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00:00:00for location consultation and promote democratic
00:00:03similar to the vast majority of countries in participation of the people, which is the 90s, but it also has many similarities with what what we are seeing here, the expression
00:00:07of the people, he turned his back on us,
00:00:10it hurts, that is the word, it tears the soul, to know that with
00:00:14the amount of life there, the Department of Natural Resources, which is called
00:00:18to protect our natural resources, all the life that
00:00:21exists there is not fulfilling its ministerial duty and that they do not
00:00:25care. On the other hand, we spoke with the mayor of
00:00:28the municipality of Cabo Rojo, who was in favor of said
00:00:32project. We asked him what the benefits would be for the
00:00:36about this beginning of people of Cabo Rojo, since the
00:00:38project has tax decrees and
00:00:42break and when we return, a White House even exemptions for the payment, for example, of
00:00:45Ibu, among others. The economic benefit that a project
00:00:48of this magnitude can represent is the jobs it can
00:00:52create for the citizens of Cabo Rojo and the economy it can
00:00:56generate for local businesses, it is always there.
00:01:00the difference that exists in relation to the decrees has been discussed,
00:01:03eh, we understand from what we have read that the decrees
00:01:06only apply to the tourist
00:01:11States within the framework of this Shield not to the residential part of the people who buy
00:01:14for residence, this could mean for us construction taxes
00:01:17and payments in crime. Regarding the water problem, the mayor
00:01:21denied that his municipality has this situation.
00:01:24water supply problems in Cabo Rojo we really do not
00:01:28have them, there may be a problem.
00:01:30of water because the light goes out and there is no pumping
00:01:34generated
00:03:52time Fujimorism resorts
00:04:03violation of human rights by the
00:04:43I wanted to watch a movie in
00:04:58Hello, hello, good evening. Welcome to Conclusiones, Mario González greets you from Mexico City
00:05:02today for my colleague Fernando del Rincón.
00:05:05Keiko Fujimori begins her government in Peru with a
00:05:08central commitment: to return the armed forces
00:05:12to a key role in the fight against organized crime, a decision
00:05:16that revives the debate on security, military power and
00:05:19the legacy of her father Alberto
00:05:21Fujimori.
00:05:24A Salvadoran man, Edwin López Cornejo, died in immigration
00:05:27custody in New Jersey. His death once again puts the conditions
00:05:31inside ICE detention centers
00:05:34under scrutiny.
00:05:3625 US states sue Donald Trump's government over his new
00:05:40tariffs, while Mexico warns about the impact of this
00:05:43commercial measure:
00:05:47in Guatemala, a new eruption of the Fuego volcano forces the evacuation
00:05:50of dozens of families living on the slopes of the
00:05:54volcano. With all this, in conclusions,
00:05:57we begin.
00:06:04And I ask you to join me from this moment on using the hashtag
00:06:07Conclusecurity P, Conclusecurity P, all together
00:06:11there I remind you. that I receive all your comments to my account on
00:06:14X, formerly known as Twitter
00:06:16@mariocnn.
00:06:19Let's go with Peru, in Peru, the return of Fujimorism to
00:06:22power begins to take shape, and one of the first
00:06:25measures of Keiko's government, Keiko Fujimori, the president
00:06:29aims at security. The new president
00:06:32announced that in areas declared in a state of emergency for security
00:06:35reasons, the armed forces will temporarily assume
00:06:39internal order control operations,
00:06:42in coordination with the national police. The measure
00:06:46that suspends some rights applies to some provinces of
00:06:49the departments of Tumbes and La Libertad and
00:06:52the regions of Ayacucho, Junín and
00:06:55Cusco.
00:06:58During states of emergency, the armed
00:07:01forces will temporarily assume
00:07:05leadership of security operations and internal
00:07:09control.
