00:04:52There is no invalidation of will, no offer, no
00:04:56incentive, nothing. There is just such a coincidence.
00:05:00There are four different people who
00:05:03suddenly decided to resign
00:05:06from their positions as Republican People's Party
00:05:10council members. They suddenly
00:05:13found themselves in a political drift, and what
00:05:16a coincidence that all of them decided to reunite
00:05:20in the same place. Either these four different people
00:05:24internalized this, experienced it without any incentive or threat,
00:05:27and suddenly decided to become a member of a
00:05:30political party they had opposed for years. Here,
00:05:34we are already shouting that there is both threat and
00:05:38incentive. Furthermore, if we look at the last Üsküdar elections,
00:05:40even though two more council members
00:05:44remained in the Republican People's Party, they voted
00:05:47for the AKP candidate. Let's say
00:05:51these friends also thought the same thing. Did they not have enough time
00:05:54to switch to the AKP, or did the AKP not have enough votes
00:05:58to win the Üsküdar elections, so they needed
00:06:02to threaten or incentivize more people?
00:06:05These are very clear. All of these
00:06:08are already very clear. Let's get to the issue
00:06:11regarding our convention. "Our
00:06:13friends,
00:06:15in the convention indictment, had their photos from the convention
00:06:19taken and circled in red,
00:06:23and those photos said, 'Look,
00:06:25he was next to Özgür Özel at the convention, now he's a council
00:06:29member.' This was a big crime.
00:06:32This was presented as a crime. How?
00:06:35Özgür Özel promised that he would win the convention,
00:06:39and after winning the convention, he would make him a council member.
00:06:42This was political bribery, and it was
00:06:46against the law of political parties.
00:06:50If someone from his own party walks with him,
00:06:53yes, he might consider evaluating him somewhere. This is inherent in politics. People
00:06:56want to continue in politics with those they walk with.
00:07:00Yet, you will consider this a crime.
00:07:03Furthermore, our council member,
00:07:05who was recently released from prison, could not even
00:07:09become a convention delegate. Look,
00:07:12even though he could not become a convention delegate,
00:07:15because they supported different
00:07:18candidates in the provincial elections. He just got out of prison.
00:07:22He wasn't even a convention delegate. He gave a bribe
00:07:25and made him a council member. We said, 'Why did Özgür Özel give a bribe
00:07:29to someone who wasn't a convention delegate?' These people are in prison
00:07:32for no reason. It's a shame, it's a sin, we said. Starting
00:07:36from this, one person's detention,
00:07:39arrest, even one person's freedom for a day or an hour.
00:07:52for these reasons. Now, all
00:07:55our friends stated that this was not the case, that they were just doing politics,
00:07:58that they made a choice at the convention,
00:08:02and that they made this choice by listening to the society. And
00:08:05we were right, we became the first party in Turkey in the elections,
00:08:09because we were able to listen to the voice of the society and bring about change
00:08:12within the party. Now,
00:08:16they are coming, openly, a council member who switched
00:08:20from the Republican People's Party to the AKP
00:08:23says that they offered him the position of Deputy Mayor, and he
00:08:27said yes. What is this? Isn't this political bribery?
00:08:30Let me tell you something,
00:08:33I think what Tahsin Usta explained in Üsküdar
00:08:37is the most
00:08:39innocent
00:08:41I think Come, you will be made Deputy Mayor,
00:08:45and political bribery will be given. If
00:08:48you could appoint a trustee to the 103-year-old Republican
00:08:51People's Party, then renewing the Üsküdar elections
00:08:55is not enough. The same
00:08:58proposal you applied should be brought now.
00:09:02Just as you took the council member inside, then
00:09:06take Mr. Tahsin as well. For the same reason, for violating the Law on Political
00:09:10Parties. For the same reason. Ask Mr. Tahsin,
00:09:13"Who made you this offer, brother?"
00:09:17How did this happen? While making a choice between two candidates
00:09:20within the party can be considered a crime, isn't it a crime
00:09:24to switch to another party and make a municipality elected by the people win
00:09:27for a party that wasn't elected?
00:09:31Will they ask Mr. Tahsin who did it?
00:09:34If there was such a rumor in any municipality of the Republican
00:09:37People's Party or today's New Party,
00:09:41prosecutors would immediately be called to duty,
00:09:45and perhaps even before being called, prosecutors would take this as their duty
00:09:48and start. Why isn't Mr. Tahsin asked this?
00:09:52Because we know this. We also know the reason for the second and third operations
00:09:55carried out in Üsküdar. There will be no more operations
00:09:58in Üsküdar, as
00:10:01they have already achieved what they wanted. But
00:10:04today, in the last
00:10:08elections, our candidate, Ms. Sibel, made a speech
00:10:12in the IBB council. I was able to listen today. I don't know if she made it today or if it came
00:10:15to my attention today. She said,
00:10:19"Yes, you can enter a municipality,
00:10:22sit in the office, and even
00:10:25sign documents, and those signatures can be official signatures,
00:10:28very true. But you cannot win the heart of a city with decrees,
00:10:32you cannot enter the heart of a city." But, I mean, we don't think
00:10:36that the citizens have a concern about creating
00:10:39social consent. I mean, do citizens really have
00:10:43a concern about creating social consent, or has the threshold been
00:10:46crossed long ago? Let's get to that in a bit, Mr. Dündar, if you wish. So,
00:10:49this confession, or rather, Mr. Usta's statement,
00:10:53I shouldn't call it a confession. It's
00:10:57a clearer, more distinct explanation than
00:11:00the allegations in the process that led to the annulment of the CHP convention,
00:11:04that is, to absolute nullity. They offered me the position of Deputy Mayor.
00:11:07Now, from the Turkish judiciary
00:11:10that issued the annulment decision, what kind
00:11:14of move would you expect here? What should happen, actually? Well,
00:11:17ideally, when we think about it, in a legal system where the rule
00:11:21of law prevails, citizens and the public
00:11:25would expect a similar process to be carried out
00:11:28for Üsküdar. Moreover, here,
00:11:32Mr. Tahsin may have inadvertently
00:11:36blurted it out. He says, "I don't think
00:11:39Ms. Sinem Dedetaş
00:11:42did the dirty
00:11:45work she was accused
00:11:48of. I wouldn't even attribute such a thing to her," he
00:11:52says. So, it means that in his opinion,
00:11:55Sinem Nedetaş, the currently imprisoned mayor of Üsküdar,
00:11:58is a clean mayor, an innocent mayor.
00:12:02He also makes such a confession. Therefore,
00:12:05if we look at another aspect of the issue,
00:12:08these municipal council members are changing
00:12:12parties, for one reason or another,
00:12:14but the voters
00:12:17didn't vote for them to
00:12:20take office in the parties they went to,
00:12:23did they? They voted for them to
00:12:26be in opposition. Doing something like this without
00:12:30the consent of the voters, in my opinion, is extremely
00:12:33wrong from an ethical point of view.
00:12:36You might say, what ethics are left? But
00:12:39we must defend ethical values to the very end.
00:12:42Today, look, Foça
00:12:45is a district where the Justice and Development
00:12:48Party did not even enter the elections.
00:12:52The mayorship was won there. But then what happened?
00:12:55The mayor was unable to attend
00:12:59the ceremonies held on September 11th, which is the anniversary
00:13:03of Foça's liberation. He was the host of the ceremonies.
00:13:06He could not attend the liberation ceremonies.
00:13:10Today, there was a local market
00:13:13in Foça. The tradesmen at the local market
00:13:17protested. So, the politician's
00:13:21momentum is actually
00:13:24determined by the people, by the voters
00:13:27who voted for him. If the voters
00:13:31are directing him in one direction,
00:13:34and he insists on going in the opposite
00:13:38direction, then I think the politician's
00:13:40career is over.
00:13:43Because any action against the will
00:13:47of the voters is a very important
00:13:50factor that prepares the end of that politician. These are now.
00:13:53faktördür. Bunlar artık.
00:13:55"Perhaps they will no longer receive votes from the Justice and Development Party
00:13:59voters either, because I talk, and conscience-minded
00:14:02Justice and Development Party voters also
00:14:06do not accept this. They say, 'We
00:14:10must win a mayorship and the council of that municipality
00:14:13with our votes, given with our free will.'
00:14:16Such behavior is not
00:14:20in line with our ethics or our expectations. Therefore,
00:14:24'we absolutely do not approve,' they say. I have friends
00:14:28in Üsküdar, for example, I talk to them, and they
00:14:31evaluate it this way. Therefore, Mr.
00:14:35Gökçek compared it to the annulment
00:14:37case, very clearly, of course. The
00:14:41evidence here is very clear, very open,
00:14:44it's a confession. The other one was an allegation,
00:14:48an allegation, an allegation of annulment, here
00:14:52it's a confession. Exactly. There's also this:
00:14:56is it illegal for the AK Party to persuade a delegate or council member
00:14:59to join them, or for the CHP or
00:15:02the new Party? I mean, when you start
00:15:05to persuade a delegate, you are corrupting the will,
00:15:09invalidating the will. But when the AK Party
00:15:12presses the button and tries to do this as the Istanbul Provincial Directorate
00:15:16or district directorate, does it become an extremely political promise of office,
00:15:19for example, Professor Mütat? No, why would it? For example, when the
00:15:23İyi Party entered the elections, it brought Bilge Yılmaz from a serious
00:15:27university in the United States. So, he said, "If we become the government,
00:15:30I want to entrust the economy to you." And the man came. Is this political bribery?
00:15:34Can you, as a leader or official
00:15:37of a political party, be considered to be engaging in political bribery
00:15:41when you say who you will work with and what duties you will assign
00:15:44when you are coming to power? Can such a thing happen?
00:15:47No, it's a guarantee to the voters,
00:15:50of course, for the voters to feel at ease and peaceful
00:15:53with those you put in the spotlight, to feel secure.
00:15:57You provide them with inner peace and
00:16:00inner comfort with people you trust very much.
00:16:04This is very important. But a little
00:16:07while ago, before the program, when I was chatting with
00:16:11dear Uğur Abi, I said that Üsküdar is a turning point
00:16:14in Turkish political history, perhaps I mentioned it in the previous program,
00:16:18I still hold the same view. In this sense, I will say it
00:16:22very quickly, so that our dear viewers don't get confused
00:16:26with the numbers of who went and who came, and can follow the chronology.
00:16:29A contractor complains. Sinem Cetatış,
00:16:32the mayor of Üsküdar, is first detained and then arrested
00:16:36based on a contractor's complaint. "There is no conviction yet,
00:16:39nothing, but since imprisonment has turned into a punishment in Turkey,
00:16:43she is immediately arrested and sent to prison. What will happen to the prison?
00:16:46The Deputy Mayor, a Deputy Mayor is elected, Ms. Sibel
00:16:50is elected. Objections are raised to the Deputy Mayor, and the court
00:16:53immediately accepts the objections and initiates new votes. There are 28
00:16:57council members, plus the mayor, makes 29. They lose one, it drops to 27.
00:17:01What happens after that is very interesting. After 27,
00:17:05three of them are arrested. They
00:17:27were kept in a hotel or something, like kidnapping a footballer
00:17:30before a transfer contract. Exactly, like kidnapping a footballer
00:17:34in the 70s, they take them to a hotel. He himself
00:17:37says it. In fact, his exact statement is this, professor, if you'd like me to
00:17:40elaborate a bit: he says, "I was following all the developments
00:17:44in Trabzon, I had gone to collect hazelnuts, and when I came back, I found myself
00:17:47in a hotel in Izmit. He says a state official was waiting for us,
00:17:51meaning there was security with us. Even my wife didn't know,
00:17:54she was very angry," he says. So much secrecy, it was like
00:17:58a movie, like a President of the United
00:18:01States kidnapping operation. But you're just a council member,
00:18:04why the police, why the hotel, why the bodyguards? It comes
00:18:07to mind, but when you look at the result,
00:18:11of course, we are speaking based on this statement,
00:18:15did they leave the hotel, did they walk around, did they say "let's go"? So, we are saying this
00:18:19based on their statement that they stayed in the hotel. This is therefore
00:18:22not a good thing. However, what's very interesting is that
00:18:26while the voting was ongoing, you know, it ended 21-21,
00:18:30the vote was postponed. During the postponement,
00:18:33during the postponement, such arrests occur
00:18:37so that they don't vote, meaning it turned into an arrest after detention.
00:18:41So, they align those dates in such a way that those in detention also
00:18:44cannot vote. So, every thin political
00:18:48engineering has been calculated in the lesson. However, there is
00:18:51one more astonishing thing: while the votes were being cast,
00:18:55two more people, who had not resigned at all, who allegedly
00:18:58had no contact with the AK Party, and appeared to be CHP council members,
00:19:02also voted for the Justice and Development Party during the voting. Now,
00:19:06here, of course, also. So, if they are from the new party,
00:19:10the new party members should also think, "How did we make
00:19:13these people council members? Should we scrutinize more
00:19:16carefully from now on?" This is a lesson for them,
00:19:20a lesson for the new party. However,
00:19:23when Tahsin's statements are examined now,
00:19:26he says, "Such a deputy mayor is political
00:19:30bribery." Because if you set out with the same party,
00:19:33for example, if I am the general chairman, Ali, we will work
00:19:36together. "For example, Ali Gökçek, come, let's work, because we will make
00:19:40you a deputy chairman responsible for local governments,
00:19:43God willing, or we will make you a minister." That's one thing. But when you
00:19:47tell someone from another party, "You actually look like you're one of them,
00:19:51come join me," this is political immorality,
00:19:54it's a political deception, whatever
00:19:58you call it. Now, when looked at here,
00:20:01going to court, this is actually an absolute nullity, of course, this is an absolute
00:20:05nullity, because you
00:20:08are sitting down to a negotiation that is outside of
00:20:12all political and ethical
00:20:15values and norms to invalidate
00:20:19an election that was won, just like the Justice and Development
00:20:22Party said about the CHP, "You had men in pavilions, money
00:20:26and dollars flying around." But what if an objection is filed?
00:20:30Let me tell you now. The election ended
00:20:3223-19. The court will say, "Well, one person,
00:20:36it will be 23 to 20." Or it would have been 22 to 20. If you
00:20:40take it from there and move it there, the result doesn't change, so it will be rejected. But
00:20:43this is important for it to go down in political history. If
00:20:47you say absolute nullity for a party that is 103 years old,
00:20:50then in a district here, beyond absolute nullity,
00:20:54with certain variations, social consent,
00:20:57in fact, I remembered last week, I said that it's as if
00:21:01the Justice and Development Party is saying, "From now on,
00:21:04we want to govern not with consent but with trouble." So,
00:21:08trouble is created, and with the trouble,
00:21:11in that way, a sort of takeover movement with transfers,
00:21:14arrests, and trustees. After the March 31,
00:21:172024 elections, the 26 to
00:21:2013 balance changed. When you look at the AK Party at the district level,
00:21:24the AK Party has the majority in Istanbul. So, what is being talked about?
00:21:27Is this the beginning of a plan for the IBB
00:21:30to be implemented step by step? you're making trustee decisions
00:21:34I assume you will add something. I find it extremely negative
00:21:38for the image of the ruling Justice and Development Party
00:21:41to win the mayorship with such methods.
00:21:44Doesn't this reveal a dilemma? I mean,
00:21:47a political party led by
00:21:51Tayyip Bey, who is a master politician,
00:21:54a politician who knows very well how the pulse of the people beats,
00:21:57especially while in power,
00:22:00should not need such methods,
00:22:03I believe. And
00:22:06I must also say this: I have never
00:22:10attended any event of the Üsküdar municipality
00:22:13until today. I have never spoken
00:22:16with Ms. Sinem. However,
00:22:19one Sunday, Mr. Küçükşahin, and then I will
00:22:22at a restaurant/cafe within the boundaries
00:22:26of Beykoz Municipality. It was packed,
00:22:29people were having brunch. Ms. Sinem
00:22:32had come with her family and was sitting at one end
00:22:36of the very long cafe. Would you
00:22:40believe it, more than 80%
00:22:42of the people there
00:22:45went and took pictures
00:22:48with Ms. Sinem one by one.
00:22:52So, based on my observation,
00:22:55she is one of the politicians, one of the mayors,
00:22:58who has great public support. And I claim
00:23:01that if they release her on, believes that purchasing
00:23:04today, if a fair election is held
00:23:06in Üsküdar, where the ballot boxes
00:23:10are protected by everyone, by all political
00:23:14parties, Ms. Sinem will win again.
00:23:18I base this on that observation.
00:23:28While increasing the resistance of social opposition, it also increases the pressure of the government.
00:23:31So, there is no step back from either
00:23:34side. Now, today, we learned that the election for deputy mayor
00:23:38in the Islands will be canceled, or rather,
00:23:41renewed. So, inevitably, it comes to mind,
00:23:45is it going, is the Islands municipality also
00:23:48in the pot? Because there is a political
00:23:51storm that started with "shake up the municipalities." Ali Bey,
00:23:55you were there during the Islands elections, what happened there?
00:23:58Today I was on the Island,
00:24:01and today I also visited
00:24:05our resigned Deputy Mayor. They are trying to create
00:24:08a lot of speculation about him. Due to
00:24:12health problems, his sugar level actually
00:24:15rose to 600s, so we wish him well.
00:24:19And he had serious health problems, sugar rises from stress.
00:24:23Does he have stress? Of course, managing
00:24:26cities is not easy. Both urban
00:24:30and urban problems, bureaucratic problems, and political
00:24:33crises. All these events have clearly
00:24:37caused problems in his system. I wish him well
00:24:40again. You said,
00:24:43"Is it aimed at IBB?" Let's look at the Üsküdar issue from there.
00:24:47Now, the mayor is naturally an IBB
00:24:51council member. We see that Ms. Sinem got one
00:24:55vote. Okay. When you elect
00:24:58an AKP member in her place, he will also go to IBB
00:25:02as deputy mayor. That makes two votes
00:25:05for IBB. You also
00:25:09arrested two IBB council members,
00:25:12making it 4 votes. And also,
00:25:16one of the two people who voted for the AKP
00:25:18when it was 21-21 is also an IBB council
00:25:22member. That makes 5 votes in the IBB
00:25:25balance. The calculation is not just Üsküdar.
00:25:28Yes, there is a big calculation regarding Üsküdar. But
00:25:32you said, "Is it aimed at IBB?" This is the calculation. it's that simple.
00:25:36But, uh, let me tell you.
00:25:40Uh, because of that IBB council member, for example,
00:25:43uh, I will object to my teacher Mithat here.
00:25:47You said, teacher, one needs to choose carefully. true, you are
00:25:51very right,
00:25:53but it's 2024, council
00:25:57members, mayors are being determined and each
00:26:00of us, even if you were... we paid attention to merit, as you would there,
00:26:04we looked at their education, we looked at the neighborhood
00:26:07balance, for example, from every neighborhood
00:26:11of Üsküdar, maybe we can't write a council member from every neighborhood, but most neighborhoods
00:26:15need to be represented, it needs to be represented
00:26:18according to the demographic structure of Üsküdar, so you
00:26:21form a council, there should be an architect, maybe an accountant
00:26:24too, by paying attention to such things,
00:26:27and politics also has its own dynamics, we write according to them as much as
00:26:31it allows. "while doing this,
00:26:34for example, our acting mayor of Şile
00:26:37joined AKP, what were we going to do, I mean, Ali Bey,
00:26:41I apologize, I received a warning from my director that we had a problem with your microphone,
00:26:45put a comma, I will continue with my teacher Mithat,
00:26:49I mean, teacher Mithat, now Ali Bey made his introduction, but the political
00:26:52climate we live in, the election of a deputy mayor
00:26:55will be repeated, either by court decision or by your own decision,
00:26:59it is enough to ask what is happening." "I mean, such a
00:27:03political climate, now elections will be renewed in the islands,
00:27:06why? Due to health
00:27:09reasons, a previous court decision had renewed it,
00:27:13the situation is clear, I mean, is this a process
00:27:16you foresee continuing in the medium
00:27:19and long term until the election?
00:27:22I mean, it's probably heading towards a metropolitan municipality, I mean, a,
00:27:25my guess is, uh, 2000 economy
00:27:29the day before yesterday, the candidate responsible for the elections in 2028 said,
00:27:40"if we held elections, it would be considered an early election." However, I don't think the economy will last until a week before the normal election
00:27:44in 2028. In fact, in a previous program, probably Ebru Baki's program,
00:27:47I had said that I,
00:27:51I mean, this was
00:27:55in April-May, I said that there could even be a snap election
00:27:57around October-November, this October-November.
00:28:01But it didn't happen, I mean, we were wrong there, there was no snap election.
00:28:04My argument was this:
00:28:08President Trump of the United States, in his perspectives
00:28:12on the region, would prefer to continue
00:28:15with Tayyip Erdoğan, or in his imaginations
00:28:19and certain constructions regarding Turkey and the region,
00:28:22he would prefer the Justice and Development Party and its leader to remain in power.
00:28:25Therefore, in November, probably due to the partial midterm elections
00:28:29of the Senate, he would lose the elections.
00:28:32I was saying that there could be a snap election before Trump declines
00:28:36and before the economy worsens. Now that it hasn't happened,
00:28:39according to my prediction, the economy will not be able to handle this
00:28:42until 2028 at such a
00:28:45level, so it could happen in 2027.
00:28:49Now, let's say it's 2027, in October of 2027,
00:28:52in these times next year, in October or November, during that process,
00:28:56the Justice and Development Party
00:28:59will think of appointing its own mayor
00:29:03or deputy mayor and proceeding
00:29:05according to those coordinates,
00:29:08and that it has made plans for this, I'm thinking this to myself,
00:29:12it might be true or not, but the trend
00:29:15shows that if you win 26 districts out of 39 districts
00:29:19of Istanbul after many years, and lose 16
00:29:22districts, and all of this happens
00:29:25with court decisions, then the trend shows that this is heading towards a metropolitan
00:29:29municipality. So here, we must also say that
00:29:32actually, sometimes, of course, we need to refer
00:29:35to certain references of political science. This
00:29:39is a very important thing in Jürgen Habermas's distinction between legality
00:29:43and legitimacy, as I always say. If you try to manage
00:29:46political dynamics solely with court decisions,
00:29:50abandoning consensus and consent,
00:29:53then that place is not governed by the consent of the people,
00:29:56it becomes a republic of judges,
00:29:59and actually turns into a rule of the minority.
