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00:00:12And what will be the relationship of the winners of these elections towards Kosovo
00:00:15on the Serbian list, I am talking with Jugoslav
00:00:18Gašić, a candidate on the student list, an assistant professor at
00:00:21the Faculty of Medicine in Kosovska Mitrovica. Good day, thank you
00:00:24for being here, uh, let's
00:00:27first perhaps look at these repeated elections. We heard
00:00:31from colleague Miloš Zekić
00:00:33Usame Zukolić enters the
00:00:36parliament, a large number of people in Aleksinac
00:00:40voted for him, one mandate
00:00:43which essentially changes nothing, but one less mandate
00:00:47for the student list, Usame Zukolić in parliament. Good day,
00:00:50thank you for the invitation. Well, I can't really tell you that I'm so
00:00:54familiar with that news, but here's what I managed to hear here
00:00:58while we were waiting for this connection.
00:01:01"In Serbia, anything is possible, it's incredible, so in
00:01:04Aleksinac, Usame Zukorlić, simply an incredible
00:01:07thing, you just have to smile at this moment about
00:01:10that, yes, that's your comment, well, I mean,
00:01:14incredible thing, who knows
00:01:16what kind of engineering existed there on election day, but
00:01:20we will find out, of course, I reserve judgment, I don't have all the information, so
00:01:23I can't comment in more detail,
00:01:26yes, now it's enough -
00:01:30questions related to uh how the student list
00:01:33will relate to what is happening in Kosovo, but how it will primarily
00:01:37relate to uh the Serbian list
00:01:41now that uh it is clear that the Serbian Progressive
00:01:44Party has been defeated and that uh the functioning of the state
00:01:48in the next period will be taken over by the student list on which you are
00:01:51also, uh what will be the relationship towards
00:01:55let's start with a broader question towards Kosovo
00:01:58well, the problem. We perceived Kosovo and incorporated
00:02:02it into our program, we presented that during this pre-election
00:02:06period, so we will absolutely not deviate from
00:02:09that by an inch, everything that we committed to
00:02:13in the program, we will
00:02:15land with plans to build implement, uh, not to mention, I think that is already
00:02:18clear to everyone, apropos of our program, of course
00:02:21this is a new political reality, the Serbian
00:02:25list is going through those phases, psychological
00:02:28phases... of accepting defeat, where
00:02:32in the first phase they were
00:02:34caught off guard, where they didn't, it took them six days to acknowledge
00:02:38what happened, the second phase for them is anger and frustration
00:02:42which they are now exhibiting, that phase will
00:02:45pass, they will enter the bargaining phase, the depression
00:02:49phase, and finally the acceptance of the election results,
00:02:53I am convinced that this will happen by the time we form
00:02:56an effective government and cabinet, at this moment... "probably
00:03:00in that phase of anger and frustration,
00:03:04they are prone to
00:03:06certain statements which
00:03:09essentially do not represent absolutely, what exactly are you referring to? Well,
00:03:13specifically something in the media space that has been
00:03:16circulating for the past few days in
00:03:19the media that are from Kosovo and Metohija,
00:03:22I think they need
00:03:26to recognize the new reality, that
00:03:29now uh..." "The Serbian list was
00:03:33directly linked to the Serbian Progressive Party, perhaps not
00:03:36necessarily to the party as such, but to what official
00:03:40Belgrade, uh, embodied in the policies of the Serbian
00:03:44Progressive Party, represented, what, what
00:03:46next? Well, the Serbian list was
00:03:50an outpost of the Serbian Progressive Party in Kosovo, the implementer of all
00:03:53works, they have stated that many times in the past period
00:03:57how they are linked to Belgrade." "they no longer
00:04:01have that Belgrade to rely on,
00:04:04so we stand by
00:04:07really not satisfied with the way the position that there is no, no political cooperation with
00:04:09the Serbian list, uh, they de facto have a certain
00:04:13institutional position, but that institutional position will
00:04:17not be a protection for
00:04:19potential law violations, endangering
00:04:22freedoms, uh, bringing
00:04:25the Serbian people in Kosovo and Metohija into such a situation,
00:04:29definitely..." "it will be, what
00:04:32their former supreme
00:04:35leader, and now just a defeated
00:04:39citizen would say,
00:04:41uh, they will be brought to the knowledge
