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00:00:00in the country in Spain, it is heard, this type of
00:00:03phenomena is not that they are the generators of change, they are the expression of a
00:00:08more charlatans today than before, because in change and it is debated, its foreign policy will be like this, lukewarm, without taking
00:00:12clear stances, conclusions with Fernando del Rincón from Monday to
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00:01:04pro-immigrant groups filed a
00:01:07lawsuit from our studios in Washington, I am Juan Carlos
00:01:11López, join me on Direct USA from Monday to
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00:01:27the data, ready for whatever no matter where life takes
00:02:25and the world of
00:06:14writer and former Vice President of Nicaragua, Sergio Ramírez, has just
00:06:18published a new novel called "The Curse of
00:06:21Ramfis," his fourth novel which features
00:06:25police inspector Dolores Morales as the protagonist
00:06:28and has as its backdrop the political
00:06:31drama that Nicaragua is experiencing. Let's go to the
00:06:35interview. Sergio, thank you for being with us, it's a pleasure
00:06:38to have you on the program again, before talking about your new novel.
00:06:43Please tell us about your personal situation, because your
00:06:46Nicaraguan citizenship and nationality
00:06:48were revoked along with several other opposition members in
00:06:522023, where do you live now, how is your
00:06:56life, well in Madrid, I have lived in Madrid for 5
00:06:59years, eh, I had
00:07:02left in May 2021
00:07:05for the United States for a medical treatment
00:07:09and while there, I realized
00:07:13that I was being prosecuted for complicity
00:07:16with Cristiana Chamorro
00:07:19eh they wanted to eliminate her from the presidential candidate panorama,
00:07:23so they fabricated a lawsuit against her for money
00:07:26laundering and then
00:07:29I decided not to return to the country,
00:07:32then I came to Spain for the
00:07:35presentation of that novel, Tongoleres didn't know how to dance
00:07:39so I stayed here and the following year.
00:07:44eh, they already took away my citizenship along
00:07:47with another group of Nicaraguans, they
00:07:50stripped me of my citizenship, but
00:07:53they also stripped me of my lawyer's title
00:07:55later,
00:07:58so they declared me non- existent, this only happens in
00:08:01novels, yes, recently Daniel Ortega
00:08:04announced in a speech that there will be no more elections in
00:08:08Nicaragua, why do you think he made that announcement,
00:08:12he could have kept quiet and said nothing
00:08:16on, I think he did it out of
00:08:18clumsiness,
00:08:21eh, when he starts talking he loses track of what he's saying
00:08:24and suddenly he gets angry,
00:08:28verbal violence begins
00:08:31to dominate him and it seemed to him that the best thing he could do at that
00:08:34moment was to declare that there would be no more
00:08:37elections eh, but he has
00:08:40tried to correct the plan. to say that it's not
00:08:44that there won't be elections, but that
00:08:47there will be elections but with healthy candidates,
00:08:51not with the candidates of imperialism,
00:08:54that's all nonsense, what do you think, Sergio,
00:08:57that the international community should do about what is happening in Nicaragua?
00:09:01Should it impose trade sanctions,
00:09:04suspend it from CAFTA, the free trade agreement of Central America
00:09:08and the Dominican Republic, that is, what should
00:09:11the countries of the region do?
00:09:13I believe that Nicaragua has the misfortune of
00:09:17not being a central case in the international
00:09:20panorama, even in the Latin American space,
00:09:24Nicaragua does not have the same attention as Venezuela
00:09:28or Cuba
00:09:30because Nicaragua is a bit on the sidelines,
00:09:36the
00:09:38personification of a country that
00:09:42has strategic interests,
00:09:45rare minerals, oil, Nicaragua has none of
00:09:49that, so when a case like
00:09:52this occurs, that Ortega's declarations
00:09:56declare that there will be no more elections,
00:10:00eh, there is a resurgence of protests,
00:10:03but these protests remain in the
00:10:06communiques, the communiques are lukewarm,
00:10:10there are
00:10:13eh, organizations that don't even speak out, let's start with the
00:10:17Central Americans, SICA, which to be a member of SICA, which is the Central American
00:10:21Integration System, you need to be a representative
00:10:25democracy without ambiguities,
00:10:28however, SICA remains silent,
00:10:30the Central American Bank for Economic Integration
00:10:34continues to consider it a normal partner,
00:10:37a normal partner, which is subject to
00:10:41credit, eh, the European
00:10:44Union,
00:10:46the 27 members of the European Union issue a single
00:10:50communiqué which is quite lukewarm
00:10:52where in the end they call for dialogue with Ortega and
00:10:56that they are interested in that dialogue, that is, dialogue with
00:10:59Ortega, I don't know what use it can have to call for
00:11:02dialogue with Ortega at this point
00:11:05in the game, so
00:11:09then those communiques
00:11:11fade away, there are countries that don't even
00:11:14speak out, El Salvador and Honduras, who are close allies
00:11:18of Trump, both Bukele and the president
00:11:22of Honduras Azura.