00:30:02It's as if he's describing today's Turkey. You get a court decision
00:30:06from everywhere, is it legal? Since there are courts, it's legal,
00:30:09but is it legitimate? It's not legitimate.
00:30:13For it to be legitimate, I, Uğur Abi, Ali Gökçek,
00:30:17all the cameramen here, everyone needs to internalize it.
00:30:19If there's a problem with internalization,
00:30:23then there's a legitimacy problem.
00:30:26Okay, one more thing, one more sentence I want to say,
00:30:29now Ali Bey, I'm saying this so he can continue, here, of course. What
00:30:32I want to say is not only for Üsküdar,
00:30:36I mean, you see, someone from Keçiören comes out at night,
00:30:39the general chairman sends messages, gives negative answers,
00:30:43uh, I don't know, someone from Afyon goes to the other side,
00:30:46Aydın does that, I mean, I could list many more things, but
00:30:50I don't want to waste time, I mean, therefore, something here
00:30:53was rushed, or certain circles within the party,
00:30:57certain individuals presented different candidates,
00:31:01there isn't such a homogeneous
00:31:03careful selection process, but it's not the end of the world, this should be a
00:31:07lesson. Personally, if I were in this situation, I would say,
00:31:11"yes, I will do it differently next time" instead of objecting. That's what I would do.
00:31:15Ali Bey, you were left, please. I will give an example, teacher.
00:31:18A thief broke into our house yesterday, teacher. He entered at night, and I had locked the door from below.
00:31:22Today, when I told you, you said, "Ali, you also needed to lock it from above."
00:31:26And I say, "Teacher, isn't the thief at fault at all?" You say, "Ali, you should have locked it from above.
00:31:30Did you also close the window, Ali? Did you inform security, Ali?"
00:31:33So, Mrs. Özdem, Aydın
00:31:37served as our member of parliament for many terms, and as our mayor.
00:31:41The deputy group leader of Afyon
00:31:45has done this. Look,
00:31:48this year, this term is my first term. I went to parliament.
00:31:51No matter how much politics you do as a newly elected MP,
00:31:55there is a different bureaucracy and diplomacy there.
00:31:59There are things you need to learn. Who do you follow?
00:32:02Your group deputy chairmen sit in front, right? You follow your group deputy chairmen.
00:32:06They intervene where and when, they are in charge of internal affairs. How
00:32:09do they act? When I went to parliament,
00:32:13Ms. Burcu was my group deputy chair. Of course, she was the person
00:32:17I tried to learn from about how parliament works in the weeks when it was her turn
00:32:21to be group deputy chair. She joined the AKP.
00:32:24Now, how should we
00:32:26filter these people, considering
00:32:30that there were 4 rounds of voting, and in the first
00:32:33round, two votes didn't come out, one vote went to AKP.
00:32:36So we came out not 21-21,
00:32:39but 22-19. We came out
00:32:42as 22-20, I apologize. And it's clear who it was,
00:32:46our friend is clear, I mean,
00:32:49I went to our group room, I'm drinking
00:32:52tea, meanwhile, we go inside again, we talk to our friends,
00:32:55those who voted come, I saw Onur Bey's
00:32:59state, I felt sad, I was truly
00:33:03sad, and I thought something bad would happen to him,
00:33:06I really thought he would have a heart attack regarding his health, God forbid something would happen,
00:33:10I told him this, Onur, I said, I don't know what
00:33:13you're going through, I don't know
00:33:17what choice you made between what, brother,
00:33:20I said, but you need to sit down and catch your breath,
00:33:23I'm afraid something will happen to you, I said. Today, he
00:33:26can explain it there, or he can remain
00:33:30silent, but no one does this
00:33:34like Tahsin Bey, Tahsin Bey says, "we passed, nothing happened,"
00:33:38there are friends who do this without being able to digest it.
00:33:42I am sad, but these people don't just
00:33:45move happily with incentives,
00:33:48I mean, when you see that mood,
00:33:51everyone expects a character, a stance, but I also felt sad for the person
00:33:55I saw in front of me, frankly, maybe I will get a reaction from our
00:33:58voters, "why are you softening things, or
00:34:02why are you trying to empathize, they need to stand
00:34:05firm, they need to protect the will of the nation."
00:34:09I agree with all of it, but I saw a person who was withered,
00:34:12whose will was gone. I am also concerned with how he was brought to that state.
00:34:28I cannot empathize. I agree with my esteemed professor in this respect, in 2014,
00:34:32my children passed the entrance exams for good schools
00:34:35for their high school education, we went to İzmir for a temporary period,
00:34:39so they could study in a beautiful city,
00:34:42in a social way, in the midst of
00:34:45a lifestyle where they could
00:34:49comfortably and easily travel without losing time in traffic.
00:34:52We went to İzmir so they could study.
00:34:56Immediately, a rumor was spread, "Uğur Dündar came here
00:34:59to design the Republican People's Party." I have never had any involvement
00:35:03with active politics
00:35:06throughout my life. I don't
00:35:09have such an intention. No matter how much
00:35:12I said, I couldn't convince
00:35:15them. In the end, my children finished their education, we came
00:35:19here, they studied abroad, they returned. I'll get to the point,
00:35:22the Foça Mayor, who was nominated
00:35:25by those who said "Uğur Dündar came to İzmir
00:35:28to design the CHP," joined the Justice and Development Party
00:35:32in the district where the Justice
00:35:35and Development Party did not participate in the election.
00:35:38Of course, of course.
00:35:42Professor, please. Finally, let me say this.
00:35:45Uğur Bey told a very nice story about Sinem Hanım. I went to Beykoz
00:35:49to see what kind of interest and attention
00:35:52there was. Now, all those friends
00:35:55who showed that interest to Sinem Hanım
00:35:58are completely (I'll say it in quotation marks)
00:36:02cursed in society. Those people can no longer
00:36:06walk in society because Sinem Hanım,
00:36:09those who showed those reactions, those who showed that interest,
00:36:13will now show different reactions to these friends.
00:36:16Those who do this work must take this into account,
00:36:20especially to young friends, I say this even more.
00:36:23It's not like I'll finish this term and close it.
00:36:27I'm asking through the islands, I mean, we've seen this movie before,
00:36:31we saw it in Üsküdar, we saw it in Bayrampaşa, we saw it in Menemen,
00:36:34we saw it everywhere, we are experienced. Now, if a deputy mayoral election
00:36:37is to be repeated in the Islands, the incident
00:36:40that happened yesterday or in Menemen comes to my mind. Could there
00:36:44be transfers, and, uh, like in movies,
00:36:48stealing members, hotels, security and so on?
00:36:51It's very new, so, uh, if I say something
00:36:55about it now, we would be looking at it the same way from all sides.
00:36:58Then what we experienced in Üsküdar would seem abstract.
00:37:01What we experienced in Üsküdar was very real. If we experience it in the Islands, we will describe
00:37:04it with the same reality, but for now, I have contacted
00:37:08our council members, there is no problem with them,
00:37:12we are standing where we are,
00:37:14it was just necessary to make a decision due to a health problem.
00:37:18Now a new friend, I wish Turkey wasn't in this situation
00:37:22so we wouldn't have to think that someone leaving due to health
00:37:26problems, saying "I can't perform my duty well, someone better should take over,"
00:37:30is an excuse. But you are right,
00:37:33uh, but I talked to our council members there,
00:37:36there's nothing like that. I want to say something, so, of course,
00:37:40one should not act on an individual basis, because as
00:37:44I speak, Ali Gökçek, uh, as a Member of Parliament
00:37:47of the New Party, will inevitably be in a defensive
00:37:50position. But what I'm saying is not really a criticism
00:37:54of a party; it could be another party tomorrow.
00:37:57What I'm saying is something else. For example, Uğur Abi said:
00:38:01The Justice and Development Party did not participate in the election
00:38:04in Foça. The elected Mayor in a place where they did not participate
00:38:07in the election says, "You didn't participate, but I will honor you and
00:38:11crown you, I will join the AKP." The former mayor,
00:38:14who was a town mayor, Öz abi, is protesting him.
00:38:18For example, sevgili Ali Gökçek mentioned Beykoz. As far
00:38:22as I know, it's not Beykoz. Who brought him, why did they bring him?
00:38:25Alaattin Köseler was arrested, he was elected.
00:38:28"He was elected on Monday, and on Thursday he says he's joining the AKP, almost.
00:38:32Can such a thing happen? Now, okay, there might be some rotten
00:38:36apples, but what I wanted to say here was something else, but there's no
00:38:39time. I mean, the time is running out.
00:38:43The law on political parties needs to change, mayor, member of parliament,
00:38:46the members should elect this. I mean, they should have a responsibility
00:38:50towards the society that elects them, so that they would be ashamed.
00:38:54As long as they don't elect these, they say, "the general chairman and friends elected me."
00:38:58When they receive a few harsh messages, they say, "it's done, it's over."
00:39:01When someone sees them in the market and says, "aren't you ashamed?",
00:39:05they say, "did you elect me? Did you put me there?"
00:39:09We need to get rid of this. Let the members elect their own,
00:39:12let them elect the mayoral candidates, if it becomes vacant somehow, let the people elect again, we are saying this too,
00:39:16hah, I mean, this is here,
00:39:19here, the real will of the people is not just
00:39:22in the ballot box every 5 years, but also
00:39:26in some elections before the ballot box.
00:39:33We say we will choose all our members, yes, that's what
00:39:37I'm trying to say. Well, now, yesterday, a notification
00:39:40went from the Chief Public Prosecutor's Office of the Court of Cassation to the New Party,
00:39:43saying that the name of the New Party is very likely
00:39:46to be confused with the Yenilik Party, citing this as a reason,
00:39:50demanding an urgent change and stating that this name cannot
00:39:53Party's Central Executive Board met, and until
00:40:00September, the Chief Public Prosecutor's Office of the Court of Cassation needs
00:40:04to send a letter. Ultimately, Mr. Dündar also has such
00:40:08a blockade, I mean, front after front,
00:40:12the inability to use his name, the need to make such a change again,
00:40:15could it be made into an obligation to make a modification?
00:40:19On the one hand, spreading it out over time,
00:40:23spreading it out over a certain schedule, and if there's a snap election
00:40:26during that time, the new party cannot enter the election.
00:40:30Such advanced questions are coming, I haven't
00:40:33talked to anyone, but, uh, I think
00:40:37the new party has plans
00:40:38like a, b, c, d, e
00:40:41for all possibilities. They have made all their preparations.
00:40:44Moreover, it is natural for the Court of Cassation to make
00:40:48this notification, it is a duty they must perform.
00:40:51However, when you look at their logos, it becomes clear
00:40:55that the logos do not express any resemblance.
00:40:58There are many political parties whose name is justice,
00:41:01or starts with justice, there are a few political
00:41:05parties that start with republic.
00:41:07There are some political parties that start with republic.
00:41:11Therefore, while such a decision has not been made for them,
00:41:14it is also natural for us to expect the Constitutional
00:41:18Court to make an assessment by looking at the logos
00:41:21and, seeing the difference, to issue a decision in favor
00:41:25of the new party. What do you say, Ali Gökçek? Now,
00:41:28at the MYK meeting, it was decided to wait for the Constitutional Court's decision,
00:41:32a name change was not considered, but the fact
00:41:35that everything has a reason, that nothing in politics is coincidental,
00:41:38the fact that every step taken
00:41:42is actually the infrastructure of the next step,
00:41:46I mean, we've experienced so many things in the last year and a half,
00:41:50where we said, "ah, this was because of that, this was because of that,"
00:41:53and then witnessed many developments. The annulment decision
00:41:57is the most concrete one, the trustee decision that came to Istanbul,
00:42:01to the provincial chairmanship, is the most concrete one. Therefore,
00:42:05it seems that a state of siege continues.
00:42:08Meanwhile, I agree with what my teacher Uğur said.
00:42:18there is a decision to withdraw, Müslüm Sarı announced yesterday,
00:42:22what is happening? It seems there will be legal
00:42:24stages again. First, if we come
00:42:28to the name issue, as Uğur Bey
00:42:30also mentioned, the Constitutional Court will make a decision,
00:42:34but when the Constitutional Court examines this, it doesn't just
00:42:37examine whether the names "Yeni Parti" and "Yenilik Partisi"
00:42:41are similar, while making this examination,
00:42:45it looks at the logo, it looks at the nickname,
00:42:48it looks at the abbreviation, moreover, it looks at whether
00:42:52the political conjuncture it evokes corresponds to the same place,
00:42:55that is, whether it makes the same connotations. In the end, it examines
00:42:59whether it can be confused when voting.
00:43:02It does not only examine similarity
00:43:05based on names. It will do this,
00:43:08uh, we will continue to use it,
00:43:11we think that the Constitutional Court will make a decision
00:43:15in our favor here.
00:43:17Let's say it doesn't, uh, today I read such
00:43:20beautiful tweets, such beautiful
00:43:24things when this conversation came up on the street,
00:43:27"you can call it whatever you want, brother, we are following your path,
00:43:31we will give way to wherever you go, we will vote for you,"
00:43:34people say, "we will be with you."
00:43:38The people already gave this name. "If you change the name given by the people,
00:43:41the people will give a new name and support that name.
00:43:45This is not a matter that is currently
00:43:49on our agenda, frankly, uh, and they must
00:43:52withdraw their appeal. Why? Because
00:43:56it's actually connected to the Üsküdar issue.
00:44:00It had nothing to do with it, but how is it connected?
00:44:03A decision was made there, an annulment.
00:44:07It is one of the most wrong legal decisions made in Turkey."
00:44:10It's a bold statement, but it's really like that, because there is no precedent for this
00:44:13decision. This decision was made for the first time in the history of the republic
00:44:17regarding a political party, and since it was not
00:44:21in the political parties law, they couldn't find a reason there,
00:44:25so they went to civil law and gave an annulment
00:44:27decision with forced reasons.
00:44:31For this to be approved by the Court of Cassation
00:44:34means that the friend who walked around
00:44:37every street in Üsküdar saying "hello, we are here now, we are neighbors"
00:44:41will not be able to sit there, because
00:44:44it will set a precedent. It will set a precedent.
00:44:47If the Court of Cassation approves this decision,
00:44:51and they withdraw their appeal, if we withdraw our internal appeal
00:44:54tomorrow, the Court of Cassation must discuss this issue.
00:44:57The Court of Cassation must discuss this issue and eliminate
00:45:01this legal absurdity, because if it does not,
00:45:03then no election in Turkey, neither a society election
00:45:07nor a general election, can be finalized. Definitely.
00:45:18Did he take this step, this legal step, for that? He took it to remove this decision from the Court of Cassation. Everyone knows that it has to be overturned.
00:45:20From the moment the Court of Cassation made this decision,
00:45:24there was no longer a Supreme Election Board.
00:45:28A court can make a wrong
00:45:30decision, that's why there are
00:45:33higher courts, there is appeal,
00:45:37there is the Constitutional Court and so on.
00:45:40It can make a decision, but if the Court of Cassation
00:45:43approves this decision, then no election
00:45:47in Turkey can be finalized after this decision. You can also go and apply for an election from 10 years ago,
00:45:50you can also apply for an election from 4 years ago, it won't happen because it can't be finalized.
00:45:54Moreover, after you approve this,
00:45:57after Tahsim Bey's statement in Üsküdar,
00:46:01there should already be an annulment there. What is an annulment?
00:46:04"That election should be cancelled.
00:46:07If we say the election is void,
00:46:11then Ms. Hanım and Sibel Çetinkaya should also
00:46:14go and sit in the Üsküdar deputy mayorship again.
00:46:17If you ask me, the annulment decision that should be taken
00:46:21is for Sinem Hanım to come and sit there. Let's say it's for the last election,
00:46:24this needs to be removed after Tahsim Bey's statement.
00:46:28That's why they wanted to avoid
00:46:31this decision from the Court of Cassation, but
00:46:35I repeat, not the republic.
00:46:39For all
00:46:52previous and future elections from today,
00:46:55this legal absurdity must be discussed and removed.
00:46:59The CHP spokesperson, Müslüm Sarık, says, "uh, my esteemed teachers,
00:47:03we are withdrawing this lawsuit, that is,
00:47:06we are waiving it, in order to initiate
00:47:10the congress process." But they were saying, "there's a precautionary measure, there's a file
00:47:14in the Court of Cassation, so we can't hold a congress," right? So they say, "we took this step to start that calendar
00:47:18as soon as possible." Uh, but in the corridors
00:47:21also...
00:47:27said that this decision was about to come out. He tweeted about it the other day from his X
00:47:30account. The President said the same thing.
00:47:33I said
00:47:36there is a similarity. Uğur Bey took
00:47:39a deep breath. When you said the sentence,
00:47:43Kemal Kılıçdaroğlu said, "I am
00:47:46not in the annulment at all."
00:47:48To me, he is in every part of it.
00:47:52This is my personal opinion. Without
00:47:56his consent, no one, I mean, as I said,
00:47:59no step in politics can be considered accidental.
00:48:02Now, on Sunday, I was here on the main news. Şamil Bey tweeted
00:48:06on Saturday evening, "I met with my high-level judicial
00:48:09friends, the decision is ready. The absolute annulment decision
00:48:13will come from the Court of Cassation at the beginning of October or November."
00:48:17Let's say Kemal Bey is right, he is not involved
00:48:20in any part of the annulment application, but during
00:48:24that process, he could have made statements
00:48:28that clarified the public, answered the questions in the public's
00:48:31mind, and stated that he had no part
00:48:35in it. Kemal Bey always remained silent. Kemal Bey's
00:48:38silence is, in a way,
00:48:41an admission. Kemal Bey was
00:48:44in every part of the annulment lawsuit, nine
00:48:48members of parliament were expelled without a party council decision.
00:48:52"Someone who says 'I have no part in the annulment' and takes over the leadership of the party
00:48:55does not expel members of parliament, is that possible?
00:48:59Our provincial chairmen were expelled, our district chairmen were expelled.
00:49:03Mr. Gökçek, many things we said wouldn't happen
00:49:06are happening, many things we said wouldn't happen
00:49:09are happening, that's enough, so I agree with you.
00:49:13We were talking about it in the programs
00:49:16back then, the Republican People's Party had two congresses back to back,
00:49:20three meetings, 6 years, 6 years to close the congress."
00:49:29What will happen if it is closed? We were talking about what will happen. Now, there, in a hurry, this schedule and this legal
00:49:33Looking at the congestion, a new party
00:49:36was established. Now, those who left at that time left, so
00:49:40we will withdraw it now. When we withdraw it, what will happen absolutely? They will hold their own congress
00:49:43without waiting for the Supreme Court's decision, and they say the party is ours.
00:49:46So, the development is exactly like that. If,
00:49:50well.
00:49:52If the Supreme Court had decided at that time, saying "no, this decision
00:49:56is wrong," no one would have probably left the party. They would have gone to the
00:49:59congress again. That is,
00:50:02the historical course of this party would have been different. We also know
00:50:06that a file in this case has been pending in the Supreme Court for years, but since this is a decision
00:50:10that can affect Turkish politics and legal history so much,
00:50:13the Supreme Court should finalize the file as soon as possible.
00:50:17I agree. The Supreme Court will definitely evaluate this
00:50:20and act according to the rule of law.
00:50:29When we said, "Let's hold a general assembly," they said, "There is a court decision, we can't," and then we went with the proposal
00:50:32that both sides withdraw their appeal applications. We'll withdraw ours, you withdraw yours. But now
00:50:36they've withdrawn them, and when we said, "Let the decision be finalized, you can go to the general assembly now,"
00:50:40those who said they couldn't withdraw the appeal application
00:50:44today filed an appeal. We have completed the first
00:50:47hour. We will be back in 10 minutes for the second
00:50:50hour.
00:51:01Turkey's energy fortress.
00:51:04Orbus.
00:51:12Even if time passes, gold always retains its value at Koçak,
00:51:15because gold carries not only today
00:51:19but also tomorrow. Koçak. Dad, give me my allowance,
00:51:23please.
00:51:24Dad, welcome
00:51:27to Matiye. Your money is being prepared. Dad,
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00:57:49Those who understand when they become a mother, those who understand
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01:00:13Orbus.
01:00:23We are starting the second hour without censorship, and as of
01:00:26this hour, lawyer Ertun Çözün is also with us. Welcome, Ertun
01:00:29Çözün. Thank you for coming. Now, in the first hour, we discussed
01:00:33the transitions, transfers,
01:00:35operations, investigations in the midst of this political storm,
01:00:39the notification that came through the name of the new party, the new party's
01:00:43decision not to change the name in today's MYK, and
01:00:46the issue of CHP's waiver of its application.
01:00:49But now, citizens are certainly following what's happening,
01:00:52observing, making an interpretation, and
01:00:55public opinion polls share those interpretations with the public
01:00:59every month with their work, the polling firms. Now,
01:01:02Gündem Araştırma is one of the reputable public opinion research
01:01:06firms. We frequently feature Gündem Araştırma's
01:01:09research results. They shared a striking
01:01:13survey result for August. As you know, we are in September,
01:01:16and when we look at it comparatively, I'm talking about a research
01:01:20that has striking results that make you wonder what's happening.
01:01:23If there were parliamentary elections this Sunday, who would you vote for? This is
01:01:27a classic public opinion research question,
01:01:30and when we looked at July, we saw the new party's vote share
01:01:34about 12 points higher than the AK Party's,
01:01:3838.58% to 27.43%.
01:01:40The AK Party's vote share was in decline compared
01:01:44to June. We are talking about a rate of 3.77%.
01:01:47We came to this month, or rather, the August
01:01:51survey. It was shared yesterday
01:01:54by the research firm. And this time, we see
01:01:58the AK Party in the first place, and there's an increase
01:02:01of almost 1% in its vote share. When we look at the past month,
01:02:05there is a decrease of approximately 12 points in the New Party.
01:02:08Here, some parties are also showing movement. Like the Party
01:02:12of 8.21, there is an increase of 3.65%
01:02:14compared to a month ago. There is an increase in the votes of the DEM Party,
01:02:18there is an increase in the votes of the MHP, but the CHP's votes
01:02:22are still below 5%, that is, below the threshold.