00:07:12The objective, according to the authorities, is to confront organized
00:07:15crime, extortion, drug trafficking, illegal
00:07:18mining that have grown in recent years. The president also stated
00:07:22that her government will recover every neighborhood, every road, every
00:07:25public space for Peruvian families. The strategy is not
00:07:29limited to the deployment of military personnel. Fujimori also
00:07:32announced more resources for the police, a national network of
00:07:35surveillance cameras, artificial intelligence to
00:07:38identify criminal patterns, better communication
00:07:41systems and new command centers to coordinate
00:07:45operations against criminal organizations. Fujimori's
00:07:48security strategy also seeks support outside Peru. The president
00:07:52said she spoke with US Secretary of State Marco Rubio and that
00:07:56she expressed her government's interest in joining the so-called Shield of the
00:08:00Americas that she announced together with the presidents of the
00:08:03region with, eh, with her allies,
00:08:06of course, I mean the United States. Let's remember that this is the
00:08:10initiative promoted by Donald Trump to coordinate efforts against organized
00:08:14crime in the region. The logic behind this
00:08:17decision is that criminal networks no longer
00:08:20operate within a single country, which is why countries must
00:08:24share information and work together. But
00:08:28this decision should not be read only from the present, it also
00:08:32has a long political, eh, surname
00:08:35that accompanies Keiko Fujimori, she is the daughter of Alberto
00:08:39Fujimori, the president who in the 90s put
00:08:42the armed forces at the center of the fight against the armed groups of
00:08:46Sendero Luminoso and the Túpac Amaru revolutionary
00:08:49movement. For his followers, that strategy allowed
00:08:52him to regain control of the country in the face of terrorism, but that period
00:08:55was also identified by serious human rights violations
00:08:59and by the judicial conviction against the former president. That is why every
00:09:05to the military again, the discussion about security and about
00:09:08the limits of state power opens again in
00:09:12Peru, with the background of the
00:09:16armed forces. The big question is whether using
00:09:19military personnel solves insecurity and will
00:09:22solve it in the country or is it only a
00:09:25popular media strategy by President Fujimori to
00:09:29begin her mandate. We are going to analyze all this, the scenario and I will
00:09:33introduce you to the next
00:09:34guest.
00:09:40I welcome the former Minister of the Interior of
00:09:43Peru, José Luis Pérez Guadalupe, thank you for being with
00:09:46us, José Luis, welcome, let's see, eh, we have to remember that
00:09:50this also has a context, we were already talking about the internal
00:09:53context, the context with the United States, but we also have to say that there is a regional
00:09:57context, practically in all political campaigns
00:10:00a topic appears that did not appear with such resonance before,
00:10:04the topic of security, of security against criminal
00:10:08groups, although before Peru faced security
00:10:11problems related to subversive or terrorist
00:10:15groups, now the topic is criminal organizations.
00:10:19How do you see the situation, José Luis?
00:10:23Thank you very much, Mario, for the invitation. The situation in Peru, very
00:10:28the region, is critical in terms of citizen
00:10:32security. We have seen the neighboring
00:10:35country of Chile, which has just had
00:10:38a government, but it has also entered with
00:10:41great difficulty
00:10:44into the, let's say, traditional crime of our
00:10:47countries. Foreign crime, which we would call
00:10:51foreign, basically Venezuelan,
00:10:54has been added. This has come to exacerbate not only
00:10:57the number of crimes but also the classification of crimes such as, for example, extortion,
00:11:00which has practically invaded all the cities
00:11:04of the country. In this context, we have 10
00:11:08years of misgovernment, eh, in my
00:11:11opinion, mostly due to President
00:11:14Fujimori herself, who did not let Pedropallo Kuchinski or the
00:11:18subsequent presidents govern, and we had eight presidents
00:11:22in 10 years. But
00:11:26now, as a Brazilian saying goes, one day the spell can go against
00:11:29the sorceress, and I think we are at that moment because
00:11:32previously, under the aegis of the Fujimorist
00:11:36congressmen, what is called pro-crime laws in Peru
00:11:40have been passed, which do not help
00:11:44in the fight against criminal organizations, and the proposal
00:11:47that President Fujimori is clearly putting forward
00:11:51is the militarization of citizen security,
00:11:54which is a temptation that we have already seen in
00:11:58other countries in the region, and failed temptations, of
00:12:01course, that is, they have not yielded results anywhere. What needs to be done is
00:12:04police investigation, police intelligence, a lot of
00:12:07support and, above all, action against internal
00:12:11corruption, because many times it has been naively believed that
00:12:15criminal organizations exist when there is no
00:12:18state, and that is false, eh, they
00:12:21precisely manage to undermine, manage to penetrate state
00:12:25actors to move forward with organized
00:12:27crime.