00:11:25They maintain absolute silence regarding
00:11:28Ortega, the president of Costa Rica has
00:11:31said that she wants to coexist with Ortega in
00:11:34peace, and that this is an electoral
00:11:37decision of Nicaraguans precisely,
00:11:41so it is a very unequal response and I would say
00:11:44no, it's not decisive.
00:11:47Let's talk about your new book, Sergio, "The Curse
00:11:51of Ramfis," once again featuring Inspector Dolores Morales
00:11:55as the protagonist, but this time investigating
00:11:59a crime in exile, please tell us quickly the plot
00:12:02of your new novel, well, Inspector
00:12:05Morales is in exile in a small
00:12:09port near the border with Nicaragua in Costa Rican territory called
00:12:12Puerto Solella in Salinas Bay and there one morning he sees
00:12:16a four-masted sailboat anchored
00:12:19and between him and Doña Sofía, who is his
00:12:22collaborator, they find out that this sailboat
00:12:26is a high-end tourist sailboat
00:12:28and that it was
00:12:32previously owned by Generalissimo Trujillo of the Dominican
00:12:36Republic when it was called the
00:12:38Angelita yacht, which was the floating cabaret of Ramfis
00:12:42Trujillo and Porfirio Rubirosa, here
00:12:45the story begins and
00:12:49then they call him to investigate
00:12:52a crime that has been committed on board the
00:12:55ship and you. This crime has to do with
00:12:58money laundering from the product of the
00:13:01bribes they collect from thousands of immigrants
00:13:05who passed through Managua airport coming from
00:13:09places as far away as Libya,
00:13:11Senegal eh, only
00:13:14between the year
00:13:172023
00:13:19eh, 300,000 immigrants passed through Managua airport,
00:13:23according to the records of the Honduran government,
00:13:27who are the ones who saw them cross the Nicaraguan border to the
00:13:31Honduran border to the United States, this is what the
00:13:34novel is about, that is, the crime
00:13:38eh, a crime committed under the
00:13:41cover of
00:13:44an act of corruption with the
00:13:47immigrants, in one part of
00:13:50Nicaraguan exiles that like you,
00:13:53they no longer live in Nicaragua, they know nothing of what happens
00:13:57there and that they always believe that a revolution will break out at
00:14:01any moment against the commander and his companion, but that no one
00:14:05will move them from where they are,
00:14:08not even with a stick of dynamite, end quote,
00:14:12do you believe, Sergio, that there is nothing that will move
00:14:15the Ortegas from power? Well, I don't believe
00:14:18that as much as the character, what he says at the beginning is an
00:14:22appreciation. that I
00:14:25have and what happens with all exiles,
00:14:28no, eh, with all exiles it happens that when
00:14:32a firecracker goes off inside a country it immediately seems that a
00:14:35real revolution is coming, revolutions are not
00:14:39improvised, revolutions or changes, even
00:14:43peaceful political changes are
00:14:47a process of organization that in
00:14:49Nicaragua is not possible now because
00:14:52organizing is impossible. That is,
00:14:55under the fear, the repression, the imposed silence, the
00:14:59persecution,
00:15:01but I, obviously within Nicaragua there will be a
00:15:05silent resistance, without a doubt, that
00:15:08one day will end up
00:15:12manifesting itself. Sergio Ramírez, thank you very much for your time and
00:15:16good luck with your new book, we have to go to a break when we return, we are going to talk with the
00:15:20Venezuelan writer and political analyst Moisés
00:15:23Naím, who has just published with the journalist Kiko Toro, a new book
00:15:26called Charlatans, we are going to
00:15:29ask them who they are, don't go, we'll be
00:15:32back.
00:15:38I'm Mexican-British, I've been a journalist for 20 years
00:15:42in Mexico City, in the United States
00:15:45and now in Miami for CNN. CNN
00:15:49América is a multiplatform program where you will
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00:16:06also from a women's field, but above
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00:16:14to polarize, but to integrate
00:16:16society.