01:02:25If there were an election this Sunday. Now, Tamer Bolat,
01:02:29the director of the public opinion
01:02:32a significant figure, shares this
01:02:35about these breakdowns: He says that in July,
01:02:39they measured the new party as the first party. This rate
01:02:43was quite important not only because it showed
01:02:46the initial interest in a newly established party, but also
01:02:50because it showed the extent of the voters' search for a new political address.
01:02:53That's right, we had already discussed this in this way.
01:02:57A strong start does not mean that a strong
01:03:00political position is permanent. He says that in our August
01:03:04research, we will see how the voting on the framework law on August 10th,
01:03:07where Özel and the party leadership said yes,
01:03:10but the majority of the deputies voted no,
01:03:14and the attitude that emerged and was called 'have et' in public
01:03:17opinion, affected this strong start that was formed
01:03:21with the establishment of the new party. And today, this situation that has emerged,
01:03:24that is, a 12% decrease in the party's votes,
01:03:27is attributed to the 'have et' attitude by Tamer Bolat.
01:03:31That's what we understand. This seems like a very radical difference. One or two
01:03:35points, 3 points, are understandable in these surveys,
01:03:38but you have been following many firms for years,
01:03:42I know. How would you evaluate this 12-point difference? Now, the research
01:03:45company you mentioned is a reputable institution.
01:03:49I find its results very important,
01:03:52I value them. There are a few others like it,
01:03:56but in the meantime, I think it's useful
01:03:59for our viewers, readers, and followers
01:04:03to know that there are some research companies that exist solely
01:04:06for manipulation and will disappear
01:04:10after the elections, and that their purpose, I repeat,
01:04:13is manipulation. Now, if you notice,
01:04:17there is no significant change in the votes of the Justice
01:04:20and Development Party. Yes, on the other hand,
01:04:23the fact that Chairman Özgür Özel
01:04:26said yes in the "Turkey Without Terror"
01:04:31vote, but gave his deputies freedom to vote no,
01:04:35was not evaluated by the public
01:04:39as they had hoped, and we see
01:04:42that a certain amount of votes
01:04:46shifted as a reaction. In this,
01:04:49the rise of the Good Party
01:04:53is noteworthy. If you notice,
01:04:57the Good Party has suddenly
01:05:00risen from 4.56% to 8.21%.
01:05:03This is a very striking and radical
01:05:06rise. The same goes for the Victory Party.
01:05:10However, I consider this to be
01:05:12a conjunctural preference.
01:05:16As long as Özgür Özel and the New Party members
01:05:19share enlightening information
01:05:22with the public on this issue
01:05:26and explain their intentions, the July results, my esteemed colleague?
01:05:29I consider these to be to its former state,
01:05:32because we see that the issues
01:05:35that influenced the public when saying no to the ruling
01:05:38party have not changed at all.
01:05:41The economy is directly
01:05:45the economy. Now, when you
01:05:48started the program, you said
01:05:52that a liter of gasoline has almost reached
01:05:54100 liras. Yes, that means
01:05:58we will now be using
01:06:00three-digit numbers. And in such
01:06:03an economy, even if Mr. Mehmet
01:06:06Şimşek were a magician,
01:06:10the things he could do would be very limited,
01:06:13because the increase in fuel prices affects
01:06:17the entire economic
01:06:18circulation. For our society,
01:06:21which has developed
01:06:23based on road
01:06:25transportation, it will surely
01:06:29affect the entire domestic market, from A to Z.
01:06:32The increase in fuel prices affects everything from A to Z,
01:06:36Ms. Sinem. The other day, I was
01:06:40returning from the Gırgıriye musical tour in Ankara.
01:06:42It was 2 o'clock in the morning.
01:06:45Professor, we entered the Marmara, North Marmara highway,
01:06:48and suddenly I felt like I was in
01:06:52Istanbul's daytime traffic. Trucks were passing on the right,
01:06:55trucks were passing on the left, and we were going.
01:06:59"Slowly, almost in first gear,
01:07:02at 2 o'clock in the morning.
01:07:06Such road transportation. Therefore,
01:07:09I don't think the economy
01:07:12can recover.
01:07:15No matter how hard Mr. Mehmet Şimşek tries,
01:07:19bless him, let's admit that
01:07:22or give him credit, he tries very hard, but
01:07:26as I said, it's not possible to fix it
01:07:28under these circumstances. They can't cut public spending, but Uğur abi
01:07:32can't do anything, it seems. It seems he can't get through to some places.
01:07:36Yes, it seems he doesn't have a say in some places. We also see
01:07:39that in the headlines of some newspapers
01:07:42referred to as pro-government, don't we, Professor? Of course, we see it.
01:07:46Mr. Mehmet Şimşek was criticized by
01:07:49Mehmet Bey, that is, he
01:07:53is an economist known for enriching the rich. In periods of inflation,
01:07:56this is an inevitable result. The rich get richer,
01:07:59the poor get poorer. If there are 19,865
01:08:03official public vehicles in a country like Germany,
01:08:06but only 12,000 here, you should sit down and think.
01:08:09This won't get better easily, unfortunately not.
01:08:12Of course, of course. Had you completed
01:08:16kolay kolay maalesef düzelmez tabii tabii ya şimdi bu temmuz sonuçları
01:08:20conjunctural, because
01:08:23I believe that there has been no change in the factors
01:08:26and facts that would affect the voter's preference,
01:08:29and on the contrary, the economy
01:08:33has developed against it.
01:08:36That is, there is no dynamic that would cause
01:08:39the vote to increase? "Yes,
01:08:42the economy is still strong despite this turbulence,
01:08:46despite the extraordinary rise
01:08:49in oil prices caused by
01:08:52our friend Trump's war with Iran.
01:08:55The economy did not suffer
01:08:58so many
01:09:00severe
01:09:03wounds. Mr. Dünder made a very accurate reading. That is,
01:09:06there is no dynamic that would cause
01:09:10the AK Party's vote to go up."
01:09:13But there is a slight increase. The significant decrease
01:09:17is seen in the votes of the new party according to Gündem Araştırma,
01:09:21and Tamer Bolat says that the public opinion poll
01:09:24conducted in the first month would reveal whether it was
01:09:28a result of the excitement for a new party, or people looking for an alternative.
01:09:31And indeed, it seems it has. He has such an interpretation.
01:09:34How would you evaluate this, Mr. Gökçek?
01:09:38Well, based on this analysis,
01:09:41if we say that our chairman and
01:09:44his administration saying yes to the framework law,
01:09:48and some deputies saying no, and receiving a backlash for it
01:09:51is invalid,
01:09:53then we would be disrespecting
01:09:56the positive and negative reactions we received
01:10:00from our surroundings, from society, and
01:10:03from our party members, as well as
01:10:06the sensitivities of the entire society.
01:10:09Yes, we also received reactions on this issue,
01:10:12that's true. I even agree
01:10:15with the assessment that a new party
01:10:18was founded, there's new excitement,
01:10:21and it's also true that the vote share in the polls
01:10:25is higher than expected.
01:10:28This will settle down with time, then it might
01:10:31rise again, or maybe fall again, but
01:10:35the new party gave its first test
01:10:38on a very serious issue for Turkey.
01:10:41And as soon as it was founded, it gave a test
01:10:44on Turkey's 50-year-old problem. Here,
01:10:47our Chairman, while saying yes,
01:10:51explained in his speech that perhaps
01:10:54we are the ones who deserve to say no the most,
01:10:57but why we are saying yes. Of course, this might
01:11:01not have fully resonated with the public.
01:11:04Here, everyone might have made an initial
01:11:08emotional decision by seeing that the Republican People's
01:11:12Party said yes, or that some deputies of the Republican
01:11:15People's Party said no. However, I think
01:11:19that when this is correctly explained
01:11:22to the public, the public will clearly
01:11:26understand why the Republican People's Party
01:11:29made such a decision. Because,
01:11:32we are still establishing our districts, we are going
01:11:36to our district presidencies, we are still
01:11:39conducting field visits. For example,
01:11:42we said we would be in 81 provinces with all our deputies.
01:11:45Tomorrow, I am going to Ağrı with our Istanbul deputy
01:11:48Türkan Elçi. In Ağrı,
01:11:52I am sure I will meet citizens
01:11:55who ask "why did you say yes?", and citizens
01:11:59who ask "why did some deputies say no?".
01:12:02I believe we can explain very clearly
01:12:06to both groups of citizens why we said yes and why we said no.
01:12:09And I think that when we explain it, it will yield results. That's why we
01:12:13are doing these field visits. People might say, based on a single
01:12:16sentence they read, that Özgür Özel said yes, for example,
01:12:20the new chairman said yes, Ozan Hovra all said yes,
01:12:24and the deputies said no. I think we will break this down.
01:12:27Still, saying all of this from the start,
01:12:30being able to measure a loss of nearly 12%
01:12:33for the new party is really
01:12:36interesting to me. I'm not saying there was manipulation,
01:12:39but there's a margin of error
01:12:43in every poll. I think the margin
01:12:46of error is high here. Also, some
01:12:49citizens confuse the Republican People's Party with the new party. I believe
01:12:53that as a habit, they answer
01:12:56"Republican People's Party." Now, but if
01:13:00the pollster insists and says,
01:13:03"They separated, Özgür Özel founded the new party,
01:13:06and the Republican People's Party remained with Kemal Kılıçdaroğlu,"
01:13:10then they say, "Oh, okay." Something also caught my attention
01:13:13on social media. Sometimes I see street interviews where
01:13:17they ask, "If there were an election this Sunday, who would you vote for?" There is a significant number
01:13:20of citizens who say Özgür Özel.
01:13:23yurttaş kitlesi de.
01:13:35is not there. If we look at the August poll, not July, something
01:13:39else emerges. Now, the AKP and
01:13:42MHP, who introduced this bill,
01:13:45will have increased their votes.
01:13:47It's normal for the DEM Party to increase its votes,
01:13:50perhaps there are DEM Party members who didn't think this process
01:13:54could be resolved. When it came to a solution point, they said yes,
01:13:58they supported it again. But the MHP base will do this.
01:14:01Moreover, let me say something else, ultimately, the base of the New Party
01:14:04and the base of the Republican People's Party
01:14:08are the same people. When we look at it,
01:14:11they just formed the new party by separating
01:14:15a month ago, and many people
01:14:18who were Republican People's Party members joined the new party
01:14:22in different segments. So,
01:14:25it's a bit interesting that the Republican People's Party
01:14:29also increased its votes by 2%. Let's say the AKP and
01:14:32MHP were leading this, and people were with something
01:14:36different, tamam. And while the new party
01:14:39and the Republican People's Party's bases think almost
01:14:42the same, let's say,
01:14:46while they are so intertwined,
01:14:49there's a 12% loss there, and 5% here.
01:14:52And he's talking about 5 out of 2%.
01:15:25the halls are not full, and it's clear from the reaction
01:15:28on the street that we, the public opinion pollsters
01:15:31and journalists, are responsible for reflecting the voice
01:15:34of the public. When we take that picture,
01:15:38we don't encounter such a reality on the street.
01:15:41And actually, the Republican
01:15:44People's Party seems to have
01:15:49shown a 100% increase in its own votes, considering July,
01:15:53and the new party's vote loss is 30%.
01:15:58Because, as Uğur Bey said, there are still people who see
01:16:02the Republican People's Party with Mr. Özgür Özel, or who continue their habits.
01:16:05Indeed, Mr. Ali just started with "Republican People's Party, Republican People's Party."
01:16:08But it does have some effect.
01:16:11For example, if you say that all of the Republican
01:16:14People's Party's 4.999 votes were given incorrectly
01:16:18and you add them, then the decrease goes down to
01:16:217.5-8%, so there's a significant drop.
01:16:25Even if you think they all voted incorrectly, which is not the case, Professor. The issue of
01:16:28Turkey without terror seriously affected it.
01:16:32Before I came here today, I spoke with some Republican
01:16:36People's Party members, and they also
01:16:41evaluate it this way. Of course, it's true that it's conjunctural.
01:16:45For example, I spoke with the owners of a couple of polling
01:16:48companies. In some polls, the Good Party
01:16:52appears at 8.21, some show 9.16.
01:16:55Some even show 13.2. That is,
01:16:58these kind of deviations happen in polls,
01:17:01of course, but For example, if we
01:17:04take this as a reference, that is, if we take this table as a basis, it seems that the Justice and
01:17:08Development Party has reached a saturation point, as they say, a satisfaction point.
01:17:11It is at a saturation point,
01:17:14meaning it is not rising, it is not 32 33. Now,
01:17:18as you said, the votes of the
01:17:21İYİ Party, the new party, are at play. Now, the votes of the new party.
01:17:25Now, Turkey without terror, I completely agree, framework law and so on,
01:17:28but I think here, rather than saying
01:17:32"yes" to the framework law, "I say yes and
01:17:35release my friends," uh,
01:17:38such a... because this is not about Turkey.
01:17:42I mean, this was discussed. If the voters are following this as carefully
01:17:45as we are, there hasn't been a terror incident in Turkey
01:17:49for a long time. I mean, as it is told, this is actually
01:17:53with the emergence of the American Ambassador,
01:17:57uh, in the region, that is, with the drawing of a
01:18:00perspective that will cover the region, in other
01:18:03words, Turkey will not only maintain peace domestically, but also
01:18:07a hegemonic structure in Syria, and a hegemonic structure
01:18:10in Iran, and it is claimed that as a country that has solved this problem
01:18:14in the region, it is claimed that as a country that has solved this problem,
01:18:17it will, uh, solve its problems in the region,
01:18:21it will be a locomotive country. I will
01:18:23not think so, but it is claimed. Now, the voter
01:18:27looks like this, "this is a very important issue,
01:18:30Iran, Iraq, etc. related to Syria, then the main
01:18:34opposition should have a homogeneous view here,
01:18:38the general chairman thinks differently, party deputies think differently,
01:18:42I think the lack of a homogeneous and compact
01:18:45view of the main opposition, the ruling party candidate, plays a role,
01:18:48teacher, and also the general polarization
01:18:52in every issue, this table shows
01:18:56us its effect, yes. I mean,
01:18:59now, regarding 'Turkey without terror',
01:19:03a part of the citizens
01:19:06wants
01:19:08it to be said no. Yes,
01:19:11they want it to be said no.
01:19:15But when you look at the realities,
01:19:18you see that there are very important
01:19:22issues that require it to be said yes. Therefore,
01:19:24I think that politicians, risking losing
01:19:28votes, must take some
01:19:31steps for the benefit of Turkey. Yes,
01:19:35you are right about the reflections of polarization
01:19:37in voter preference. For example, the AKP
01:19:40has always kept its distance from the process.
01:19:43The AKP kept its distance from the process.
01:19:47There was a political risk taken here, and Mr. Bahçeli, the MHP leader,
01:19:50took it. According to these surveys,
01:19:54there were also drops in the vote share from time to time.
01:19:58The most surprising statements and actions came from Mr. Bahçeli.
01:20:01So what you said is important. Right, right, I
01:20:05agree too, but it was like this:
01:20:08this was not digested
01:20:12slowly, it went very fast,
01:20:16it didn't produce social consent and didn't explain it very well.
01:20:19For example, now, maybe it's not our topic today, but for example,
01:20:23in an interview given by Devlet Bahçeli to a journalist the other day, whose name
01:20:26I don't want to mention again, he said things like "housing is being built."
01:20:30For example, does Mr. President know about that, or was it just said?
01:20:34If it was said without his knowledge? "Actually, does he want to speed
01:20:37up this process and involve Mr. President even more as a catalyst?
01:20:41I mean, Mr. Bahçeli did this from time to time
01:20:44during that process." He made statements
01:20:48that meant "come on." Now,
01:20:51this also, for example, makes people... What are we talking about? We are talking
01:20:54about judicial executions here, aren't we? We are talking about
01:20:58unfair detentions. We are talking about how detention
01:21:02has turned into a punishment. On the other hand,
01:21:06we are talking about what a leader of a terrorist organization
01:21:09will do in his two-story villa. Now, the reasons
01:21:13for those who say no to this, those who say no,
01:21:17are so numerous that I think the failure
01:21:19to explain this well, the failure to produce social consent,
01:21:23is an important parameter. This is a very, very important thing.
01:21:27This needs to be explained. We are talking about Turkey's 40-year painful history.
01:21:31If 40 years have been spent, you will explain this for 40 months.
01:21:34Those under 50 years old don't know the
01:21:37conditions under which terror started and
01:21:41the suffering it caused. But now, my dear Seynem,
01:21:44this is just one dimension. For example, if there is really
01:21:47such a decrease, it varies according to each
01:21:51survey and survey company. I also agree with Uğur Abi that
01:21:54this can be conjunctural. You might see in the next survey what it says.
01:21:58For example, the İyi Party is here. Uh,
01:22:02the new party has 3858 one
01:22:06no, 28, uh,
01:22:08uh, it's written wrong, huh? 2695. 2695.
01:22:11In the next survey, for example, it might come out as 32.43 or 32.45.
01:22:15So it can be conjunctural, but this is just one parameter.
01:22:19For example, I wish
01:22:22that, for example, now Greece came to the island of Meis.
01:22:25I'll be very brief. It's changing another topic. Ankara's research is also
01:22:29there. Yes, for example, Michotakis came to the island of Meis. He's making a show of force
01:22:33there. Turkey wants to take from Dedeağaç to Crete.
01:22:35ağaçtan Girit'e kadar Türkiye.
01:22:39It made it with Israel again, and with Southern Cyprus, etc.,
01:22:42it's like this in the Eastern Mediterranean. Uh, exploration continues
01:22:46in the parcels belonging to Turkey. On the other hand, there is still
01:22:49the 12-mile case. Now, for example, if I were the new party,
01:22:53I would come out and say, "Turkey must immediately take
01:22:57initiative in the islands whose status has not been determined here."
01:23:00Look, for example, on the other hand, what do we expect from Turkey? Of course
01:23:04initiatives.
01:23:07Or what does it mean? We address
01:23:10the government, let's act with integrity until the end.
01:23:13Turkey should immediately start searching for natural gas
01:23:16in its own parcels in the Mediterranean. I personally hope that it will.
01:23:28I mean, I want to say this, without getting off topic,
01:23:32if you are an opposition party, there are many
01:23:35parameters in foreign policy, that's right.
01:23:39Now, do you have anything to add here, Ertunç Özcan, or should I continue with
01:23:43Ankara's? Now, Ankara has done a comprehensive study
01:23:46on the AK Party in the 2023 elections.
01:23:50I will share with you the results of a very comprehensive study
01:23:53on voter behavior and voter reflexes.
01:23:56Let's quickly look at the details. Who would the voters who voted for the AK Party
01:24:00in 2023 choose today? This is one of the August
01:24:042026 surveys. It says that
01:24:0764.9% would still vote for the AK Party.
01:24:11Undecided, protest is 24%.
01:24:14This is important. There is a 10%
01:24:17who say they would switch to other parties, vote for other parties.
01:24:21Now, when you put 24%
01:24:24and 10% side by side, it points to a 35% vote
01:24:28potential. This also brings us to the question of
01:24:32whether that grey area, which would determine the fate of the election
01:24:35if there were an election today, is actually the undecided voters
01:24:39and how they will react at the ballot box. And 10% are asked
01:24:42which parties they would prefer to vote for.
01:24:46That is, among the voters who say they will no longer vote for the AK Party,
01:24:502.7% say new party,
01:24:532% say İyi Party, 1.8% say DEM Party,
01:24:571.4% say MHP, and the rate of those
01:25:00who say key party is 1.1%.
01:25:03CHP, that is, the rate of those who say "my hand will not go to the six arrows"
01:25:06is 0.7%. Therefore,
01:25:09when you sum up this table, the fact that the New Welfare Party
01:25:12is 0.2% is very important.
01:25:15That is, there seems to be no shift to the New Welfare Party
01:25:18within the 10% who have given up. The 2.7% here,
01:25:22and of course, Ertunç Özcan, let's continue with you.
01:25:26We always say, "Will the most decisive voter group
01:25:30in the next election be the undecided,
01:25:34and the voter group that says 'I will no longer vote for my previous party'?"
01:25:38Does the table say this to you again?
01:25:41I mean, 40% of AK Party voters
01:25:44are struggling to consider voting for the AK Party again,
01:25:48even going to different parties.
01:25:5235, yes, 35 have started to consider different parties. Before,
01:25:55we didn't see such detachments of 10-15%
01:25:59from the AK Party. Maybe 1-2,
01:26:02depending on the candidates or the MP lists, there would be changes,
01:26:05but now we are talking about 35%. That is, one
01:26:09out of three AK Party members says, "I don't think I'll vote for the AK Party again,
01:26:12I'm looking for another alternative." And when you look at other surveys,
01:26:16actually, with the new party, there's an increase of 30% in opposition votes.
01:26:20That is, before, it remained at 25%, not exceeding 25%. Now we are talking about
01:26:2330-38%. If I combine this with the previous survey,
01:26:27in the previous survey too, in that one-month period,
01:26:31when we talk as lawyers, what has changed in our country?
01:26:35Have detentions changed? I just looked
01:26:37at what happened legally or politically during those dates.
01:26:41Municipal operations continued, detentions continued.
01:26:44While these are happening, I think the sudden change
01:26:48of 6-7% is just an instantaneous reaction
01:26:52to a framework law. Perhaps in the September-October surveys,
01:26:55it will continue in this 30 and above band.
01:26:59Indeed, we see the same in the AK Party's votes.
01:27:02That is, 2.7% of the 10%
01:27:06can go to the new party, but 2.7%
01:27:10is a very important rate, isn't it? By the way, there is something
01:27:13I forgot to mention about the previous survey, but which I consider very important.
01:27:17Uh, "the AK Party taking
01:27:20municipalities with the methods we just talked about does not
01:27:23turn the ruling party into an attraction
01:27:26area, a center of attraction. On the contrary,
01:27:30it caused its votes, which were above 30%,
01:27:34to fall below 30%. Perhaps
01:27:36the undecided voters within that 24%
01:27:39said, 'This is too much' after the Üsküdar election.
