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00:00:09You're watching TRT World, I'm Katie Pilbeam,
00:00:11a reminder now of our main headlines for you: Iran has laid out what it
00:00:15wants from the US before the restart of
00:00:18of a any negotiations on ending their standoff, and the conflict is well threatening the
00:00:22entire region now. Security chief Mazim Razayev says
00:00:26seven conditions have been delivered via
00:00:29of Qatar, as Donald. Trump prepares to meet golf leaders on the sidelines
00:00:32of the UN General Assembly in New York next week. The
00:00:36Saudi Led coalition says it's intercepted a hoothy
00:00:39ballistic missile targeting Riad and stopped a wider attack
00:00:43on several other Saudi cities,
00:00:45but the hoothis say their missiles and drones hit sensitive sights in the
00:00:49capital and an Aramco facility as well in Yambu causing
00:00:53large fires and Israely strike against the
00:00:57civilian vehicle in Gaza City has killed at least...
00:01:00of one person, this raised the death toll on Saturday alone to
00:01:03five people, including other attacks in Jabalya, Nazarat and
00:01:07Gaza City. It is the latest Israeli violation to the
00:01:11ceastfire signed with Hamas in October last year. More than
00:01:15of 1,300 Palestinians have been killed
00:01:17of in Israeli attack since that agreement. English
00:01:21music star Ed Sheiren has apologized to fans for how he's
00:01:24handled the controversy over the dropping of American rapper Macalmore
00:01:28from the US tour. or he was
00:01:30of removed in after stadium owners objected to comments to
00:01:34pro-palestinian comments he made on
00:01:37of stage during a performance in New Jersey, we Shiran blamed the tour
00:01:40promoter for the move, all of Shiran's remaining opening acts and his band
00:01:44as well then pulled out
00:01:46of the tour and solidarity with
00:01:48Mackhamore, but this week the criticism was about
00:01:52something much more important and I've had to take uh and make difficult
00:01:56decisions and I
00:01:57in am making
00:01:58in mistakes and I'm so so so...
00:02:01Hundreds of Ukrainian drones have targeted Russia killing at
00:02:05least two people, including an election official. Moscow
00:02:09has accused Keve of sending over
00:02:11of 1600
00:02:12of drones towards the country with the aim of
00:02:15of disrupting the current elections there. The head of Russia's
00:02:18of election Committee says the drone attack targeted a civilian bus
00:02:21in the Russian controlled part of Hesson. Our
00:02:25of president
00:02:25of vom Zelensky has confirmed that the drones also struck an oil
00:02:29refinery. Moscow region overnight. Russian air
00:02:33defenses have intercepted most of those
00:02:35drones. The news continues on TRT
00:02:39World.
00:02:50of Coming up on this week's review of round table.
00:02:54of Israel's diplomatic isolation grows. The EU considers
00:02:57a wider trade band after 12. countries agree limited
00:03:06of of sanctions, Britain's masked protests, why is anti- migrant sentiment on the
00:03:10rise and who is behind the demonstrations?
00:03:13keep our jobs here, EU manufacturing in
00:03:17crisis, the industry warns of huge job losses and is
00:03:21blaming China, and Europe spends billions on maritime
00:03:25defense, but will have
00:03:26of protected a seas from Russian hybrid attacks.
00:03:42of Hello and welcome to this
00:03:46week's review of roundtable amenda brady now the European Union is
00:03:50considering wider trade sanctions on Israeli illegal
00:03:54settlements with its top diplomat Kaye Calas saying it will be a
00:03:58principal stance. The Israeli. government is pushing
00:04:01of ahead with its E1 settlement, which would effectively split the
00:04:05occupied West bank in two. 12 countries, including the
00:04:08UK,
00:04:09a France, and Canada, have agreed new sanctions on trade with
00:04:12illegal Israeli settlements in the occupied West Bank, so is the
00:04:16tide finally turning on Israel. Many
00:04:20of these countries have been the stanchest allies of Israel in Europe.