00:12:31Of course, now, eh, the nature of the armed forces is
00:12:34very different from police work, as we mentioned a
00:12:38moment ago. Alberto Fujimori, well, I think he, eh, reached a
00:12:42moment where he fought subversive and
00:12:45terrorist movements. Now the fight is
00:12:48different, although we are talking about security, but they are different
00:12:52movements. Much has been debated, for example, in Mexico, about whether
00:12:55the armed forces are trained to confront
00:12:59criminal groups that are involved in the social fabric,
00:13:03José Luis. Look, I believe that the armed forces not
00:13:06only can, but must intervene in the
00:13:10fight against organized crime in favor of citizen
00:13:13security. I am convinced that the role of the armed forces has to change
00:13:17and has to be a much more active actor, which at this
00:13:20moment is wasted along with the intelligence service, the intelligence
00:13:24services in general fight against organized
00:13:27crime. I believe in principle that there has to be
00:13:30participation, the question is what type of participation, what type of
00:13:34role can be assigned to the armed forces and it has to be based
00:13:38on their preparation and their capacity, their expertise, their core
00:13:41competence. For example, now it has been proposed that they participate and be more active
00:13:45in border areas and in areas of illegal mining. Personally, I think
00:13:49it's fine, but there is a proposal that the president has made that the
00:13:52military personnel should now be prison directors. And
00:13:56that seems as absurd to me as pretending that military personnel should now be
00:14:00police chiefs, or delegates,
00:14:03of the police stations that are purely police. So there are
00:14:06roles that are intended to be given under the cloak,
00:14:10the myth that military personnel will bring more security or
00:14:13that, eh, certain functions will be attributed to them that
00:14:17will unfortunately fail. What needs to be done is, first of all, to
00:14:20identify that we are not in the 90s, and that
00:14:24is a big mistake of the entire Fujimorist
00:14:27campaign to always allude to the
00:14:30father, everything he did in the 90s, as if that were going
00:14:33to work when Sendero Luminoso, which was the great
00:14:36enemy of the country, has nothing to do with the current criminal
00:14:40organizations. The actions that could be taken in the 90s have nothing
00:14:44to do with our current reality, and remember that it was
00:14:47the police that captured Abimael Guzmán
00:14:50and the entire Sendero leadership
00:14:52based on intelligence, not the military, but the
00:14:56police. But now we are in a 90s
00:14:59fashion, retro fashion, okay, that now
00:15:02it turns out that everything military is good, so, eh,
00:15:06they are going to be given, as I said, not only
00:15:09general security in the streets, which at this moment we are already in many
00:15:13parts of the country in states of emergency, that is, the military is already in the
00:15:17streets, but they want to give them even the direction,
00:15:20not, not the perimeter, not the security, no, the
00:15:23direction of the prisons, and that seems to me a
00:15:27quite clueless measure,
00:15:29mistaken and that will fail, yes, now
00:15:31uh-huh,
00:15:34eh, eh, it has, let's see, eh, you talk about a film, it's retro politics from
00:15:40is being proposed in other parts of Latin America, as we started the conversation, that is, for us not
00:15:44to go so far, El Salvador has also proposed a strengthening
00:15:47of even detention centers, exemplary
00:15:50prisons, eh, eh, are there differences or
00:15:54are we talking more or less about the same
00:15:57proposals that are being launched, thank
00:16:01you very much, Mario, because there is this Bukelization of security
00:16:04policies in our country, we must understand that
00:16:07the context of El Salvador is very
00:16:10particular, I believe that President Bukele implemented a very
00:16:13good criminal policy regarding gangs, and it is effective
00:16:17and that must be recognized, everyone in El Salvador recognizes it, but
00:16:21his penitentiary policy is another thing, there, for example,
00:16:24the secod, but of course when we talk about the secot in
00:16:28countries with authoritarian presidencies, the
00:16:32first victim is the truth, right? So, in truth, we cannot
00:16:35know what is happening in El Salvador, only what
00:16:39his tweets or the images that President
00:16:43Bukele allows give us. So, let's say, I start from the premise that everything that comes from
00:16:47news from El Salvador is not necessarily true or may be
00:16:50exaggerated, since Bukele himself was an expert in
00:16:54political communication, but let's suppose that the sekot
00:16:57model works, okay, but the secot is made and
00:17:00there is a big difference with the prisons in the rest of Latin America, the
00:17:04secot is made for people who will not leave prison.