01:27:43That is, even my acquaintances say, 'This is too much.'
01:27:47'Arrest one, transfer one, detain one.'
01:27:51You are also directing the undecided voters towards the other side
01:27:54with your unlawful trials.
01:27:57Besides this, there is an economic reality, an economic reality
01:28:01that is getting worse and worse in this process. These people no longer believe
01:28:05that the AK Party is the one who will change things. They have started to decrease.
01:28:0835% of AK Party members themselves have decreased in this regard.
01:28:12If it continues in this direction, despite this decrease,
01:28:15I think the graph will continue to jump up like this, but I mean."
01:28:18Ali Gökçek, now, this 34%, that is,
01:28:21when we add up the undecided, protest,
01:28:24and voters who switched to other parties, we get a rate of 34%.
01:28:28That is, now the voter says, to 100 AK Party voters,
01:28:3165% say, "I will still go to my political
01:28:35party, and I will vote no matter what the climate is."
01:28:38But 35 people say, out of 100 people, 35 people say, "Wait a minute, I am
01:28:42undecided, I haven't made my decision yet." But when they go to the ballot box,
01:28:46how will they position themselves, how will they react? Will they react with a sense of party affiliation?
01:28:49But 10% also say, "No, my business with the AK Party is over.
01:28:53I will not vote for them again." And we see a 2.7% new party tendency.
01:28:57How will it affect it?
01:29:00I was just about to look on my phone,
01:29:03uh, what was the AK Party's vote share in 2023?
01:29:07What was it in 2023? Yes,
01:29:11what was the AK Party's percentage vote?
01:29:15Wait a minute. 30, 30. 33?
01:29:18Let's take 32.83
01:29:21for easy calculation. 65% of it. Let's make it
01:29:2566%. I mean, like two-thirds.
01:29:28Two-thirds makes 22%. We are talking
01:29:31about the August survey. In the previous August survey,
01:29:35the AK Party was seen as 28%. In the previous company's August survey.
01:29:38That's why there can be changes between these companies
01:29:42and between surveys. Okay, 36, but there is something there,
01:29:45my dear, there are undecided voters. For example, if you consider 24
01:29:4925 or close to 30 of the undecided, and you distribute one-third
01:29:52of the undecided equally, you have to add that
01:29:55too. That is, we cannot distribute it at the same rate
01:29:59just according to the 64 there, but this time, I don't know,
01:30:03but now 24 is not a small number there. If we divide that 24
01:30:07equally among the political parties here, how many are there?
01:30:103, 5, 7, 10. If you add two points each,
01:30:14it makes a distribution close to 5%. Teacher,
01:30:18for the new party. Now, if we come to 2.7% of the new party,
01:30:22this will increase much more,
01:30:25because we are just starting to explain what the new party
01:30:28wants to do in terms of economy, agriculture,
01:30:32health, national education, and foreign
01:30:35policy, what it aims to do. Our congresses
01:30:38are still continuing. After these congresses
01:30:42are settled and our establishment process is fully
01:30:46completed, we will explain what we want to do.
01:30:49Now, in the 2023 elections, I never
01:30:52forget, I always tell the story, I entered a coffee shop
01:30:55during an election visit. It was a place
01:30:59that served as both an association and a coffee shop where people
01:31:02sat. After the election, I said, "Diesel will be 20 lira."
01:31:06An elder said, "If you're going to lie to us,
01:31:10don't even start talking. It won't be 20. Come here and tell us
01:31:14what you will do. Don't come to us with these kinds of things, it won't be 20."
01:31:17Today, diesel is 96
01:31:21lira. That is, think that when
01:31:25I said diesel would be 20 lira,
01:31:28there was a crowd reacting like that.
01:31:31It became 96 lira, and right after the election,
01:31:35it became 20 lira. And when we arrived, seeing
01:31:38this and still only
01:31:4210% of the AK Party voters going to other parties,
01:31:45I think it's a good result for the AK Party.
01:31:49I don't think they can manage
01:31:52it until the election.
01:31:54Furthermore,
01:31:56we can distribute the undecided to a certain extent,
01:32:00but there is no reason for the undecided
01:32:04to lean towards voting for the AK Party again.
01:32:07Oh, wait a minute, let me note this down. Uh, now, under normal circumstances,
01:32:11we conduct a survey, and after asking about each party,
01:32:15undecided voters emerge. We distribute these undecided voters
01:32:18to a certain extent. But we are only asking people
01:32:21who are undecided about voting for the AK Party, among those who voted for the AK Party.
01:32:24So there is no reason for them to lean towards voting for the AK Party
01:32:28again. There is this:
01:32:32if you don't offer an alternative,
01:32:35people might lean towards the AK Party again.
01:32:39And here, we see the effect of the new party being new, of not having been able
01:32:42to fully explain itself to society. As time goes on,
01:32:46there will be shifts from that 24% to 10%,
01:32:49and those shifts to 10% will be for the new party.
01:32:53Mr. Metat, please. So,
01:32:56there is something called voter behavior, which is a separate discipline.
01:33:00People take their associate professorship exams on voter behavior.
01:33:04So this is one of the important things in political sociology.
01:33:06Now, voter behavior... If we are being rude by speaking so grandly,
01:33:10our professors should excuse us. No, not at all. Now,
01:33:13for example, distributing the 24 undecided voters and saying they won't go there
01:33:17is contrary to statistics. That is,
01:33:20if the voters don't find a very strong alternative, they will say,
01:33:24"I won't give up." Just like
01:33:27two-thirds of those who vote for the Justice and Development Party
01:33:30despite diesel being 96 lira.
01:33:35They say, "I'd rather die than give up." Now, if we can't
01:33:39solve this, we will have talked in vain.
01:33:42We need to solve this. Where does it come from? It means we are not
01:33:46explaining something well. "I always dwell on that. We are not explaining something well.
01:33:49That is, even though I teach the whole lesson, if the class average is 32, 38,
01:33:53I don't blame the student, I blame myself.
01:33:56It means I'm not explaining well, I'm doing something wrong, or I'm explaining
01:34:00it incompletely. But, teacher, let's not forget
01:34:03the existence of a significant segment that owes its life
01:34:07and living standards to the Justice and Development Party being in power.
01:34:10And also the expenses
01:34:13to be made during the election period."
01:34:15Of course.
01:34:19The opposition. 4,863,000
01:34:22families receive aid, etc. 4,860,000 families.
01:34:25When you look at it per person, 17,785,000
01:34:29people directly receive aid, money, coal, pasta, bags, whatever.
01:34:33Turkey has 20 million, and there are already 50-55 million voters. You are entering the election
01:34:37with 23% or so. Now, for example,
01:34:40we discuss this on television, don't we? In the media.
01:34:43Okay, not all media is on the side of the opposition,
01:34:47but opposition channels gather a stronger audience
01:34:50than other channels, just like we are gathering tonight. And
01:34:54the İyi Party, for example, doesn't use media at all. And it's the same with the new party.
01:34:58That is, 2.7% of the 10% who say they won't vote for the Justice and Development Party
01:35:02have come to the new party, and two to the İyi Party. This is essentially
01:35:05a thing.
01:35:08I mean, its distribution
01:35:11should be around 4.8%, I think.
01:35:15The new party should be around 4.8%, and the others should be distributed among themselves,
01:35:181.2, 0.8, and so on. Now, I don't understand
01:35:22the fact that 65% of the segment remains
01:35:26in the same place. Doesn't saying "I'd rather die than leave"
01:35:29signify a change in government? It's not enough.
01:35:32Now, most of it is already done by phone.
01:35:36There is also this parameter: it is done by phone. By phone,
01:35:39statesmen, now I can say AK Party if they don't give news about justice and development.
01:35:42They can say it, because most of these
01:35:45are done by phone. We also take this into account,
01:35:49but here, I mean, people wait with hope for another five years,
01:35:53they wait for another five years, and so on. We no longer have the patience to wait.
01:35:57All of us, we live in this country.
01:36:00I am also trying to make a living in this country. I also want to look to the future with hope.
01:36:04I also want every student I teach to stay in this country without leaving.
01:36:07So we need to get out of this without making a mistake.
01:36:11Look... For this reason,
01:36:15I say, for example, don't get stuck on this framework law.
01:36:18You need to have something to say in foreign policy, and they say they will say it.
01:36:22It's a good thing. You need to have something to say in economy.
01:36:26And just saying it is not enough. You won't just say, "I will give every pensioner
01:36:29at least the minimum wage." You will say where you will find the source for all of this.
01:36:33You will say it like a pill. You will go door to door
01:36:36and explain it. For example, if a general chairman
01:36:39is to be elected by members at the general congress, you will show everyone
01:36:42as an example how internal party democracy is being expanded.
01:36:46Everyone will take you as an example. If it can achieve all this quickly,
01:36:50it still has a great chance, I think. But if
01:36:53it's seen to be in such a state of inertia, if there are internal party conflicts
01:36:57and nothing is done, it won't work. And also,
01:37:00politics is about power. Power,
01:37:04as they say, power politics. Why am I saying this?
01:37:08Now, for example, 26 municipalities have been taken illegally.
01:37:12Of course, we are talking about them constantly. For example, 16 of your
01:37:1526 municipalities have been taken. For example, Üsküdar. Now, for example,
01:37:19if I were the general chairman, I would silently
01:37:22protest with 500,000 people, without breaking anything,
01:37:25without shouting, without hurting anyone.
01:37:28I would say, "Don't leave the Üsküdar municipality for three days.
01:37:32Then sit on the sidewalks and don't leave from there."
01:37:35This means there needs to be a more effective protest.
01:37:39Something is being discussed there, 5000 people for 3 days,
01:37:42and then they disperse. Another operation
01:37:45in another district, discussed in another district.
01:37:49But 1, 2, 8, 11, 14, 16 have gone now. The voter
01:37:53also sees this. And the voter is tired, teacher. Mr. Özel
01:37:56may not be aware of this. Can he be aware? I mean,
01:38:00the voter is also told to go and wait there for three days, go and wait at Saraçhane, then go to
01:38:04Istanbul University, then go get a diploma.
01:38:07The citizen is tired, I mean. You're right, but for example,
01:38:11there were over 100 rallies. They filled all the rallies.
01:38:14That's right. The voter participates.
01:38:17I'm saying all this so that this opposition wave
01:38:21can be better united and grow within the framework
01:38:24of law. I understand. Now, one of the most talked-about
01:38:27names of recent days is the Mayor of Ankara Metropolitan Municipality, Mansur
01:38:31Yavaş. After he visited Mr. President at Beştepe
01:38:35last week, especially the issue of him
01:38:38being able to switch to the AK Party at any moment started to be discussed.
01:38:41Even one of the important figures of the MHP, Mr. Abdülkadir
01:39:15says that a lot is being talked about Mansur Yavaş
01:39:19in Ankara's political circles. He is said to have said,
01:39:22"I don't want to go to prison at this age," and he explains this as follows:
01:39:24"Until the official application
01:39:27period for the presidency begins, I will not put my head forward.
01:39:31When the candidacy application begins, no one can arrest
01:39:34me. At that time, society will say he was arrested because he was a presidential candidate."
01:39:38He is reported to have said this. "I will not be the candidate of only the CHP and the new party,
01:39:42I will be the common candidate of the opposition.
01:39:45I will be the common candidate of the CHP, the new party, the İyi Party, and the Zafer Party,"
01:39:49he is reported to have said.
01:39:53information shared by Ali Gökçek. Did he actually
01:39:56say something while saying nothing here?
01:40:00I mean, if I become a presidential candidate,
01:40:03I will be arrested. I think the issue should
01:40:07now move beyond Mr. Mansur. I mean,
01:40:10isn't there a bigger problem in this article?
01:40:14That's why I took it. Why does Mr. Mansur
01:40:17associate not wanting to go to prison
01:40:19with running for president or being prominent in politics?
01:40:23This is being discussed in Ankara's political circles.
01:40:25Mr. Abdülkadir also takes this to his column.
01:40:29I mean, when you become a presidential candidate,
01:40:32excuse me, let me ask my question. Does it mean you get arrested
01:40:36when you become a presidential candidate? That's why he might be summoned
01:40:39to give a statement or even arrested for writing this article.
01:40:43Many, uh, in quotation marks. I am telling you, there are real
01:40:47opposition journalists who, when they write this, when they express
01:40:50this, they are openly spreading misleading information
01:40:54and will be arrested and imprisoned. There are journalists who will be arrested and imprisoned. What
01:40:57does this mean? Are we now going to associate
01:41:01people's path to the presidency
01:41:03or a more effective
01:41:07politics, a more prominent politics, with whether
01:41:10they go to prison or not? Will we manage that process accordingly? What does this mean? If we are
01:41:14talking about this in Turkey, there is nothing else to say.
01:41:17So, Mr. Mansur has made
01:41:20such a decision. According to Mr. Abdülkadir, Mansur
01:41:23Yavaş's statement – I'm not talking about his statement –
01:41:27"I don't want to go to prison, so I will announce my presidential candidacy
01:41:31later." In that sense, for example, Mr. Mansur, yes,
01:41:34the Mansur Yavaş I know would want to be the joint
01:41:38candidate of the CHP, the New Party, the Good Party, and the Victory Party, that's right,
01:41:42yes, but Mansur Yavaş would also want to be the candidate
01:41:45of AK Party voters, if you ask him.
01:41:48He would also want to be the candidate of MHP voters. Let's not look
01:41:52at it as parties but as party members,
01:41:55people who feel like MHP members. The general
01:41:57leaders of the parties
01:42:05would not want to be candidates, wouldn't every politician
01:42:09already be like that? If I were to embark on the path of presidential candidacy,
01:42:12I would also want to be the candidate of all
01:42:15thing, but
01:42:19what does "I don't want to go to prison" mean? Mr. Mansur
01:42:23would not say that. If he were to embark on such a path, he would already
01:42:27risk it. But why should someone who wants
01:42:30to be a presidential candidate in Turkey risk going to prison? Why are we
01:42:34not asking this question? The main question here is that Mr. Abdülkadir
01:42:37makes us ask this question with his article.
01:42:40He says, "I won't stick my neck out now.
01:42:43I will define my politics as serving the Ankara
01:42:47Metropolitan Municipality. And for the roadmap,
01:42:50don't believe anything you don't hear from me."
01:42:53I will develop this discourse. Very good. I will be arrested if
01:42:56I become a candidate. "Doesn't it imply
01:43:00that, as Mr. Selvin said, a presidential candidate in this country
01:43:04will then be arrested? Is that what
01:43:06we should understand from this? He himself
01:43:10makes this comment by referring to people,
01:43:13saying that "this is what is being talked about in Ankara." He makes such an assessment.
01:43:17And I agree with Mr. Gökçe,
01:43:20that if someone becomes a presidential candidate,
01:43:23they will definitely go to prison." To normalize the discourse
01:43:28"Yes, actually no pen that shapes public
01:43:31opinion constitutes a duty.
01:43:34That is, as he said, if
01:43:38we, names known as opposition,
01:43:40had written such a thing,
01:43:44presumably an investigation would be launched
01:43:47against us immediately and for openly spreading
01:43:51false information
01:43:54what is necessary would be done, yes."
01:43:57"As I said, I was in Ankara last Sunday,
01:44:01two Sundays ago. I went to Ankara
01:44:04for the first time in 1970. Believe me, of course, in this
01:44:08I admit that the preparations for the NATO summit will also
01:44:12play a role, but I admired
01:44:15the city of Ankara. Mr. Mansur has done
01:44:18a very successful municipal work.
01:44:22To such a successful mayor, not
01:44:24only new party members, not only CHP members,
01:44:28but also those who voted for the ruling
01:44:32party, Good Party members and members of other parties
01:44:37for him. Moreover, Mr. Mansur
01:44:40is not a person who has ever expressed
01:44:43himself as a fanatical partisan in his discourse.
01:44:47Since he became the mayor, the metropolitan mayor,
01:44:51he has always made embracing
01:44:54speeches, yes, he makes statements
01:44:57for all Ankara residents. When we look at Mr. Mansur,
01:45:00we should look at him like this. That is, when you spread
01:45:04Mr. Mansur's success from the Ankara scale
01:45:08to the whole country, it turns out
01:45:11that he is a very important name. Mr. Mansur
01:45:14is a very successful mayor.
01:45:17I don't think
01:45:19Mr. Mansur
01:45:22would be in such fears as Abdülkadir Selvi
01:45:25said. In fact,
01:45:29in the polls, he receives 5-6% of votes
01:45:32from the Justice and Development Party. When he becomes a presidential candidate,
01:45:36I admire the Justice and Development Party in Ankara. Of course,
01:45:40but if your words were cut off and you want
01:45:44to continue, the problematic thing here is that this article
01:45:47is being written, that something like "a presidential
01:45:50candidate in this country goes to prison" is being talked about. Look,
01:45:54what did Ms. Özzem say? She said, "I can't spend my life
01:45:57in 12 square meters." After that, she joined the AKP.
01:46:01What did they say to our Bayrampaşa mayor? Two days ago,
01:46:04they called him, one day ago, they called him again and said, "Rasan Mutdıye,
01:46:08I love you, brother, there's an operation against you,
01:46:12come join our party, don't be like this." They called him. He said, "I won't
01:46:15budge." Today, they are prosecuting Hasan
01:46:19Mutlu for 7800 years. All this will happen. In the municipalities
01:46:22that joined the AKP last year, there are no operations.
01:46:25Those who didn't join will be prosecuted for 700 to 800
01:46:28years. Someone will join the AKP
01:46:32because they said, "I can't stay in 12 square meters."
01:46:35On the day our presidential candidate is determined in our primary election,
01:46:39but what kind of primary election? Our presidential
01:46:42candidate, determined in a primary election where 15.5 million
01:46:46people voted, will be arrested that day. His
01:46:49image, his voice, his social media
01:46:52accounts will all be banned. His defense will be banned.
01:46:55The book he wrote to make his defense heard
01:46:58will be banned. It won't be enough. He couldn't make his defense
01:47:02there. The tea he drank
01:47:05while waiting for the hearing
01:47:08at the courthouse to ask a question will be banned. The league match
01:47:12he watched will be banned. Yes, these will happen. And then
01:47:15someone who is considering presidential candidacy
01:47:19will have to risk prison, of course, that's the kind of article
01:47:23that comes out here, this understanding emerges. To say
01:47:26that this is being talked about as "I don't want to go to prison"
01:47:29means that if you are thinking of becoming a presidential candidate,
01:47:33you will have to risk prison. The mere writing of this
01:47:37is an atrocity on behalf of the Republic of Turkey, but it is a reality.
01:47:40It is a reality, unfortunately, with the examples we have seen
01:47:44and experienced in Turkish politics. Can we give the thing to Professor Mümtaz again,
01:47:48Mr. Abdülkadir's article? Please. Let's give it to him, director,
01:47:52can I request the article again? Look, we have summarized it, he says
01:47:55that a lot is being talked about in the Ankara lobby,
01:47:59that is, he doesn't want to go to prison
01:48:02at this age. We don't know if it's true or not. If
01:48:06it's true, then it means suicide for Mansur Yavaş. If it's true,
01:48:09it means political suicide. But if it's not true,
01:48:13and I don't think it is, if it's not true, it's not
01:48:16subliminal, Mr. Selvi is giving an open message.
01:48:19That is, if you don't pledge allegiance, you will go to prison.
01:48:23Can something like this happen? In fact, this is what is desired.
01:48:26For example, if we ask those listening to us now, is there
01:48:30a similarity between Mansur Yavaş's
01:48:33article by Abdülkadir Selvi and the re-election
01:48:37for the Adalar Municipality? If you ask, what kind
01:48:40of common ground emerges? To make people think twice
01:48:44about even becoming a candidate, to make them reconsider
01:48:47the idea of becoming a candidate, that is, to make the opposition
01:48:51unable to find a candidate, to leave them without candidates.
01:48:54Now, I don't think Mansur Yavaş would say such a thing,
01:48:58because that would be political suicide. But here it clearly
01:49:01says that you will pledge allegiance and do what they tell you. Now,
01:49:05this can actually be discussed further. It's such a conjuncture
01:49:09that the Üsküdar municipality. Events are happening,
01:49:12arrests are still continuing in many district municipalities.
01:49:15Within this whole conjuncture, moreover, on the 9th
01:49:19of September, the anniversary of the Republican People's Party's establishment,
01:49:22why? I mean, it's not that Mansur Yavaş requested an appointment,
01:49:26why did the President immediately say "come" and give him an appointment?
01:49:29This should actually be looked into. Okay, let's talk and complete the second hour. I am asking
01:49:32for another half an hour from Uğur Dündar,
01:49:36as you were supposed to leave at 22:00, but we will discuss an important topic shortly: which public
01:49:40institutions and organizations
01:49:43are giving advertisements to television channels,
01:49:45according to whom and what? The New Party's Şanlıurfa
01:49:49Deputy Mahmut Tanal asked, and Şimşek did not answer.
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02:00:25We are starting our new hour with our new guests.
02:00:28As of this hour, we are saying hello to
02:00:31Halktv.com General Broadcast Manager, my dear friend
02:00:35Bengüşap Babaeker, and journalist Şükrü Küçükşahin. Dear Bengi
02:00:38Babaeker, welcome. Welcome. And Şükrü
02:00:42Küçükşahin, I would like to welcome
02:00:45you too. Your voice is not coming through. If you open your microphone,
02:00:48that would be great. Now, as of this hour, we have an issue to discuss,
02:00:51and we would like to hear the opinions
02:00:54of dear Bengü and our other colleagues on the matter.
02:00:57Now, the advertising budgets transferred
02:01:01to television channels by institutions
02:01:04and companies operating with public resources have now become a parliamentary issue.
02:01:08The New Party's Şanlıurfa Deputy Mahmut Tanal asked
02:01:12Mehmet Şimşek in his parliamentary question, "Which public
02:01:15institutions and organizations' advertisements
02:01:18are you distributing to which television channels,
02:01:22according to what criteria, and to whom?" Mehmet Şimşek's
02:01:25answer came as an interesting response. May I request
02:01:29his answer, my dear director Murat Erdoğan. The question is: What is the annual
02:01:33distribution of advertising and promotional
02:01:37budgets transferred to television
02:01:40channels by Turkish Airlines, Ziraat Bank, Halk Bank,
02:01:43Vakıfbank, Botaş, and other companies
02:01:47with majority public capital, per institution and channel?