00:04:24What does this tell us about how far Israel's standing has
00:04:27fallen? Well, it makes me think of Lord
00:04:30Palmerston's statement that a country has no
00:04:34friends, it only has interests, and I think here is
00:04:38case where the United Kingdom and Canada
00:04:42and number of other states have found that the
00:04:45situation in terms
00:04:47of of the legitimacy and the violence that they're witnessing in
00:04:51Israel is being responded to by their own public in
00:04:55such a way that they have had to step up and change the
00:04:59narrative. and so this is in many ways a sea
00:05:03change, but we never see international relations moving quickly,
00:05:06so I think it's taken a
00:05:08a long while to get here, we've anticipated something like this,
00:05:12and now it's here, yosi, come in on this, how will this be received in
00:05:16Israel, how has it been received? i think especially we are
00:05:20time at at election, you see the reaction to it,
00:05:24on the one hand, people reject any intervention, because it's
00:05:27look like intervention in the election, so there is rejection, we saw the
00:05:31overreaction by the Israeli government, definitely the foreign
00:05:35minister, and we see the steps, the measure, they they took school,
00:05:39closing the the British consulate in in in his Jerusalem.
00:05:43them kicking out basically the BST people from from Ramala, the British
00:05:47officers there and and and and and the rest. on the other hand, there is
00:05:50also understanding that this was as Roxan saying this was on
00:05:54coming, because if you think in
00:05:572019 the EU already
00:06:01ask you all to label commodities from from from
00:06:05from the from the west bank, so you could see if nothing happened in seven
00:06:08years to stop settlements, what you see is actually the...
00:06:12increase the building of settlements, the increase of settler
00:06:16violence, the terrorism there, and the building of e1, that
00:06:20really er anyone, because what it means to two-state
00:06:23solution, they feel obliged to react in one way or
00:06:27another, and that's what we see, now so there will be
00:06:31between how the voters are going to see that, are they
00:06:35actually going to internalize that the last four years, three
00:06:38years under under the Netanyahu government,
00:06:42results in completely breakdown in relations with with friends or
00:06:46allies or will develop sige mentality. the world is against
00:06:50us, we are not going to do anything about it. thank you Yossi.
00:06:54Pablo, to you, your home country of course is Spain. talk to me
00:06:57about Spanish public thinking on this one? well, I think like in many other
00:07:01countries, certainly the countries that have just announced these measures, this are general
00:07:05whitespret feeling against what the
00:07:08Israeli government has been doing in the Middle East, and there's certainly lot of...
00:07:12negative feelings that was the Netanyahu government, this has been, and we've talked about this in
00:07:16the show before, this is always been an easy win to some extent for the Spanish
00:07:20government, Pedro Sanchez who's obviously from the central from the socialist
00:07:23coalition, so this is always a very big political win for for him and it's
00:07:27a very good positioning himself as sort the leader across
00:07:31Europe, across the west in this sort of movement, that is his sort of
00:07:35effort against what many are seeing as as bad
00:07:39actions from the Israeli government, so I think these news comes
00:07:42as as very good news to this to Spain and particular to the Pedro Sanchez government who as we know
00:07:46has been a little bit of hot water, a little bit of trouble in recent weeks and recent
00:07:50months, so this comes as very welcome news and again it helps Spain position itself as
00:07:54sort of a leader in this particular for international politics, which I think is good for
00:07:58Spain. Thank you. Majed, what seems to have been the tipping
00:08:02point here for many these countries is the increasing
00:08:05settler violence in the occupied west bank, but what strikes me is very
00:08:09strange is that we've seen three years of a genocide in Gaza. and these
00:08:12countries didn't move very quickly on that,
00:08:16true, actually, we also have to see that settlements have been there for decades
00:08:20in Palestine and Israell
00:08:23as a has been
00:08:26building this settlements for decade, but again the
00:08:29international sanctions is the minimum acceptable measure at the
00:08:33moment after a genocide when we should have actually tackle the
00:08:37system long long
00:08:39ago seeing the settle. colonial violence and
00:08:43colonial like building,
00:08:47settlement building have been there for long time, and also one must
00:08:51see that the now, especially after genocide again in my