00:17:09They are for life sentences, while in Peru only
00:17:122% of prisoners in Peru have life
00:17:15sentences, so the question is another, that is,
00:17:1998% of prisoners in Peru, we have
00:17:22capacity for 41, and there are
00:17:25and at this moment there are 106 prisoners and it has been 10 years since not a
00:17:29single prison has been built, okay, 98% of our prisoners will
00:17:33leave, so the question is how do we want them to
00:17:35leave, so there has to
00:17:38be a different policy, especially
00:17:42for the recovery, reintegration of those inmates, if you put
00:17:46the military there, I doubt very much that they know what
00:17:49to do to reintegrate or in the very
00:17:52same tasks of surveillance, order, conduct
00:17:56within the prisons themselves, so I think there has been
00:18:00haste, there has been, let's say,
00:18:03punitive populism, penal populism focused on the
00:18:08militarization of citizen security, which is no
00:18:10novelty in our
00:18:14continent, yes, with all the risks that it also implies and which we will talk about, when we return, if you allow me, José
00:18:18Luis Pérez Guadalupe, former Minister of the Interior of Peru, we return with
00:18:21him,
00:18:25I'm Juan Carlos López, welcome to Clash of Opinions,
00:18:29diplomacy, you know very well what is said in private is not what is said in public, well
00:18:33let's see what is said in private, Clash of
00:18:36Opinions. Sunday, on
00:18:38CNN.
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00:19:00Come, join me to understand the world at the speed at which events
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00:19:23by CNN.
00:21:45Guadalupe, former Minister of the Interior of Peru, about the security
00:21:48policy announced by President
00:21:52Keiko Fujimori. Does it make sense, José
00:21:55Luis, this announcement of rapprochement with the United
00:22:01of the Americas? Could there be, let's say,
00:22:05something bigger that contemplates,
00:22:08well, extraterritorial
00:22:09actions?
00:22:19Eh, there are some assumptions that must
00:22:23be taken into account, that organized crime effectively has no
00:22:26borders, and viewing this in isolation, each country
00:22:30independently, does not make much sense, that is, organized crime
00:22:33walks around as if it were at home in all our
00:22:37countries, so regional policies,
00:22:40global policies, integrating
00:22:43coordinated policies, I think it's good on the one hand,
00:22:46now logically entering this Shield of the Americas. it will have
00:22:50its reservations, eh, and we will also see how Trump does in the
00:22:54November elections and if he will have the same leadership
00:22:58or not, but what I do think is that definitively, whether in the
00:23:02Shield of the Americas or any other shield, there has to be a much
00:23:05greater coordination
00:23:08between, eh, the states of the continent for
00:23:12this fight that, as I say, eh, Peru, for
00:23:15example, in Peru, we are not consumers of
00:23:18drugs, we produce coca leaf, we produce
00:23:22basic cocaine paste, cocaine hydrochloride, we export, but we do
00:23:25not consume, while Brazil does not
00:23:27produce coca, but it is the second largest
00:23:31consumer of cocaine and the United States is the first,
00:23:35so we cannot take these issues and not to mention illegal
00:23:39mining that is taken from Peru, passes through Bolivia and then
00:23:42reaches Europe, especially gold,
00:23:45so we cannot see these issues of organized
00:23:48crime in isolation. I think it has to be seen as a whole,
00:23:52and I agree with that, there is a regional
00:23:54integrating policy, whether the Shield of the
00:23:58Americas is the best option,
00:24:02well, I don't know if there is
00:24:03another of that dimension, to
00:24:08begin with, now José Luis, would the president face
00:24:11legal problems, that is, for the implementation of her plan, would she have to seek
00:24:15constitutional reforms, legal reforms, at
00:24:17least.