00:04:44of the law, uh, they can absolutely
00:04:48continue, of course, to function in that
00:04:50system, uh, it's hard for me to
00:04:54believe that they will now be able to
00:04:57really do what they were elected to do,
00:05:00to be representatives of the Serbian people in that system, when
00:05:04they haven't done it until now, but
00:05:07all attention our focus will now be
00:05:11directed at them. "and let's believe that
00:05:14it will come to that, yes, when you say that, do you mean
00:05:18that they are mayors or that they are
00:05:21members of parliament in the Kosovo parliament? I mean both,
00:05:25so I mean both with the stipulation that uh
00:05:28the consequences
00:05:31of their actions can be far
00:05:34more tragic for those who are in the Kosovo parliament than
00:05:38those who are mayors, in what sense what do you think could happen? Well,
00:05:41legal..." regulations
00:05:45uh also should
00:05:48they worry, uh, those who work in
00:05:52how shall I say, in Kosovo but in the Serbian system, education,
00:05:56healthcare? Well, you see, in this period
00:05:59now we are listening to that cacophony in the media space
00:06:03that comes from that defeated citizen
00:06:06and who, in creating some kind of escape route for himself,
00:06:10his defeated body
00:06:13by giving some support and imitating some
00:06:17cohesiveness, they do this by
00:06:20that is absolutely
00:06:23unrealistic, uh, our
00:06:26goal, if nothing else, perhaps as
00:06:29a priority, is to do everything to
00:06:33stop that spiral of negative things that have been
00:06:36happening in Kosovo and Metohija, to prevent the departure of our people from that
00:06:40area, so everything will be directed
00:06:43in that sense to preserve people, no one
00:06:46should absolutely worry that they will be without any
00:06:50earnings or that they will be forced to leave,
00:06:54we will absolutely not stop that, in fact,
00:06:57we have a plan to strengthen it and to distribute
00:07:01it properly, not to function as the
00:07:04Serbian list functioned with favoritism in distributing
00:07:07certain social assistance in exchange for votes
00:07:11in those... uh election
00:07:14processes, but certainly those who have
00:07:17broken the law, they have reason to worry,
00:07:21and now you come from education, what
00:07:25that was also a topic in this
00:07:28campaign, but earlier, what will happen to the university,
00:07:32bearing in mind that uh the Pristina authorities at one
00:07:35point made it quite difficult, uh, or
00:07:38intended to make it difficult, uh
00:07:41communication between Central Serbia and Kosovo, what,
00:07:45what, what about that? Well, there are many
00:07:48problems in Kosovo, you know, the whole of Serbia is, if we
00:07:51look at it as a kind of backyard by regions, it is actually
00:07:55full of weeds, for these 14 years that weed
00:07:58has been watered, especially in Kosovo perhaps most intensively,
00:08:02all that needs to be resolved, unfortunately, in Kosovo we don't enter
00:08:06there free to solve it with both hands, but one hand
00:08:09is tied, what can already be seen. is that we have brought
00:08:13some freedom to the people, you see that smiles have returned
00:08:17to people's faces, that something is being celebrated that was not
00:08:20possible eight days ago, then it was dangerous
00:08:23to like anything, however, we have several
00:08:27priorities, perhaps that one is very
00:08:30important as a short-term goal to preserve our
00:08:33university, because we have a limited time when we expect a serious
00:08:37blow, those measures that the temporary government in
00:08:41Pristina. extended for one year expire on March
00:08:4415th, we don't have much time, we must preserve the university,
00:08:48but not through some postponement of those measures, but through
00:08:52finding some systemic solution for the university
00:08:56to survive and function within our Serbian system, that
00:08:59includes talks with Pristina authorities, that
00:09:03includes talks with the international community,
00:09:07we expect the most cooperation from them, as you
00:09:10said, I am from education,
00:09:14uh, we perceived that problem during this period and we were
00:09:19information was being shared by the then authorities, in fact,
00:09:23and the current ones, let's say, they are still in those
00:09:26positions, about what was happening in that process, you know,
00:09:29we had some visits
00:09:33to faculties by the rector who said, wait for instructions from Belgrade,
00:09:37no instructions from Belgrade came, of course, during
00:09:40that period, uh...
