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00:00:00This was Mr. Trump's statement in response to this question, although he said that if he had the
00:00:04same choices again, he would attack Iran again.
00:00:07And this is very interesting because we know that Mr. Trump expects a lot of
00:00:11loyalty from all members of his cabinet, and he can
00:00:15rarely confirm such a statement that goes against his views. Could this mean that Mr.
00:00:19Trump, if J.D. Vance wants to run in the next
00:00:23election, is already giving signs that he will
00:00:26support him? I think it's too early
00:00:32to determine whether
00:00:36Mr. Trump will support J.D. Vance or
00:00:40not. I want to say something that
00:00:43in fact, if you allow me,
00:00:46I'll just go back to one of
00:00:50our esteemed guests' comments regarding two
00:00:54points: Israel and the issue of
00:00:57necessary war. That's my opinion, anyway. And
00:01:00I've written this several times and
00:01:03mentioned it elsewhere. In my
00:01:06opinion, this
00:01:09war, meaning what Mr. Trump did,
00:01:13was not
00:01:17to end the war that Iran had
00:01:21started. This was a
00:01:24necessary war, not an
00:01:27optional war. It was a necessary war.
00:01:30But do you mean that the war that Iran started
00:01:34was a proxy war? Because we know that
00:01:36America didn't directly attack Iran.
00:01:39Right? What exactly do you mean by the war
00:01:42that Iran started? Look, in 1957,
00:01:46please let her finish her speech, Mrs. Wahdati. Please go ahead. Look, in
00:01:501957, during the Islamic Revolution,
00:01:53the Islamic Republic declared war on four
00:01:57fronts. One, against America.
00:02:00Two, against Israel.
00:02:04Three, against modernity.
00:02:07You can take the fatwa against Salman Rushdie, and
00:02:11four, against the majority of their
00:02:14own people who don't accept
00:02:17the Islamic Republic. This is a permanent war.
00:02:20That is, in fact, the mistake that in America,
00:02:24well, the explanation, that is, a misunderstanding
00:02:27is that Americans in the name of
00:03:04America attacked Iran, and it was indeed a war that was very unpopular. According to every poll,
00:03:08more than 60-65 percent are against this war
00:03:11in America.
00:03:13That's
00:03:16right, of course. The polls that have
00:03:19come out now make this issue a bit more
00:03:23complicated. That is, in fact, dissatisfaction with economic
00:03:26issues always takes priority. This
00:03:30issue, and I said, I repeat the issue.
00:03:34Look, the leader of a country
00:03:36must present the cost that this country
00:03:40must bear to the people.
00:03:44They must explain it. They must show
00:03:47this framework so that you can imagine
00:03:51you say that you, in fact,
00:03:54this extra dollar at the gas pump is
00:03:58actually a kind of B. payment.
00:04:02It's insurance. It's insurance. Imagine that the Islamic Republic, which from
00:04:05America's perspective
00:04:08is the world's
00:04:11biggest state sponsor of terrorism.
00:04:14That is, in fact, this issue is not a slogan. It's in American
00:04:17law.
00:04:20The opinion of the Islamic Republic from
00:04:22Tehran, I just want to make this point. That is,
00:04:26in fact,
00:04:29look. In fact, the Islamic Republic,
00:04:33all American presidents, from
00:04:36Bush to Obama to Biden, all
00:04:39said that we will not allow the Islamic
00:04:42Republic to acquire nuclear weapons.
00:04:44And the Islamic Republic has consistently said that it has no
00:04:48intention of acquiring nuclear weapons. Yes,
00:04:51it doesn't. They officially
00:04:53said so.
00:04:55The Islamic Republic's claim, which we know
00:04:59from the documents that Mossad
00:05:03brought from Iran, with all the equipment
00:05:06and with all the documents that were in
00:05:10the Tehran warehouse, showed that this was a complete lie.
00:05:13And the Islamic Republic, even
00:05:16today, if the Islamic
00:05:19Republic truly has no
00:05:23intention of pursuing a nuclear
00:05:26weapons program, why doesn't it allow all
00:05:29IAEA inspectors to go everywhere? Why
00:05:33Please let's get back to the program's topic, which is really
00:05:36directly related to the US midterm elections, and my point
00:05:40is that yes, my point is that I am
00:05:58talking about the necessity of this war. Now, I would say
00:06:02this was a necessary war, but then it was
00:06:06planned, then it was executed,
00:06:09and that's why now the Islamic
00:06:12Republic (meaning America) is in trouble. It couldn't. Yes, it was executed to such an extent that even
00:06:16some American publications say that America wanted to carry out regime
00:06:20change in Iran, but in practice, the Islamic Republic has
00:06:23carried out regime change in America. Mr.