02:01:50"Which objective criteria are taken as a basis
02:01:54when determining advertising and promotional
02:01:57budgets? For example, are ratings, reach, target
02:02:01audience, cost, effectiveness analysis, and independent media
02:02:05planning reports taken into account?" he asks.
02:02:08Mehmet Şimşek shares the joint answer of the three banks,
02:02:11stating that the requested detailed information
02:02:15beyond the data in the publicly
02:02:18disclosed financial statements, audit
02:02:21reports, and activity reports of the mentioned
02:02:25banks is considered a bank and customer
02:02:28secret under articles 73 and 159 of the Banking Law,
02:02:31and therefore cannot be shared. Now, I didn't understand
02:02:35this, dear Bengişap Babaeker. Mahmut Tanal is not asking
02:02:39who has how much money in these banks. He is saying, "Which channels
02:02:43do these bank advertisements go to, and according to what?" What's wrong with sharing this? Nothing.
02:02:47Now, he bases it on two articles of the banking law, and we looked
02:02:50at both of them. It has nothing to do with it, because no one is asking
02:02:53how much money anyone has, what they did,
02:02:56what their profit or loss is. The expenditure
02:03:00item that should be the most transparent is what we are asking about.
02:03:03Now, there is a product. You want to sell it more,
02:03:07reach more people, and earn more money, right? What will you do
02:03:11for this? You will advertise yourself in the media
02:03:14that will reach the widest
02:03:17audience. We would think that these institutions
02:03:20are doing the same. Where should they place their
02:03:23advertisements to reach more people, earn more,
02:03:27and reach more customers? On the most watched channel.
02:03:31Now, if we are talking about news channels, Halk
02:03:34TV is the most watched news channel in Turkey.
02:03:38There is only one rating agency. According
02:03:41to its calculations, Halk TV is always first. Halk TV has not
02:03:45received any advertisements
02:03:48from public institutions for 5 or 6 years. So then,
02:03:51according to what criteria are you giving them? Mahmut Tanal
02:03:54also asked this. "Objective criteria," he says. There are no
02:03:57objective criteria, because they are not giving their
02:04:01advertisements to the most watched channels,
02:04:04the ones that will reach the widest customer base,
02:04:07or to newspapers. To whom are they giving them? To channels
02:04:11that broadcast daily and make propaganda for the government.
02:04:14That is, public resources
02:04:17are only transferred to one group. What is the income
02:04:21from these advertisements? This is not an advertisement, this is a transfer
02:04:25of resources, because the income of the banks comes from
02:04:29our taxes. You also pay that tax, Mr. Uğur also pays it,
02:04:32I also pay it, millions of people watching Halk TV
02:04:36also pay it. There is a pool of money formed
02:04:39from everyone's taxes, accumulated in public institutions,
02:04:43and they are transferred to pro-government media,
02:04:46to the so-called government media channels. Of course, resources
02:04:50are being transferred, clearly, and other independent
02:04:54broadcasters like Halk TV,
02:04:57independent media, are being punished.
02:05:00They are being put into an economic squeeze,
02:05:04you are being deprived of these resources,
02:05:06that is, these resources are not distributed
02:05:10equally. We don't even want equality, we want
02:05:13it to be fair. Look at the ratings, if we don't have ratings,
02:05:17if we don't have viewers, then don't give them.
02:05:20So, the criterion here is not ratings, we understood
02:05:23that. The criterion here is actually broadcasting
02:05:26under the guidance of the government. There is also an interesting
02:05:30point in the answer, which Mr. Dündar must have
02:05:33noticed. Three banks are mentioned. He says, Ziraat
02:05:36Bank, Halk Bank, Vakıfbank. Mr. Dündar,
02:05:40Mr. Şimşek is making a joint statement on their behalf.
02:05:43But he doesn't mention Turkish Airlines and Botaş
02:05:47at all. Mr. Şimşek obviously didn't fully understand
02:05:51the bank accounts. No one is asking about the deposits there.
02:05:54But there is no answer for THY and Botaş in this
02:05:58answer. Why do you think not? I agree
02:06:02with Ms. Bengü's explanation.
02:06:04I will add one more point. Halk
02:06:08TV is first in terms of
02:06:11ratings among news channels. But perhaps
02:06:14they could say, "Brother, you may
02:06:17be watched a lot, but for us,
02:06:20a viewer with high purchasing power is important.
02:06:24We take this as a basis." If they say that,
02:06:27then Halk Television is watched
02:06:31by all voter segments, by all
02:06:35citizen segments, especially by citizens
02:06:39with high purchasing power, in the same way.
02:06:42In all categories, Halk TV is always
02:06:45first. Therefore, I agree
02:06:48with Ms. Bengü again. Pro-government
02:06:52media is subsidized with public
02:06:55resources. Yes, in all democracies
02:06:59in the world, especially. "Newspapers supporting
02:07:02the government do not sell well. Opposition
02:07:06newspapers gain respect
02:07:09and are in demand, because journalism's
02:07:12nature is to oppose. Everything is fine and dandy
02:07:16when everything is running smoothly, but that's not
02:07:19news. Anything that is not working,
02:07:23out of order, and needs to be corrected is news.
02:07:27And the journalist reflects these for the public's
02:07:31right to know the truth. Thus,
02:07:34by transferring public resources
02:07:37to pro-government media,
02:07:40Halk TV, which actually has real ratings
02:07:43and always maintains its first
02:07:47place in all categories,
02:07:50is being punished. Therefore, Halk TV viewers
02:07:53are also being punished. We cannot
02:07:56accept this. I absolutely
02:08:00disagree with Mr. Şimşek's
02:08:03assessment. Public resources are also,
02:08:06as Ms. Bengü said, your money and my money. But he says
02:08:10public resources are a secret. Editorial decisions may support
02:08:14the government, but this is a choice
02:08:17and a patronage choice. The boss
02:08:20covers it from his own pocket, subsidizes it.
02:08:23But when it comes to the distribution
02:08:26of public resources, it is the primary
02:08:29duty of those who use these resources to be fair.
02:08:32Ms. Bengü, please. It is not transparent, it is not auditable,
02:08:36this is clear. I understand from this answer that these institutions
02:08:40are giving advertisements according to what criteria,
02:08:43we cannot ask this, if you ask, you don't get an answer.
02:08:47For example, in fires, it's asked, opposition
02:08:49MPs submit a motion, how many fire planes do we have,
02:08:53as needed, how many planes does the presidency have,
02:08:56enough. This is also something like that, Olkan. Only
02:09:00the advertising expenditure for the first 3 months of this year for only two public
02:09:03banks in the first 3 months of advertising expenditure, Mr. Uğur, is
02:09:071 billion 65 million liras. 1 billion 65 million
02:09:10liras. There is no 1 lira coming to Halk TV
02:09:13for advertising and promotion expenditures. Where did it go? It went
02:09:16to televisions that are never watched, to newspapers that are never
02:09:20read. They are never read,
02:09:22they are not watched, but all resources are transferred there.
02:09:26What are 73 and 159? What does ErtunçÖzen say here?
02:09:30Bank and customer secret. We are not asking for customer secrets, so
02:09:33could Mr. Şimşek have misunderstood this? So, to deflect
02:09:36the issue is actually related to legal articles that are not related to the content
02:09:40of the issue. We are talking about an article related to confidentiality and trade secrets, but
02:09:44the event in question here is different. It is not
02:09:47a question that falls within the scope of personal data protection, Mr. Tanal. That is,
02:09:51to disclose which channel a customer's portfolio
02:09:54advertises on for how many minutes is not a trade secret
02:09:58in any way related to banking.
02:10:21how many big advertisements public institutions gave in that campaign and
02:10:25where did they give them? Did you see a one-second advertisement on Halk TV?
02:10:28In the transition to 5G, there was a terrible transfer of resources
02:10:32and all institutions organized a very big campaign again.
02:10:36Even in that campaign alone, it's visible
02:10:39where these advertisements are going.
02:10:42Did you get it, but is there anything you'd like to add? Let's
02:10:46say that the first uh question wasn't
02:10:49answered. Regarding which television
02:10:53channels the funds were transferred to, they say it's a trade secret. There's another question that says
02:10:57what criteria is this based on? Why
02:10:59is this a trade secret? I don't understand this. For example, Mehmet
02:11:03Şimşek could have answered: "How much
02:11:05was transferred to which television channel is a trade secret,
02:11:09however, when we determine these
02:11:12channels, we base it on these criteria." This is not
02:11:15a trade secret, but the reason he cannot answer
02:11:18is that there is no, how can I say,
02:11:21impartial criterion according to which
02:11:24a television news channel that comes first in ratings in every
02:11:28measurement, receives not even
02:11:311 lira of advertising. There is no
02:11:34such criterion, that is, there is no such criterion. Since
02:11:38there is no such criterion, it's a trade secret, as with all our questions.
02:11:41They hide it, but these
02:11:45are not anyone's father's companies. There cannot be such a trade secret.
02:11:49We are talking about public banks. Also, there's this:
02:11:53without meeting with all channels and getting advertising
02:11:56prices from them, how will you create a competitive environment
02:12:00and give advertisements cheaply? Well, don't.
02:12:03If you don't do this, then isn't there a public loss here?
02:12:06So, if this is a public bank, then if
02:12:09these banks are all ours, you are actually
02:12:13creating a public loss here by not creating it. Maybe you will give
02:12:17a one-minute advertisement for 100 liras there, but here you will reach
02:12:20more people for 90 liras, maybe more people for 50 liras.
02:12:23They hide behind this being a trade secret,
02:12:27uh but
02:12:29as in everything, we all know, as you said,
02:12:33they use public resources to feed
02:12:37their pro-government channels. Public banks and public institutions
02:12:40are the best example for this, because
02:12:42as you asked, it's a trade secret. It's over. 73.
02:12:46Also, private banks, let's say
02:12:48private banks were defrauded by businessman X
02:12:52This
02:12:55is not, in my opinion, a newsworthy
02:12:58event. It is
02:13:02an indication of a legal process that needs to happen
02:13:05between two people or the bank
02:13:08and that fraudster. It is a matter that needs to be
02:13:11resolved in court. But when it comes to
02:13:15siphoning off the resources of public banks or
02:13:18evaluating and distributing their resources,
02:13:22this concerns us a lot,
02:13:25because public resources consist of money that belongs
02:13:29to the orphans whose hair has not yet grown.
02:13:32That is, it is the money of the entire nation.
02:13:35Therefore, to give the nation's money fairly
02:13:39to those who deserve it is superior management.
02:14:00Why did Turkish Airlines give advertisements to
02:14:04which channel and based on what? Come on, the banks are very
02:14:07much from the beginning, but Cinematographer, from the very beginning, but
02:14:10it's not like that. They gave him a file, you know, as Ali Bey also knows,
02:14:14in recent years in the parliament, the fate of all parliamentary questions is this.
02:14:18Most of them are not answered at all. Those that are answered are passed off as secrets,
02:14:22half answered, one-fourth answered,
02:14:25and that also wrongly. Well, thank you very much.
02:14:28General Manager of halktv.com, dear Bengi Şap Babayaker,
02:14:31for your contribution. While you're here, I can say a thing or two
02:14:35if you have 2-3 more minutes, that is,
02:14:39in essence, I mean,
02:14:46sit down
02:14:49in the evening, I zap through the channels and watch. For example, most have opened YouTube.
02:14:52For example, any channel, like, 5-6
02:14:56people are sitting there, discussing a political matter, and 56 people are watching.
02:14:59You know, if he told his wife, children, and neighbors, it would be 150-200 people.
02:15:0356 people are watching, then it goes to commercials, and
02:15:07the 10-minute commercial never ends. Now,
02:15:11if you're looking for criteria. For example, what comes to my mind is this:
02:15:13The state provides treasury aid to political
02:15:16parties, doesn't it? There's a condition for that. Okay, good, well done, there's a good condition,
02:15:20you must have received at least 3% of the votes, uh. And you must have been established
02:15:23some time ago, and so on. Now, if you consider getting 3% of the votes
02:15:27as a reward, then here, take the viewership rates,
02:15:31calculate the monthly average, across all groups and categories,
02:15:34A, B, AB, whatever. Distribute it equally based on that.
02:15:38It's that simple, Professor. Professor, if these public
02:15:42banks or public institutions had given
02:15:45advertisements to Halk Television, Mr. Mehmet
02:15:49Şimşek would have proudly answered this
02:15:52question. He would have explained
02:15:55it, of course, because the
02:15:58fact that these advertisements were distributed fairly
02:16:01would have emerged. As I said,
02:16:04Halk Television is watched a lot, and it is watched
02:16:07by viewers in every category, from segments with high purchasing
02:16:10power to all layers of society.
02:16:14When you look at it objectively, when you evaluate it from an
02:16:18outside perspective, it naturally
02:16:21emerges that Halk Television is the institution
02:16:25that should receive the most public advertising among news channels.
02:16:28There are huge public banks. Let's not name them one by one. Here,
02:16:31they offer salary promotions and try to tie pensioners to themselves.
02:16:35Normal citizens deposit money, businessmen deposit money. A businessman
02:16:38who pays his taxes has deposited his money in that public bank. A normal pensioner
02:16:42goes and gets his salary. But if these people
02:16:45are watching an opposition channel, Halk TV, then why
02:16:49would the bank, where Halk TV has been working
02:16:52and showing loyalty for years, not advertise?
02:16:56Quite naturally, for example, I receive my pension
02:16:59from a public bank, but that public bank does not
02:17:03advertise on Halk Television. If this is not
02:17:06injustice, what is? Also, Mr. Uğur, those who make this decision
02:17:10are public employees, that is, they will be responsible for even 1 lira
02:17:13of public money. You must state which criteria you used
02:17:17to make payments. As you mentioned earlier, you give
02:17:20millions of liras in advertising money to
02:17:23a channel watched by 56 people...
02:17:34The money you gave is public money, so there would be a severe punishment and prosecution
02:17:37for this. So, we should talk about these things considering
02:17:41that we went all the way to Switzerland and uncovered the bribery account
02:17:44of Emlak Bank General Manager Engin Civan, and we
02:17:48headlined it as "the document of bribery," because, as I said,
02:17:52he was the general manager of a public bank
02:17:55that held the rights of orphans whose hair had not yet grown,
02:17:59and he was responsible for siphoning off the public
02:18:02bank.
02:18:05Well, thank you very much, Bengü Şap. Thank you for your contributions.
02:18:09We will say goodbye to you. Thank you very much. Thank you, Şükrü Küçükşahin.
02:18:12Is there anything you would like to add to this
02:18:16matter? Of course,
02:18:18that is, as Uğur Abi also stated,
02:18:22look, in the past,
02:18:24even when many important news stories that were perceived
02:18:28as being against these banks or any institution or political
02:18:31institution were made, such an advertising
02:18:35share, that is, a reduction in advertisements
02:18:39from public institutions to broadcasting organizations
02:18:42could not have been the case, because
02:18:45this would have gathered a very big reaction.
02:18:48Also, it is considered
02:18:51a fundamental principle of journalism. These news stories that are made.
02:18:55Today, if you are making
02:18:59journalism, if you are doing propaganda for
02:19:02the government's understanding, then you deserve
02:19:05public advertisements, especially advertisements from public
02:19:08institutions. But if
02:19:12you are not acting in the understanding of Her Majesty's
02:19:15in Rize, his hometown, you do not have
02:19:18the right to receive advertisements. This actually means
02:19:21the elimination of the public's right to information. This actually means
02:19:25the elimination of journalism. It means the elimination
02:19:28of journalistic ethical principles. In this way, you
02:19:31direct journalists to a single type of
02:19:35understanding, and we have actually experienced
02:19:38many examples of this. We unfortunately see with sadness
02:19:41that all broadcasting organizations that receive advertisements
02:19:45use the same headlines and see the same news.
02:19:48Uh, and unfortunately, the government, especially the AK
02:19:51Party government, in previous periods... "We weren't seeing such examples.
02:19:55The media has also gone the way of
02:19:57being brought under control by
02:20:01unevenly benefiting
02:20:04from the advertising pie. This is both
02:20:07an unfair practice and a practice that destroys
02:20:11journalistic principles. But most
02:20:15importantly, as I said, it is a situation that prevents
02:20:18the public's right to information. So, Mehmet
02:20:22Şimşek's answer is
02:20:26a very sad answer, to be honest.
02:20:29We cannot see those expected
02:20:32rational outputs from Mehmet Şimşek,
02:20:35Ms. Sinem. He could have even
02:20:39said that there is war
02:20:43around us, there are crises, and because
02:20:46of these crises, opposition channels should also
02:20:49give us money because they cannot see
02:20:52how much we are fighting this crisis.
02:20:55He could have thought that, but of course
02:20:58I'm joking, it's a bad joke, I admit, but
02:21:02unfortunately, at the point we have reached, this is the situation.
02:21:05Today, you discussed the first part of the media,
02:21:09you talked about it. Because of that,
02:21:12if you understand media or
02:21:15column writing, and you become
02:21:18a presidential candidate in this country,
02:21:22you should be afraid of prison, you should experience
02:21:25the feeling of imprisonment. If one of those who give
02:21:28you this feeling is the media, if it is given
02:21:32through the media, then
02:21:34this is truly a rare
02:21:38or unprecedented media
02:21:40profile in the world. It is a very saddening situation,
02:21:44uh, but Turkey has come to this point
02:21:47in the last 20 years, especially regarding
02:21:50the media. You know how they say "it's a shame, it's a sin,"
02:21:54it really is a shame, it's a sin, and the people are the ones who lose
02:21:57again, because if this media
02:22:01didn't exist, TÜİK's inflation calculations would never
02:22:05have been criticized until today. So, people
02:22:09would never have seen how the minimum wage
02:22:12and pension were calculated to be so low.
02:22:16I will just give a simple example. Of course, Mr. Ertunç Özün, please go ahead.
02:22:19We are talking about the media, we are talking about the unequal
02:22:22distribution in the media. A moment ago, we saw a post by Abdülkadir Selvi,
02:22:25not a post, when we saw his article, Mr. Uğur
02:22:28also said a moment ago, Mr. Ali said, if an opposition member did this,
02:22:32a file would be opened for openly spreading misleading information,
02:22:35because you are talking about a presidential
02:22:38candidacy and a prison threat, and today, Mansur Yavaş's
02:22:41press advisor shared that these are entirely Abdülkadir Selvi's
02:22:45figment of imagination, and Abdülkadir Selvi
02:22:48himself shared this again, meaning he accepted it.
02:22:52Yet, there is nothing regarding this post, is there? But
02:22:55if an opposition journalist had done the same, that is,
02:22:59let's say it was evaluated within the scope of press freedom,
02:23:03I wish the opposition were looked at in the same way.
02:23:06And Abdulkadir Servi's
02:23:08denial made by the Press Advisor
02:23:10of the honorable Mayor of Ankara Metropolitan Municipality,
02:23:14when he shared it on his own social media account,
02:23:18let's evaluate it as responsibility.
02:23:20As responsible journalism, he made a correction. Yes,
02:23:24he made a correction. In fact, Ms. Sinem, let's look at this issue from this
02:23:27perspective: the power of the parliament, especially
02:23:31after the transition to the presidential system, is an indication
02:23:34of how much it has declined. It is a hopeful
02:23:37indicator. The reason is this: Would it have been possible, Mr. Uğur
02:23:41also remembers well, for an MP to ask a question and the minister not
02:23:45to answer him within 15 days, and not
02:23:48to answer with the truth, whatever it may be? But today,
02:23:51I saw the other day, no explanation was given. For example,
02:23:55Mr. Minister of Justice, it hasn't been a year since he took office, has it?
02:23:59900 questions were asked, and no question has been answered
02:24:02yet. For example, this is actually an indicator
02:24:06of how much the respect of the parliament or the oversight
02:24:09power of the MPs has been reduced.
02:24:12The fact that Mehmet Şimşek did not answer this question is also a very
02:24:16concrete example of how much the power of the parliament
02:24:19has been reduced. Well, thank you. Now,
02:24:22the hot topic of politics, one of the letters,
02:24:24notes, and issues.
02:24:28Meanwhile, my editor Alper sent me a message.
02:24:32Okay, there's an important note that Serra Karaçam will convey to us from the United States,
02:24:35but until then, until it's ready,
02:24:39especially regarding President's candidacy, statements continue to come
02:24:42from the AK Party Headquarters one after another. After President
02:24:46used the phrase "upcoming elections"
02:24:50while it became a matter of discussion whether there would be an early
02:24:53or snap election, Erdoğan's candidacy
02:24:56was also reopened for discussion. Because influential and authorized
02:25:00figures from the General Headquarters, for example, the Vice Chairman in charge
02:25:04of electoral affairs, said that there is no legal or
02:25:08constitutional obstacle to Erdoğan's candidacy, and that he can be
02:25:11a candidate again, referring to the elections to be brought
02:25:15forward by one week in the parliament, meaning 2028.
02:25:18Today, the group deputy chairman, one of the important figures
02:25:22in the party, Abdülhamit Gül, made a statement. If I'm not mistaken, in visual number 8,
02:25:26Mr. Gül says, "One of the important
02:25:29consensuses of our nation is for our President to continue
02:25:33his path as President and lead Turkey to
02:25:36stronger leadership. I believe that
02:25:39this demand and expectation of our nation will find a response
02:25:42in our Grand National Assembly. With the decision to be taken
02:25:46by our Assembly, our President will run again as a candidate for the presidential election." Now,
02:25:55we all know that, since our
02:25:59legal literacy has increased, it is possible for the President
02:26:03to be a candidate again either with a snap election decision
02:26:06or with a constitutional amendment. Which possibility does Mr. Gül
02:26:09see as stronger? What do you say? Candidacy discussions
02:26:13have started again in recent days because
02:26:16the constitution is proposing a new law. However,
02:26:20lately, instead of a new constitution,
02:26:23uh, along with the MPs,
02:26:25this actually emerged with Mehmet Uçum's article
02:26:29about a month and a half ago, if I remember correctly, within
02:26:32a month and a half. Uh,
02:26:35that's right. Recep Tayyip Erdoğan does not
02:26:39need to be elected again, but
02:26:42Turkey needs to elect Recep Tayyip Erdoğan
02:26:44again. This statement is very well remembered.