00:08:55opinion, the those countries which is trying
00:08:58to adjust their moral, the moral
00:09:02corrupt that they could not do to actually where they fail
00:09:06to stop the genocide, they now trying
00:09:09to respond to the public center. in the
00:09:13street
00:09:14you know by actually doing this in my opinion this minimum
00:09:18response
00:09:18you know when they could actually just directly darget the structure which is the
00:09:22aparatite regime. thank you madget roxant will
00:09:26these sanctions matter a job to Israel? mean a lot of
00:09:30critics are saying this is too little too late and largely
00:09:33performative. well i think that uh
00:09:36certainly the very act of of putting sanctions
00:09:40on is symbolically very important. "and clearly why
00:09:44there has been quite a few states that have come as a coalition
00:09:48behind this, but further, I think that it's really
00:09:51important for Britain, you asked about legitimacy
00:09:55and and all of that earlier, for Britain and the other states to
00:09:59show they have legitimacy uh they can live up to. They have
00:10:03been saying for years, as Maget has said that settlement
00:10:07shouldn't be put down, that the
00:10:10the two-state solution..." is what they support, and that actually
00:10:14is the language that's been used this time around,
00:10:17that the reason they're putting on sanctions a minimum, perhaps,
00:10:21but nonetheless a step much greater than ever. has happened
00:10:25before along with comments such as this
00:10:29has been an apartite a a genocide and
00:10:33apartide regime that the um that
00:10:37the at least the government of Britain and these other
00:10:41governments can feel as though there's been a consistency of what they've
00:10:44said before and that two-state solution is the
00:10:48reason why they're doing this to maintain that as viable
00:10:52option.
00:10:57"violent anti- migrant protests have been unfolding in Britain with
00:11:01hundreds of mass demonstrators descending on UK ports.
00:11:05public anger over small boat arrivals is growing despite official
00:11:09figures showing there's been a drop in numbers, but people
00:11:12smugglers are finding new roots to reach the UK and they're using
00:11:16mega dingis to pack more migrants into a single
00:11:19vessel. the protests have been organized by patriot
00:11:23platform, a group launched by man known as Danny Tomo
00:11:27who has links to the right-wing activist Tommy Robinson. How
00:11:30have you felt seeing these protests, these very threatening and intimidating
00:11:34groups of men turning up in balaclavas and masks? how how have
00:11:38you felt seeing this? I think it's a it's a
00:11:42challenge that we've been seeing for number of years now, so we go back
00:11:46at least the last couple of years, we've seen these repeated
00:11:49outbursts of protests, whether those were about asylum
00:11:53hotels, about specific... areas receiving small boat migrants,
00:11:57everything around immigration is now uh is now under a
00:12:01spector of of lot of frustration, it's been going on and it's been
00:12:05building up for number of years, so I think it's it's not
00:12:08necessarily surprising to to see this happen once
00:12:12more. why do so many people want to come to the United Kingdom and
00:12:15claim asylum when they've traveled through multiple other countries
00:12:19across Europe? there's no one single
00:12:23reason, there's large number of people who all want to get to
00:12:27the UK for a variety of reasons, for some it's
00:12:31because they have friends or family here in the UK,
00:12:34others just want to get here because the English
00:12:38language or because the UK's image as safe
00:12:42and welcoming place, there's also the the issue of
00:12:45Brexit, now the fact that the UK is no
00:12:49longer part the EU's asylum arrangements has
00:12:52meant that in some ways the... UK is now a
00:12:56form of court of appeals for asylum applications in the
00:13:00EU, so we have two situations, either people who've applied
00:13:04for asylum somewhere else, whether that's France, Germany, somewhere in the
00:13:08EU and have gotten rejected, or we have the case of
00:13:11people who've entered the EU through countries like Italy
00:13:15and Greece on the southern periphery, they were registered
00:13:19there and they risk being sent back to these
00:13:23countries of first entry if they... for asylum somewhere else in
00:13:26Europe, now because we're no longer part these
00:13:29arrangements, that's not a problem in the UK, they
00:13:33cannot be sent back, the UK government does not have access
00:13:37to databases to tell them if people have been
00:13:40rejected asylum elsewhere, for example, and we know that if
00:13:44you go and ask people in northern France, they do
00:13:48consider that that to be reason, at least some them. thank