00:06:26Mahdizadeh, now if we return to the topic of
00:06:30the elections and their results and their effects on events
00:06:33and developments in Iran, we know that the defeat of the Republicans in the
00:06:36elections has emboldened many officials of the Islamic Republic. Their statements
00:06:40are much more defiant. For example, Mojtaba
00:06:44Khamenei threatened America that if aggressions are repeated,
00:06:48a much wider war that will be trans-regional
00:06:51will occur. Gholamhossein Mohseni Ejei, the head of the judiciary,
00:06:55wrote that we will certainly inflict more defeats on him,
00:06:59meaning Mr. Trump. He said that this is still the result
00:07:02of the early morning, and referring to the hostage-taking of
00:07:051979, he said that November 4th has always been a day of defeat
00:07:09for Americans. Does this mean that,
00:07:13in fact, as I said, they have become much more defiant and determined
00:07:16regarding their demands from America, the officials of the Islamic
00:07:20Republic?
00:07:22Mindy, one point, since I am in Iran. Mr. Tajbakhsh
00:07:26brought up that he said the war was necessary. No,
00:07:30it was by no means necessary. International laws did not allow such
00:07:34a thing. I think he has little knowledge of international
00:07:37laws. The International Atomic Energy Agency, in
00:07:41its latest report, and that report actually
00:07:44caused the war, Mr. Grossi, who they said was biased,
00:07:48even in that report, emphasized that Iran had not
00:07:52moved towards nuclear weapons. On the first day
00:07:55of the 40-day war, Mr. Chuck Schumer, as
00:07:59the leader of the minority Democrats in the
00:08:03Senate, declared that this was a war of choice.
00:08:06Mr. Trump's partner was also someone whom the International
00:08:09Criminal Court had prosecuted for
00:08:13war crimes in Gaza. And the American people
00:08:16naturally revolted. It wasn't just an economic issue. All these
00:08:20factors, plus the war crimes in Minab,
00:08:23Lamerd, and the wedding ceremony in
00:08:25Sirik that took place, all
00:08:29of these had a global impact.
00:08:32They provoked very strong reactions in America and throughout the world,
00:08:35and caused this atrocity. Therefore, that you
00:08:39repeat, no, this is a necessary war and
00:08:43Iran must be attacked, while 90 million Iranians live in Iran,
00:08:46is a very, very vulgar
00:08:48statement. Mr. Mirizadeh, if you could answer my
00:08:52question, I would be grateful. The question I asked is, but regarding,
00:08:56regarding, no, I think I've been waiting for 20 minutes. I need
00:09:00to go back. Regarding the officials
00:09:03of the Islamic Republic, Mr. Khamenei, before
00:09:07these elections, in a meeting with military commanders,
00:09:10he had also said that. That is, Mr. Khamenei's father and
00:09:14Mr. Khamenei's son's positions have always been harsh towards America,
00:09:18and he also said there that if there is to be a war,
00:09:21it must be without geographical limitations. Well, at the
00:09:25time he said this, the congressional elections
00:09:28had not yet been held. But as I said, this
00:09:32has given extra confidence to the officials of the Islamic Republic
00:09:36to want to challenge Trump.
00:09:39You also said that at the beginning of the program.
00:10:00This is historic for us, the Iranian nation, and I, as a journalist,
00:10:03have always said that I'm with you, and
00:10:07I think the vast majority of Iranian people say the same. But the more
00:10:10aggressive
00:10:13it gets, the more dangerous it becomes. Mr.
00:10:16Rajaeian, because Trump, when he lost and started
00:10:20with bombs, started with negotiations,
00:10:24he
00:10:27must end it with bombs, and he's like
00:10:30a person who's chest-deep in a swamp and sees a branch in the
00:10:34middle. Well, he won't turn back. He'll take the risk and
00:10:38go forward. Although I think and I'm sure that he
00:10:42can't end it with bombs either, and he'll make
00:10:44it worse. Mr. Hesami, what is your opinion on the
00:10:48question I asked? Do you think that after these results
00:10:52of the US midterm elections, will Iranian
00:10:55negotiators, if there is a negotiation underway and
00:10:59it continues, will they have a longer tongue, so to speak?
00:11:02Will they have more demands? It's interesting,
00:11:06look, now this discussion about the necessity of war or
00:11:10explaining war to the people is a discussion that I disagree with.
00:11:13The issue is that. But look, what was the goal of the attack
00:11:17and what is it? Let's not mind-read. Let's see what the goal was.
00:11:21That is, the achievement of the 12-day war and the 38-day
00:11:28war, whatever its goal was. If this goal was going to be, they had
00:11:32repeatedly said the goal was regime change, which they also changed later.