00:16:19What excites me most is to inform, inquire,
00:16:22investigate the why of things, to get to the bottom of the
00:16:25facts, here you will see what makes news and everything that
00:16:29impacts your daily life. CNN América
00:16:32with Rebecca Kelly, Monday to Friday on
00:16:34CNN.
00:16:40To understand the world you need to seek the
00:16:43truth that we return to the era when we had to be
00:16:46much more human, that's why we follow the facts
00:16:50wherever they lead us, no matter how far we have to
00:16:54go from the internal story, there are new
00:16:57statements from President Donald Trump, an external
00:17:00perspective, we delve into
00:17:12Maduro's defense? Find joy in new
00:17:15perspectives and new horizons. Every
00:17:19day, no matter where life takes
00:17:22you. We follow what matters
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00:17:28truth and understanding of the
00:17:30world.
00:18:47I'm Patrickman in Havana, we are
00:18:50CNN.
00:18:57Thank you for staying with us, the Venezuelan writer, journalist and political analyst
00:19:00Moisés Naím, has just published with journalist
00:19:04Kiko Toro a new book.
00:19:09Charlatans, there it says that the world is increasingly filled with
00:19:13charlatans and gives several recommendations
00:19:16on how we can protect ourselves from
00:19:19charlatans, let's ask him what it's about.
00:19:23Moisés, thank you for being with us, well,
00:19:26tell us a little about charlatans,
00:19:29in the book you present the cases of 25
00:19:33charlatans, most of them contemporary
00:19:37and... many of them quite well-known, what do these
00:19:4025 characters in your book have
00:19:43in common, that is, how do
00:19:46you define a charlatan? It is a person who
00:19:50eh pretends to have knowledge, skills, resources,
00:19:54capacities that they actually do not have,
00:19:57eh, and the big difference between a charlatan, for example, and a
00:20:00guy who sets up a scam is that the
00:20:04swindler, let's say,
00:20:08taking your money, possessions, power,
00:20:11etc., this and then disappearing, the charlatan
00:20:15no, the charlatan develops a chronic, perpetual,
00:20:18deep, emotional relationship with his
00:20:22followers, why did you write this book?
00:20:25Good question, no, this, this has been traced
00:20:29from other books that I have had, no, "The End of Power," "The Revenge of the
00:20:32Powerful," what is happening, in all these topics it is
00:20:35power, how it... is desired, used, utilized,
00:20:39misused and lost, eh,
00:20:42so what I have seen is that power there is a
00:20:46transfer of power to the traffickers, the...
00:20:50eh, charlatans are in their golden age right
00:20:54now, why, why are there
00:20:58history we saw alchemists, as you say in the
00:21:01book, who sold the idea that they could transform materials into
00:21:05gold, throughout history, there have always been sellers
00:21:08of miracle cures, that is, why do you say that there are more
00:21:12charlatans now than before, because the old ones operated at a
00:21:16regional level, city level, the
00:21:19geographical level. The geographical spectrum in which they were involved
00:21:23was always more restricted,
00:21:26instead now with social networks, with the Internet and with
00:21:29globalization, opening of borders and all the rest,
00:21:32charlatans have a much larger field of operations
00:21:36eh, and
00:21:38they have technological capabilities that are accessible to all of us
00:21:42that they use and put at the service of their goal of convincing
00:21:46gullible people to go against their own
00:21:50interests eh, we have talked about Trump,
00:21:53this is very interesting to see how
00:21:56Latinos este that
00:21:59are being really are
00:22:03under threat in the United States, they are
00:22:06operating in a way that goes against their
00:22:10interests, they are supporting policies, ways of
00:22:13acting of the Trump government that go against their
00:22:16interests, their own interests, this is a recent example, but... everywhere,
00:22:20the essence of the story is that the charlatan makes you think that he has
00:22:24things eh that no one else has and that he will put them at your service
00:22:28and that if you follow him you will benefit greatly, when in reality
00:22:31if you follow him you will lose greatly. Who are the charlatans
00:22:35of today? There is a boom of charlatans today, as I already said, because
00:22:38these moments are more digital. They are
00:22:42viral, if they are digital, as you know, they can quickly go
00:22:46viral. If they go viral, borders no longer matter.