00:13:52you, claire, you spent years working with there. made when she was home
00:13:55secretary in the home office dealing with this issue and obviously she went to become
00:13:59prime minister and you worked with her as well, a couple of reports this week and it was one
00:14:03from the UN HCR saying that the speed
00:14:07the work in the home office right now is far more important to the
00:14:11government than the quality um that they're pushing through people
00:14:15who not necessarily should be getting asylum, is that your
00:14:18experience? no it wasn't, I mean we were dealing with quite a
00:14:22large backlog when I was at the home office but no... near the size
00:14:26the uh the work in progress field that they have currently,
00:14:30it's always going to be a challenging area because you are
00:14:34reliant upon other countries giving you information, if somebody states that
00:14:38they're from Eritrea or from South Sudan, you have to verify that,
00:14:41and those countries are not always the best at record keeping, they're
00:14:45not always going to give you the information quickly, so there are number of
00:14:48challenges, but I think the home office is just too large in itself, and I
00:14:52said for a long time that it needs to be... split, you need to take out
00:14:56immigration, make an own standalone department where you can pour the
00:15:00resources where you need them at the times that you do need them, because otherwise
00:15:04you're just being spread across national security, policing,
00:15:07drugs, uh, passports, you name it that comes into the home
00:15:11office, so I think that is part the problem that nobody ever seems to want to deal
00:15:15with. Is that solution, Sebastian, for you, creating an immigration
00:15:19department, because other countries have them, and I'd be interested to see what
00:15:22benefits that has, because all of those issues you mention whether. it's um policing or
00:15:26drugs, they're all linked with immigration as well, so I would imagine having not worked in the home
00:15:30office that you need those people to be speaking each other, um, I know that's reform pledge
00:15:34as well to separate it out, but I think the solutions are probably lot more... or
00:15:37global as well, it's about working with people, whether they're in Europe or in the Middle
00:15:41East, because these are trails that start a long, long way away from the UK and
00:15:45end up here, and it's only by keeping those relationships strong that we can, we can
00:15:49tackle that that very long problem. Claire, you live in Kent,
00:15:53which is huge county in the east of England, Dolver is one the towns there, how are
00:15:57local people feeling when they see these gangs of hoodlums turning up in balaletlavas and
00:16:01masks? I spoke to number of people when the protest
00:16:04happened uh, and they said how intimidating... was uh there
00:16:08was somebody in their car going into the town just to do some shopping
00:16:12and was stopped at around about by somebody wearing a balaclava dressed in
00:16:15black just standing and staring at them and they said this is the
00:16:19kind of tactic that you would have seen in belfast in the
00:16:231970s not Dover in 2026 and all they were trying to
00:16:27do was get to the shops so local businesses have suffered there will be
00:16:31those who support them support these protesters but I
00:16:34think that grinding the town to
00:16:36a halt is did, all they managed to stop were freight trucks
00:16:40and people coming either back from holiday or going onto their holiday, so they
00:16:44weren't that happy about. who is this Danny Tomo guy
00:16:48who is on this patriot platform who seems to be
00:16:51coordinating lot the anti-migrant response in
00:16:54England? he's got an interesting character when you
00:16:58look, he um, i understand he met Tommy Robinson
00:17:02who is another sort of right-wing agitator in
00:17:05prison, so it gives you the... measure of the individual that you're dealing
00:17:09with, and he's managed to get a bunch of people who don't
00:17:13like anybody coming to this country via any means
00:17:16whatsoever, and I have to say the organization for
00:17:19Dover was very, very good, Kent police were caught
00:17:23completely on the hop, they didn't know it was happening, it was incredibly
00:17:27organized, people were coming from long distances, they were disciplined, and
00:17:31I think that should be a worry for everybody, how disciplined and
00:17:35not that information didn't... leak out in the same way that it
00:17:38normally would, so I think that that is a really worrying aspect. I think he
00:17:42will do himself more damage, I think that there are a number of legal issues that
00:17:46he is caught up in currently, so all these things will come to the force, so whether
00:17:50he's going to lead it for much longer, I think remains to be
00:17:53seen.