02:26:48It came out, and Mehmet Bey generally
02:26:52initiates these matters. In terms of bringing up a topic,
02:26:55then other AKP officials
02:26:59come here and talk about
02:27:02taking the MPs to early elections.
02:27:05This is a method
02:27:08of inviting our Grand National Assembly,
02:27:11with Abdülhamit Bey's words, to a trick, nothing else.
02:27:15We determined the constitution, and when we determined the
02:27:18constitution, without anyone,
02:27:22even our President at the time was known, but
02:27:26they said that they did not find it right
02:27:29for Recep Tayyip Erdoğan to be president more than twice. Was the AKP
02:27:33not in power when this constitution was determined? Was the AKP
02:27:36not in power when this article was written?
02:27:39Today, why was this article
02:27:43put there? A different situation
02:27:45may arise in the country, and the deputies may need
02:27:48to dissolve the parliament. "In that case, the presidential
02:27:52term can be repeated, it is not considered the second,"
02:27:55they say. Okay, very good. Today,
02:27:59they say that they are trying to circumvent the criterion they set
02:28:02that it should not be done more than twice with a trick.
02:28:05"We wrote this constitution, we
02:28:09determined it, and we think it is correct that
02:28:12the presidency should not be held more than twice,
02:28:15but we are inviting our Grand National Assembly to elect
02:28:19a third president with a trick." They should say this openly,
02:28:23that is, "no, Turkey needs
02:28:26it." Turkey does not need Recep Tayyip Erdoğan
02:28:29to be a candidate again, brother. Since you brought
02:28:32the presidential system in 2018, tell me one thing
02:28:36that has gone well in the country. In health?
02:28:39In education? In economy? We see what state we are in.
02:28:42Since 2018, nothing has gone well. He says he needs to be
02:28:46there again. Turkey doesn't need such a thing. Turkey needs change. The Grand National Assembly
02:28:50does not need to make anyone president
02:28:53again by trickery, in a way that violates the constitution.
02:28:57Abdülhamit Bey's statement can certainly be consistent
02:29:01for him, but what he is calling the parliament to is a trick.
02:29:04Now, Professor Mithat, actually, in the pro-government
02:29:07press and media, when the election issue is brought up, the calendar
02:29:11is either November 2027 or April 2028,
02:29:14but we already know very well the procedure, that is, for the President to be able
02:29:18to run as a candidate again, one of two things is necessary:
02:29:22either a constitutional amendment or an early election decision.
02:29:25Now, when the President used the phrase "upcoming elections,"
02:29:29it was asked if an early election was on the horizon, but today, Ömer
02:29:33Çelik said after the MYK meeting that there is no election or whatever
02:29:36on their agenda. So, what remains is a constitutional amendment.
02:29:40So, since all these things are now being talked about more loudly,
02:29:44is that the timeline? I don't think they will take the risk of a constitutional
02:29:47amendment. I mean, this is also possible,
02:29:51but what seems close to me is actually that if he says
02:29:55"we are going to early elections," the opposition will say "where did this election come from?"
02:29:59but then they will say "are you running away from the election?" So, when he puts forward the early election
02:30:02thesis, everyone may have to accept it. Therefore,
02:30:05here, 360
02:30:08will be found. Therefore, when the parliament makes a decision,
02:30:12you know, in 2018, they reset the odometer. The clock was reset.
02:30:15The period between 2014-2018 was not counted.
02:30:18The period between 2018-2020. is 1 term.
02:30:2123:20, that is, 28 is two terms.
02:30:25In the second term, if there is an early election with a parliamentary decision, he can be a candidate again.
02:30:28Therefore, since the odometer started
02:30:31from 2018, when the parliament finds 360
02:30:35and makes an early election decision, no legal flaw is seen,
02:30:39even if it is debatable in terms of legitimacy. Now,
02:30:42here, for example, it says that the lines are very
02:30:46important. Abdülhamit Gül's "this demand of our nation
02:30:50and expectation will, I believe, find a response in our Grand National Assembly."
02:30:53That is, they will bring the early election
02:30:56to the parliament. That is, there is a constitutional
02:30:59amendment, he says. Of course, what could happen? For example, what
02:31:03argument could they use, dear Sinem? For example,
02:31:06if you strain your memory, about a year and a half ago,
02:31:10the chief legal advisor, Mehmet Uçum Bey, said something
02:31:13like "exceptional situation."
02:31:16This is very important, especially for those interested
02:31:20in political science and political sociology. They
02:31:23know well that there was a very
02:31:26famous political sociologist named Carl Schmitt who lived in the 1930s.
02:31:30Carl Schmitt has a thesis on the exceptional
02:31:34situation. He says that sometimes in a state, while
02:31:37the parliament is open, that is, while the political
02:31:41mechanism is functioning within a democratic order,
02:31:44such exceptional situations occur, which you can
02:31:47fill with regional crises, wars, any
02:31:50tension, then the sovereign
02:31:53is actually the decision-maker.
02:31:56That is, the parliament and everything can make decisions
02:32:00without going through the whole process. "In this exceptional
02:32:03situation, the decision-maker is sovereign and must make a decision,"
02:32:06he says, which is actually a thesis that paved the way for more authoritarian
02:32:10regimes. Now, these are being taken off the shelf again, Carl Schmitt is being re-written,
02:32:13doctoral theses are being written on him. I don't think Mehmet Uçum Bey
02:32:16used this by coincidence. So, something like this happened,
02:32:19and therefore, we should actually look not only at internal
02:32:23dynamics but also at external dynamics. In a process leading
02:32:26to elections, these external dynamics must be observed very, very well.
02:32:30I also agree with my professor. Also, in Turkish
02:32:32politics, The
02:32:35perspective of those in power is that
02:32:39yesterday is yesterday, today is today, meaning
02:32:42we do what today requires, and this never changes.
02:32:45Did you complete it?
02:32:49Yesterday is yesterday, haha, yes, yes. By
02:32:52the way, Ali Gökçek, Istanbul Deputy of the New Party, thank you very much for your
02:32:56contributions. We will say goodbye to you. I will turn to Mr.
02:32:59Küçükşahin. Don't look at your watch, you are still here.
02:33:02"I see, I see on the left while looking right. I will say something
02:33:06for Ali Gökçek and for 15. Of course, please.
02:33:09When talking about the new party,
02:33:13especially in our democracy, it is the first
02:33:16time that a political party has been established from scratch
02:33:19and reached such a high
02:33:23vote percentage in such a short
02:33:26time. This fact should never be
02:33:29overlooked when evaluating the new party.
02:33:32It is necessary to consider such a
02:33:35rise in votes and voter appreciation, which no other
02:33:39political party has experienced
02:33:41at its foundation, to this extent. Even the Justice and Development Party,
02:33:44when it came to power
02:33:48in 2003, the November 2002
02:33:51elections, and then
02:33:54came to power in 2003, even then, it barely
02:33:57reached this vote percentage, right, professor? Yes, I mean, after
02:34:01separating from the main body, consider the Democratic Party that split from the Justice Party,
02:34:04consider the Republican Trust Party that split from the Republican People's Party.
02:34:08For any party that splits from the main body, I completely
02:34:11agree, it is very rare for them to achieve such a
02:34:15rise in votes in such a short time, not just rare, but almost
02:34:18unseen. We must give it credit, but I think the
02:34:21decision that forced them to separate, which has gone
02:34:24down in legal history like Mutlan, also had an effect.
02:34:27Just as in the Istanbul elections, the 13,000
02:34:31difference rose to 800,000.
02:34:44Mr. Şükrükşahin, Erdoğan's candidacy is being particularly
02:34:48highlighted. What do you say?
02:34:51First of all, I think there is a magic word here:
02:34:55legitimacy. For example, as Uğur Abi said,
02:34:58the main reason for
02:35:01the new party becoming the first party a week or
02:35:04a few days after its establishment is its
02:35:07legitimacy. In other words,
02:35:09this party was established on legitimate
02:35:13grounds and as a result of legitimate necessities. All
02:35:16illegitimate initiatives have
02:35:19therefore gathered the reaction of the
02:35:22people. Here, the new party became
02:35:26the first party due to its legitimate
02:35:29status. Now, today, elections will be held.
02:35:33"No one should worry about this.
02:35:36Anatolian lands have been very experienced and
02:35:40very conscious about the ballot box for 150 years.
02:35:44Especially, they will never forgive the slightest
02:35:48disrespect to their will.
02:35:51They will punish it more than
02:35:54enough. Now,
02:35:57early elections will be held on this date, on that date, 360 will be found,
02:36:01will not be found. 400 will be, will not be. Do you know,
02:36:05all of these can hypothetically happen,
02:36:09of course, but I think this
02:36:11will be a coercion and it will not have legitimacy. If
02:36:15you say early election, it should be at least one year
02:36:18in advance. Otherwise, if you are not
02:36:22going to hold early elections, this, I think,
02:36:26would be going outside of legitimacy. In what
02:36:28sense? In terms of getting the will of the people
02:36:32behind you, especially in this area,
02:36:35I say. Now, you will
02:36:38transfer deputies.
02:36:41You will try to defeat the opposition by using
02:36:45all your forces, and in this way, you
02:36:49will make the early election decision,
02:36:52I think, as if mocking society and all of us, saying
02:36:56that if we do it a month or a week earlier, it will be an early election.
02:37:00Believe me, this will have no legitimacy in the eyes
02:37:03of the people, and it should be known that
02:37:07Turkey has been experiencing a crisis for a long time. I am
02:37:10not saying this only in terms of an economic crisis.
02:37:13There is also a crisis in terms of political trust.
02:37:17There is also a crisis in terms of state management.
02:37:19All of these are happening in front of society's eyes.
02:37:23Society wants to get out of this crisis. It
02:37:26has also seen that getting out of this crisis
02:37:29is not possible with the system created in the last 10
02:37:32years. So, the system needs to be changed.
02:37:35Change is needed. Something new needs to be done,
02:37:39something new needs to be said, a new proposal needs to be made.
02:37:42The current government does not leave
02:37:45a positive impression in response to
02:37:48any of these issues. On the contrary, as I just
02:37:52said, it feels the need to eliminate
02:37:55the opposition through illegitimate means. It does
02:37:58this in every area of life. Sinem hanım,
02:38:01what we have seen in Üsküdar for the last few days,
02:38:05what we have seen in Adana Yüreyir, or the political ban
02:38:08and prison sentence given to Ekrem İmamoğlu
02:38:11after he was acquitted twice, we have seen the conditions
02:38:15of all these. I think all these
02:38:18increase the legitimacy discussion
02:38:21I just mentioned, and all
02:38:24of this is happening in front of society's eyes. Turkey
02:38:27is chronically experiencing inflation.
02:38:31Pardon, we are listening to you. Your
02:38:35voice went away and came back. Don't let another voice
02:38:39interrupt. I apologize. Turkey, look, I always
02:38:42give this example: there is no other country in the world
02:38:46that has struggled with inflation for so long. It has become
02:38:49chronic. Turkey's economic problems have also become chronic.
02:38:52All of these happened during this government's term. While all this
02:38:56is happening, if the market,
02:39:00which is the place where ordinary people do most of
02:39:03their shopping, has ceased to be that,
02:39:06if the market vendor is closing their stall there,
02:39:10if people cannot go and shop there,
02:39:14if that place has also...
02:39:46regarding the issue, but since you will be leaving at the end of this hour, I would like to get
02:39:49your final assessment. So, regarding
02:39:52the agenda, please, professor, is that right? Before
02:39:56connecting, yes, please. I agree, of course. Now, Mr.
02:40:00Şükrü mentioned a change. What are we talking
02:40:03about? Why, for example, do we need to oppose, and
02:40:07based on what dynamics and parameters are we saying this? There
02:40:11are 14 trillion liras of interest payments in the next 3 years.
02:40:15This means approximately 3 trillion 865
02:40:18billion in 2027, 4 trillion 170
02:40:22billion in 2028, and 4 trillion 300
02:40:25345 billion in 2029. When you add them up, there
02:40:29are approximately 14 trillion liras of interest payments. Now,
02:40:33so the viewers don't get confused, let me put it this way: everyone pays
02:40:36taxes. For every 100 liras in the budget, 19 liras
02:40:40and 43 kuruş go to interest, and only 9.95
02:40:43kuruş go to investment. That is, half of the interest
02:40:47goes to investment. That is why the unemployment
02:40:50rate has reached 31% of society. That is why there is such
02:40:54impoverishment, as we discussed earlier. That is why there
02:40:57is a significant distortion in income distribution that will
02:41:01not improve. That is why the middle class has disappeared and
02:41:05is rapidly moving towards the lower segment. So, for society, both
02:41:09the unemployed with diplomas and those we call
02:41:12unskilled unemployed, who are neither
02:41:15in school nor university nor at home, for
02:41:18all these young people, to rebuild their dreams, to re-establish
02:41:22social peace, for the social consensus we call consent
02:41:25to be re-realized,
02:41:27for people to regain the lost smile
02:41:31they have lost, a change is certainly
02:41:34needed. As long as the parties aspiring
02:41:37to change can present a prescription
02:41:41that is like a pill, compact, understandable
02:41:44to everyone, and that they can really
02:41:47embrace with faith for the future. Let me get
02:41:51a final assessment from you. I believe that the anti-democratic
02:41:54initiatives of the Justice and Development Party,
02:41:57especially towards the new party,
02:42:01will not benefit the party. I
02:42:04believe that initiatives and facts that have
02:42:07not gained their legitimacy from the ballot
02:42:10box will not be enough to keep a political
02:42:14party in power. As an example,
02:42:17I show this: How was the Justice and Development
02:42:21Party founded? It was founded by breaking away from the Welfare
02:42:25Party, that main body. The Welfare Party
02:42:28was previously led by the late Professor
02:42:32Necmettin Erbakan as its general
02:42:35chairman. That political view, through the
02:42:38closure of numerous parties, became the Welfare Party, then
02:42:42the Virtue Party after Welfare. Yes, National Salvation,
02:42:45Virtue, National Order, National Salvation,
02:42:48Welfare, Virtue, Virtue. If
02:42:52prohibitions or initiatives that we
02:42:55could call anti-democratic could prevent a
02:42:59political formation from coming to power,
02:43:02then the Justice and Development Party, chaired
02:43:05by Mr. Tayyip Erdoğan, could not have come
02:43:08to power in its first election. But those
02:43:12in power, who cannot foresee this, must
02:43:16always keep this reality in mind
02:43:18for their own political future and
02:43:22for our democratic
02:43:24life. It is very important. It
02:43:27is very valuable. I have a request for the
02:43:31viewers of Halk TV. I want to address
02:43:34them. As you saw earlier, Halk TV gets
02:43:37its strength from you, dear viewers. It has no
02:43:41other power to rely on. Halk TV is an uncensored
02:43:45television, just like the name of this program.
02:43:48Look, in this studio where we are currently
02:43:52speaking, there is no prompter in front of
02:43:54any camera. The on-screen faces
02:43:58of Halk TV do not read a pre-written
02:44:01text by looking at a prompter. They express
02:44:04their thoughts freely within the framework
02:44:08of their personal and professional responsibilities.
02:44:12While doing this, they strictly adhere to universal
02:44:15professional principles. Therefore,
02:44:18I ask you to continue to increase your support
02:44:22for Halk TV. Because for Turkey to breathe a
02:44:26democratic atmosphere, it greatly needs Halk TV
02:44:29to continue its existence. Mr. Dunar, you touched
02:44:33on such a beautiful and accurate point, which is also
02:44:36very compatible with today's issues. That's why I call Halk TV viewers
02:44:40"Great Halk TV viewers." Like "Great Fenerbahçe fans" and so on.
02:44:44Great Halk TV viewers. Yes, we don't get a single penny
02:44:47from public institutions and organizations, but they have such
02:44:50appreciation and such respect and love that
02:44:54in my many years in this profession, of course, my professional life is nothing
02:45:34Let's do it, but for a minute, why has the general headquarters started making consecutive statements
02:45:37regarding the president's candidacy? Statements are coming that there
02:45:41is no legal or constitutional
02:45:43obstacle. I think that the
02:45:47normative situation, the rule-bound situation, is
02:45:51behind us. They will enter this process as they please,
02:45:54and I don't think they have achieved legitimacy. For
02:45:57the opposition, will they say no to early elections,
02:46:01as Mr. Mithat Hoca said?
02:46:04They will use that. I think the main
02:46:07problem is that they will go into the election
02:46:11by exaggerating the opposition's legitimacy problem. Now,
02:46:14as I was entering the broadcast, we were constantly
02:46:17messaging. Today, it's a disastrous situation, yesterday,
02:46:20today. Now, our journalist friends, Tuğba
02:46:23Tekerek, yes, her arrest is being requested right now for reporting in Georgia.
02:46:40See you later. Let's take a break for the third hour.
02:46:42Let's
02:46:48come back at the top of the hour.
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03:00:00football to the fullest.
03:00:09Orbus. Yes, we are starting the 4th hour. We are
03:00:13discussing the hot topics of domestic politics, but we
03:00:16will go to Washington, as there was a very
03:00:20important meeting at the White House. The person who
03:00:23held the meeting was the Minister of Justice, as
03:00:27everyone knows Trump's demand, especially for
03:00:30voting by mail, before the elections to be
03:00:33held in November. Therefore, the statement to be made
03:00:37by the Minister of Justice and the messages he would
03:00:40give at the press conference were also
03:00:43important, and with all its splendor, our beloved
03:00:46Serra Karaçam, Halk TV's Washington correspondent, will
03:00:50convey what's happening there with her smiling face. Now,
03:00:53should we start with the Minister of Justice holding
03:00:57a meeting at the White House? Or should we go
03:01:00to where the mail-in voting issue will evolve? I will immediately
03:01:05give the floor to you, dear Serra. Please convey it.
03:01:08Yes, thank you very much. Today, it is indeed an
03:01:12unusual sight for the Minister of Justice to
03:01:15choose the White House as the venue for his press
03:01:19conference. The White House Press Secretary, after having her second child,
03:01:23left her post, but actually the main reason
03:01:26was President Trump's departure from Ankara in
03:01:29a food cargo plane instead of a regular
03:01:33plane after security concerns, and putting
03:01:37his press secretary in such a known threat
03:01:40is said to have made her make this decision. She
03:01:43then left her post, saying she would take
03:01:47care of her child. For this reason, various
03:01:50administration officials and ministers come to the
03:01:54White House podium because no new person has been
03:01:58appointed, and they hold press conferences here.
03:02:01However, this situation is not customary for
03:02:05the Minister of Justice, because the Minister of Justice
03:02:08is expected to be more impartial, even if he
03:02:12has an ideological affiliation, at least
03:02:15symbolically, they usually do not speak at
03:02:19the administration's rostrum here. The FBI
03:02:23can come, other directors can come and give
03:02:26information, but today, in this sense, the
03:02:30press conference in the Rose Garden of the
03:02:32White House, especially being announced and held
03:02:36here one day after the Constitutional Court's decision, was therefore
03:02:39significant. We can say that it was
03:02:43an unprecedented event and it naturally brought
03:02:46new questions about independence back to the agenda.
03:02:49Let's talk about the Supreme Court's the process of distributing ballots
03:02:52in states like he thought he could consolidate
03:02:56his powers in the federal government. Objections came from lower
03:02:59courts. On August 24, the Supreme Court temporarily
03:03:03gave permission to Trump, but yesterday the final
03:03:06decision came, and it was said that he would not be able to
03:03:10do this because the elections would be at risk.
03:03:13Let's provide this background information. Of course, the Minister of Justice
03:03:17came out today and said that the president's goal
03:03:21is not to prevent people from voting or restrict them, but on the contrary,
03:03:25he supports free and fair elections. He explained, "We took this step
03:03:28to prevent illegal voting, voting by non-citizens,
03:03:32and to prevent duplicate voting."
03:03:36Therefore, this decision
03:03:40will not actually hinder our work. We will continue
03:03:42our investigations into those who vote again or who vote
03:03:46while being immigrants. He gave the message
03:03:49that we will continue these investigations, but
03:03:52for now, the post office will continue to distribute
03:03:55the existing envelopes and ballots of the states. The restrictive
03:03:59provisions they wanted will not
03:04:02be implemented. The president also had
03:04:06other messages from the Minister of Justice today, but if there is anything you want to ask, let me take that first
03:04:09and then we can continue, because
03:04:12especially in our conversation in between,
03:04:15there is also a decision taken regarding
03:04:17the broadcasting license. Now, it is clear to us how important
03:04:21the Radio and Television Supreme Council is. So, when I heard
03:04:24there was a decision about those licenses, I thought it was
03:04:28worth asking. Yes, actually, there might be a slight misunderstanding
03:04:31there. I wanted to contribute to your broadcast
03:04:34with what regulations RTÜK here makes
03:04:38regarding the issue. No important question about licenses was asked
03:04:41to the Minister of Justice at this meeting today, but let me just say
03:04:45that here too, there is a commission called the FCC,
03:04:48and as a regulatory body,
03:04:52this commission normally, independently of the views of its officials,
03:04:56does not consider editorial viewpoints but other
03:04:59requirements, such as certain content for children and families,
03:05:02and to guarantee
03:05:05true independence, all candidates
03:05:09should speak for an equal amount of time. If a candidate from
03:05:12one state speaks, their opponent should speak
03:05:16for the same number of minutes.