00:09:43"and I, my colleagues gathered in informal groups,
00:09:47for example, Proaktiv is one of those groups, uh,
00:09:50held meetings with certain international
00:09:53actors in terms of presenting that
00:09:56problem, uh, sometime during the period when the Serbian list
00:10:00came out with an interesting statement that they, for example, had
00:10:03held 80 meetings with
00:10:06representatives of the international community in seven days, then we also had
00:10:09a meeting after that with some..." International
00:10:13community, when we told them about the problem of our
00:10:16university, which is actually most affected by
00:10:20that law on foreigners, they had absolutely no
00:10:23idea what was happening, so much for those
00:10:27contacts and their diplomatic missions, does that
00:10:30mean that you will demand that uh the dialogue that
00:10:33is being conducted under
00:10:37the auspices of the European Union be revived, would
00:10:40you be in that team, who would take that over now, well, I
00:10:44understand your journalistic curiosity and need for
00:10:47information, but I don't know how I could give you information that would
00:10:51satisfy you without exceeding my mandate, mhm. "I think
00:10:55it's too early to talk about that, it's been eight days
00:10:59since the elections, so we still don't know when we will
00:11:02constitute the assembly and form this government, what's
00:11:05important is that we are not losing time, that
00:11:09we are quite organized around all segments in
00:11:13groups, that we are working on expanding the groups,
00:11:16with experts from certain fields so that we can
00:11:20use this period of government transition in the best possible way
00:11:24so that literally..." with the beginning of our
00:11:27government, we already have defined goals that
00:11:30we can achieve very quickly, so
00:11:34in that process there are certain processes and
00:11:37strategies, but you will understand that I cannot tell you that now, even
00:11:40if I have information, I might potentially jeopardize
00:11:43something, now how
00:11:46that transition should look like, the transition
00:11:50of power in Kosovo in Serbian communities,
00:11:53the transition of power. "In Serbian communities,
00:11:56you must, we must look at it like this, meaning that there are only
00:12:00two systems left that function within the system
00:12:03of the Republic of Serbia, that is education and healthcare,
00:12:07the transition of power implies that we, in
00:12:10accordance with our program, bring competent and
00:12:14qualified people to leadership positions, so
00:12:17the transition of power implies the removal
00:12:20of politically appointed leadership in these
00:12:23institutions which have..." for the past period been guided
00:12:26exclusively by personal interests and predominantly used
00:12:29dominantno
00:12:32uh the popularization of the Serbian list or SNS
00:12:35very, very often incorrectly violating
00:12:38human freedoms, pressuring and blackmailing employees
00:12:42for voting, uh, they have no
00:12:45moral right anymore to be in those positions,
00:12:48it is absolutely necessary to remove that management and bring in
00:12:52professional management. Yes, do uh... "you expect that they
00:12:56will resign themselves or
00:12:59will they wait for the formation of a new government to be
00:13:02dismissed? Well, I would not go into what they
00:13:06think, you know, they, I think they are now preoccupied with some
00:13:10of their own survival, I am convinced that
00:13:14everyone is aware that in this period they have done many things
00:13:17that are not in accordance with the law
00:13:19and I think they were quite
00:13:23surprised by the change that happened in Serbia on
00:13:26October 25th, I believe they thought that for them
00:13:30October 26th would be an ordinary working day,
00:13:34a Monday when they would continue to do that. This that
00:13:38has now befallen them, they are not coping well with it yet,
00:13:41and I think it would be good if they resigned,
00:13:45not for us or for them, but for the interest
00:13:48of the Serbian people, because we don't have much time, specifically,
00:13:52if we talk about the law on foreigners, we... We don't have much
00:13:55time to lose now, to constitute the government and then to
00:13:59replace certain leaders so that we can
00:14:02direct policy in the direction we believe it should
00:14:06be, they would help themselves and us, but primarily
00:14:09the interest of the people, so just to conclude, you will not
00:14:13yet reveal all plans and tactics until the new