00:17:58Now, 300 thousand factory jobs could be lost across the EU
00:18:02by end the
00:18:02the year. That's the warning from the industry representative,
00:18:06Eurometal, which says, growing competition from China is putting
00:18:10European manufacturing jobs and supply chains at
00:18:13risk. The EU China trade deficit has now reached more than
00:18:17billion dollars a day. European Commission president Arcela
00:18:21Vonderline warns that Europe faces second China
00:18:24shock. Are we looking at the
00:18:27deindustrialization of Europe now? Well, we're certainly looking at the
00:18:31beginning the deindustrialization of Europe, although to be fair, we
00:18:35voluntarily deIndustrialized in
00:18:37you know that over the China price in
00:18:40globalization we moved low-end manufacture to China because it was
00:18:44cheap, that was the first phase of of deindustrialization, the
00:18:47shock now is that China's come back with with advanced
00:18:51technology and extremely efficient uh
00:18:54manufacturing and highly organized supply chains, and it is
00:18:58hitting those sectors that Europe thought belong to it,
00:19:01so you high-end manufacturing, which in in
00:19:05Europe accounts still for... thousands of jobs, particularly in
00:19:09Germany, so yeah, it's a worry. Ian, what are you hearing in
00:19:13the business news world, how concerned are people? I think this
00:19:17is an inevitability, as Isabelle said, I think Mainland
00:19:21Europe is going through a process now that the UK probably went through 40,
00:19:2445 years ago, we began deindustrializing a long
00:19:28time before Mainland Europe did, and I think they're going through that same
00:19:32paint trade now, and it's most obviously going to be played out in sectors
00:19:36like automotive. where for example, a country like
00:19:40Germany, had they prepared for it adequately would have known that this was
00:19:43coming anyway uh, with the transformation to
00:19:47EVs, it takes far fewer people to build an electric vehicle
00:19:51than it does one with a traditional internal combustion engine, and so to that
00:19:55extent countries like Germany ought to have been preparing for this moment
00:19:58anyway, and perhaps as Isabel says, it has taken people by
00:20:02surprise that China's moved up the value chain, but it oughten to have been
00:20:06a surprise. "anyone that's visited China, anyone that's spoken
00:20:10to Chinese business leaders, anyone that's spoken to the Chinese
00:20:13government, would have told you they were not going to be happy, just sitting there knocking
00:20:17out cheap components and cheap goods, they wanted to move up the value chain, and
00:20:21that's exactly what's happened, and they have, Philip, to you in Brussels, give us the
00:20:25reaction in Brussels then about all these job losses and problems with
00:20:28industry across the EU, how worried are
00:20:31they? well, in Brussels, policymakers and
00:20:35the EU bubble is alarmed of course." because this is really
00:20:39now uh touching at the core of of European industrial
00:20:43provinces and there is talk about uh you
00:20:47know being tougher on China when... comes to trade, when it
00:20:51comes to uh,
00:20:52you know, imports of EVs of batteries, of other
00:20:56machinery goods and chemicals, where European industry has
00:21:00so far been leading in the world, and yeah, there is now
00:21:04a three-month truce between China and the EU, where there are
00:21:08intensive discussions going on, how to move on,
00:21:12best, ideally, but while avoiding a trade war, but the
00:21:16EU is also ready to to speak,
00:21:20suffer language with China, that is at least what we hear for now,
00:21:24and there's talk of development of new trade defense
00:21:27tools that should allow a more rapid and a
00:21:30more, commenturate response to Chinese
00:21:34overcapacities, there are based on
00:21:37largely often illegal subsidies
00:21:41that go against WTO rules and
00:21:43also an
00:21:46artificially low currency and artificially low running. Thank
00:21:50you, Philip. Isabel to you, I saw a quote from a European business leader who
00:21:54said, control the supply chain and you own the
00:21:57complete value chain. That's pretty much what the Chinese have done to
00:22:01European business and industry, isn't it? Uh, pretty much. Yes, so you
00:22:05know, of course, nothing is entirely
00:22:09uh, straightforward in a trade war, and and these measures are really
00:22:13important, it, Europe has been slow to realize what's
00:22:17happening, it's been all western economies have been. slow to realize
00:22:21they actually need industrial policy at this point, you
00:22:24know, it was way out of fashion during globalization, those days are over.