03:05:28they got into serious legal trouble, because instead of protecting the freedom of expression article of the constitution,
03:05:31they took steps towards punishment, towards threatening
03:05:35with license renewal. They started an investigation
03:05:38without waiting for the time when licenses are normally renewed every 8 years
03:05:42for ABC and Channel 8, and with this license stick,
03:05:45they enabled them to self-censor,
03:05:48meaning instead of directly
03:05:51prohibiting speech, they put pressure
03:05:54on channels and intermediaries,
03:05:57and thus on advertisers, banks,
03:06:00and payment systems that advertise on those channels,
03:06:04and indirectly shaped
03:06:08things. My God,
03:06:10how far away these things are from us. I mean, you're explaining it now,
03:06:14and I just can't believe it. It means
03:06:28that they haven't gotten their share of democracy, as far as I understand, but at least something is coming from the judiciary,
03:06:32let's add that. Of course, now, when did this discussion
03:06:35first come up? We've been talking about the Iran war for months,
03:06:39you know, the Iran war is the number one topic
03:06:41even in prime time slots. For a long time,
03:06:45they started labeling some news
03:06:49about the administration's failures regarding the Iran war as fake news,
03:06:52and they threatened to revoke the licenses
03:06:55of those channels if they continued to report
03:06:59with such an approach. Trump even explicitly told a reporter,
03:07:02"You shouldn't have a license. How can you ask if Iran
03:07:06has been defeated?" Also, there was an important
03:07:09programmer named Jimmy Kimmel on ABC. He recently
03:07:12interviewed a senator, but due to pressure,
03:07:16on the grounds that the other party was not given enough time,
03:07:18they had to upload the interview to YouTube; it could not be broadcast
03:07:22on the channel. So, they act as if they support
03:07:26diversity, and they say that's why they are doing it, but it always
03:07:29works for one side. It always works when there is a Democratic interview,
03:07:33because it was not biased against the other side. Therefore, lawsuits are currently
03:07:36ongoing. Broadcasters, especially
03:07:39television broadcasters, are given fewer rights
03:07:43than the written press. That is, while the written press
03:07:46has a jurisprudence that protects freedom of expression,
03:07:50television broadcasters do not. This is also
03:07:53being re-evaluated. Of course, journalists are no longer satisfied,
03:07:57because, for example, the owner of the Washington Post,
03:08:00Jeff Bezos, is known to be close to the administration,
03:08:03because he is a businessman. They resigned from the Washington Post
03:08:07and moved to Washington Sanayi, we talked about that
03:08:10a few days ago. The press part is like this. Our viewers who compare,
03:08:13in the first part, with the comments of dear Uğur Dündar,
03:08:17let them combine it with what I have told them
03:08:21and compare it themselves. But they will follow you,
03:08:24because they were curious about what you would say,
03:08:26dear Serra. Yes, now the Minister of Justice.
03:08:30Let me mention a few short headlines, and then I'll leave the floor to you.
03:08:34You know, there was news yesterday that a Russian businessman,
03:08:38allegedly close to Putin, had contributed hundreds
03:08:41of thousands of dollars as a wedding gift
03:08:45for President Trump's son's wedding. This was also asked to the Minister of Justice.
03:08:49A brave journalist asked, "Will you investigate these claims?
03:08:53Is there any impropriety here? A businessman, said to be close
03:08:57to a foreign head of state, while in office." You know,
03:09:01the wedding just happened, and Trump couldn't even attend, let's remind that. To this question,
03:09:04he replied that it would be difficult to investigate
03:09:07the wedding gift, and he said that they didn't
03:09:11have enough information. He said that the claim that he was Putin's friend
03:09:14was just a claim, and there was no evidence to prove it. Therefore, he refrained from giving
03:09:18details, but journalists are not afraid to ask questions.
03:09:22This alone is an important assessment of the situation, I think.
03:09:26Another topic, as you know, there are very strict
03:09:29immigration policies. To the extent that an investigation
03:09:33was launched into Representative Ilhan Omar. There were rumors for months,
03:09:36for years, that she married her brother to give him
03:09:39legal status. This was asked to the Minister of Justice,
03:09:43and he said he did not want to comment on an ongoing investigation.
03:09:46Again, regarding the ideological polarization in institutions,
03:09:50"Are you taking any steps in this regard? Everywhere is taken over by a certain
03:09:53ideology." He said that the ideology
03:09:56of any federal employee, whether Republican
03:10:00or Democrat, is not a good thing. "We are doing our best
03:10:03to prevent this." Let's add this immediately:
03:10:06there is serious judicial cooperation between Turkey and the United States,
03:10:10especially the FBI. Two important individuals
03:10:13sought by America were extradited from Turkey to Turkey.
03:10:16One is a terrorist, and the other
03:10:19is an individual who committed healthcare fraud and misused public funds.
03:10:23Their names are İbrahim Haldun and Muhammed Bakır Elsadi, an Iraqi
03:10:27national with links to the Iranian Revolutionary Guard.
03:10:33Turkey immediately arrested and extradited
03:10:36these two individuals, but while these individuals
03:10:39who fled from America were coming, there are also individuals
03:10:43that Turkey wants, for example, Umut Altaş, whose extradition
03:10:47case is still ongoing. There is an important witness,
03:10:51perhaps also a suspect, in the Gülistan Doku Murder case,
03:10:54and he has important information about the governor's son.
03:10:58This cooperation always works for one side, meaning in favor of America.
03:11:02We see that it is not progressing. Another important file
03:11:05is Taşkın Torlak, who had to confess his crime
03:11:08in the Venezuela sanctions case after being held in prison.
03:11:12He was caught while the owner of the company he worked for
03:11:15was being sought, even though it was not his own company. Despite
03:11:18his confession, he was not allowed to return home, while other
03:11:22individuals were waiting at home. His process
03:11:26will be determined. There are issues like these. And finally, another Turkish
03:11:30citizen, Mustafa Mollaoğlu, was arrested in Panama
03:11:34as part of an American operation for violating Iranian sanctions.
03:11:37But there is a confidentiality order, so how consistent
03:11:40or inconsistent this cooperation is, these are important test
03:11:44points. Thank you very much, dear Serra Karaçam. With all your energy,
03:11:48you summarized the agenda of the United States in one breath,
03:11:50in one go. Good luck,
03:11:54and good broadcasts. Thank you, Ercüment Akdeniz. Before we went to the break,
03:11:57you had started to explain how what happened in the country
03:12:00in the last 24 hours would shed light on the upcoming period.
03:12:04Please, if you remember where you left off, let's continue from there. Of course, yes,
03:12:08you are discussing whether there will be an early election.
03:12:11Now, when we look at that medium-term program,
03:12:14we see signs that the election has been brought forward. This was discussed,
03:12:17but we also need to look at the operations.
03:12:20That is, operations against municipalities, operations against the main
03:12:23opposition were already
03:12:26systematized, but this situation has now
03:12:30reached an interesting point in the last few days.
03:12:33As a news center at İlke TV, I'm sure
03:12:36you are struggling to follow at Halk TV. Şükrü Bey
03:12:39is also very knowledgeable. Now I'm taking notes, I'll catch up.
03:12:45He can be arrested at any moment, his statement is being taken.
03:12:49This was done within the scope of LGBT operations, but our journalist
03:12:52friends, Canhan Coşkun and Kazım Kızıl,
03:12:56our journalist friends,
03:12:58are now being investigated in connection with the Rabia Naz file,
03:13:02with a request for 14 years in prison. We already
03:13:05know Selahattin Günday, he was arrested for the second time,
03:13:09for the second time. Now today again,
03:13:12Şebnem Korur Fincancı, Erol Önder, former RSF
03:13:16representative, Turkey representative Ali Nesin, and other names
03:13:20were brought before the court again in the Özgür Gündem case, which was
03:13:23actually a closed case. Now, the decision to continue
03:13:26Nadiye Gürbüz's detention was given. While all
03:13:30this is happening, one should probably think,
03:13:33as the press area, the area of press freedom,
03:13:37is narrowing so much, how will the opposition go to the elections?
03:13:40It has no voice, no right to receive information. Therefore,
03:13:45let me also say this, Ertunç Bey, Evrensel newspaper,
03:13:49meaning the daily Evrensel newspaper, has 1 million followers
03:13:52on X, and an access block
03:13:55was imposed on it, and it does labor journalism. Now we are talking
03:13:58about the diesel price hike, we are talking about the workers'
03:14:02problems. How will unions and laborers make their voices heard now?
03:14:05You come to the Ali İsmail Korkmaz Foundation. Ali İsmail
03:14:09Korkmaz was lynched in a very brutal and cruel way
03:14:12in the middle of the street in Eskişehir and
03:14:15killed. His mother Emel Anne, along with
03:14:18his family, his elder brother, lawyer Gürkan
03:14:22Korkmaz, established a foundation that provides
03:14:25scholarships to children, and education. There is nothing else. How can you block access
03:14:29to this account? Why do you block access?
03:14:32They say there will be a process for peace academics,
03:14:35and steps will be taken, etc. But you say peace,
03:14:39and then access to the peace academics' account
03:14:42was blocked. Amnesty International's was blocked.
03:14:45It's endless. Now, when things are like this,
03:14:49what a dark tunnel we are entering, and
03:14:52will there really be a chance for a normal election,
03:14:55even at a minimum level, in this dark tunnel?
03:14:58Will it be an equal race between parties?
03:15:02I mean, looking at it from here, there is also an operation
03:15:05against socialists today. 39 people
03:15:09were detained. Probably there are arrests, I can't follow
03:15:12it now. For example, one of them is Mert Titiz, the president
03:15:16of the Socialist Refoundation Party. The president was taken
03:15:19into custody within the scope of this investigation. These are also
03:15:22a component party of the HDP. Moreover, the process,
03:15:25etc., there were concerns about trust in the process,
03:15:29which it increased. You talk about a new constitution, don't you? "We will bring
03:15:33it on October 1st, we will discuss it." Who
03:15:35will you have a social consensus with? You arrest journalists,
03:15:39you judge people for their gender, you include them
03:15:42in the scope, you criminalize them, you operate against municipalities
03:15:46every day, you turn the name of the main opposition party
03:15:50into a problem. I don't take that
03:15:54lightly at all. Let's see what comes out of there,
03:15:57including the issue of electoral eligibility. Also, Fatih Yıldız,
03:16:01for example, made an interesting post.
03:16:04I don't know if you talked about it, but please tell us, or
03:16:07let's introduce a new threshold for parties in the system.
03:16:11But the election law...
03:16:22Şükrü Bey, as far as I understand, Ercüment Akdeniz's concern
03:16:26and question is this: as a journalist, he cannot foresee
03:16:30a normal election climate. He asks how it will be. Excuse me, before I hand over to Şükrü Bey,
03:16:33let me just connect with one sentence. I'm also curious
03:16:37about Şükrü Bey's thoughts. After all, we are colleagues. So,
03:16:41parties, the opposition as a whole,
03:16:43everyone has many problems,
03:16:47but can't they come together and fight for press freedom,
03:16:50against censorship, can't they have a very strong
03:16:53rally, a very strong opposition? I mean, if journalists
03:16:57cannot be protected today, when will they be protected?
03:17:00How will this blockade be broken?
03:17:03This also needs to happen. Not just one party,
03:17:06but all the opposition, all the unions, all civil
03:17:10society, all together, can't they do something like this? Take a breath.
03:17:27We are easily expecting arrests,
03:17:31social media posts are constantly
03:17:33being banned, and they are forced to create new ones.
03:17:36I have been in this profession for 45 years,
03:17:40believe me, we used to not like
03:17:43what was happening, we would criticize it.
03:17:46Those days were days of freedom for journalists.
03:17:49Unfortunately, we have come to that point. For example, we keep
03:17:53saying it, but nobody... Don't simplify this.
03:17:57I have been saying since the beginning that journalists
03:17:59use their power to inform the public,
03:18:03to spread news to the public. Just as judges
03:18:06and magistrates make decisions on behalf of the people,
03:18:10journalists also observe and watch on behalf of the people,
03:18:13and convey it to the people. Now, for example,
03:18:16in an administration of a party that prides itself
03:18:19on having the largest courthouse in the world
03:18:23and has "justice" in its name. Journalists
03:18:26are seated like refugees in a corner
03:18:30of the hall. However, a journalist should
03:18:34be in a position to see the judicial
03:18:38personnel, the defendants, and the defense personnel,
03:18:41because even the smallest hand gestures and facial expressions
03:18:44between them, to give a simple example,
03:18:48carry news value, and the public needs to know these.
03:18:51That is, they need to see any such movement of a judge,
03:18:55a prosecutor, a defense lawyer, or a defendant, and report
03:18:58it to the public. But no, I also stated this
03:19:02in the first section, or rather,
03:19:05when talking about the advertising embargoes
03:19:08against the media.
03:19:11The ethical principles of the media have been destroyed.
03:19:14The freedom to receive and disseminate news has been abolished.
03:19:17Look, journalism has become a simple accusation.
03:19:21What was that fake news,
03:19:27what was the classic saying, misinformation, spreading misleading information.
03:19:30I don't want to memorize spreading misleading information
03:19:33publicly because we might become accustomed to it.
03:19:37We shouldn't become accustomed to it. It shouldn't be that easy,
03:19:40but this disinformation law was passed. Look,
03:19:44it was said that this was not related to journalists, but under
03:19:48the pretext of the disinformation law, our friends are being arrested
03:19:51and detained. They remain in prison for months, for years.
03:19:55They remain in custody.
03:19:57I think this is not just an opposition
03:20:00problem, but also a government problem. That is,
03:20:04the government should also be meticulous about media
03:20:08freedom. We may be right to criticize
03:20:11the opposition for not protecting it, but our main message
03:20:14is, "Oh government, you have the power.
03:20:17If you believe in the public's right to information
03:20:20in this country, then you must free the media,
03:20:24you must free journalists, not newspaper
03:20:27owners, not media moguls.
03:20:30You must especially free journalists."
03:20:33Unfortunately, since the AK Party came
03:20:36to power, it has taken no steps
03:20:40that would make us happy or pleased in this regard.
03:20:43On the contrary, today, as in every
03:20:47area of life, it is using excessive force
03:20:49in the media area
03:20:52and choosing to suppress the media
03:20:56in one way or another. For that reason,
03:20:59a very strong voice must be raised,
03:21:03and this must be done by all parties.
03:21:06This voice must be raised, and the media that claims
03:21:10to be close to the government should remember
03:21:13ethical principles again, I think.
03:21:16The real problem is there. In the past, there were
03:21:20media organizations with different ideologies,
03:21:22but when it came to journalistic
03:21:25principles, when it came to journalistic
03:21:28ethics, there was generally
03:21:31a very broad area where they agreed,
03:21:34and they could come together. But today it is not
03:21:38like that. We are in a completely different world.
03:21:41That is, no one should see this as a simple example,
03:21:45but people who call themselves journalists come out and say,
03:21:48"This one should be thrown in jail, this one should suffer,
03:21:50this one should rot, this one should be imprisoned."
03:21:54This is a horrific picture. But where does this power come from?
03:21:58It comes from the government. When a well-known opposition
03:22:01journalist says the same thing, they are immediately investigated.
03:22:04But when someone close to the government says this,
03:22:07let alone an investigation, they are applauded.
03:22:10This situation, Ercüment Hoca,
03:22:14must change. And Turkey must change it.
03:22:17As I always say, the government has more responsibility.
03:22:21As long as the government loses its democratic
03:22:24maturity, it increases its pressure
03:22:27on the media. Today, I truly
03:22:31believe, they always say, for example, that Mr. President
03:22:34reads politics well. I no longer think Mr. President reads
03:22:37politics well, because if he read politics well,
03:22:41Üsküdar shouldn't be like this, there shouldn't be so much pressure
03:22:45on the media, because these cause the government
03:22:48to lose its legitimacy, these cause the government,
03:22:51or rather the AK Party, to experience an erosion
03:22:55of trust among the people,
03:22:59and today these suppressions
03:23:02are also seen by their own voter
03:23:06base. They cannot stomach
03:23:09what is happening in Üsküdar. "Is this all our power?"
03:23:12I mean, look, today,
03:23:16I was chatting today, Ms. Sinema,
03:23:19and do you know what the person across from me said? "Oh,
03:23:22Şükrü Bey," he said, "it's very easy to win municipal elections now."
03:23:26"How so?" I asked. "What will happen? 4 transfers,
03:23:303 detentions, 2 arrests. You've won the municipality,
03:23:33the council members." Now, if this is being talked about
03:23:37in Turkey, if this is being talked about,
03:23:40then the government has really lost the trust of the voters.
03:23:43This is due to excessive use of force.
03:23:46Today, there is only one thing the government knows.
03:23:50I mean, in that sense, I say, "I will use force,
03:23:53I will use excessive force. By using excessive force,
03:23:56I will get the desired result, I will protect my power." No, no.
03:24:00The voters see this, and in Turkey,
03:24:02an election cannot be avoided.
03:24:07The voters see that the economy cannot recover,
03:24:11that the price of a liter of diesel has now reached
03:24:15triple digits, or is starting to reach them.
03:24:18What was always said?
03:24:21"The economy wants predictability,
03:24:25the economy wants legal regulations
03:24:27to be implemented, and the judiciary
03:24:31not to be instrumentalized." In such climates,
03:24:34economies can recover. Now,
03:24:38there is a war near us, that's true, it was in Russia and Ukraine,
03:24:42and there is one between the US and Iran, but how right is it to evaluate
03:24:45this current situation only by geopolitical risks
03:24:48or the developments around us? Now, we say
03:24:52the real agenda of the citizen, of course, we know
03:24:56the economy, we are aware. The price of diesel reaching
03:24:59100 liras today. Please, I would like to ask
03:25:02the director, Murat Erdoğan, to project the visuals
03:25:06on the screen. How it came from where to where. That is,
03:25:09in 2021, the price of a liter of diesel,
03:25:13which reached double digits, is now on the verge of triple digits
03:25:175 years later. That is, as of yesterday,
03:25:20after the confirmed 6.62 increase,
03:25:23it exceeded 90 liras in Istanbul, and reached 95 liras
03:25:26in Batman and other places. Look at what it was and what it became.
03:25:30At the end of 2021, the price of a liter of diesel
03:25:33was 11.50. At the end of 2022, it was 22.0.
03:25:38At the end of 2023, it was 36.40.
03:25:41At the end of 2024, it was 43.20.
03:25:44In 2025, that is, last December,
03:25:48the price of a liter of diesel, which was 65 liras,
03:25:52is currently 96 liras.
03:25:55The increase in diesel in 5 years is 841%.
03:25:59The increase since the beginning of the year
03:26:02is 50%. So, there's that classic saying now,
03:26:05"I always buy for 50 liras." "No matter how much it increases."
03:26:09Now, with our largest banknote,
03:26:12200 liras, you can buy 2 liters of gasoline.
03:26:15Ertunçöz, you're giving away your biggest banknote for 200 liras,
03:26:19and it gives you 2 liters of petrol or diesel,
03:26:23that is, when we look at the price per liter of diesel in countries at war,
03:26:26you'll say that Iran is already a rich country in terms of resources,
03:26:30but in Syria, it's between 49 and 70 liras, and there
03:26:34were protests here too, about the increase in fuel prices.
03:26:37Is the price hike only affecting fuel, Ertunçöz? I mean,
03:26:41we're not such an unconscious society that we don't know
03:26:44that this increase, re-evaluation, and
03:26:48re-pricing of everything, from needles to thread, has a huge impact.
03:26:51Let's leave aside needles and thread, I don't want to digress,
03:26:55but we go to trials in Silivri, right? The cost for a lawyer or
03:26:58a defendant to go to and from a trial in Silivri
03:27:01is 2,500 liras. Think about it, we're talking about
03:27:05a fair trial, you're going to go, represent
03:27:08yourself at the trial, give your statement there,
03:27:11or ask questions to other defendants.
03:27:14You go 4 days a week, so you need to spend
03:27:1710,000 to 12,000 liras a week
03:27:21just to attend a trial. This is truly unacceptable,
03:27:24and the situation is clear, we haven't even reached the end of 2026 yet. There's a nearly
03:27:2750% increase every year, but we don't see
03:27:31a 50% increase in retirement pensions, minimum
03:27:34wages, or other earnings. We saw the same
03:27:37thing with rents. And now,
03:27:41today, an operation was carried out against fruit and vegetable sellers, wasn't it?
03:27:45An operation was launched regarding exorbitant prices for fruit and vegetables after complaints.
03:27:48Of course, whoever is guilty, whoever is responsible, can be prosecuted,
03:27:52and they can serve their sentence whatever it may be. But
03:27:55is only the fruit and vegetable seller at the market guilty, or
03:27:59is the producer guilty, who is trying to produce with this diesel and
03:28:02these fertilizer prices, and despite all this, is trying to make
03:28:06a profit of 3 or 5 liras?
03:28:09How will they do it? How will they produce with these
03:28:13prices? Look, diesel is indispensable for the villager,
03:28:16for the tradesman, indispensable for transportation. That 10-lira increase
03:28:20here in Istanbul will perhaps come to our table as 300
03:28:23liras, perhaps it will come as 1,000 liras
03:28:27in our other businesses, in our other indirect expenses.
03:28:30What did they used to say? "I always buy 50 liras worth." Now
03:28:34with 50 liras, you can't even smell the diesel, and even if the equivalent
03:28:37of 50 liras in today's inflation was 500 liras, you would still be ashamed
03:28:41to buy 500 liras worth of petrol for your car. When I pass by the gas station,
03:28:45I say, "Quickly, 1000, 100 liras." I'm ashamed to say it because it's gone in
03:28:49a second. We are talking about such an economy.
03:28:52What are we talking about as lawyers? Legal predictability.
03:28:55If you don't ensure legal predictability,
03:28:58if you take someone from their home in the early morning
03:29:02with a newspaper headline, if you conduct operations against poultry farmers one day,
03:29:05greengrocers another day, and oil producers another,
03:29:09and appoint trustees, then in a state
03:29:12of law, if people don't feel safe under the protection
03:29:15of the law, if the law is not working as it should,
03:29:19but instead is changed by daily
03:29:21practices, then these prices will be 500 liras, 600 liras,
03:29:25we cannot stop this. What are we talking about? A tight monetary policy, right?
03:29:29This is what Mehmet Şimşek announced, a situation where taxes are increased
03:29:32and the burden on the people is heavier. But
03:29:36while these continue, unlawful trials continue,
03:29:40injustice continues, detention is a last resort,
03:29:43we say, appointing a trustee is a last resort. You need
03:29:47to present concrete evidence, you need to find that this company is "really
03:29:50an element of crime, that its assets are being laundered or that this company
03:29:54was established with it," you need to say that so you can appoint a trustee. But
03:29:57without even taking statements,
03:30:01you're seizing companies, you open a file for people,
03:30:05"Oh, let's take them into investigation, let's proceed to prosecution. Sorry,
03:30:09we kept you in custody for 4 or 5 days, and then mistakenly imprisoned you for a month or two, you're acquitted," you say.