00:14:16parliament is constituted, but what you can convey,
00:14:20bearing in mind that uh the outgoing
00:14:23party uh and "the man who was once president
00:14:27is sending some signals, information that the state's competencies
00:14:30will be reduced in Kosovo, that means that will not happen,
00:14:34that absolutely will not happen, I mean, we emphasize that this is
00:14:38an absolute untruth and their propaganda that they are using in
00:14:41this period to create their exit strategy, do
00:14:45you think that your compatriots in Kosovo
00:14:48believe what they hear from them or do they
00:14:52believe this student list more?" Well,
00:14:55our compatriots have shown in the past period
00:14:59who they trust,
00:15:02if we look at it through the election results,
00:15:06but I believe that it was not, that it was not the free
00:15:09will of our people,
00:15:12so perhaps we are a new
00:15:15reality for them, but they will get
00:15:19to know us through our actions, we will work on mutual
00:15:22trust and they will trust us, you will see that. Already with these
00:15:25presidential elections, what is happening in Kosovo according to the election
00:15:29results, mhm, you won't tell us who the candidate is, do you already know who the candidate
00:15:32will be, I know, but I won't tell you, yes, well, thank you very much for
00:15:36this conversation, it was Jugoslav Gašić, candidate
00:15:39on uh on the student
00:15:42list,
00:15:47a businessman close to the Serbian Progressive Party, owner of Alta bank
00:15:50Davor Macura was detained last night, Nova
00:15:54RS learns. Previously, the police for more than 30 hours, since Saturday,
00:15:58conducted a search of the premises of that bank, which on Saturday morning
00:16:01the Executive Board of the National Bank of Serbia revoked its operating license and
00:16:05declared its bankruptcy. More
00:16:08about that, continuing with Milan Ćuliberg, editor of the Economy
00:16:11section of the weekly Radar, so here's
00:16:14just a brief comment on this news, we are still
00:16:18waiting for its confirmation, Radar and you
00:16:21have written on several occasions about how
00:16:24uh Macura went from a small trader
00:16:28to managing an entire
00:16:31financial empire,
00:16:35well, yes, and the consequence of that was a lawsuit. Mr.
00:16:38Macura claimed we had damaged his business reputation,
00:16:41right? Now we've seen that in
00:16:45that boasted it was the fastest growing in
00:16:48Serbia, uh, the point is that Mr.
00:16:51Macura's business success somehow
00:16:54overlaps with the coming to power of the Serbian Progressive
00:16:57Party sometime in 2012,
00:17:00especially in those 10 years when he really managed to
00:17:04build a business empire in a relatively short time,
00:17:07about 100 years, at least.
00:17:10Uh the point is that we
00:17:14and colleague Nataša Korlat and the rest of us from Radar
00:17:17wrote articles where based on
00:17:21official documents we found data that
00:17:23the state even subsidized him in all his business
00:17:27endeavors, many deals
00:17:31he concluded thanks to
00:17:34some privileges. Let's not forget that he
00:17:38bought IMT shortly before the law was about
00:17:41to change, which would enable
00:17:45the conversion of uh land of failed factories
00:17:49into urban building
00:17:52hundreds of thousands of square meters of residential buildings
00:17:55on that site, and when you multiply that by the average price
00:17:59of 3.5 or 4,000 euros, we come to the conclusion that these deals
00:18:03were planned in the value of some 600, 700 million e...
00:18:07euros, unfortunately, this is not the first
00:18:11time, we have already had the opportunity to see something similar, it
00:18:15happened after the defeat of the previous government in 2012,
00:18:18when the business empire of Mr.
00:18:22Bugićević, Farmakom, collapsed overnight with all its
00:18:26dependent companies, I just fear that this with Alta
00:18:29bank is just the beginning, uh, because
00:18:33within the Alta group there are other companies that were
00:18:36directly... connected to Altabanka and depended on it. Here's
00:18:40just one more question before we
00:18:44let you go, there's a lot of work for Radar
00:18:48these days, was it then expected that
00:18:51the first, let's say, financial victim of the change of government
00:18:54would be this group?
00:18:57Honestly, I'm not surprised, only by the speed with which it all
00:19:01happened. On the one hand, on the other hand, I'm
00:19:04surprised how the National Bank didn't react much faster.