00:22:28we're now facing moment in which China has a bigger share of global
00:22:32manufacturing than the United States had in 1945, and if
00:22:36you think what other and other economies were like in
00:22:391945, just after World War II, you know, this
00:22:43China has achieved without World War II, so we
00:22:47are a we are a very, very difficult... moment when the sheer
00:22:51scale of China, the the the fact that China has prepared
00:22:54for 15, 20 years to do to lessen
00:22:58its dependency on on external
00:23:02inputs and to control supply chains, it's in very, very
00:23:06powerful position, because it controls key components that that that
00:23:10everybody else needs to manufacture, that said, it also needs
00:23:14markets and at the moment nobody's making money in China, it's an absolute
00:23:18cut throat competition, they're all cut. prices because there is
00:23:21insufficient consumer activity in China, so
00:23:25everybody has problems and they could get worse with the trade
00:23:29war, but we we shouldn't assume that all the cards are in China's
00:23:32hands.
00:23:37Europe seas are becoming new frontline as tensions with Russia
00:23:41escalate. The EU and its member states have spent around
00:23:45$130 billion dollars on maritime defense over the past
00:23:48decade. "the oceans are particularly vulnerable due to the
00:23:52sub-sea cables which carry more than 95% the
00:23:56world's telecom data. so what are the challenges Europe
00:24:00is facing? sean to you, first of all, where are the
00:24:04threats coming from then? yeah, I mean, one thing to remember is that
00:24:08we've got some maritime experts here, but the vast majority of global trade moves via
00:24:12the oceans and therefore you need to be able to protect that. the main threats
00:24:16are the critical national infrastructure. we've got lots of cables and pipelines under..." the
00:24:20ocean, we've also got GPS that can be jammed from the ocean as
00:24:23well, and we're also seeing certainly
00:24:25in the UK, lot of Russian uh oil tankers, the sanction fleats
00:24:29are making their way through, and therefore you need to have capability against them,
00:24:33critically, for the cold war and I'm a cold war veteran, um,
00:24:37we used to be looking our main focus on anti-submarine warfare, we recognized that the
00:24:41sub-surfice threat was really dangerous, but over the years we've lost the
00:24:45ability to do that as credibly as we used to be able to, and threats like Russia
00:24:49and China, but most... particularly Russia has something like 50
00:24:52attack submarines available, we've got five, and most of
00:24:56those are actually not serviceable and they're all concurrently in being worked on, so
00:25:00we do have a significant shortfall in our military capability in the
00:25:04maritime environment. Jean Francis, to you, I
00:25:07read an extraordinary statistic this week, 90% of
00:25:11Europe's trade goes via the sea. We are hugely,
00:25:15hugely dependent on our waters. Are we doing enough to protect
00:25:18them? i will i will give the the wishy-washy
00:25:22answer of yes and no. um, i think the investment that we're seeing at the
00:25:26moment uh are a good uh that there are good
00:25:30steps. um, what i a little bit unclear about and i
00:25:33think it's it's touching on on some points that that we're having here is that the
00:25:37choices that we're making at the moment to defend and and
00:25:41to be to be clear um my my day today is to look
00:25:45mostly at the north sea and the baltics um
00:25:49but when you look at these two environments, the way the way the
00:25:53geography and and the sea works,
00:25:56um, frigates are not necessarily
00:26:00the most uh... well prepared
00:26:03platform to defend for example