00:24:20what we have seen in recent years is that Congress has practically
00:24:23changed the entire constitution of the country
00:24:26through Congress, where she
00:24:29played a fundamental role, Fujimorism,
00:24:32so now she no longer
00:24:34has a majority in the deputies, she has a
00:24:38technical tie in senators, but it would
00:24:41be necessary to see if she will be able to change the laws as
00:24:44she did before during these 10 years, as I say, 10 years, which
00:24:48is a decade. for Peruvian politics,
00:24:52which has not been lost for the economy, fortunately, but the Peruvian economy would
00:24:56have been able to grow much more if it had had political
00:24:59stability, so now I think that in general the
00:25:03consensus among Peruvians is that we all want
00:25:06to return to the political stability that we have had
00:25:10for decades, decades, and that we have lost
00:25:13precisely in my opinion due to Mrs. Fujimori's
00:25:17whim not to accept her three previous
00:25:20electoral defeats.
00:25:24Wow, we can say that we have already seen
00:25:28this movie in Peru and in Latin
00:25:31America.
00:25:34Yes, we are talking, I don't know if it's a remake
00:25:37or a déjà vu, but well, we want
00:25:41the ending to be different,
00:25:44eh, even if the actors are the same, but we are all
00:25:48betting that... not only Peru, I repeat, because
00:25:52what happens in Chile or Colombia or Bolivia or
00:25:55Brazil affects us all, so I think we have
00:25:59to bet on the governments we have now. and rather
00:26:03collaborate with ideas and
00:26:06move towards the best options. For example, yesterday
00:26:09a Sparta, which is a large plane of the
00:26:13Peruvian armed forces, was sent carrying three
00:26:17Venezuelans to Caracas, three, the plane is for
00:26:2080,
00:26:2180,
00:26:26Wow, we had a problem with José Luis's signal, unfortunately it's José
00:26:30Luis Pérez Guadalupe. whom I thank for these minutes to
00:26:34talk with Conclusiones
00:26:38Keiko Fujimori's administration, thank you and see
00:26:41you soon. We are going to take a
00:26:45decision that seeks to pressure the world, now faces
00:26:48resistance within its own country, what is at stake behind
00:26:52this battle for Donald Trump's tariffs,
00:26:54we'll be back.
00:26:59The news doesn't stop and CNN is.
00:27:02Always present to bring you the most relevant
00:27:05information, now on weekends follow Rey
00:27:08Rodríguez, who leads the World View team, your reference
00:27:12point to find out what is happening in your city, in your
00:27:16country and in the world, stay with CNE to
00:27:19get accurate and timely information on the
00:27:23stories of the moment. World View, Saturdays and
00:27:26Sundays on
00:27:27CNN.
00:27:30It is important to have a clear perspective of
00:27:32what is happening in the world, to know the different angles of a single
00:27:36event, in perspectives we take you to the key places
00:27:39where the news happens, we interview
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00:27:49live in, join me and discover all the
00:27:52perspectives, perspectives with Mario González, Monday
00:27:55to Friday on
00:27:57CNN.