03:30:13In a situation where you cannot foresee anything, you can neither
03:30:15invest your money anywhere, nor is there a situation
03:30:19where you can get a return on your invested money.
03:30:23How will social consensus be formed, how will
03:30:26this economy change, and how will we enter the elections?
03:30:30I think that has been abandoned as well, because of the Üsküdar election, as
03:30:34Mr. Şükrü said earlier. Which AK Party member, which
03:30:38Nationalist Movement Party member, would say, "Oh, good, we won this"?
03:30:42"How nice that we won, and the national will found its expression."
03:30:45Would someone with an average intelligence level who can
03:30:48comprehend and interpret events really say that? Now, since
03:30:52the situation is like this,
03:30:56come to Mr. Ercüment again, because your sentence was
03:31:00left unfinished a moment ago. Now, from this point forward, is there
03:31:03any citizen who believes that food prices will decrease and purchasing
03:31:07power will normalize, not increase?
03:31:11Let's listen to what a citizen says today.
03:31:14Let's play
03:31:17his voice. There's been a price hike, friend. Today we filled our tank again for 4 liras.
03:31:20God willing, what's going to happen with this? Price hike on everything, price hike on everything.
03:31:24They should find a solution to this. I can't go to the market,
03:31:27we can't go shopping. Diesel, diesel
03:31:31means price hike on everything. We're fed up, enough is enough.
03:31:34I can't go to the market, I can't go to the bazaar. Price hike on diesel means price hike
03:31:38on everything. So, do you think a citizen, from this point
03:31:41power will increase,
03:31:45or that food prices, to take the simplest example, will decrease?
03:31:48Do you have such a belief? No.
03:31:52Nobody does. How could they? Look, today,
03:31:55when I was coming here, my wife told me, she wrote it down.
03:31:58I went and bought it, believe me, it's an ordinary market, not luxury
03:32:02or anything, I'm being honest. 1 kg of minced
03:32:05meat and 600 grams of sautéed
03:32:09meat cost 2044
03:32:11liras. 2044 liras for
03:32:14minced meat and sautéed meat, 600 grams of sautéed meat and 1
03:32:18kg of minced meat. You go to the market,
03:32:21as I said earlier, you're faced with a terrible situation,
03:32:24and the minimum wage and purchasing power are clear.
03:32:27The government, while it should really
03:32:30be dealing with these issues,
03:32:34does not convince us about its goal in this regard.
03:32:38That's why I insist, there is no country in the world
03:32:41that has a policy of fighting chronic inflation.
03:32:45Look, not inflation itself, but fighting inflation.
03:32:48At most, this takes two years and then it's over. But
03:32:51Turkey has been fighting inflation for almost 10
03:32:54years, because the system is wrong.
03:32:57Look, they said, "Give us the authority, and you'll see the impact." At that time, inflation
03:33:01was 15%, and it was even considered high.
03:33:05Exchange rates were around 4 liras,
03:33:08and interest was at 9%. Today, Mr. Hoca is gone.
03:33:11That is, 20 liras of every 100
03:33:15liras of tax go to interest. You are the world
03:33:18champion in inflation. Food inflation.
03:33:22It's impossible to understand how Turkey can be the champion
03:33:26in food inflation. In August, Ms. Sinema,
03:33:28in August, inflation was at zero levels.
03:33:31It's always like that in Turkey, because vegetables and fruits are most abundant
03:33:35in June, it comes out like that. Uh, Mr. Şükü,
03:33:38how is it that June inflation comes out as zero, and then
03:33:42in July things happen? That's due to the wage policy,
03:33:45but inflation is around 2%, approaching
03:33:492%. This is a very high rate.
03:33:52Why? Because you are not following the right policies.
03:33:56Mr. Ertunç said it, you used to carry out
03:33:59operations against hoarders, against gas station owners. Now
03:34:03it's about, "Oh, from the field to here,
03:34:06the price is like this, it forms like that." How does
03:34:09it form? Why did it form today, or did it
03:34:12form suddenly today? You are governing the country.
03:34:16This is an economic situation. This requires economic
03:34:19decisions. It cannot be prevented by police
03:34:23measures, really, Ms. Sinema. There is a malfunction here.
03:34:27You should prevent this. This is
03:34:30your priority. Being the government,
03:34:34you need to ensure that there is a truly healthy
03:34:38pricing policy for products reaching
03:34:41citizens from the field. This won't happen with police measures, it happens with the economic
03:34:44decisions you make, with the
03:34:47framework of regulations you adopt. But there's
03:34:51no such intention. I sincerely believe this now. That is, the government
03:34:54does not prioritize the economy, or restoring the economy. This is a choice,
03:34:58you mean this is a choice now? Is this an economic policy?
03:35:07It moved away from the victims, from the poor,
03:35:10and now it represents other groups.
03:35:13Therefore, in this country, the share of national
03:35:17income received by workers
03:35:20and the poor has shifted almost 10
03:35:23points in favor of
03:35:25the wealthy in the last 10 years.
03:35:28Look, I am making a truly bold statement.
03:35:31In Turkey,
03:35:39a party that came to power saying it would eliminate poverty and destitution. I no longer believe
03:35:43that this, especially the inflation policy,
03:35:47is like this: "When this happens, our tax revenues are higher,
03:35:50so the state doesn't need to save,
03:35:54the state can spend more, and
03:35:57then our spending power increases." I think
03:36:01they look at it that way. I'm not an economist, but I repeat,
03:36:05we've become somewhat familiar with economics, or we've received some
03:36:08education in it at university. It's not possible,
03:36:11such a long-term fight against inflation is not possible.
03:36:14Sinema, it's not possible. And look at the success,
03:36:1832%. Argentina reduced
03:36:21its inflation from 250% to 30% in 2 years.
03:36:24I guess, then, the fight against inflation... Excuse me for interrupting, but you
03:36:28say that you can't fight for so long. Is the long duration of the fight
03:36:31against inflation entirely the government's
03:36:35choice and policy, or is it an outcome of the political
03:36:39climate we're in? Is it a mandatory
03:36:42outcome of what's happening?
03:36:45Look, if you intend to reduce inflation,
03:36:48you would ensure that Turkey rises to the top ranks
03:36:52in terms of the rule of law. You would demonstrate
03:36:54democratic maturity, you would eliminate the pressure
03:36:58on the opposition and the media. You would grant the opposition
03:37:02the same freedom as yourself. If you don't do these things,
03:37:05you cannot prevent inflation. It won't happen with police measures,
03:37:09Ms. Sinema, because you are not a country
03:37:12governed by a dictatorship. Even those countries
03:37:15make very different calculations when making
03:37:19economic decisions. Look, today,
03:37:2223 medium-term programs
03:37:25have been announced, Ms. Sinema. What was the inflation target
03:37:29for 3 years later when it was first announced in 2005?
03:37:325%. That is, in 2025,
03:37:36in 2005, in 2008, inflation was
03:37:40supposed to be 5% in 2008. And
03:37:44today, in the medium-term program for one year
03:37:47later, there's a 12% discrepancy
03:37:50in your inflation calculation. This is too much,
03:37:53really, this is too much. Especially if you have
03:37:57appointed an expert in this field
03:38:00who claims to be following a rational policy – let's name
03:38:03him, Mehmet Şimşek – and despite this, these issues are still
03:38:06at 32%, and you're saying, "Oh, how nice,
03:38:09inflation is finally
03:38:12falling." Let's also not forget, Ms. Sinema, that Mr. President
03:38:16says the same thing every year: "Turkey's star
03:38:20is shining, we are doing these things with qualified
03:38:22personnel, with capable people. Our medium-term program
03:38:26is strong, the measures we have taken are strong.
03:38:30You will see, Turkey will be a shining country."
03:38:34But the people's star has never shone, nor has Turkey's,
03:38:37and it won't shine with this inflation. But the reason
03:38:40is related to this law you apply,
03:38:44to political life, to the independence
03:38:47of institutions, to the decisions
03:38:51concerning the central bank. If you insist on changing
03:38:54the central bank president every year, Ms. Sinema, it won't work.
03:38:58You cannot convince us that you are fighting
03:39:00inflation. That is, if you say you don't
03:39:03know about interest rate policy, how it should be, and
03:39:07for this reason you change ministers, and change central
03:39:11bank policies, it won't work. This is just an indication
03:39:15that you don't want to prevent
03:39:17inflation. More impoverishment.
03:39:19I guess it's thought that as
03:39:22poverty increases, the education level probably
03:39:25drops, and then those who vote for us
03:39:29increase, because they had such a thesis, you know.
03:39:32As the education level drops, the group
03:39:36deputy leaders said, "Those who vote for us are increasing." But they don't realize
03:39:40that the world is not Turkey 20 years ago,
03:39:43nor is it Turkey 50 years ago. People,
03:39:47one way or another, learn from their daily
03:39:50lives, from their daily experiences. You can silence
03:39:54the media as much as you want, silence the opposition. People go
03:39:57to the market every day, to the greengrocer, to the supermarket,
03:40:01and there they face reality.
03:40:05Now, these price hikes, Ercüment Akdeniz, have become
03:40:08a fundamental economic indicator that determines all pricing
03:40:12behaviors. That is, transportation,
03:40:16production costs. What kind of situation are citizens
03:40:19facing now? Even if we assume that the elections will be held
03:40:23on time, the government still has expectations of being able
03:40:27to fix the economy. The OVP was announced the other day,
03:40:30and there were some discrepancies, or rather, updates.
03:40:34But now, it's clear that things won't go as planned,
03:40:38whether due to this, or that, or geopolitical developments,
03:40:41or internal political unpredictability.
03:40:44With what kind of preparation, in terms of economy,
03:40:48will the government enter the election climate?
03:40:52Exactly. Now, prices will increase for everything,
03:40:55and it will be severe. That's very
03:40:58clear. And will it stop at 100 liras? Will diesel stop? Yes, how far
03:41:02will it go? Until the elections, these are cumulative price hikes.
03:41:05This means, if it is thought,
03:41:09"Oh, we have allocated a certain budget, it's also in the OVP,
03:41:13we will do some work on pensions and minimum wages just before the elections,"
03:41:17this is what is
03:41:19being done now, and the price hikes that will come until then
03:41:22will wipe it out. That's over, that's in the past. It's not
03:41:26easy. The government's job is really difficult
03:41:30in this regard. But if we ask if this is a choice, a mistake,
03:41:33or incompetence, I think it's a choice. There's
03:41:37a segment of 8-10 million people in Turkey. If you have
03:41:41money, if you have financial power, if you make money from money, you're not affected by anything.
03:41:44The rich get richer. But the base is crumbling,
03:41:47the majority is crumbling. When I hear diesel, the villager immediately comes
03:41:51to mind, the producing villager. If agriculture and animal husbandry
03:41:55go away, how will you ensure resilience
03:41:58during wartime, during periods of global conflict,
03:42:01crisis periods, pandemic periods? You're
03:42:05not a self-sufficient agricultural country. How will you ensure
03:42:09this? From that perspective, the situation is really
03:42:12not good. Now I remember the pandemic.
03:42:16It ravaged the whole world, and it ravaged the economy.
03:42:20It provided 1.4 or 1.7 trillion dollars in subsidies
03:42:23to its citizens, wage
03:42:26support. They can't work, so they don't starve, health
03:42:29services, etc., etc. Now, for example,
03:42:32we say there is an oil crisis, there is the Strait of Hormuz,
03:42:36now Yemen has been added. Now, the economy is fragile, okay.
03:42:40You have reduced industry, manufacturing, you say your services
03:42:43sector is strong. Excuse me, in times like these,
03:42:47the services sector won't save you. If your industry is not strong,
03:42:50if your employment is not strong, it won't save you. But
03:42:53what are you giving to your citizens during this period of hunger,
03:42:56poverty, and price hikes? What kind of subsidy are you giving?
03:43:00There was a sliding scale to balance it, yes,
03:43:03at least from taxes. Yes, maybe a regulation could be made in terms of taxes?
03:43:07I mean, with the situation like this, with the figures like this,
03:43:10the fact that these taxes will remain
03:43:14in force... They couldn't do that, it's over. That story is over.
03:43:17They removed it, they removed the protection measure. Now, the entire bill, the entire bitter
03:43:21pill, is on the shoulders of the citizens, the villagers, the workers,
03:43:24the retirees. I will conclude with this. Look,
03:43:28we are not the same as Syria, right? Syria
03:43:31came out of a civil war. As a journalist who has interviewed Syrians for years,
03:43:35I know very well. They returned.
03:43:38I still meet with them, I do interviews. We are not the same. There's no infrastructure,
03:43:42the economy is clearly not what they say it is.
03:43:45There is hunger, 70% of the country is hungry,
03:43:48etc. A 40%
03:43:51price hike on petrol
03:43:54there, and the people are protesting. So, can't
03:43:57we be as good as Syria? I'm asking this.
03:44:01That is, the citizen should also ask themselves.
03:44:04I absolutely don't want to make a comparison. Turkey is a more modern
03:44:07country. Capitalism in Turkey is much more advanced.
03:44:11The tradition of trade union and democratic struggle in Turkey
03:44:14is very strong. That is, the leftist tradition is very strong, the struggle
03:44:18to gain labor rights is very strong. It can't even be compared with Syria
03:44:21or Middle Eastern countries. But how many waves of price hikes is this,
03:44:25how many price hike frenzies? Then the citizen will ask themselves
03:44:28or look at their own history, what did we do in such
03:44:32periods of price hikes, what would the trade unions do?
03:44:36Now, the villagers are crying, that is, they are rebelling against diesel.
03:44:39What is the chamber of agriculture doing? What are the producer
03:44:43peasant unions doing? Workers are suffering, what are the trade union
03:44:47confederations doing? No one should be offended, but the citizen
03:44:51should prick themselves. That is,
03:44:54without unity, without seeking rights, without pressure
03:44:57from below, no one gives rights from above.
03:45:01That's where it has come to, unfortunately. That is, if
03:45:04we vote for this party, that party will save us. Parties are important,
03:45:08elections are important, of course, this is important, yes,
03:45:11of course it's important. But in Turkey's tradition,
03:45:14there has always been a democratic struggle from below,
03:45:18a trade union struggle from below, a struggle of workers from below.
03:45:22This struggle gains a little more bread,
03:45:26expands the democratic space a little more. It makes freedom
03:45:29free, develops trade union freedoms. If this is missing,
03:45:33no one from above will give anyone anything proper, no offense.
03:45:36So, here, elections
03:45:40are important, but the citizen should draw conclusions
03:45:43for themselves from a situation that is only focused on elections.
03:45:46In the past, there was a labor platform, there was a "no to privatization" platform.
03:45:50Look, we're talking about highways and bridges now.
03:45:52Is there a platform fighting against privatization?
03:45:56Why isn't there? There used to be. It could be done 20
03:45:59years ago. It could be said, "There's a lot of pressure, there's a more authoritarian system now,
03:46:03there's this..." But these are not excuses. There were these before, in the 90s,
03:46:06in the 1980 military coup. How did this country emerge
03:46:10in 1986, 1987? It emerged with student
03:46:13protests and worker protests. That's how freedoms were gained.
03:46:17How did the AKP come to power? Let's remember that too.
03:46:19I remember. How did the DSP-MHP-Anap coalition
03:46:23fall? Hundreds of thousands were in the streets
03:46:26protesting price hikes. They were protesting that.
03:46:29That's how change came. Now, without something
03:46:33like this, no rights can be sought, no change can happen.
03:46:37It's also not right to put all the burden on political parties.
03:46:40Trade unions, people, citizens need to take
03:46:43on this responsibility. And the opposition, as a whole,
03:46:47I'm not making any party distinctions here, as a whole,
03:46:50it's not just about preparing for elections.
03:46:54These people's grievances need to be brought to the streets.
03:46:57They need channels where they can express their grievances
03:47:00and win their rights. I remember Poland, I always
03:47:04give it as an example. Lech Walesa
03:47:07was a trade unionist during the change of power,
03:47:10and he came to power with the strength from the factories, from the trade union
03:47:14movement. He brought about a great change there. He's a negative example,
03:47:17I don't agree with his ideas, but he still achieved
03:47:20this. That's how the world changes. Now,
03:47:23look, for example, we're having a discussion about autocrats
03:47:27and democrats, right? Özgür Bey's statement is a very
03:47:31accurate assessment, and Şükrü Bey also underlined
03:47:34that. Ertunç Bey said that if there is no law, no democracy,
03:47:38no justice, your economy will be like this. You will choose autocrats or
03:47:41democrats, and this is very true, but
03:47:45it also needs to be completed in this way: For example,
03:47:48AFD, what is AFD? It's the far-right in Germany,
03:47:51isn't it? Anti-immigrant, Islamophobic, etc., etc.
03:47:55We can list more. But it increases
03:47:57its support from workers
03:48:00or the poor. That is, autocrats can also increase
03:48:04it, that's what I'm trying to say. That's why it's not
03:48:06just about democracy, law, justice, but also about
03:48:10putting the struggle or the political perspective
03:48:14into the context of class struggle. That is, without winning the working
03:48:17classes, without gaining their support, change is difficult,
03:48:21I think. Tuğba Tekerek has been arrested, by the way.
03:48:24Journalist Tuğba Tekere, who was detained as part of the operation.
03:48:27She is a very valuable friend known by the entire
03:48:30press world. So, yes,
03:48:34Alper just conveyed it. Now, of course, none of us are lawyers
03:48:38or economists, naturally, like you. But
03:48:41how these increases will affect the September inflation rate
03:48:45and, of course, the year-end inflation rate.
03:48:49I wonder what the worst could happen is. The target won't be met again,
03:48:53it will be updated again, but how will the citizen
03:48:55uh, Actually, we can see the citizen's
03:48:59internalization in the enforcement offices. There are almost
03:49:0330 million enforcement files.
03:49:06That is, one out of two people has an enforcement file.
03:49:10Enforcement has become so common that maybe you used to say, "I won't eat meat, I'll eat chicken,"
03:49:13right? Now you're losing your assets, you're losing
03:49:17the house you live in. We've reached that point,
03:49:20and we just talked about the inflation rate,
03:49:24it was calculated at 16%. There's an estimate that will be
03:49:27almost 100% wrong, right? There's a target. If you did this in a private
03:49:31company, a different sales and
03:49:34marketing specialist
03:49:36wouldn't be able to
03:49:38sit down and do this. This is the economy of a country, and we are getting
03:49:42salary increases based on this inflation rate from TÜİK,
03:49:45we're trying to execute. We're talking about a country's economy,
03:49:49but still, look, when we talked about
03:49:53Halk TV's advertising revenues earlier,
03:49:56you ask, "According to what criteria do you distribute
03:49:59these numbers?" Okay, don't give us this information
03:50:03as a trade secret, but what criterion do you take when you give
03:50:06millions of liras to a channel, and 1 lira to the most watched channel?
03:50:10You don't give it, there's no answer. Now, how does
03:50:14the targeted inflation of 16% become 32%?
03:50:16How can you not manage this inflation? Don't you
03:50:20want to make a statement about the mistakes in the legal system?
03:50:24How do you explain people saying, "I won't
03:50:27invest there without an arbitration board abroad, by setting
03:50:31an arbitration clause for a company coming from abroad when investing
03:50:35here, about this trustee issue? How will you answer these questions?
03:50:38As long as you don't settle these, whatever
03:50:42you say is meaningless. Really, there's no way out of this
03:50:45without law. Mr. Ercüment mentioned earlier
03:50:49about organizing, and about responding to these, but
03:50:53rest assured, there's a puppet show too. The journalists you mentioned earlier, every day
03:50:57we see a journalist being arrested and detained.
03:51:00Miners, in their protest, we know that unionists were arrested.
03:51:04And when these things happen, we're trying
03:51:06to fix the economy, but without law."
03:51:47Turkey's energy source
03:51:51Orbus.
03:51:58Gold belongs to everyone, but the bracelet belongs to Koçak.
03:52:02Years of accumulation, the tradition of these lands.
03:52:05Turkey's bracelet is Koçak.
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03:57:50We're starting the last hour. I had taken
03:57:52the floor, and by the way, let me add this: According to the research of BESAR, the amount
03:57:56of expenditure a family of four needs to make
03:57:59monthly to be able to eat healthy, that is, the poverty
03:58:02line, has reached 50,000 liras.
03:58:05Uh, I apologize, the hunger line
03:58:08is 49,655 liras, and the poverty line
03:58:11is 124,339 liras. That
03:58:15is the situation.
03:58:18Ms. Sinem, I just wanted to say something, Mr. Ercüment.
03:58:22When you gave the number of enforcement
03:58:25files, 30 million, it's a terrible number, a very large
03:58:29number. I wondered what the number of files
03:58:32was in 2002. Mr. Ertunç gave it, I'm sorry.
03:58:36Ertunç Ercüment, the names are similar of course. Oh, sorry, Mr. Ertuğ,
03:58:40I apologize. Yes, in 2002, the population was 65
03:58:43million. The number of enforcement files, according to the Ministry
03:58:46of Justice data, was 8.6
03:58:49million, relative to the population.
03:58:53Around 13%. Look at the number of enforcement
03:58:57files. Today, the population is 87 million.
03:59:00The number of enforcement files is 30 million, about one third,
03:59:0435%. That is, we are facing
03:59:07a terrible situation. I just wanted
03:59:10to convey that. Well, now,
03:59:13of course, we're talking about how the economy will improve,
03:59:17what kind of political climate we'll have before the elections, but actually, one of the places
03:59:20where the government and the opposition have clashed the most
03:59:23recently is the municipal councils. Before we get to that, uh, it just occurred
03:59:27to me, we had a story about finding oil in Gabar. Actually,
03:59:31today, while we're talking about three-digit numbers,
03:59:35uh, and the price per liter of fuel, we actually
03:59:39had very hopeful days. They weren't bad. Let's listen
03:59:42and remember. Those were good days, weren't they? Let's remember.
03:59:45Those were good days, weren't they? Let's remember. Those were good days, weren't they? Of course.
03:59:49mi hatırlayalım ya güzel günlerdi o günler değil mi tabii.