00:26:05the the Baltics uh
00:26:07but I'm yet to see and you see it piece meal lets and right left
00:26:11and right um but I think especially in the EU
00:26:14um I'm yet to see very
00:26:17strong argument being made for
00:26:21uncrued vehicle maritime especially um that
00:26:25could that could either be fielded in conjunction with frigate and
00:26:28submarine for example uh or also as part the main
00:26:33strategy uh moving forward. Mark to
00:26:36you, what's your assessment of how secure our
00:26:40European Cs are? in some ways i
00:26:44think it's tying the other two speakers points, it's
00:26:48like as if the ocean saked up and snook
00:26:51up on us and we just realizing how much of our infrastructure is
00:26:54ocean-based, our communications cables our energy
00:26:58interconnectors, our sea lines communications in terms of trade.
00:27:02"they're all converging on the oceans and I've often said that state
00:27:06security is inextrickably linked with economic security, which
00:27:10is inextrictly linked with energy security, and our oceans
00:27:14are a key component of that, so I'm concerned
00:27:17that the architecture in terms of law the sea convention from
00:27:211982 and its subsequent amendments is no longer fit for
00:27:25purpose in the context of what we see today, Europe in particular is
00:27:29engaged a full-scale hybrid war and much of that. centered
00:27:33on the ocean and just to tie into your last speaker there, we need
00:27:36a lot more situational awareness in the context the
00:27:40complexity of activities that are at sea, so we are quite
00:27:44vulnerable. Sean to you, Europe is spending money on
00:27:48defense like never before, or not in living memory anyway,
00:27:52is enough of it going to see? I think a lot of it's down to
00:27:56priority priorities, I've been off to Ukraine fairly regularly, and you go
00:27:59through Poland and they feel the heat. the Russian
00:28:03invasion far more than we ever do over here through the lens of
00:28:07history, but also because obviously it's right on their border, and therefore
00:28:11they're investing heavily, but in land forces, in tanks and air
00:28:14and they're less worried about the maritime environment, we
00:28:17traditionally in the UK have been a mari time nation, we've been a
00:28:21maritime power, so whilst lot of Europe tends to look east we really need
00:28:25to be looking west and north, and therefore it feels like
00:28:28nationally and with some of our Nordic partners, France and... Spain
00:28:32and Italy, all of which you have so key maritime borders, but
00:28:36actually that's where it's a different priority, and I do think you can't just sort of say
00:28:40NATO or Europe here, you have to have subsets of where
00:28:44our responsibility lies, because we're seeing in the UK, when it's the
00:28:48Antar, um, just off our shores, where it's the Russian submarines and
00:28:51their test submarines lautering over under sea cables, whether it's
00:28:55aircraft coming over, we're feeling that heat a lot more than I would say
00:28:59Poland does, for example.
00:29:05'well that's it for me for the week, remember you can see more discussion and debate on our
00:29:09YouTube channel, search for roundtable, TRT World, and if you like what
00:29:13you see there, please do hit that subscribe button, you can also listen to
00:29:17select episodes wherever you get your podcasts, but for now from me and the
00:29:20brady and all the team here, goodbye and thank you for
00:29:24watching,
00:29:31is just coming in to TRT'.
00:29:55The truth is coming to light. This is
00:29:58one story that will touch millions of
00:29:59people.
00:30:09You're watching TRT World, I'm Katie Pillbeam, reminder now of our main
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