00:22:50and they transcend, they are international, they are globalized
00:22:52and if there is all that, if they are digital,
00:22:56viral, international global, they are
00:23:00scalable, they can grow, so
00:23:03that is the way to see what is
00:23:06happening in the world, and you ask me why, what
00:23:09contemporary examples do we have, well, the sellers of cryptos
00:23:13and tokens
00:23:15the
00:23:19eh. financial use
00:23:24technology and even
00:23:26artificial intelligence now opens
00:23:29unprecedented possibilities for charlatans,
00:23:32but you yourself say in the book that not all cryptocurrency sellers are charlatans, some
00:23:36are, others are not, of course, that is
00:23:39clear, but I am referring to those who have already collapsed,
00:23:43we have several who are in jail, others, that
00:23:46is, we already know who
00:23:50the charlatans are and why they fell, why did you include
00:23:54Donald Trump among your 25 charlatans,
00:23:57because one could say, well, he is a man who promises things he
00:24:01does not deliver, but those who support Trump would tell you that almost all
00:24:05politicians promise things they do not deliver, why him?
00:24:09He participates in what I have called in one of my books "The Revenge of the Powerful" the
00:24:13three P's, it is becoming common in
00:24:17the world of international politics to
00:24:20use three P's to operate,
00:24:23the first is populism, polarization
00:24:27and post-truth, the three P's. Populism has always
00:24:30existed and has nothing new, however it is now boosted by the
00:24:33great, the second P, polarization,
00:24:37where all those who do not share exactly my ideas
00:24:40become my mortal enemies, they are not compatriots who have a
00:24:44different way of seeing things, but rather unacceptable beings, and not
00:24:48even tolerable their political presence or their
00:24:51legitimacy, etc., and all that, of course, as we have
00:24:55already discussed, is boosted, amplified by the
00:24:58fact, by post-truth, we are living in an era in which
00:25:02we don't know whom to believe, what to believe, who said what, how much,
00:25:06how much conflict of interest there is, how it is discovered
00:25:10that things are fraudulent and how they are a deception
00:25:13or are they really a contribution
00:25:16to society, friendship, family, finally? Finally, Moisés, how can
00:25:20we protect ourselves against charlatans, is there
00:25:23an antidote for charlatans,
00:25:26first is to regain the idea that if what they are
00:25:30proposing to you is too good to be true, there must
00:25:32be something strange, you have to be more skeptical,
00:25:35careful,
00:25:37check things, have critical analysis,
00:25:41you have to respect
00:25:43critical analysis, not simply believe in the charisma,
00:25:46attractiveness, table, etc. that charlatans
00:25:50have, second, a very
00:25:53important protection for people, for individuals not to fall for a charlatan is
00:25:57family, the main protector
00:25:59and... this
00:26:02against charlatans are
00:26:06family members, why? Because
00:26:08they are capable of telling you things that others won't,
00:26:12because they know you, because they can still discern the
00:26:15trick from the truth, etc., but family
00:26:19gives you a contribution, it gives you
00:26:22a possibility to protect yourself from someone who
00:26:25is lying to you to make you do things that go against your
00:26:28interests. Moisés Naím, thank you very much for your time and good
00:26:31luck with your new book Charlatans, we have to go to a break when
00:26:35we return my reflection on some of the things we talked about today, don't
00:26:39go, we'll be
00:26:40back.
00:26:48right here, this is our planet, this is our home, water
00:26:52has the ability to absorb, to
00:26:55cleanse, to migrate, move, that's nature's
00:27:55the funds for the Department of Homeland Security. When there is a lot at
00:27:58stake, we eliminate the noise to... inform you clearly
00:28:02about the issues and policies that affect you, from the decisions made in
00:28:05Washington to their repercussions
00:28:09throughout the United States, Latin America
00:28:13and the world. At what point are relations with the United States?
00:28:17Relations between the United States and Cuba have always been
00:28:20abnormal. Direct USA is that window
00:28:23through which you can enter the United States and see what is happening in
00:28:27this country. We follow the story from all angles to
00:28:31bring you. directly the facts, groups of
00:28:34pro-immigrants filed a lawsuit
00:28:38from our studios in Washington, I'm Juan Carlos López.
00:28:41Join me live on USA from Monday to Friday
00:28:44on CNN. My name is Jimena de la Quintana, I am
00:28:48CNN correspondent in Peru. Peru has gone through several
00:28:51political and social crises, I have had to be in the streets covering
00:28:55each one of them in recent years and on several occasions
00:28:58people have surrounded us to hear what we reported.
00:29:32government should be guided and dictated by biblical law, right? yes, how
00:29:36in the world did you survive this? the full force of that technology
00:29:39is landing here today. the full story with Anderson
00:29:43Cooper, Sunday on CNN.