00:11:35Then they said the goal was to eliminate
00:11:39Iran's so-called nuclear capabilities.
00:11:42Then they talked about missiles and ICBMs.
00:11:45Then they talked about what we should do about the Strait of Hormuz.
00:11:49The discussion of whether there will be a war or not
00:11:53and whether these negotiations are always ongoing. This issue
00:11:57has never stopped. But
00:12:00the two countries presented a narrative
00:12:04to their people, and they distanced themselves from these two narratives
00:12:07and reached an agreement when trust
00:12:11was zero. For 48 years, trust has really been zero.
00:12:14An effort was made during Rouhani and Zarif's time. An effort was made
00:12:17for the JCPOA to do this. During Rafsanjani's
00:12:21time, if you remember, it was one of Hashemi's plans to
00:12:25normalize relations. Well, this confrontation and interaction with the
00:12:29Islamic Republic with America has been an issue from day
00:12:32one. But as for the possibility of war in these two months,
00:12:36yes, it is possible because, as you know,
00:12:40Trump wants to do great things. He wants to make
00:12:44Gaza, the West Bank, the French Riviera.
00:12:47He wants to end the Ukrainian war in one day.
00:12:50My point is that
00:12:54his so-called claim that the big beauti
00:12:58will bring the greatest peace to the Middle East
00:13:01in Gaza. Well, when
00:13:04the inability of this attack and the current problems that have arisen
00:13:08both electorally and in reality in the
00:13:11region and the damages that even
00:13:15the regional countries have suffered, this shows
00:13:18America's inadequacy, that it cannot in fact protect
00:13:21the region's security and that superpower and hyperpower that
00:13:26it should be is unable to do this. Now, this strengthens the hand of the Islamic Republic
00:13:29in the region. But this also does not mean that
00:13:33in fact, the main issue of Iran's nuclear
00:13:36issue, the issue of the Strait of Hormuz, and
00:13:39the issue of that enriched uranium.
00:13:43That's still on the table. Now, let's think about an attack.
00:13:47What is the goal of the attack? Friends say a limited attack. Well, what do they want to
00:13:50hit? And the goal of that attack is that will some other people come?
00:13:57Will they find reasonable people at the negotiating table so that they can deal with them? They are specifically saying that it is highly probable that a mountainous area,
00:14:00Gzalar, where it is thought that there are new nuclear facilities
00:14:04or they are in the process of building them, they will hit that. Well, what will happen then?
00:14:08What will happen? That is, Trump will come and say we succeeded.
00:14:12Iran's nuclear program is gone. Now it's 20 years, 30 years,
00:14:1550 years behind. Again, you have to sit at the negotiating
00:14:19table about whether the agency, about the NPT, about
00:14:22nuclear proliferation. About the missile program and the Strait
00:14:26of Hormuz, you need to reach an agreement. Therefore,
00:14:29diplomacy under Netanyahu and under Trump
00:14:33had in fact been lost and is lost. That war
00:14:36was necessary. I don't see it as necessary even from Israel's perspective.
00:14:40I know that for Israel,
00:14:44because the Islamic Republic not only says that it is increasing uranium
00:14:47enrichment, but it also says that it wants the destruction of the Zionist
00:14:51state. These are two issues for Israel.
00:15:25Iraq had said, and in fact, some say that the Islamic
00:15:28Republic thrives on crisis and
00:15:32continues its life through crisis. Some also think
00:15:36that perhaps this time the officials of the Islamic Republic
00:15:39look at this issue differently because in the recent wars that
00:15:42America and Israel fought, the leadership officials lost
00:15:46several layers of leadership, and those who are in power now
00:15:50know that if another war happens, their lives will most likely
00:15:54be in danger. As a result, they will probably avoid war.
00:15:57Please allow me to elaborate on a few points in relation
00:16:00to your question. First of all,
00:16:03war is a crisis
00:16:08that strengthens national sentiment among the people
00:16:12and makes the government much stronger. This is what Netanyahu also
00:16:15wanted to do in Israel and increase public support
00:16:18for his own government. Therefore, it's not just the Iranian government.
00:16:22Some people thought that Trump also wanted to
00:16:26do the same and buy political support for himself
00:16:29during wartime by using the national sentiments of the people.