00:19:07So, already after election night, although there were some
00:19:11signals that that bank started to empty, that some
00:19:14people withdrew money from
00:19:18their accounts even before the elections, before Sunday, just in case, as they
00:19:21say, to put it somewhere safe, especially those rumors intensified
00:19:24on Tuesday. We have
00:19:27a subsequent announcement from the Higher Public Prosecutor's Office that it already on Tuesday
00:19:31ordered the National Bank to investigate what
00:19:34was actually happening in that bank, and now the
00:19:37key question is who managed during those five days until the night
00:19:41between Friday and Saturday when the executive board of the national bank
00:19:44decided to revoke the operating license for Alta bank, who managed to
00:19:48withdraw that money, I cannot claim anything, but
00:19:52I dare to bet that it was done by
00:19:55privileged businessmen, very
00:19:59close to the top of the Serbian Progressive Party and the former
00:20:02state leadership until recently,
00:20:05unfortunately... "many public and state enterprises that
00:20:08were ordered by the authorities to
00:20:12deposit their money there were unable to withdraw
00:20:16it, so there were
00:20:19hundreds of millions of euros of state money from state
00:20:22enterprises and the question is what will become of it in the end
00:20:26when, because now everything depends on how the bankruptcy will end, let's
00:20:29not forget that the bankruptcy of those four failed
00:20:33banks that were closed back in 2002 is still
00:20:36not..." finished, so
00:20:39this could drag on, I only hope that the new government, when it is
00:20:43established, will manage to speed up that bankruptcy
00:20:46procedure so that creditors
00:20:50who uh have money
00:20:52there will be able to at least partially recover it, I don't believe there were
00:20:56many citizens who kept their money there because
00:21:00uh I don't see the motive for that, except that
00:21:03that bank offered slightly higher interest rates on savings than all others,
00:21:07but when someone offers you something more than everyone else,
00:21:10that is somewhere uh a signal for you to ask why
00:21:14that is being done, uh I believe that
00:21:17this all collapsed so quickly because... neither
00:21:21Mr. Macura nor the people with whom he closely cooperated and who
00:21:24enabled him to build that business empire, believed that
00:21:28on October 25th they would be able
00:21:31to behave as before for another four
00:21:34years, thank you very much for this first
00:21:38comment, it was our colleague Milan Ćuliberg, editor of
00:21:41Radar.
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00:27:47use, carefully read the instructions regarding indications, precautions, adverse reactions to the drug, consult
00:27:51a doctor or pharmacist.
00:28:06And what about the security sector now, can those who broke the law and
00:28:10put the service at the disposal of one party now be trusted to work in accordance
00:28:14with the law? I'm discussing this with Predrag Petrović from the Belgrade Centre
00:28:18for Security Policy. Good day, thank you, thank you for being
00:28:21here. Well, over the past few days since the election results
00:28:25until now, the question has been raised, can one trust
00:28:28not only the judiciary, but first
00:28:31and foremost, uh, people from the security sector
00:28:35to suddenly have to work according to the law? No, these people who are currently in
00:28:39leading positions cannot be trusted, that's
00:28:42for sure, because they came on
00:28:45a, uh, as they say, super loyalist
00:28:49wave, where loyalists were replaced by those
00:28:52people who were even more loyal than the
00:28:55predecessors. They proved their loyalty precisely by being willing
00:28:59to act according to political
00:29:03will, not in accordance with the law and rules of
00:29:06the profession. They did it in an open manner, so it was clear to
00:29:10everyone and in front of the cameras, they didn't
00:29:13hide what they were doing and Kričak is
00:29:16perhaps the most famous and best
00:29:19example of such a thing, and his security
00:29:23unit, so we had those scenes where, uh,
00:29:27they applied excessive
00:29:30uh, force towards students, we had that
00:29:34case of Nikolina Sinđelić in the
00:29:37government garage of Serbia, so there's a whole
00:29:40series of such cases that indicate that
00:29:44these people definitely cannot
00:29:46remain in those positions and that we cannot
00:29:50trust them, but yesterday we had the case
00:29:53that Kričak was arrested according
00:29:57to Veselin Milić's report, not for what you are now all
00:30:00talking about, that's right, in public there were several versions
00:30:03that finally the prosecution began to
00:30:06do its job,
00:30:09then that it was about, uh, first of all,
00:30:13about building bridges to the new authorities by
00:30:17the, uh, higher public
00:30:19prosecution in Belgrade, to the fact that it was actually
00:30:23uh, Veselin Milić's revenge for what
00:30:26Kričak did, or rather, what he tried to do by fabricating
00:30:30evidence to accuse him of what seems to be complicity
00:30:34in murder, uh, so, but I think the
00:30:38truth is always somewhere in the middle, but what is
00:30:41certainly true, and history teaches
00:30:43us, is that old structures always
00:30:47try to build bridges to
00:30:50new authorities in order to either
00:30:53preserve their positions, or to
00:30:56facilitate their departure, that departure would be, you know.