00:16:32But as I said, I want to
00:16:35elaborate on this point that this is Israel's war
00:16:39against Iran. Even if America withdraws,
00:16:43we must see how much American support for Israel
00:16:46there is. Mr. Trump came and said that he wanted to cut
00:16:50the 4 billion dollar budget for aid to Israel. But this is the
00:16:54superficial aspect of the issue. In essence, this budget
00:16:57is being given to Israel through another channel,
00:17:01which is through the US military budget. When they approved the budget, there was a clause
00:17:05in it that said that the Israeli army
00:17:08can practically merge with the US army, have all
00:17:12military secrets, have access to the most advanced technology,
00:17:15have joint training, and receive all
00:17:19military equipment. This is very dangerous for Iran,
00:17:23because Israel, with its direct
00:17:26and indirect aid and, so to speak, technical assistance from America,
00:17:30is again in danger. What the new Congress wants to do, and
00:17:34what the people expect to be done,
00:17:37is to change or remove this
00:17:41clause. That is, effectively, to stop
00:17:45aid to the Israeli government for an attack on Iran.
00:17:48Note that Israel is a country where, Mrs. Wahdat Bina, we
00:17:52know that the Democratic Party was very strongly
00:17:56interested in Israel and cooperation with Israel, closeness with
00:17:59Israel. Now, do you think that they, who took over Congress,
00:18:02will act against their own inclination?
00:18:05Many of those who were recently elected are
00:18:09in the left wing of the Democratic Party.
00:18:13That is, a wave of leftism has emerged in America, which I call a kind
00:18:16of intellectual revolution and a political earthquake.
00:18:20And they are trying to purge or cleanse
00:18:23the right wing of the Democratic Party, remove them.
00:18:26And we hope that in two years, when
00:18:30the elections are held, this shift to the left will continue
00:18:33a bit more. Therefore, a strong movement of the Democratic Party is correct. As you
00:18:37said, until the previous elections,
00:18:40they enjoyed the full support of
00:18:43the Israeli lobby. All their candidates were the ones who came to
00:18:47power. But now we see that in Texas, which is strongly
00:18:49Republican, a teacher comes to power who says that
00:18:53she is ashamed that our hands are stained with the blood of Palestinian children
00:18:56and our tax money should not be spent on that. Therefore, this movement has started
00:19:00in the Democratic Party, and we hope that it will continue,
00:19:04and that if, because I am approaching the end of the program,
00:19:08I want to hear others' opinions on this very issue of Israel. Mr. Tajbakhsh, what is your opinion?
00:19:11I just want to make one point because I participated
00:19:15in the program and Mr. Tajbakhsh spoke
00:19:18as if he was Mr. Trump's defense lawyer. In a situation
00:19:22where Trump's own deputy is saying that this war was a mistake, it led to this.
00:19:25Millions of votes. This statement, because I say time is very
00:19:29personal attacks and so on be put
00:19:32aside. The main point is about
00:19:35your program. Exactly, this BBC
00:19:38Farsi program is for the people of Iran. It should be in the direction
00:19:42of supporting the interests of the Iranian people, who,
00:19:45in the way he thinks can support the interests of the Iranian people,
00:19:49he differs. Please allow me to continue my question about
00:19:52Israel. Please allow Mrs. Wahdat Bina, Mr.
00:19:55Tajbakhsh, what is your opinion on how much
00:19:59this Senate and House of Representatives that
00:20:02will come to power will change America's approach towards
00:20:06Israel?
00:20:37This anti-Israel sentiment
00:20:40has gained momentum
00:20:44in a segment of
00:20:48progressive groups or, in fact, Democrats
00:20:53and even young Jewish youth. This is, in my opinion,
00:20:56a very dangerous phenomenon. The idea
00:20:59that the issue of Israel is this war of Israel,
00:21:02in my opinion, we should reconsider
00:21:05this claim. The reason is that
00:21:09a very small country
00:21:12can turn a superpower around and force
00:21:15it to go to war. It's not at all
00:21:25Say about this issue, look, someone can
00:21:28be a supporter of the Israeli people and Israel, but
00:21:32oppose Mr. Netanyahu's policies. Here I
00:21:36see that the same thing that happened to America after 9/11
00:21:40also happened to Netanyahu and Israel.
00:21:42After 9/11, people in countries
00:21:46around the world were sympathetic and supportive of
00:21:49America. But after Abu Ghraib prison, after
00:21:51Guantanamo and torture, public opinion
00:21:55turned. Now Mr. Netanyahu is also accused
00:21:59of crimes against humanity and war crimes.
00:22:02Therefore, a part of the Democratic
00:22:05Party, a part of the Republican Party, are against
00:22:09Netanyahu's policies. I don't see a contradiction.
00:22:12Thank you very much. With thanks to Aram Hesami,
00:22:15Sahila Wahdati Bana, and Kian
00:22:19Tajbakhsh.
00:22:21We have reached the end of the US election coverage on BBC Persian. Thank you for joining us. I hope to see
00:22:25you on Tuesday as well. Until then, have a good time.
00:22:29The brain and skin are made